Alcohol Vs. Ciggerettes

The Jammy dodger

It is my theory that Alcohol causes more deaths than ciggerettes, yet unlike ciggerettes alcohol is free to be advertised and sold for next to nothing. Should they ban the advertising of alcohol like they did with ciggerettes? Should they limit what it is we are allowed to consume in some way?

I mean ciggys are banned from public places and from advertising and the labels are on the ciggys also show black lungs and dirty rotten teeth and so on. Should they show the effects of alcoholism on the labels of bottles of wine and cans of beer?

Discuss......

GarIT

The Jammy dodger wrote: »

It is my theory that Alcohol causes more deaths than ciggerettes, yet unlike ciggerettes alcohol is free to be advertised and sold for next to nothing. Should they ban the advertising of alcohol like they did with ciggerettes? Should they limit what it is we are allowed to consume in some way?

I mean ciggys are banned from public places and from advertising and the labels are on the ciggys also show black lungs and dirty rotten teeth and so on. Should they show the effects of alcoholism on the labels of bottles of wine and cans of beer?

Discuss......

They should ban its advertising. It is already illegal to drink outside of a private or licenced premises.

No they should not limit consumption, never mind it being impossible to do.

Warnings on the labels might be a good idea.

I also think pubs should be allowed open 24-7 if someone is of legal drinking age and they want to consume alcohol in a pub they should be allowed do so whenever.

Where To

The elephant in the room kills more people than both combined. . . . .

put an elephant and six people in a small room for 48 hours and you will see for yourself

christmas2012

alcohol no..cigarettes hmm.. im on off them at the moment hard to give them up but im still trying,its just that anytime i give them up i pile on the weight..its a tough one for me right now..

crazy cabbage

how does alchol cause more deaths than cigarets?

Cannibus has never caused any deaths. where does that fit in? surly by that reasoning it should be made legal

yes warning labels are a good idea. I agree that pubs should be aloud to open 24-7 if they wish.

SocSocPol

crazy cabbage wrote: »

how does alchol cause more deaths than cigarets?

Cannibus has never caused any deaths. where does that fit in? surly by that reasoning it should be made legal

yes warning labels are a good idea. I agree that pubs should be aloud to open 24-7 if they wish.

care to back up that stupid statment

flutterflye

I like alcohol and cigarettes

M cebee

ciggies are all bad

alcohol can be beneficial-but seldom in ireland

My name is URL

GarIT wrote: »

I also think pubs should be allowed open 24-7 if someone is of legal drinking age and they want to consume alcohol in a pub they should be allowed do so whenever.

Just because people want to do stuff doesn't mean that they should be enabled to do so through legislation. Laws are there to serve society as a whole, not protect an individuals right to indulge themselves. If people want to drink 24/7 they're more than free to do that already.

shopaholic01

flutterflye wrote: »

I like alcohol and cigarettes

Me too, might as well be hung for a sheep as a lamb and speed up the painful death:P.

PseudoFamous

crazy cabbage wrote: »

how does alchol cause more deaths than cigarets?

Beyond liver failure and other alcohol related illnesses and impairments, there are also dozens of car accidents as a result of drunkenness, increased likelihood of suicide and reckless self endangerment. Doubt you have look hard to find a lot of alcohol related accidents resulting in death (e.g., drownings, falling from height)

GarIT

My name is URL wrote: »

Just because people want to do stuff doesn't mean that they should be enabled to do so through legislation. Laws are there to serve society as a whole, not protect an individuals right to indulge themselves. If people want to drink 24/7 they're more than free to do that already.

Why not be free to do it in a pub or club? Apparently its because of anti-social behaviour but there are already relevant laws to do that.

GarIT

PseudoFamous wrote: »

Beyond liver failure and other alcohol related illnesses and impairments, there are also dozens of car accidents as a result of drunkenness, increased likelihood of suicide and reckless self endangerment. Doubt you have look hard to find a lot of alcohol related accidents resulting in death (e.g., drownings, falling from height)

Assuming tobacco causes as many deaths in Ireland per capita as it does in England tobacco kills 3,600 people in Ireland each year. There are maybe 300 to 400 road deaths in Ireland, at most half by alcohol, so alcohol kills 200 so far, then you add drowning 20-30 a year, maybe 5 alcohol related, throw in maybe 20 more due to random alcohol related accidents, there is no way liver failure due to alcohol makes up 3,300 deaths.

The Jammy dodger

PseudoFamous wrote: »

Beyond liver failure and other alcohol related illnesses and impairments, there are also dozens of car accidents as a result of drunkenness, increased likelihood of suicide and reckless self endangerment. Doubt you have look hard to find a lot of alcohol related accidents resulting in death (e.g., drownings, falling from height)

Exactly. It also breaks up marriages and homes and a lot of physical and mental abuse is dished out as a result of consuming it. A lot of anti-social behaviour is another one to put in there. I would probably put it on par with Ciggerettes.

crazy cabbage

PseudoFamous wrote: »

Beyond liver failure and other alcohol related illnesses and impairments, there are also dozens of car accidents as a result of drunkenness, increased likelihood of suicide and reckless self endangerment. Doubt you have look hard to find a lot of alcohol related accidents resulting in death (e.g., drownings, falling from height)

true. i didn't think of that. dout if it makes up the numbers though.

care to back up that stupid statment

of course i will. and no it was not a stupid statment.

This quote is taken from here

marijuana smoking can't kill outright -- there's no such thing as a fatal marijuana overdose.

Sidney points to two large studies. The first is from (where else?) California. A large HMO looked at 65,177 men and women age 15-49. Over 10 years, marijuana users died no sooner than nonusers.

The second study looked at 45,450 Swedish army conscripts. They were 18-20 years old when asked about marijuana use. Fifteen years later, the marijuana users were just as likely to remain alive as nonusers.

Here is another study form the FDA. This one shows that it has never been the primary suspect of a death. has been secondary (meaning it helped cause a car accident (like drink driving) or it was in system with a load of other drugs at the time of death. this basicly means that they cant prove it had anything to do with the death so they put is as a suspect to scare people)

Sorry i got off topic mods bringing it back now.

Think the really question in the alchol and tobacco debate is how much the a goverment can restrict peoples freewill with the aim of public safety. there has to be a balance. you could just ban both of them but then there would be a public outcrie (not to mention a majour opening in the black market). on the other hand if you let everyone do whatever they want there would be maham. There has to be a balancing point.

Wattle

I'd like to see this label on all alcohol sold: WARNING: MAY CAUSE YOU TO BECOME A COMPLETE ASSHOLE

dougal-maguire

Get rid of the alcohol and ciggerettes, just dont take my rollerblades.

Sunnyisland

crazy cabbage wrote: »

how does alcohol cause more deaths than cigarettes?

Cannabis has never caused any deaths. where does that fit in? surly by that reasoning it should be made legal

yes warning labels are a good idea. I agree that pubs should be aloud to open 24-7 if they wish.

Don't know whether it kills more people than cigarettes ? here are some alcohol related facts

Every seven hours, someone in Ireland dies from an alcohol-related illness

There are almost twice as many deaths due to alcohol as due to all other drugs combined

Many cancers, including cancer of the mouth, larynx, oesophagus, liver, colorectum and female breast, have a causal relationship to alcohol consumption

Three people in Ireland die from oral and pharyngeal cancer (OPC) every week - which is more than skin melanoma, hodgkin’s lymphoma or cervical cancer. Despite this, the disease remains largely unknown. It is also largely preventable as the two major risk factors for OPC are tobacco and alcohol consumption

You can find more here http://www.google.ie/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=alcohol%20related%20deaths%20in%20ireland&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CFAQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Falcoholireland.ie%2Falcohol-facts%2Falcohol-related-harm-facts-and-statistics%2F&ei=yqz0T7jxA4fQhAekk9jdBg&usg=AFQjCNEn1oVDsPp9pN60ks6_cuvE1xYXzQ

GarIT

GarIT wrote: »

Assuming tobacco causes as many deaths in Ireland per capita as it does in England tobacco kills 3,600 people in Ireland each year. There are maybe 300 to 400 road deaths in Ireland, at most half by alcohol, so alcohol kills 200 so far, then you add drowning 20-30 a year, maybe 5 alcohol related, throw in maybe 20 more due to random alcohol related accidents, there is no way liver failure due to alcohol makes up 3,300 deaths.

Alcohol (misuse) is a huge risk factor for an awful lot more than just Liver disease.

AllyMcFearless

Personally, both have pros and cons. But as with anything, in moderation they have a chance of increasing your enjoyment.

Misuse of alcohol is a messy path, and smoking carries a stigma as well as many illnesses promoted by usage.

Mixed bag!

OMARS_COMING_

Alcohol is the devil.

The Jammy dodger

Who to approach though with this request? how would we get the message heard?

murphm45

crazy cabbage wrote: »

of course i will. and no it was not a stupid statment.

This quote is taken from here


Here is another study form the FDA. This one shows that it has never been the primary suspect of a death. has been secondary (meaning it helped cause a car accident (like drink driving) or it was in system with a load of other drugs at the time of death. this basicly means that they cant prove it had anything to do with the death so they put is as a suspect to scare people)

Sorry crazy cabbage i appreciate i'm sticking my oar in where id doesn't belong but some of this feels a bit "rubbishy". For example "there's no such thing as a fatal marijuana overdose" i'm fairly sure there's no such thing as a fatal tobacco overdoes but millions of peopele die from tobacco related diseases. i assume you'd get a similar thing with cannabis. Also "usage" in the studies isn't specified, the average could be very low (e.g. once or twice a month). i'm sure a pint, or two or three cigarettes a week/month wouldn't lead to any appreciable difference in deaths either.

Also, even worse side bar, did you ever hear of confirmation bias? People will always find studies that verify their point of view even if they're vastly outweighted by ones to the contrary. Not saying this is the case here (i'm too lazy to look) but just something to watch out for.

Back on topic though while it's a good idea, even if it didn't resduce death rates that dramatically i think society might be better for it. people who abuse alcohol are too large a minority to ignore!

Sunnyisland

AllyMcFearless wrote: »

Personally, both have pros and cons. But as with anything, in moderation they have a chance of increasing your enjoyment.

Misuse of alcohol is a messy path, and smoking carries a stigma as well as many illnesses promoted by usage.

Mixed bag!

Where I can see some pros of social\moderate drinking,I cant see any pros for smoking ?

realies

realies wrote: »

Where I can see some pros of social\moderate drinking,I cant see any pros for smoking ?

I enjoy it.

DEFTLEFTHAND

realies wrote: »

Where I can see some pros of social\moderate drinking,I cant see any pros for smoking ?

Very few really, a quick google search throws up a couple. There is some evidence to suggest that smoking decreases the risk of Parkinsons Disease, the nicotine acts as dopamine stimulant.
Also the prevention of certain of certain stomach ulcers can be aided by smoking.

As well of course, it is a pleasurable sensation and acts as a relaxant for the user

Sunnyisland

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Very few really, a quick google search throws up a couple. There is some evidence to suggest that smoking decreases the risk of Parkinson's Disease, the nicotine acts as dopamine stimulant.
Also the prevention of certain of certain stomach ulcers can be aided by smoking.

Didn't know that ? thanks.......Maybe they should put that on there packs

crazy cabbage

murphm45 wrote: »

Sorry crazy cabbage i appreciate i'm sticking my oar in where id doesn't belong but some of this feels a bit "rubbishy". For example "there's no such thing as a fatal marijuana overdose" i'm fairly sure there's no such thing as a fatal tobacco overdoes but millions of peopele die from tobacco related diseases. i assume you'd get a similar thing with cannabis. Also "usage" in the studies isn't specified, the average could be very low (e.g. once or twice a month). i'm sure a pint, or two or three cigarettes a week/month wouldn't lead to any appreciable difference in deaths either.

Also, even worse side bar, did you ever hear of confirmation bias? People will always find studies that verify their point of view even if they're vastly outweighted by ones to the contrary. Not saying this is the case here (i'm too lazy to look) but just something to watch out for.

yea. kinda going off topic to everyone else. really sorry.

This is the best documentry i have seen on the issue. Says everything way better than i can. Trust me. Watch it.

The thing that really annoys me about cigs is this. People say that they are addicted to them but why? nicoteen isn't addictive (well. not really). if you look how they are made they add a suger to make it tast better. This is what people are addicted it. This mean that all them nicotten patches are useless becouse nicotten isn't the problem

Also i believe that it is all the other carcinogens in cigs that are cancer causing.

Really stupid question here but why cant we just take out all these sugers and carcinogens. Whould that not solve alot a problems

Lisandro

The Jammy dodger wrote: »

It is my theory that Alcohol causes more deaths than ciggerettes, yet unlike ciggerettes alcohol is free to be advertised and sold for next to nothing. Should they ban the advertising of alcohol like they did with ciggerettes? Should they limit what it is we are allowed to consume in some way?

I mean ciggys are banned from public places and from advertising and the labels are on the ciggys also show black lungs and dirty rotten teeth and so on. Should they show the effects of alcoholism on the labels of bottles of wine and cans of beer?

Discuss......

You draw a very confused link between the number of deaths related to the consumption of a drug and whether or not it is justifiable to advertise it. When you look beneath the surface, you will see that the smoking trade is really a much more pernicious one than that of alcohol.

The point at which something becomes undesirable to promote is not when people suffer from its excess, but when people suffer from moderate use. It is the reason that it's OK to promote the consumption of fats, sugars, etc., but only as part of a balanced diet.

A responsible individual will drink alcohol, enjoy it and respect their own limits whereas an alcoholic will drink to the extent that they cannot not be affected in a bad way. Smoking, meanwhile, is a threat to one's health and hygiene, if it is done on any consistency, be it one a day or a pack a day.

The advertising of alcohol is the promotion of what is a very enjoyable social drug when consumed in moderation, whereas that of smoking is the promotion of an inherently unhealthy habit that should never be endorsed as a substance a healthy person ought to consume. Therefore, it is OK to promote the responsible consumption of alcohol, but we must realise and act on our responsibility in our advertising policies to discourage people from smoking.

Blondini

I smoke alcohol ...

badabing106

Breathing oxygen and eating is the cause of all deaths

af_thefragile

^Life is the cause of all deaths!

DEFTLEFTHAND

af_thefragile wrote: »

^Life is the cause of all deaths!

That's right folks, you can't win. Just try and enjoy yourself once and a while along the way.

Fr_Dougal

I had 15 smokes during the day and felt grand, had 4-5 pints tonight and now I can't drive and know I'll be somewhat groggy in the morning...but yeah cigarettes are worser...

AnonoBoy

Cigarettes cause more cancer cases but alcohol causes the misspelling of cigarettes though so that kind of evens things out so it does.

mikom

The Jammy dodger wrote: »

It is my theory that Alcohol causes more deaths than ciggerettes.

Yes, but alcohol also causes more lives as well.
Ya see it cancels all the bad stuff out....