Sought after rental locations

lawnmower_man

hi there

i figured this might be the place to try and pick someones brains about a particular subject

i recently came into some money and rather than place it at the mercy of the stock markets , i think i would be more comfortable buying an appartment in dublin city , i realise that the appartment market may not have reached the bottom but even at todays prices , a 6% plus yield appears to be the norm from appartment rentals , houses may well be a better bet in terms of capital appreciation but yield is my main priority right now as i will not be borrowing

i had the likes of bachelors walk or the ifsc in mind , rents for a two bed seem to be between 1100 and 1300 per month and theese kind of properties appear to start at around 200 k on daft.ie

in essence im trying to pin point what is the most in demand rental location in the capital

thanks

RATM

Leaving aside your choice of investment vehicle I would say you might be better off looking at 1 beds- in (some) case yields of 8-10% are possible.

Location wise I'd say do your research- read Daft reports and analyse the average time taken to rent out properties in different areas. Of course it is easy to just say Dublin 2 but really do your research as D2 is a big place and there is a massive difference between an apartment just off Stephen's Green and one just off Townsend Street.

Finally you mention not "being at the mercy of stock markets". I think you should really rethink your investment thinking here- stock markets have outperformed property hands down over the last 100 years, period. And if you pick a winner you can be in for some explosive returns- eg over on the investment forum a good few posters bought into Paddy Power shares at €25 a pop only 18 months ago. Today they are at €51 a share, in other words they have doubled their money in 18 months.

Even at a yield of 7% it would take you more than a decade to double your initial investment on property in Ireland. And your entire investment would be exposed to one asset class rather than having the safer ability to diversify that stocks and shares will give you.

lawnmower_man

RATM wrote: »

Leaving aside your choice of investment vehicle I would say you might be better off looking at 1 beds- in (some) case yields of 8-10% are possible.

Location wise I'd say do your research- read Daft reports and analyse the average time taken to rent out properties in different areas. Of course it is easy to just say Dublin 2 but really do your research as D2 is a big place and there is a massive difference between an apartment just off Stephen's Green and one just off Townsend Street.

Finally you mention not "being at the mercy of stock markets". I think you should really rethink your investment thinking here- stock markets have outperformed property hands down over the last 100 years, period. And if you pick a winner you can be in for some explosive returns- eg over on the investment forum a good few posters bought into Paddy Power shares at €25 a pop only 18 months ago. Today they are at €51 a share, in other words they have doubled their money in 18 months.

Even at a yield of 7% it would take you more than a decade to double your initial investment on property in Ireland. And your entire investment would be exposed to one asset class rather than having the safer ability to diversify that stocks and shares will give you.

i told a lie , i have some money in stocks , i just dont want to put all my money in them , im not clever enough and i dont have the stomach either , i missed out on paddy power however :mad: , kerry and glanbia have done well for me though

interesting point about one beds being the better choice , this is part of my research, asking people unconnected to the trade , with no agenda

Victor

RATM wrote: »

Finally you mention not "being at the mercy of stock markets". I think you should really rethink your investment thinking here- stock markets have outperformed property hands down over the last 100 years, period. And if you pick a winner you can be in for some explosive returns- eg over on the investment forum a good few posters bought into Paddy Power shares at €25 a pop only 18 months ago. Today they are at €51 a share, in other words they have doubled their money in 18 months.

Tell that to people who had banking shares.

RATM

Victor wrote: »

Tell that to people who had banking shares.

For sure, a lot of Irish people lost heavily on the shares of AIB and BOI. But that is because they left it all to stockbrokers - mainly Goodbody and Davy who were formerly the stockbroking arms of those two banks. There were vested interests at play with bank shares- even when BOI were crashing from €19 to €11 a share Davy were advising people to buy more becuase the banks wanted them to artificially prop up their share price. They eventually crashed all the way to 0.21c a share and it was only then that people like Gay Byrne started complaining despite having ample opportunity to exit (in profit) much much sooner. Instead they listened to vested interests and they got done over.

With the exception of a few very well run Irish companies like Paddy Power, Glanbia I would stay well away from Irish shares. This country is way too small and corrupt to trust those in charge. Also insider trading here rarely gets punished so it almost certainly goes on- it did in the DCC Fyfess case and I am sure it will again. In the US insider trading gets punished by jail sentences, in Ken Lay's case he got a 127 year prison sentence for manipulating the energy markets. I'd much rather be in markets where the punishment is severe for the type of crap the Irish banks pulled on the pensioners of this countyr who were all told by their brokers that their money was 'as safe as houses'.

OP good to hear you are already in the stock market. A well balanced portfolio should only be exposed around 20% to property and no more than that. If you can't afford a one bed using 20% of available cash then look at property funds in emerging economies like Brazil or India.

But if you want to go it alone then the other thread on here by Darren and his dealings with one bed apartments will be of interest to you for sure.

lawnmower_man

RATM wrote: »

For sure, a lot of Irish people lost heavily on the shares of AIB and BOI. But that is because they left it all to stockbrokers - mainly Goodbody and Davy who were formerly the stockbroking arms of those two banks. There were vested interests at play with bank shares- even when BOI were crashing from €19 to €11 a share Davy were advising people to buy more becuase the banks wanted them to artificially prop up their share price. They eventually crashed all the way to 0.21c a share and it was only then that people like Gay Byrne started complaining despite having ample opportunity to exit (in profit) much much sooner. Instead they listened to vested interests and they got done over.

With the exception of a few very well run Irish companies like Paddy Power, Glanbia I would stay well away from Irish shares. This country is way too small and corrupt to trust those in charge. Also insider trading here rarely gets punished so it almost certainly goes on- it did in the DCC Fyfess case and I am sure it will again. In the US insider trading gets punished by jail sentences, in Ken Lay's case he got a 127 year prison sentence for manipulating the energy markets. I'd much rather be in markets where the punishment is severe for the type of crap the Irish banks pulled on the pensioners of this countyr who were all told by their brokers that their money was 'as safe as houses'.

OP good to hear you are already in the stock market. A well balanced portfolio should only be exposed around 20% to property and no more than that. If you can't afford a one bed using 20% of available cash then look at property funds in emerging economies like Brazil or India.

But if you want to go it alone then the other thread on here by Darren and his dealings with one bed apartments will be of interest to you for sure.

would you include kerry group in your pick of respectable companies ?

btw , id be reluctant to buy shares in ryanair , the airline industry is notoriously hard to make money in and is completley at the mercy of the oil market

RATM

I've never analysed Kerry Group properly but I do seem them as a excellent company with a good management track record.
However Paddy Power and Glanbia would interest me more as I believe them to be in a serious growth phase at the moment. I've done some work from Paddy Power with my own business and I know some of the senior people in there to be at the very top of their game and they are an extremely ambitious company. Also the fact that their App is excellent means that every single person now has a very user friendly bookmakers on their phone in their pocket- such market penetration in gambling has never been possible on this scale before so I reckon there is some growth in them still to come, especially if they crack the US market as they're currently trying to do.

Also gambling is a vice- it is something that humans have been addicted to since the beginning of time. Along with other vices like alcohol, cigarettes, coffee, etc these industries always make money. It's just a matter of identifying the best companies within those sectors and getting in if the time is right.

Would agree with you on airlines- stay well away. I'm not knocking Ryanair as it is run very well but, as 9/11 proved, airlines are always only one major incident away from a share price crash. If terrorists set off a bomb in an airlines hangar and blew up even 10% of their fleet you'd very quickly see an investment crumble.

Also by investing in them you are taking another gamble- that their purchasing managers call the oil futures markets correctly when they hedge for fuel. Even Ryanair once had almost a years worth of profit wiped out when they bought aviation fuel on the futures market and the the price of oil tumbled soon after but they were locked in to a huge price.

bear_hunter

RATM wrote: »

I've never analysed Kerry Group properly but I do seem them as a excellent company with a good management track record.
However Paddy Power and Glanbia would interest me more as I believe them to be in a serious growth phase at the moment. I've done some work from Paddy Power with my own business and I know some of the senior people in there to be at the very top of their game and they are an extremely ambitious company. Also the fact that their App is excellent means that every single person now has a very user friendly bookmakers on their phone in their pocket- such market penetration in gambling has never been possible on this scale before so I reckon there is some growth in them still to come, especially if they crack the US market as they're currently trying to do.

Also gambling is a vice- it is something that humans have been addicted to since the beginning of time. Along with other vices like alcohol, cigarettes, coffee, etc these industries always make money. It's just a matter of identifying the best companies within those sectors and getting in if the time is right.

Would agree with you on airlines- stay well away. I'm not knocking Ryanair as it is run very well but, as 9/11 proved, airlines are always only one major incident away from a share price crash. If terrorists set off a bomb in an airlines hangar and blew up even 10% of their fleet you'd very quickly see an investment crumble.

Also by investing in them you are taking another gamble- that their purchasing managers call the oil futures markets correctly when they hedge for fuel. Even Ryanair once had almost a years worth of profit wiped out when they bought aviation fuel on the futures market and the the price of oil tumbled soon after but they were locked in to a huge price.

paddy power is an excellent company and a great long term bet but it has run up too far - too fast , was less than 30 euro last september , is 52 today , thats more growth than apple in less than twelve months , a correction is inevitable


as for kerry , kerry has the exact same potential as glanbia as it operates in the exact same market both domestically and globally , glanbia has seen the much greater run up this past six months so if i were to take profits on either at the moment , it would be glanbia

Victor

Uh, this is the Accommodation & Property board.