RaboDirectPro12 2012/13 General Discussion (with transfers/season preview)

CDM001

Its going to be close this year

CatFromHue

Glasgow got the 5 points away to Zebre today, 20-36 it finished. That puts them on second

Ulster - 53
Glasgow - 46
Leinster - 44
Ospreys - 43
Lanelli - 42
Munster - 41

There's 8 games left and I can see Ulster being wound in a bit. They're 7 points ahead of Glasgow now and still have to go to Glasgow and Leinster, other than those two games they should win the rest of who their games.

Leinster only have to play 3 more away games this season, two of which are to Dragons and Zebre. They do play all of the other top 6 teams though. Other than the Ospreys on the final day of the season, they have an excellent home record against the teams they have to play.

Munster on the other hand have 5 away games still to play, with two of them against other top 6 teams (Lanelli and Glasgow). Then they've two home games against Leinster and Ospreys who both know how to win in Thomond Park.

None of the Welsh or Scottish teams have any games left in Europe to aim for.

Certainly there's no room for error in the Rabo from now on in.

thomond2006

Zebre

Munster go to Scarlets next week, massive game.

Podge_irl

Zebre

CatFromHue wrote: »

There's 8 games left and I can see Ulster being wound in a bit. They're 7 points ahead of Glasgow now and still have to go to Glasgow and Leinster, other than those two games they should win the rest of who their games.

They play Glasgow on a 6N weekend though. That's definitely to Ulster's advantage.

Winters

Amazing how a split in the league table has occurred. The teams from 2nd down to 6th are all within 5 points of each other and then the gap between 6th and 7th is 13 points.

thomond2006

Zebre

Glasgow 3-34 up at Dragons, BP in the bag.

wtf

NEWPORT GWENT DRAGONS 3 - 60 GLASGOW WARRIORS

eyeball kid

Zebre

thomond2006 wrote: »

Glasgow 3-34 up at Dragons, BP in the bag.

Ended up 3-60 :eek:

awec

eyeball kid wrote: »

Ended up 3-60 :eek:

thomond2006

Zebre

Jesus you'd have made some money backing a margin like that!

CatFromHue

Some good games on next weekend

Cardiff v Connacht - A win for Connacht and they could be realistically looking at finishing in 7th.
Glasgow v Ulster - 2nd v 1st
Ospreys v Edinburgh - Ospreys need a BP win
Leinster v Lanelli - 3rd v 4th. A Leinster win would give them a bit of breathing space
Treviso v Munster - Munster need a win here but Treviso have beaten them in Italy before.
Zebre v Dragons - Zebre to get their first ever win.

thomond2006

Zebre

Former Dragons coach Paul Turner, who left under pretty negative circumstances, has had plenty to say about the heavy Dragons defeat:
https://twitter.com/paulturnerrugby

P_1

Wow, he certainly didn't hold anything back there.

decisions

Zebre

Bitter much?

He does have a point tho.

its_phil

The man abuses '#' on Twitter. Already dislike him. Fair enough if the Dragons were s*** but the man must be seriously out of touch with rugby if he doesnt think Glasgow aren't a good side and can't acknowledge they are quite deserving of their second place position this year.

thomond2006

Zebre

Ospreys have "no money" to spend on recruits: http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rugby-union/21593159

.ak

Zebre

De Luca banned for 13 weeks after this tip tackle. Fairly reckless, but don't know if I agree with 13 weeks. Again, it's all boils down to consistency, and this isn't consistent with other suspensions handed out to other tip tackles in the past few weeks. The one in the Connacht match was worse in regard to intent tbh.

CatFromHue

Rob Simmons got banned for 8 weeks for a tip tackle against France in November that was reduced to 5 weeks for something pretty similar.

thomond2006

Zebre

.ak wrote: »

De Luca banned for 13 weeks after this tip tackle. Fairly reckless, but don't know if I agree with 13 weeks. Again, it's all boils down to consistency, and this isn't consistent with other suspensions handed out to other tip tackles in the past few weeks. The one in the Connacht match was worse in regard to intent tbh.

I didn't see the one in the Connacht match but the De Luca one here looks very bad.

.ak

Zebre

thomond2006 wrote: »

I didn't see the one in the Connacht match but the De Luca one here looks very bad.

Yeah it's nasty, defo deserved the red and the ban, but it seemed more reckless to me, lazy tackling and frustration getting to De Luca after almost 80 minutes of a trashing. It doesn't look like there was any malice in it. Now, I'm not saying 13 weeks isn't right, but considering the other tackles we've seen, it's defo not in keeping with what's handed out.

To put it into consideration, Bradley Davies was handed a 7 week ban for his tip tackle on Donnacha Ryan. In my eyes, what Davies did was far, far worse. He was intentionally going out of his way to cause Ryan harm, off the ball (which makes it far worse imo). De Luca half committed to a tackle got lazy and instead of driving through the player he stupidly lifts his legs, he further complicates it by trying to un-commit himself by letting go, which makes it worse. Very reckless stuff, but I can't see how it warrants a longer ban than what others have done in recent times.

CatFromHue

Glasgow have recorded 4 straight maximum point wins in a row.

Who's record have they equaled?

The Dragons in 03/04 :eek:

Teferi

Scarlets

.ak wrote: »

De Luca banned for 13 weeks after this tip tackle. Fairly reckless, but don't know if I agree with 13 weeks. Again, it's all boils down to consistency, and this isn't consistent with other suspensions handed out to other tip tackles in the past few weeks. The one in the Connacht match was worse in regard to intent tbh.

That English U20 chap too, he only got 7 weeks and his little hissy fit after really annoyed me too. He deserved a longer ban.

De Luca at least realises what he did and backs off after. Don't think 13 weeks was deserved in the context of other similar sentences.

[Jackass]

Zebre

its_phil wrote: »

The man abuses '#' on Twitter. Already dislike him. Fair enough if the Dragons were s*** but the man must be seriously out of touch with rugby if he doesnt think Glasgow aren't a good side and can't acknowledge they are quite deserving of their second place position this year.

Agree 100%

Glasgow have seriously got their house in order. Their move to Scotstoun has been a great success, modern stadium and facilities with top class training set up there (and ground can be expanded to just about any size temporarily)

They've some superb players coming through, Maitland, Hogg, Jackson - other great stalwarts of Scottish team that beat Ireland there. It's sad to see Edinburgh so poor, but Glasgow have moved on a lot over the last few seasons and are becoming a serious team.

I'd love to see them make the next step and make Heineken Cup knock-outs.

Great for Scottish rugby and great for the league to have a Scottish team competing.

The only long term obstical I can see with Glasgow is how much of the crowd share is up for grabs? It is a city that hosts one of the greatest, oldest and largest football rivalries in the world, it lives and breathes football....just not sure how much impact rugby could ever make in a city like that...

thomond2006

Zebre

Glasgow have re-signed Richie Vernon from Sale and Mark Bennett from Clermont.

Bennett (turned 20 this month) was signed by Clermont at the beginning of last season but did his cruciate ligament early into his move. If Clermont were willing to take a punt on such a young player then he must be a great talent. He returned to Glasgow on loan recently but has now made the move permanent.

CIARAN_BOYLE

Zebre

[Jackass] wrote: »

The only long term obstical I can see with Glasgow is how much of the crowd share is up for grabs? It is a city that hosts one of the greatest, oldest and largest football rivalries in the world, it lives and breathes football....just not sure how much impact rugby could ever make in a city like that...

How long will Rangers retain their attendances while making their way up from the Doldrums of the Scotish league

There may be a large number of sports fans with time on their hands making the way to Scotstoun

[Jackass]

Zebre

thought that myself, but by the looks of it, they'll go straight back up, doubt they'll fail to win promotion from any league along the way. They have maintained 40k+ attendances and have a bigger budget than most team combined in the lower leagues.

Podge_irl

Zebre

[Jackass] wrote: »

thought that myself, but by the looks of it, they'll go straight back up, doubt they'll fail to win promotion from any league along the way. They have maintained 40k+ attendances and have a bigger budget than most team combined in the lower leagues.

Still, its a couple years for Warriors to possibly make an impression. Their attendance is incredibly poor, which is all the more unfortunate because they've been quite successful this season. A couple thousand extra fans would make a huge difference - especially in such a small stadium.

irishbucsfan

Podge_irl wrote: »

Still, its a couple years for Warriors to possibly make an impression. Their attendance is incredibly poor, which is all the more unfortunate because they've been quite successful this season. A couple thousand extra fans would make a huge difference - especially in such a small stadium.

Good performances in the Rabo mean literally nothing to new Scottish rugby fans though. They aren't going to tune into Alba to watch rugby if they aren't fans already!

They need success in the H Cup to bring in fans. They won only 1 game in the H Cup this season.

Podge_irl

Zebre

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Good performances in the Rabo mean literally nothing to new Scottish rugby fans though. They aren't going to tune into Alba to watch rugby if they aren't fans already!

They need success in the H Cup to bring in fans. They won only 1 game in the H Cup this season.

True, though annoying.

I don't really understand their performance in the HEC this year. They're good enough to beat all of Ulster, Castres and Northampton at home imo.

Wexfordboy89

big signing for the dragons

http://www1.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/15188/8547301/Edinburgh-scrum-half-Richie-Rees-to-join-Dragons-in-the-summer

ssaye

Wexfordboy89 wrote: »

big signing for the dragons

http://www1.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/15188/8547301/Edinburgh-scrum-half-Richie-Rees-to-join-Dragons-in-the-summer

Breaking the contract too, they mean little these days

thomond2006

Zebre

Hopefully Edinburgh will more SQ players opportunities next season. When they played Munster in the Rabo a few weeks back there was only 5 Scottish Qualified players in the lineup. Pretty ridiculous situation when Scotland only has two professional franchises.

totallegend

The Scarlets have lost another player; 21-year old out-half Owen Williams (MOTM against Munster recently) has signed for Leicester Tigers for next season.

An odd move? He's progressed a lot this season and would be challenging Priestland for the 10 jersey sooner rather than later I think. Is moving to Leicester to compete with Toby Flood and Dan Bowden a better option?

irishbucsfan

I suppose the Tigers lost Ford and they want to replace him. I think it's a good move for Williams, he'll get a good bit of rugby.

Winters

They lost Billy 36 as well as Ford.

By the sounds of it Scarlets were not happy to lose him. You never know the ins and outs of it but its a pity to see young players leave their local clubs before their development is complete, it leaves Scarlets in the lurch somewhat. There have been loads of rumours of Leicester sniffing around Irish players the last few months too. Dont they have their own academy?

irishbucsfan

Winters wrote: »

They lost Billy 36 as well as Ford.

By the sounds of it Scarlets were not happy to lose him. You never know the ins and outs of it but its a pity to see young players leave their local clubs before their development is complete, it leaves Scarlets in the lurch somewhat. There have been loads of rumours of Leicester sniffing around Irish players the last few months too. Dont they have their own academy?

They have one of the best academies in Europe. They had 2 academy graduates at 10 this season (Ford and Flood). One of them decided to leave so they had to replace him with another player for next season... Who does that sound like?

Winters

irishbucsfan wrote: »

They have one of the best academies in Europe. They had 2 academy graduates at 10 this season (Ford and Flood). One of them decided to leave so they had to replace him with another player for next season... Who does that sound like?

But they already signed Ryan Lamb.

If you are comparing Leinster's signing of 29 year old Kiwi Jimmy Gopperth from Newcastle Falcons to Leicester Tiger's signing of 21 year old Welsh Owen Williams from the Scarlets academy I wouldnt consider that quite like with like but fair point and I see where you are coming from.

I would see it as the situation being much tougher on Scarlets than Newcastle. I feel for Easterby and Scarlets fans here as they have lost an upcoming welsh player but he was out of contract so free to move.

I dont quite agree with the targeting of other academies but I doubt Irish provinces have always been innocent parties.

totallegend

irishbucsfan wrote: »

They have one of the best academies in Europe. They had 2 academy graduates at 10 this season (Ford and Flood). One of them decided to leave so they had to replace him with another player for next season... Who does that sound like?

Didn't Flood start out at Newcastle?

No real sympathy for Scarlets; plenty of Academy guys don't get senior contracts so conversely there's no real reason why an Academy player should feel particularly obliged to stay on... I'd just think Williams would have more chance of getting first-team action at Scarlets.

Edit: Just see from the above post that Tigers have also signed Ryan Lamb for next season, I missed that announcement completely. Makes this even harder to fathom; Flood, Lamb, Bowden and Williams all fighting it out for the ten jersey?

irishbucsfan

Oh I didn't know they'd signed Ryan Lamb either! That IS different!

I wouldn't have a problem with them signing Williams though if they only had Flood as a 10 going into next season (if you don't include Bowden).

errlloyd

Zebre

North has been linked with Northampton by BBC can't post a link from this, but it's pretty much their top rugby news story.

Wexfordboy89

heres the skysports news link about the possible north transfer

http://www1.skysports.com/rugby-union/news/12507/8577480/Northampton-bid-to-sign-Wales-winger-George-North-from-Scarlets

thomond2006

Zebre

This is terrible for the Rabo. If the best players are leaving the Rabo sides then it has a ripple effect on the other teams in the league.

Wexfordboy89

thomond2006 wrote: »

This is terrible for the Rabo. If the best players are leaving the Rabo sides then it has a ripple effect on the other teams in the league.

very true two of the biggest names in the comp leaving would be bad.

thomond2006

Zebre

Dan Biggar signs three year deal to stay at Ospreys: http://www.planetrugby.com/story/0,25883,3551_8600702,00.html

Good news, I think the Rabo league as a whole needs to see its best players stay as long as possible. It is losing some quality names like Lydiate, Fotuali'i, Sexton and Roberts in the summer.

totallegend

Former Ospreys wing Nikki Walker will be joining Edinburgh next season after Worcester agreed to release him. If he can stay injury-free, he'll be a good addition.

thomond2006

Zebre

totallegend wrote: »

Former Ospreys wing Nikki Walker will be joining Edinburgh next season after Worcester agreed to release him. If he can stay injury-free, he'll be a good addition.

You'd wonder if there will be a clearout in the summer from Edinburgh, a lot of recruitment last summer has yielded very little. There's a lot of NSQ players in the squad.

Fianna Fowl

thomond2006 wrote: »

This is terrible for the Rabo. If the best players are leaving the Rabo sides then it has a ripple effect on the other teams in the league.

Pro 12 is a farce and has no public appeal. It will continue to loose players and die a slow death.

Only solution is the replacement of the Pro 12, Premiership, Top 14 & H Cup with pan European wide league with a Division I & II of 20 teams each. A pan European league would allow the proper scheduling of the club and international matches. Not the current farce of a scenario where Pro 12 teams lose 10 of their best players to their country and fans are expected to believe that a game played in March with an reserve team is the same as a match played in December with a full team.

The 6 nations could be played over February & March with 2 weeks between games and full club games on the intervening weeks.

Either Ireland, Wales & Scotland lobby for it now or it will get there in stealth with all the best players in France or England.

molloyjh

Zebre

Fianna Fowl wrote: »

Pro 12 is a farce and has no public appeal. It will continue to loose players and die a slow death.

Only solution is the replacement of the Pro 12, Premiership, Top 14 & H Cup with pan European wide league with a Division I & II of 20 teams each. A pan European league would allow the proper scheduling of the club and international matches. Not the current farce of a scenario where Pro 12 teams lose 10 of their best players to their country and fans are expected to believe that a game played in March with an reserve team is the same as a match played in December with a full team.

The 6 nations could be played over February & March with 2 weeks between games and full club games on the intervening weeks.

Either Ireland, Wales & Scotland lobby for it now or it will get there in stealth with all the best players in France or England.

Good luck selling that to the English and French clubs....

thomond2006

Zebre

Fianna Fowl wrote: »

Only solution is the replacement of the Pro 12, Premiership, Top 14 & H Cup with pan European wide league with a Division I & II of 20 teams each. A pan European league would allow the proper scheduling of the club and international matches. Not the current farce of a scenario where Pro 12 teams lose 10 of their best players to their country and fans are expected to believe that a game played in March with an reserve team is the same as a match played in December with a full team.

The French clubs would never go for it, the Top14 has been around for decades and its history and tradition are hugely signficant. There is also far more money floating around in France, in both TV money (Canal + pay €12m a year for the TV rights IIRC) and club finances. It wouldn't make sense for the French clubs / LNR to join a European 'Super League'.

Am I the only one that enjoys the 'stripped down' fixtures?

I like seeing how academy players are doing, how the senior NIQs really take hold of the reigns for a couple of fixtures, and like to see how players 'buy in' to the overall ethos of a team.

I admit that the games become a little bit more unpredictable / lottery like, but c'est la vie.