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Michaela McAreavey trial accused 'not guilty'

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    #482
    Wacker The Attacker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,473 ✭✭✭Wacker The Attacker


    JONJO THE MISER wrote: »
    :mad:Just read that a newspaper over there published pictures of her dead body, people need to boycott that savage backward country, nothing better than a bunch of animals over there.
    A official boycott needs to begin and any of there citizens over here need to be deported.


    Perhaps the french government should boycott us for failing to find sophie toscan du plantiers murderer


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    #483
    token101
    Registered Users Posts: 3,050 ✭✭✭token101


    Wacker The Attacker wrote: »
    Why? If the evidence wasnt there to convict then they cant be convicted

    Being acquitted doesn't mean they are innocent


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    #484
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    Wacker The Attacker wrote: »
    This may not be a particularly popular or sensitive thing to say but here goes.

    There have been many remarks made about the standard of the police investigation in this particular case and a lot of these comments have their merits. However, as a nation, we are in no position to denigrate or criticize the standards of policing of any other nation without looking at our own police force first.

    A particular example that I've heard mentioned since the verdict is the Sophie Toscan Du Plantier murder investigation.
    I've seen this argument in relation to human rights abuses (we're in no position - look at the industrial schools), treatment of women in the Middle East (we're in no position - look at the laundries). If it's your point of view, ok, but I really don't understand it. Why are we in no position to criticise the handling of this case just because of a poorly handled case in this country? We're not those gardaí. If it's a terribly handled case, it's a terribly handled case - nothing wrong at all with criticising it.
    But I agree it's pathetic to call for a boycott on holidaying in Mauritius etc - yes because of other Mauritians deserve to have their economy suffer, ffs.

    With regards to the two men, I was very concerned when I heard reports of them being coerced into confessing, but I don't see any proof that they're definitely innocent either.


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    #485
    Wacker The Attacker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,473 ✭✭✭Wacker The Attacker


    token101 wrote: »
    Being acquitted doesn't mean they are innocent

    It means that they have been cleared of the crime they were charged with. Whats the difference?


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    #486
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    JONJO THE MISER wrote: »
    :mad:Just read that a newspaper over there published pictures of her dead body, people need to boycott that savage backward country, nothing better than a bunch of animals over there.
    Can only assume that's a piss-take. Something so stupid can't be genuine... can it?


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    #487
    Rasheed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Rasheed


    true wrote: »
    people who were not their husband/partner.
    Relatively few women - if any - were ever murdered by hotel workers in a sealed hotel compound.

    Oh Jesus. There is no way in hell that that man killed his wife, that concept is just ridiculous dreamed up by people looking for something more dramatic than the fact that a young woman was murdered. And her murderers are still walking free.


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    #488
    Wacker The Attacker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,473 ✭✭✭Wacker The Attacker


    Onixx wrote: »
    I've seen this argument in relation to human rights abuses (we're in no position - look at the industrial schools), treatment of women in the Middle East (we're in no position - look at the laundries). If it's your point of view, ok, but I really don't understand it. Why are we in no position to criticise the handling of this case just because of a poorly handled case in this country? We're not those gardaí. If it's a terribly handled case, it's a terribly handled case - nothing wrong at all with criticising it.
    But I agree it's pathetic to call for a boycott on holidaying in Mauritius etc - yes because of other Mauritians deserve to have their economy suffer, ffs.

    With regards to the two men, I was very concerned when I heard reports of them being coerced into confessing, but I don't see any proof that they're definitely innocent either.


    The essence of what I was trying to say was those in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

    They were trying to prove their guilt. Not their innocence


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    #489
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,814 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    OurLadyofKnock wrote: »
    and newspaper journalists are generally mentally ill, have drink, drug and sex addiction problems - many are social psychopaths devoid of compassion who found employment in a profession devoid of ethics.

    They are only "outraged" that a newspaper in Maritius can print what they wish they could here.

    I really do not know how to react to that post, it beggars belief that in this day and age some people can be so backwards. I know one very prolific ex journalist who routinely covered crime and time after time was disgusted by the events he had to cover. Each time he had to write about a murder or a rape it took a little out of him. He is one of the most pleasant, down to earth people that you will ever meet and to say that he is mentally ill or that he has a drink, drug or sex addiction would be ridiculous.

    I imagine that like many others your opinion of journalists has been coloured by the traditional cliched representations that we see on TV and in films. you may gnat to start living in the real world.


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    #490
    Sunnyisland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,562 ✭✭✭✭Sunnyisland


    JONJO THE MISER wrote: »
    :mad:Just read that a newspaper over there published pictures of her dead body, people need to boycott that savage backward country, nothing better than a bunch of animals over there.
    A official boycott needs to begin and any of there citizens over here need to be deported.


    I agree and while were at it, Our huge Armed forces can invade and take over there Island and govern it the way a proper country should be governed................We could show them a thing or two, cant we, well cant we. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: Its starting to get a bit ridiculous now folks.


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    #491
    SocSocPol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,043 ✭✭✭SocSocPol


    token101 wrote: »
    Being acquitted doesn't mean they are innocent
    Thats true, but it does mean that their presumption of innocence should be respected, I mean its not like they are the Birmingham 6 or Guilford 4 who got away with mass murder....if you get my point!


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    #492
    Madam_X
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,327 ✭✭✭Madam_X


    OurLadyofKnock wrote: »
    and newspaper journalists are generally mentally ill, have drink, drug and sex addiction problems - many are social psychopaths devoid of compassion who found employment in a profession devoid of ethics.
    Seems more like that's you, tbh. Name ONE such journalist, with proof obviously.
    Wacker The Attacker wrote: »
    The essence of what I was trying to say was those in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.
    I know. But what responsibility in relation to the Du Plantier case does, say, a person from Dundalk have? None. Sharing the same nationality with the gardaí working on it is, to say the least, tenuous.


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    #493
    the culture of deference
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 2,196 ✭✭✭the culture of deference


    Can you imagine getting married and having your new wife murdered on holiday in a 5 star honeymoon resort, then waiting 1 and a half years to get justice. Then a few days after the farce that was the trial, your dead wife's crime scene photos get published in a national newspaper.

    Its a nightmare. How could anyone cope with that. The depth of pain and hurt and anger that family must feel.


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    #494
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,814 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    steelcityblues wrote: »
    Watching and reading the media coverage, I get the same impression that because we have a victim who came from a prominent GAA family, that she matters more than other murder victims. I have been looking at the Indo's website in recent days, and they have about a dozen articles/columns on this one story.

    I honestly don't think the motives of FG in this are entirely sincere, either.

    Before others reply, I 100% want to see someone put in jail for this, but this week has really highlighted how the media and our political class are in their own bubble.

    I've been saying the same things for ages, if this was just some girl from Dublin who was murdered on holiday it would have got a little coverage but nowhere near the level this one has gotten. The amount of articles about her father in law and husband is unreal, the fact that he is invovled in the GAA seems to make his every move worthy of news coverage and fat as I'm concerned he is in no way famous. I still have no real idea who he is nor do I wish to know. I just wish that this entire debacle would be over with as I'm sickened by the constant coverage of the story, there are much more important worldwide events occurring far more deserving of news coverage.


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    #495
    Wacker The Attacker
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,473 ✭✭✭Wacker The Attacker


    the culture of deference wrote: »
    Can you imagine getting married and having your new wife murdered on holiday in a 5 star honeymoon resort, then waiting 1 and a half years to get justice. Then a few days after the farce that was the trial, your dead wife's crime scene photos get published in a national newspaper.

    Its a nightmare. How could anyone cope with that. The depth of pain and hurt and anger that family must feel.


    Even the scenes following their acquittal must have been difficult for the families of the victim


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    #496
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 25,611 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Has the family made any indication as to what they think of the verdict? Right from the start I imagine that they were quite skeptical especially given where they're from.


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    #497
    Crackle
    Closed Accounts Posts: 960 ✭✭✭Crackle


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I've been saying the same things for ages, if this was just some girl from Dublin who was murdered on holiday it would have got a little coverage but nowhere near the level this one has gotten. The amount of articles about her father in law and husband is unreal, the fact that he is invovled in the GAA seems to make his every move worthy of news coverage and fat as I'm concerned he is in no way famous. I still have no real idea who he is nor do I wish to know. I just wish that this entire debacle would be over with as I'm sickened by the constant coverage of the story, there are much more important worldwide events occurring far more deserving of news coverage.
    The media will cover events that people are interested in, and it's clear a lot of people are interested in this case.

    If you are sick of the coverage then the next time it's on the news, change the channel. If it's on the radio, change station. If it's in a newspaper, turn to the next page. If it's on boards.ie, don't click on the thread. Nobody is forcing you or anyone else to view/listen to the coverage of this case.


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    #498
    Rasheed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Rasheed


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I've been saying the same things for ages, if this was just some girl from Dublin who was murdered on holiday it would have got a little coverage but nowhere near the level this one has gotten. The amount of articles about her father in law and husband is unreal, the fact that he is invovled in the GAA seems to make his every move worthy of news coverage and fat as I'm concerned he is in no way famous. I still have no real idea who he is nor do I wish to know. I just wish that this entire debacle would be over with as I'm sickened by the constant coverage of the story, there are much more important worldwide events occurring far more deserving of news coverage.

    It might have got slighty more coverage but the family didn't ask for it. It got so much coverage because it was such a horrific case,the fact that she was on her honeymoon and that the police made a pure sh1te of the case. Mickey Harte is a lovley humble man who's obviously heartbroken. The man even came up to The Hyde in Roscommon yesterday when Tyrone was playing.


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    #499
    rubadubduba
    Closed Accounts Posts: 152 ✭✭rubadubduba


    from the pictures i've seen in the papers of the two men and by their celebrations i'd have to say the older fella looks the more dubious of the two.


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    #500
    steelcityblues
    Registered Users Posts: 4,630 ✭✭✭steelcityblues


    Crackle wrote: »
    The media will cover events that people are interested in, and it's clear a lot of people are interested in this case.

    If you are sick of the coverage then the next time it's on the news, change the channel. If it's on the radio, change station. If it's in a newspaper, turn to the next page. If it's on boards.ie, don't click on the thread. Nobody is forcing you or anyone else to view/listen to the coverage of this case.

    Having worked in the media, it is an editor, and his/her team of a few sub editors who sit around a table, and decide the daily agenda. They do not exactly go to serious lengths to ask a fair sample of the public of what they would like covered.


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    #501
    SocSocPol
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,043 ✭✭✭SocSocPol


    rubadubduba wrote: »
    from the pictures i've seen in the papers of the two men and by their celebrations i'd have to say the older fella looks the more dubious of the two.
    Wow , thats what i call real evidence, have you contacted the authorities with that? hell you may have just broken the case wide open!:rolleyes:


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    #502
    cruais
    Registered Users Posts: 1,559 ✭✭✭cruais


    Deleted User wrote: »
    I've been saying the same things for ages, if this was just some girl from Dublin who was murdered on holiday it would have got a little coverage but nowhere near the level this one has gotten. The amount of articles about her father in law and husband is unreal, the fact that he is invovled in the GAA seems to make his every move worthy of news coverage and fat as I'm concerned he is in no way famous. I still have no real idea who he is nor do I wish to know. I just wish that this entire debacle would be over with as I'm sickened by the constant coverage of the story, there are much more important worldwide events occurring far more deserving of news coverage.

    I can't say I agree with ya. Regardless of whos daughter and wife this girl was, she was murdered. The manner in which the whole trial was ran was an absolute farce. It lacked in professionalism throughout, with the lawyers seeming to achieve a celebrity status.

    Of course this trial was going to receive media attention and even more so due to the way things were conducted. Releasing these pictures is creating an even more negative view on Mauritius and completely lacks and sympathy for the families involved.


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    #503
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,814 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Crackle wrote: »
    The media will cover events that people are interested in, and it's clear a lot of people are interested in this case.

    If you are sick of the coverage then the next time it's on the news, change the channel. If it's on the radio, change station. If it's in a newspaper, turn to the next page. If it's on boards.ie, don't click on the thread. Nobody is forcing you or anyone else to view/listen to the coverage of this case.

    I do turn it off when it comes on but it's all over the place. There's non stop coverage of it all over the place and it simply is not warranted. It is a tragic case but there are far more important and tragic events occurring that are simply not getting the coverage because some editors think that this is a major story, it isn't they simply made it so.
    Rasheed wrote: »
    It might have got slighty more coverage but the family didn't ask for it. It got so much coverage because it was such a horrific case,the fact that she was on her honeymoon and that the police made a pure sh1te of the case. Mickey Harte is a lovley humble man who's obviously heartbroken. The man even came up to The Hyde in Roscommon yesterday when Tyrone was playing.

    I don't think that any family asks for coverage of an incidents such as this, it's the editors at the respective newspapers and TV stations who do. I really don't care if Mickey Harte is a lovely humble man and while I have no doubt that his family is in mourning and that their lives will never be the same again does the fact that he attended a GAA game warrant a page 3 story in a major newspaper?


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    #504
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,814 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    cruais wrote: »
    I can't say I agree with ya. Regardless of whos daughter and wife this girl was, she was murdered. The manner in which the whole trial was ran was an absolute farce. It lacked in professionalism throughout, with the lawyers seeming to achieve a celebrity status.

    Of course this trial was going to receive media attention and even more so due to the way things were conducted. Releasing these pictures is creating an even more negative view on Mauritius and completely lacks and sympathy for the families involved.

    Good job that the Gardai have never made a pigs ear of a case or that an Irish paper never published murder scene pictures. Crime scene pictures are published all the time but I have never seen any outrage over it on boards, does the fact that the murder victim is Irish make the publishing of the pictures that bit more wrong?


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    #505
    perri winkles
    Registered Users Posts: 489 ✭✭perri winkles


    A Mauritian paper has published pictures of the crime scene and of Michaela's body :mad: story on the Irish times website, will try link http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/breaking/2012/0715/breaking13.html

    What little respect I had for this country has been shattered after this. I thought all those calling boycott were being ridiculous but this really is a new low. Really can't believe it.

    Also seeing as the case is still open, is this not illegal?


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    #506
    Sunnyisland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,562 ✭✭✭✭Sunnyisland


    steel city blues wrote: »
    Having worked in the media, it is an editor, and his/her team of a few sub editors who sit around a table, and decide the daily agenda. They do not exactly go to serious lengths to ask a fair sample of the public of what they would like covered.


    It is more in there interest to see what reactions there headlines get and how many more newspapers they will sell,They will roll on & on with this story as long as they can till there own benefits see fit.Anyone who thinks the media are here for the good of the unfortunate victims are very much mistaken.


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    #507
    noodler
    Registered Users Posts: 26,392 ✭✭✭✭noodler


    OurLadyofKnock wrote: »
    they would if they could. In a moment.


    I sincerely doubt any decent broadsheet will publish those photos tomorrow.

    I even doubt that likes of thr Sun etc will publish them.


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    #508
    cruais
    Registered Users Posts: 1,559 ✭✭✭cruais


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Good job that the Gardai have never made a pigs ear of a case or that an Irish paper never published murder scene pictures. Crime scene pictures are published all the time but I have never seen any outrage over it on boards, does the fact that the murder victim is Irish make the publishing of the pictures that bit more wrong?

    Correct me if I'm wrong but as far as I'm aware, the gardai have never released a murder victims body to the media for front page news. I think the closest to this was the body in the canal case, where they released a picture of the victims face as they were unable to identify him.

    Anyway, to release those photos of michaela was just a vile act to sell a newspaper!


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    #509
    Augmerson
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭Augmerson


    Many people have brought up the murder of Frenchwoman Sophie Toscan Du Plantier to highlight the fact, and quite rightly, that an all out boycott of Mauritius, is hypocritical, when our efforts to bring to justice Toscan Du Plantier's killer have failed, and Toscan Du Plantier's murder and Michaela McAreavy's murder's are somewhat similar. It would be interesting to bring up some facts relating to that case.

    One person had said to Gardai, Marie Farrell, that on the night of Toscan Du Plantier's murder, she saw Ian Bailey, in the area, not far from the murdered woman's home. As far as the information I can find, either our DNA and forensic testing and detecting capabilities at that time were poor or non-existent, or not enough DNA to make a match was found or none at all, or not enough evidence could be brought to bear to make a case against Ian Bailey - a person of significant interest in this case, who was twice arrested by the Gardai and questioned. A serious failure occured when the state pathologist at the time, John Harbinson, couldn't make it to the crime scene until a full day after the crime had been detected. Vital evidence may have been lost, it's not known.

    Ian Bailey, a named suspect, was an English freelance journalist who lived in the area, and the first journalist to appear on the scene and report about the murder. Gardai had suspicions about articles he wrote about the murder. He denied anything to do with it. He was never formally charged with her murder, and I can't find out why exactly, but I would imagine, there just wasn't enough proper evidence, only circumstantial. The Gardai did hand over a file to the DPP, but the DPP never went the next step.

    It's particularly sad that nobody was ever charged, that the killer was never brought to justice for an awful crime. Worse still, that Irish authorities were initially not the most co-operative in sharing information when the French authorities wanted to come on board, but this kind of failure to co-operate is endemic in circumstances like these when going international with police agencies and judiciaries. There is unfortunately a lot of red tape, different laws.

    The case suffered further failure when Marie Farrell retracted her statement that she had seen Bailey in the area on the night of the killing, saying she only made the statement under Gardai pressure and coercion.

    In 2003, Bailey brought a libel case against a number of newspapers over those newspaper's printing of him as the chief suspect in the case. During that case, evidence was heard that, on at least one occasion, Bailey had confessed to locals of the murder. This snippet, taken from a Guardian article, is worth reading:
    The Guardian wrote:
    And yet suspicions about Bailey – unfair or otherwise – still linger. At the libel trial, several witnesses testified that Bailey had confessed to the killing – on each occasion, he claimed that he had been joking or that they were mistaken.

    Richie and Rosie Shelley, neighbours with whom Bailey spent New Year's Eve in 1998, said that, on that night, he appeared to break down in front of them, sobbing: "I did it, I did it, I went too far." Bailey insisted that he was imitating a mantra drilled into him during police interrogations: "You did it, you did it, you went too far."

    Then there were the scratches on Bailey's face and hands on the morning after the murder, which he attributed to plucking a turkey and putting up a Christmas tree. But perhaps the most unsettling details to emerge in the 2003 case concerned Bailey's physical mistreatment of his long-term partner, Jules Thomas, a Welsh-born artist. He beat her on three occasions – in 1993, 1996 and 2001. Thomas insisted the fights were "tussles", flaring up as a result of drink and "over in a flash", but her injuries were serious enough that Bailey was given a suspended jail sentence in 2001 after beating her with a leg crutch, leaving her with a black eye, a swollen lip and bruised jaw.

    So we didn't get justice right, but comparing us to the Mauritian's, they seemed to have straight up ****ed it.


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    #510
    Sunnyisland
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,562 ✭✭✭✭Sunnyisland


    Maybe the mauritius government can have a investigative tribunal into the whole episode,I am sure the Irish government could help them with that considering our expertise in these matters.


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    #511
    Rasheed
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,117 ✭✭✭Rasheed


    Deleted User wrote: »

    I don't think that any family asks for coverage of an incidents such as this, it's the editors at the respective newspapers and TV stations who do. I really don't care if Mickey Harte is a lovely humble man and while I have no doubt that his family is in mourning and that their lives will never be the same again does the fact that he attended a GAA game warrant a page 3 story in a major newspaper?
    Well obviously it does or it wouldn't be on it. Fact is, MOST of the country is interested that justice is done.

    Even if you don't know who Mickey Harte is, which I find hard to believe, you must surely agree that it that it's not right that her killer is still free and thats what warrents the interest.


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