Looking for cost of building a house in 2012/2013

gerry1958

Can you pm the link to me

yoloc

kkelliher wrote: »

And then round up to approx €215k if you actually want to have a realistic budget for a finished house

Why 45k extra

kkelliher

yoloc wrote: »

Why 45k extra

because you simply cannot finish a property to current building regs for €80/ft2. The average minimum allowance would need to be €100/ft2 with the majority that we work on closer to €150/ft2

kkelliher

kkelliher wrote: »

because you simply cannot finish a property to current building regs for €80/ft2. The average minimum allowance would need to be €100/ft2 with the majority that we work on closer to €150/ft2

and we have not dicussed the fact that all of these rates per ft2 are generally excluding VAT so you need to allow for same in addition.

expatin africa

Hi, am in the process of constructing a new build in a rural area at the moment, just thought i would share the costs so far, the house is 2,900sq/ft with attic accomadation, at the moment have sealed and are working on the electrical and the slabing for partition up stairs. the biggest cost i encountered so far was the material for the roof.
material 18,000 (including 10 vilux windows)
labour 6,000

the blockwork was laid for 70c a block (i provided material)

the concrete floors and foundations were laid by me, my father and brother

the plaster of of outside and inside is done, 5,000e but had to plat two men off each to get this as they started at 9,000e, (again i provided material

First fix of plumbing was 1,000e

the electrical will be 5,000e again had to play three electricians off against each other

the labour up stairs for the partitions and slabing is 4,000e,

the inslulation for the roof is going to be 5,000e

i did''nt put in any aeroboard into the cavity when we were doing the blockwall, we poured it after the roof was on this cost 2,400

the facia and soffit was 2,000e including labour

we are using normal slabs for up stairs but insulated on the gabels. price going to be around 2,200, it was 1,500 if no insulated slabs were used

the windows are 90mm pvc with wood finish thick got 17 windows, the front and back door and french doors for 7,000, (this was the hardest hangle ever done, in the end the father sealed the deal).

we hired the scaffolding for 1,000e for as long as you needed it, the man came put it up and came and took it down when finished

so far 95,000e has being put into the house from foundation up, this is being built by cash as i whole montly cheque goes on it,

my main question is does any one know how much a WITH SEPTIC TANK, PURAFLOW EFFLUENT TREATEMENT SYSTEM AND SOIL POLISHING FILTER would cost to buy and install. as i fear this will be the biggest cost


this is my first post on boards will have to edit it a few times to get it right as sure i forgot a lot thing i should have put it, have pics of the build process if anyone wants

sheff the ref

The Bord Na Mona system would have had a soil polishing filter and was around €5,000 back in the boom and included the tank. The Biocycle tanks were around €2500 to €3000 in that period. I know someone who got one up North last year, and from hazy memory the tank cost around £1700 I think

sheff the ref

Sounds like negotiation could have saved you a good few thousand.

What is the ball park overall figure for the sum saved based on the original prices and the final haggled prices??

UrbanFret

expatin africa wrote: »

Hi, am in the process of constructing a new build in a rural area at the moment, just thought i would share the costs so far, the house is 2,900sq/ft with attic accomadation, at the moment have sealed and are working on the electrical and the slabing for partition up stairs. the biggest cost i encountered so far was the material for the roof.
material 18,000 (including 10 vilux windows)
labour 6,000

the blockwork was laid for 70c a block (i provided material)

the concrete floors and foundations were laid by me, my father and brother

the plaster of of outside and inside is done, 5,000e but had to plat two men off each to get this as they started at 9,000e, (again i provided material

First fix of plumbing was 1,000e

the electrical will be 5,000e again had to play three electricians off against each other

the labour up stairs for the partitions and slabing is 4,000e,

the inslulation for the roof is going to be 5,000e

i did''nt put in any aeroboard into the cavity when we were doing the blockwall, we poured it after the roof was on this cost 2,400

the facia and soffit was 2,000e including labour

we are using normal slabs for up stairs but insulated on the gabels. price going to be around 2,200, it was 1,500 if no insulated slabs were used

the windows are 90mm pvc with wood finish thick got 17 windows, the front and back door and french doors for 7,000, (this was the hardest hangle ever done, in the end the father sealed the deal).

we hired the scaffolding for 1,000e for as long as you needed it, the man came put it up and came and took it down when finished

so far 95,000e has being put into the house from foundation up, this is being built by cash as i whole montly cheque goes on it,

my main question is does any one know how much a WITH SEPTIC TANK, PURAFLOW EFFLUENT TREATEMENT SYSTEM AND SOIL POLISHING FILTER would cost to buy and install. as i fear this will be the biggest cost


this is my first post on boards will have to edit it a few times to get it right as sure i forgot a lot thing i should have put it, have pics of the build process if anyone wants

I did mine last week. Kingspan p6 Domestic Sewage Treatment Plant pumped(certified and commissioned) cost €2500, Soil polishing filter , hymac ,pipes , stones,labour etc about another €5000. You seem to know how to haggle so on that basis €7500.

expatin africa

i am afraid it is not me who is good at haggling over the price, it is the father, he is over day to day running of site as i am working abroad, but thanks for the response as i can start budgeting now for it

BryanF

here we go again! (no offense meant personally Expatin but..) what is ingored in some self builders posts is the father/brother/cousin/ partner who is:

expatin africa wrote: »

i am afraid it is not me who is good at haggling over the price, it is the father, he is over day to day running of site as i am working abroad, but thanks for the response as i can start budgeting now for it

so when you say that your 'self building' the average newbie to this process takes the poster at face value, when in fact there is a project manager who is not taking a wages on site running the job. which would add (for arguments sake) 30K ? to the price of the job, if you didn't have this kind free labour

sheff the ref wrote: »

Sounds like negotiation could have saved you a good few thousand. What is the ball park overall figure for the sum saved based on the original prices and the final haggled prices??

this is the real question we should be asking!

this is being built by cash as i whole montly cheque goes on it

ah! 'cash prices'... how many self-builder are in a position with their bank that they can get cash prices from every subbie?
i hope your father has the paper work in order if the revenue come to visit which is increasingly in frequency at the moment

(please note that this forum must abide by its charter which includes a section entitled: respect the law)

W123-80's

kkelliher wrote: »

because you simply cannot finish a property to current building regs for €80/ft2. The average minimum allowance would need to be €100/ft2 with the majority that we work on closer to €150/ft2

This is what is really beginning to frighten me.
As mentioned in an earlier post, I am hoping to start a 2,600sq ft dormer next year. Our budget is 180k with a max of 200k.
According to the figures above it will cost us anywhere between €260k and €325k.
At those rates there is no doubt in my mind that we are well of buy a house.
As I mentioned earlier, I will have plenty of help with certain jobs (ground work, carpentry) and hopefully a few cash jobs.

What makes it impossible to complete a house to current building regs for less than €100 per sq ft?
That is a genuine question, I'm beginning to get cold feet to the whole project at this stage.

kkelliher

W123-80's wrote: »

This is what is really beginning to frighten me.
As mentioned in an earlier post, I am hoping to start a 2,600sq ft dormer next year. Our budget is 180k with a max of 200k.
According to the figures above it will cost us anywhere between €260k and €325k.
At those rates there is no doubt in my mind that we are well of buy a house.
As I mentioned earlier, I will have plenty of help with certain jobs (ground work, carpentry) and hopefully a few cash jobs.

What makes it impossible to complete a house to current building regs for less than €100 per sq ft?
That is a genuine question, I'm beginning to get cold feet to the whole project at this stage.

The simply answer is the reailty of what is required and the cost of having it done.

The bottom line is that every project is different, has different labour resourses (some can get it free others cannot), has different specifications (laminate floors v porcelan tile v parquet floor), has different heating systems, has different electrical specifications and systems, has different ground conditions, has different engineering constraints, has different layouts, has different number of storeys and therefore roof area etc etc etc.

There is also the question of supervision, complying with regulations, certification, contributions, driveways, entrances, site boundaries, landscaping etc etc. What one person includes in the real cost others seem to think it dosnt matter and can be done overtime and for some reason is not included in their costs.

In order to know what YOUR house is going to cost you need to have it costed. simply as that. guessing, using per square foot costs plucked from the sky, taking to builders for guesstimates etc are all the wrong way to go about it as they so often lead to disaster when you run out of money.

Its like comparing cars - do all cars cost the same.....No. Why? because they all have different specifications. So why is everyone under some illusion that houses should cost the same? My role is not to worry people its to relay facts and the facts are what they are and the cost of YOUR houses is going to be what it is depending on what you build, how you build it, who builds it and how you pay for it.

BryanF

W123-80's wrote: »

I am hoping to start a 2,600sq ft dormer next year.

why do you need 2,600? would 1600 not do you?

as an exercise when you look at your drawings

• colour in all the circulation space corridors, hall, landing, thoroughfare through kitchen due to too many doors etc..
• then colour in the area in the habitable rooms that you will actually 'functionally' use - look at the where the couch will be in reality, then look at the areas that will gather dust.

at 2600 your looking at a 5 bed plus two living spaces, utility and all the trimmings - is all that floor space necessary?

W123-80's

kkelliher wrote: »

The simply answer is the reailty of what is required and the cost of having it done.

The bottom line is that every project is different, has different labour resourses (some can get it free others cannot), has different specifications (laminate floors v porcelan tile v parquet floor), has different heating systems, has different electrical specifications and systems, has different ground conditions, has different engineering constraints, has different layouts, has different number of storeys and therefore roof area etc etc etc.

There is also the question of supervision, complying with regulations, certification, contributions, driveways, entrances, site boundaries, landscaping etc etc. What one person includes in the real cost others seem to think it dosnt matter and can be done overtime and for some reason is not included in their costs.

In order to know what YOUR house is going to cost you need to have it costed. simply as that. guessing, using per square foot costs plucked from the sky, taking to builders for guesstimates etc are all the wrong way to go about it as they so often lead to disaster when you run out of money.

Its like comparing cars - do all cars cost the same.....No. Why? because they all have different specifications. So why is everyone under some illusion that houses should cost the same? My role is not to worry people its to relay facts and the facts are what they are and the cost of YOUR houses is going to be what it is depending on what you build, how you build it, who builds it and how you pay for it.

Thanks for the reply. I understand the whole variance on specifications side of things. I have family/friends who have houses barely finished and will work on them over the next few years and others who walked into beautifully finished palaces. Obviously different strokes for different folks etc.

I still don't understand, after everything you said there about finishes, labour resources, ground conditions, heating specs etc etc, how it is impossible to build a house to current building regs for less than €100 per sq foot.
If every project is different and people have different expectations of what is an acceptable finish surely this makes it impossible to put a min figure on a per sq foot charge?

If I do alot of work myself, pull in a little free labour, have the site and PP sorted, already have water on site surely it has to be at least possible??

I'm going to get the house costed in the next week or two to see if it's worth my while employing a contractor to take the house to a builders finish. I will post up the costings when I have them. To be honest I am kind of dreading what will come back to me at this stage.!

Thanks for your input, all the info on this thread is invaluable.

BryanF

W123-80's wrote: »

I'm going to get the house costed in the next week

there you go!

your taking your tender drawings, provisional BER calc (decisions on heating system) & detailed specification, along with your scope of work (that outlines what you do not intend to get for free through family friends etc) to an independent quanity surveyor - please let us know how you get on, and feel free to upload a detailed break-down on here, that would be great!

fare play

W123-80's

BryanF wrote: »

why do you need 2,600? would 1600 not do you?

as an exercise when you look at your drawings

• colour in all the circulation space corridors, hall, landing, thoroughfare through kitchen due to too many doors etc..
• then colour in the area in the habitable rooms that you will actually 'functionally' use - look at the where the couch will be in reality, then look at the areas that will gather dust.

at 2600 your looking at a 5 bed plus two living spaces, utility and all the trimmings - is all that floor space necessary?

That's a good point. I'm going to do that this evening with my wife.
There is also a sun room on the side that we could probably do without in fairness.
Out of interest, if we decided to reduce the house size, change a few rooms etc, would that mean a full re-application for planning permission or is there some sort of avenue that we can get an amendment to the current granted planning permission.
Thanks.

Frog Song

W123-80's wrote: »

This is what is really beginning to frighten me.
As mentioned in an earlier post, I am hoping to start a 2,600sq ft dormer next year. Our budget is 180k with a max of 200k.
According to the figures above it will cost us anywhere between €260k and €325k.
At those rates there is no doubt in my mind that we are well of buy a house.
As I mentioned earlier, I will have plenty of help with certain jobs (ground work, carpentry) and hopefully a few cash jobs.

What makes it impossible to complete a house to current building regs for less than €100 per sq ft?
That is a genuine question, I'm beginning to get cold feet to the whole project at this stage.

As helpful as advice is on here get quotes before you let anyone scare you off. We have been quoted 85 per sq ft. With builders with a very good rep, they've built numerous houses around our area and everyone we asked and saw the houses of said they were very happy with them. Maybe it depends on what your location is too and by all means cut out bits that could save you a lot of money but definitely get quotes first before you make any decisions.

BryanF

W123-80's wrote: »

if we decided to reduce the house size, change a few rooms etc, would that mean a full re-application for planning permission or is there some sort of avenue that we can get an amendment to the current granted planning permission.
Thanks.

yes, potentially a new application -speak to your architect as s/he understands your particular house best

kkelliher

Frog Song wrote: »

We have been quoted 85 per sq ft.

An this is the problem. It does not in any way give any detail of what is included and to what standard. Is it including or excluding vat for example. Is a kitchen included, are the entire groundworks including driveway and boundary walls included. Is tiling, painting, timber floors, sanitary ware included etc etc etc

BryanF

Frog Song wrote: »

1. We have been quoted 85 per sq ft.
2. they've built numerous houses around our area
3. Maybe it depends on what your location is too
4. and by all means cut out bits that could save you a lot of money
5. but definitely get quotes first before you make any decisions.

1. quoted and completed dwelling to satisfaction of mortgage persons are two different things
2. under the 2011 part L , including vat, waste etc ? excluding council fees & professional fees i assume - would you be willing to give us the details of the quotation?
3. agreed
4. im not clear on how much builders finish you can 'cut out'? given that the bank will want planning & building reg compliance before releasing the final mortgage payment generally in excess of 10%
5. definitely have detailed drawings and specification before getting quotes, so you can compare like with like

kkelliher

W123-80's wrote: »

I still don't understand, after everything you said there about finishes, labour resources, ground conditions, heating specs etc etc, how it is impossible to build a house to current building regs for less than €100 per sq foot.

because when you take the word average and base it over the amount of properties that cross our desk on an ongoing basis, we see what the average costs are and therefore we express what we feel is possible and impossible. When you add in free labour etc then of course this changes the equation. You also need to take vat into account and at 13.5% your figures will reduce on actual cost of work.

W123-80's wrote: »

If I do alot of work myself, pull in a little free labour, have the site and PP sorted, already have water on site surely it has to be at least possible??

clearly that would not be like with like to those who do not have this ability. When we quote figures per ft2 we are quoting based on builder doing the works and obviously not for free as despite what peple on boards.ie believe, the majority of properties are still built compltly by builders not self builders.

W123-80's wrote: »

I'm going to get the house costed in the next week or two to see if it's worth my while employing a contractor to take the house to a builders finish. I will post up the costings when I have them. To be honest I am kind of dreading what will come back to me at this stage.!

The best stage you can do is do this.

archtech

Frog Song wrote: »

by all means cut out bits that could save you a lot of money

recently I came across a case where builder told a client he could save them a good bit of money by omitting thermal blocks from the construction. The client went ahead and did it, but now is in the situation where they are going to have to spend 3 times the saving to achieve compliance with Part L.

sheff the ref

Just did a few sums there

For arguments sake, if I choose to labour for a couple of blocklayers myself and the blockwork takes say 10 days.

For arguments sake that is 10 days by a nominal rate of say €100. That is €1000 euro saved on the job. On a house of 2000 square feet, saving €1000 reduces the building price by 50 cent a square foot. Not a massive saving...........

It would fund a sofa though!!!

You would need to be doing €10000 worth of labour yourself for a €5 a square foot saving. Obviously if you mind the pennies, the pounds will mind themselves but in most cases, I do not think that significant saving is there to be made on labour and haggling would save more than doing the job yourself.

sheff the ref

I have heard so much about the banks holding back on the extra 10% that you would nearly want to be finishing the job for the 90% and letting them hold onto the extra 10%

BryanF wrote: »

[/LIST]

1. quoted and completed dwelling to satisfaction of mortgage persons are two different things
2. under the 2011 part L , including vat, waste etc ? excluding council fees & professional fees i assume - would you be willing to give us the details of the quotation?
3. agreed
4. im not clear on how much builders finish you can 'cut out'? given that the bank will want planning & building reg compliance before releasing the final mortgage payment generally in excess of 10%
5. definitely have detailed drawings and specification before getting quotes, so you can compare like with like

Open A

Self-building to be phased out under the New Regulations:
http://bregsforum.wordpress.com/2013/12/04/self-builders-to-be-phased-out-under-s-i-80-bregs/

BryanF

Open A wrote: »

Self-building to be phased out under the New Regulations:
http://bregsforum.wordpress.com/2013/12/04/self-builders-to-be-phased-out-under-s-i-80-bregs/

Open A, one thread is enough thanks

Open A

BryanF wrote: »

Open A, one thread is enough thanks

I think I posted to three.. sorry!

expatin africa

for the paperwork in order, i dont think its my responsability to make sure sub-contractors are paying tax or not, i hope there are, but i am paying cash as i am currently a resident of an african county where i work and paid in ireland into the credit union who i am not sure of this but dont have cheque books there is no loans involved in this house. i am giving a price and take it vat is included.

also one thing we decided this week, we will only finish two bedrooms and also leave one bedroom unfinished when we move in, and finish later in the year when more funds are available.

also when started i said sure 80-100euro sq/ft i would do it alot cheaper than that, o how wrong i was. also dont forget outside,

archtech

expatin africa wrote: »

paid in ireland into the credit union who i am not sure of this but dont have cheque books

But one can arrange payment by way of EFT or a bank draft form a credit union. Have you got invoices for the works to date?

expatin africa

yea i have receipts to show that i paid for the work done this is also to make sure that they dont come back in 4 months and say i did'nt pay, it is easier for me to just to take the money out when needed and pay by cash then doing bank drafts of eft,

also what in a ball park figure would stairs costs you as this is my next process to organise when i am home for christmas