Lets discuss 'knackers' shall we?.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Shamelessly stolen from my own After Hours Thread from last year.

My own OP from that thread;

Do you use this word, and in what context?.

When I was growing up it was an excepted description for a member of the traveling community, but its rare (if ever) I hear it used in that context these days, thankfully - tbh, I put it on a par with using the N word for black people.

However I do find it acceptable to describe scumbags, and I'm not in the least bit offended if its used in that context in my company.

Anyone with me on that, or is it a word which shouldn't be used in any context?.. (ok, exceptions can probably be made for a knackers yard but since I'm a Dub I've no idea if these even exist anymore).

Lets keep it civil eh?.

But I'd like to know how you guys use the word in a Dublin context.

And keep it bloody well civil people!.

I'm not including a pole as I'd rather read people's opinion on this as it might be reflected in how moderators see the word being used in future.

chin_grin

I'd use it for those engaging in a "knacker-like" behaviour.

Basically anything that would be deemed anti-social or intimidating to those who don't deserve it (the likes of lads who ask "What are you looking at?" even though you've just glanced at them).

Degsy

A knacker used to mean a smelly,badly-bred,unruly kid..the sort of kids who wore wellies to school and had a pair of tights holding up thier trousers.

Now,as far as i know,its only a derogatory term for members of the travelling community..the origin being in thier love for horses and most of those horses only being fit for the "knackers yard" or glue factory.

For anybody who cares,the Travller word for anybody who isnt a traveller is "buffer"..no idea where it comes from.

Tombi!

I don't really use it to describe travellers either.
And I haven't used it in years but it's just another word for skanger.
Back around 10 years ago or something it'd be used to describe behaviour that was dirty or someone that was dirty. Both inoffensive (is that even a word?). Now it's only really got negative meaning to describe a traveller.

Now I don't really use it. Maybe to describe a skanger if I think they look a lot worse for wear then the average person but that's really it.

Al Capwned

I think it has evolved from being a derogatory term for travellers, to being more of a catch-all term for people that you wouldn't want near you or your family. Bold, unlawful, ignorant....

frag420

^^^ this

Squ

A scumbag is a (generally) young fella who enjoys fúcking with people who he knows wont do a thing about it. Probably from a nice house with decent folks. Will grow out of it at some stage.

A knacker is a term to describe a lad from the lowest caste in this country. His parents and grandparents would all be of the same line of thinking when it comes to antisocial behaviour. The lad hasnt a hope in hell of outgrowing his surroundings. May or may not live in a dwelling with wheels.

Dyr

tbh we always used it for the travelling community, i.e "you're not going out dressed like a knacker"

eventually it became associated with durty, uncouth types with low moral standards and dodgy hygiene rather than just caravanning types

tbh I wouldnt consider using knacker to be offensive in a traveller context, that would be more for the likes of "smokey"

mikemac1

Grew up on a farm and knackerman was the guy who takes away dead livestock. Farmer calls up the knackerman to come and collect, just how it is. Traditional term but only farmers use it nowadays, not the general public.


I'd say intenerants, that's a bit old-fashioned nowadays.


A skanger is a skanger, a knacker is a violent skanger who threatens you or throws a beer bottle at you from across the street, something like that.
It's not the person, it's more the action, have they done knackerish behaviour, ok now they are a knacker

cson

Down the country a knacker is still a knacker per the regular connotation of the word. What I suspect has happened somewhat is that the definition has been carried up to Dublin by people from the country and used to describe what you'd otherwise call scumbags thus coming into common usage up here.

For me its your typical tracksuit wearing, Nike Air Max, peacock walking individuals with the "ahhhh heeeere leave ih ouu" accent. May be the case that such a person is an upstanding member of the community but tbh if you dress like that, talk like that and carry yourself like that then the burden of proof is on you to prove me wrong.

Ole Rodrigo

None of these words should be used. They serve no purpose other than to further alienate people/ groups and reinforce stereotypes. 'Skobes' is another one. Funnily enough, when those words are used to describe people it is the person using them them that ends up being closer to that which they are attempting to deride - the ignorant pouring derision upon the ignorant. We would be better off framing our concerns from the point of view of inequality and poverty..

Brokentime

The English have a better word, 'Chav'. Avoids any of the knacker/scumbags ambiguity.

We could also use skobie/skanger etc..

Degsy

Back in the mid 1980's what are know called scumbags were known as "Hoodies" or "Hoodahs".

Hoodies tended only to be worn by those people in those days.

Hoodies who were up to more than the usual were known as "Bogies"...Bogey became an insulting term for halfwits who affected the whole shifty demeanor of more serious players...those who wanted to be thought of as bogies,that is.

In Norn Iron such people were known as "Spides",short for Spider as they were "always hanging around".

In my Father's day..they were known as "Cornerboys" or "Gougers".

carlmango11

ror_74 wrote: »

None of these words should be used. They serve no purpose other than to further alienate people/ groups and reinforce stereotypes.

Should we pretend these people don't exist? Smells like political correctness nonsense.

Degsy

ror_74 wrote: »

None of these words should be used. They serve no purpose other than to further alienate people/ groups and reinforce stereotypes.

Rubbish.

Words dont alienate people..they alienate themselves through thier deeds and behaviour.

"Stereotypical" behaviour is often very stereotypical with certain stereotypes.

If prison fails to bother them i fail to see how negative epithets will.

mikemac1

If you read books about old Dublin and the tenements they had huge issues with "animal gangs"

Gangs of lads hanging around on corners and could be pretty violent.

Street against street, area against area.

Got busted up by the gardaí eventually

Great article on it here
http://www.independent.ie/national-news/taming-the-violent-animal-gang-2900596.html

Dyr

Degsy wrote: »

In my Father's day..they were known as "Cornerboys" or "Gougers".

Ya left out bowsie's and gurrier's

Ole Rodrigo

I don't know what you mean exactly by ' these people ' . As for political correctness, it's a decent enough attempt to make life more civilized.

Anyway, a decent standard of living plus more equal opportunity for everyone isn't the same thing as political correctness. Its just good policy when the money and expertise is there to implement it.

Degsy

ror_74 wrote: »

Anyway, a decent standard of living plus more equal opportunity for everyone isn't the same thing as political correctness..

Everybody gets free education..if they want to avail of it thats fine,if they dont its nobody else's fault.

A decent stadard of living is actually possible without ever having done a day's work..for some people they take this as a basic entitlement and take every oppurtunity to abuse the system along the way.

The welfare state is what created these people..make no mistake.

Boulevardier

On a related point, I am not sure there is anything all that wrong with using the word "tinker" for travelling people. It is not inherently derogatory, it is a historical term based on the travellers' own activities in "tinkering" i.e. mending pots and pans, etc.

Are there any travellers, tinkers etc. on this thread who could tell us what they think?

Squ

Degsy wrote: »

"Stereotypical" behaviour is often very stereotypical with certain sterotypes

I coludn't agree more!

latenia

The word knacker is now generally used to describe skangers (amongst the middle class anyway), so much so that people will use 'traveller' to convey precisely who they're talking about.

arybvtcw0eolkf

latenia wrote: »

The word knacker is now generally used to describe skangers (amongst the middle class anyway), so much so that people will use 'traveller' to convey precisely who they're talking about.

Got to agree completely with this, but its working class too.

Lads leave the PC argument out of this please, I really want to see how the word is being used in a Dublin context now ~ thanks.

hardCopy

I'd generally understand it to mean anti-social skangers, unless used in the definitive article "The Knackers".

I try not to use it to avoid ambiguity, I refer to anti-social types and skangers, scobies, scrotes or scumbags.

I'd never use the term "members of the travelling community" because it's just too long, I usually say travellers or tinkers.

I use knacker for scumbags, if I see someone spitting I think they're a knacker etc. I never ever use it for travellers but my mam does and I cringe when she says it.

Dirk Gently

Brock Tiny Tutorial wrote: »

I'm not including a pole.

good thinking, we don't want to bring swan eating into it.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Dirk Gently wrote: »

good thinking, we don't want to bring swan eating into it.

We can bring warnings and infractions into it

Miss Lockhart

It's not a word I like to use really. But if I do use it I am referring to skangers/scumbags. I also hear people refer to a "knacker-tache" meaning that hideous bit of upper-lip hair that skangers often sport. An of course there is "knacker drinking" which I think refers to skanger-like behaviour rather than the behaviour of travellers.

I would never use the word to refer to travellers.

My parents don't use the word but they would connect it to travellers.

FloatingVoter

I've got kids throwing empty bottles of bulmers into my back yard during the day. They are old school country "settled" travellers. These are knackers. The 10 year old idiots who tried to climb in my front window while I was watching TV were Dublin born and bred. These too are knackers - (correct Dub term is scroats or skangers).
All are knackers / skangers / scum / ****wits....any name you choose. Their inevitable heroin addiction and incarceration after 278 convictions will not be mourned. If one or two dies , it is one or two less.
They themselves have made it this way.
btw before the politically correct brigade get on my case...I have drank with and had my life saved by a member of the travelling community. These little ****ers and their parents play the "race card" so fast it is an insult to everybody.

dd972

what is it with those dreadful nasal whinging voices they have ( I'm typing from the Dublin area needless to say )

I cannot even get near it if I try to imitate it, are those nasal slurred accents real or are they an affectation as part of the uniform with the tracksuits?

Ironic thing about the tracksuits is how unfit and unathletic they are

arybvtcw0eolkf

dd972 wrote: »

what is it with those dreadful nasal whinging voices they have ( I'm typing from the Dublin area needless to say )

I cannot even get near it if I try to imitate it, are those nasal slurred accents real or are they an affectation as part of the uniform with the tracksuits?

Ironic thing about the tracksuits is how unfit and unathletic they are

Read the first post and thread title again please.