'Cut the dole' they say: What the IMF wants, the IMF gets

EchoO

puffishoes wrote: »

keep throwing out this number is pointless.

There is 400k+ unemployed.

The vast majority from a sector who have skills we mostly do not require anymore.

so there's not 26 people going for every job. we're creating on average 1k jobs a week. A lot of these jobs are skilled and a large portion of the 400k+ do not have these skills. so people need to upskill.

but i bet you there's not 26 people from the 400k throwing there CV into the take away in terenure.

from aprox 100 employed over the last month we've brought 90% or so from outside of ireland because the skills were not there.

we didn't have 26 people for every job applying. 26 cv's per opening would be a dreamland.

so stop with the numbers they don't give a clear picture of the situation.

None of the above makes the statement - "loads of notices in pub and cafe windows in town looking for people" any less spurious in the grand scheme of things. Which was the point I was addressing.

Tombi!

TheTurk1972 wrote: »

God help you is all I can say.
From all your posts on here, I dont see much hope for you personally getting a job tbh.

Thanks for you opnion I guess. But TBH your idea of "cut the dole and work non-exsitent jobs" is up there with needing divine help, too.

christmas2012

puffishoes wrote: »

didn't the ambulance drivers drive the wrong way? which is what caused the two hour drive on bad roads?

thats not the point really the point is that there was a 15 minute journey to a hospital in roscommon that was near her,but because our government (some frauds in there too)decided to CUT this hospital and not CUT their own wages..

whats good for the goose is good for the gander..

but they wont want to hear that at all,there is really one rule for them and one rule for us,the fact that there has been no strong uproar on RTE shows you who really is boss,not the public taxpayer but the governemnt who pay themselves with the taxpayers good money..

they are even going after the DOLE small fry they are going after instead of chasing the big bucks in the dail,senates,ceos,and consultant and business sharks double jobbing in the dail..

Sin City

CucaFace wrote: »

I pay enough taxes as it is for many scrongers to sit on their arses rather than go and out and work.

You are showing your stupidy with a comment like that.

So you honestly can't understand the link between having less to spend on health care because of increases in Govt spending on Social welfafe??

If there were jobs availible then people would take the,

So I guess youd prefer people to starve rather than pay any more


Again if there were jobs availible then people woul be off the dole

cutting it only makes the poor poorer

Dave!

Dave! wrote: »

Myself and several of my mates (and plenty of their mates) went on the dole after finishing college, and over the months (while still looking for work) managed to save up enough to go to Australia.

It's a pretty silly situation if that is possible. The dole shouldn't be as high for a 21 year old recent graduate living with mammy and daddy as it is for a parent who recently lost their job and has a mortgage.

And surely we can all get behind significantly reducing or removing the dole for long-term unemployed.

BTW this nonsense of "why don't the IMF tell the government to lower TD salaries?" is typical AH rabble rabble stuff. How much would that save the state? An insignificant amount. We still have a huge budget deficit which has to come down, and social welfare is one of the biggest costs to the exchequer, so populist stuff like reducing government salaries might make people feel better, and might be appropriate, but it's simply a distraction from the important and difficult decisions that the government was elected to make.

On 100 quid a week fair play to them. Also fair play for saving that while living with parents also on the welfare.

war_child

I wouldnt mind my money being cut if the government offered a job incentive scheme so that i could atleast make my money up with even 10hours a week work

But the idea of cutting someones money to encourage them back to work when there are no jobs to accomodate them is just ludicrous. Were not greedy people we just want the oppurtunity to be able to feed ourselves and keep a roof over our head.

Im a qualified carpenter by trade and imbeing forced to beg for labouring work trawling facebook sites with people looking for small building work done.

I could go to The states , canada or australia. But my support network is here the idea of leaving everything i know behind to work on a site in a country on the other side of the world should something go wrong terrifies me.

Plus my partner is on disability here, and the medical care she receives wouldnt be covered abroad. So i ask the question "Whats a bloke to do ?

smash

war_child wrote: »

Im a qualified carpenter by trade and imbeing forced to beg for labouring work trawling facebook sites with people looking for small building work done.

Could be part of your problem. Who uses facebook to advertise jobs?

Sin City

war_child wrote: »

I wouldnt mind my money being cut if the government offered a job incentive scheme so that i could atleast make my money up with even 10hours a week work

But the idea of cutting someones money to encourage them back to work when there are no jobs to accomodate them is just ludicrous. Were not greedy people we just want the oppurtunity to be able to feed ourselves and keep a roof over our head.

Im a qualified carpenter by trade and imbeing forced to beg for labouring work trawling facebook sites with people looking for small building work done.

I could go to The states , canada or australia. But my support network is here the idea of leaving everything i know behind to work on a site in a country on the other side of the world should something go wrong terrifies me.

Plus my partner is on disability here, and the medical care she receives wouldnt be covered abroad. So i ask the question "Whats a bloke to do ?

I feel for you mate but Ill bet there is someone here who is thinking

Well you should have thought about her disability before you decided to become unemployed

Or ok so Im supposed to pay for her disability treatment aswell as pay for him to have his jollies on the dole


Seriously some people arent happy unless they are looking down on folk

christmas2012

Or ok so Im supposed to pay for her disability treatment aswell as pay for him to have his jollies on the dol

how can you have your jollies on the dole,its **** all in comparison to the standard price of living.wake the hell up.

ZX7R

Sin City wrote: »

No government in power will cut the social welfare bill by 40 % its political suicide

That is what they said in greese they protested and voted in a new goverment twice and it still happened there.

emul8ter25

Deleted User wrote: »

i live on 101 euro a week its very hard you know i eat only once a day if im cut anymore i dunno what i will do

maybe stop paying for internet, which is not a necessity. im sure you have a cell phone as well...

Sin City

ZX7R wrote: »

That is what they said in greese they protested and voted in a new goverment twice and it still happened there.

Will Enda risk getting the boot though?

Tombi!

emul8ter25 wrote: »

maybe stop paying for internet, which is not a necessity. im sure you have a cell phone as well...

I suppose you're of the opinion "we'll post a letter to you if you get the job"?

CucaFace

Sin City wrote: »

If there were jobs availible then people would take the,

So I guess youd prefer people to starve rather than pay any more


Again if there were jobs availible then people woul be off the dole

cutting it only makes the poor poorer

Starve?

Please come off it, what might happen is some people couldn't get as much alcohol as they once could afford.

There is a certain element in this country that need to be pushed off Social welfare or out of the country entirely for the good of the country.

I'm Not saying that you are in this group, but you cannot deny there is a fair proportion of people living here that would gladly collect their dole and drink away for the next 20 years if they could, or go and have 4/5 babies safe in the knowledge that the rest of the people who are working can pay for the upbringing of their kids and their homes.

The system is broken and it is wrong.

And it needs to be fixed.

Like I said before the Dole should not be there to be used as a life style choice.

Sorry to say if the jobs you want can't be found or got in this country now, then you should be looking to move to europe where you can get these jobs, or you take the jobs that are available here, even if it means you end up with the same or less than you get on the dole.

The world doesn't owe anyone a living.

christmas2012

The system is broken and it is wrong.

And it needs to be fixed.

Like I said before the Dole should not be there to be used as a life style choice.

Its not a lifestyle choice for a lot of people,its a struggle.

I agree dole frauds need to be throughly checked up on and caught and brought to justice.

ZX7R

Sin City wrote: »

Will Enda risk getting the boot though?

I dont want to see cuts for any body,but i dont see what the goverment can do if the imf and e.u want these cuts done through our budget, want can we do. our goverment dont have a say over it any more ,it doesent matter whos in power

CucaFace

war_child wrote: »

I wouldnt mind my money being cut if the government offered a job incentive scheme so that i could atleast make my money up with even 10hours a week work

But the idea of cutting someones money to encourage them back to work when there are no jobs to accomodate them is just ludicrous. Were not greedy people we just want the oppurtunity to be able to feed ourselves and keep a roof over our head.

Im a qualified carpenter by trade and imbeing forced to beg for labouring work trawling facebook sites with people looking for small building work done.

I could go to The states , canada or australia. But my support network is here the idea of leaving everything i know behind to work on a site in a country on the other side of the world should something go wrong terrifies me.

Plus my partner is on disability here, and the medical care she receives wouldnt be covered abroad. So i ask the question "Whats a bloke to do ?

War Child while i do feel sorry for you, the reality is your industry is fcked and you will need to go where there is still construction going on in the world.

emul8ter25

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

I suppose you're of the opinion "we'll post a letter to you if you get the job"?

Dont care what your rational is.

Dont complain about not having enough money when you are spending it on unnecessary things.

Sin City

CucaFace wrote: »

Starve?

Please come off it, what might happen is some people couldn't get as much alcohol as they once could afford.

Are you for real man? Maybe a single person with no kids but a family come off it

CucaFace wrote: »

There is a certain element in this country that need to be pushed off Social welfare or out of the country entirely for the good of the country.

I'm Not saying that you are in this group, but you cannot deny there is a fair proportion of people living here that would gladly collect their dole and drink away for the next 20 years if they could, or go and have 4/5 babies safe in the knowledge that the rest of the people who are working can pay for the upbringing of their kids and their homes.

So the majority should be punished for the tiny minority?

CucaFace wrote: »

The system is broken and it is wrong.

And it needs to be fixed.Like I said before the Dole should not be there to be used as a life style choice.

Yes but not during a recession

Tombi!

emul8ter25 wrote: »

Dont care what your rational is.

Dont complain about not having enough money when you are spending it on unnecessary things.

Heh, claiming a phone isn't needed.

What's next? You don't need an address?

Jame Gumb

The Irish got soft and lazy during the boom.

We've gone from a nation of hard workers who thought nothing of heading over to Kilburn and working 60 hours a week to asking "is transport home provided?" in relation to a job vacancy.

No wonder non nationals have all the lower paid jobs...if the mentality displayed in threads like this is anything to go by, there are a lot of people who will never work again. They'll blame everyone else when in reality it's their own fault.

The IMF are right...let the wasters eat cake.

war_child

i have to say i personally dont pay any mind to people who look down , my skill is such that it provided a very good living for myself and my partner, and worrying bout disability and becoming unemployed i didnt wake up one morning and say Hmmmm ya know what things are going so well at the minute id LOVE to be unemployed for a while.

I use facebook sites because theirs always people looking forpainting decorating building work done for cheap, i use every tool at my disposal to get work and considering your on boards saying why would you use facebook you can obviously see how social networking sites can be used as a very useful business tool. The same as boards and adverts, i use em all.

But then again as i mentioned earlier i dont really care what u think or what u do. simple

golden lane

Sin City wrote: »

Are you for real man? Maybe a single person with no kids but a family come off it




So the majority should be punished for the tiny minority?



Yes but not during a recession

"not during a recession".....sadly, these things are not done, when they can be done.......they are only done when they have to be done.....that is, during a recession.....

Logical Fallacy

Jame Gumb wrote: »

The Irish got soft and lazy during the boom.

We've gone from a nation of hard workers who thought nothing of heading over to Kilburn and working 60 hours a week to asking "is transport home provided?" in relation to a job vacancy.

No wonder non nationals have all the lower paid jobs...if the mentality displayed in threads like this is anything to go by, there are a lot of people who will never work again. They'll blame everyone else when in reality it's their own fault.

The IMF are right...let the wasters eat cake.

Interestingly enough that quote is a fake, never uttered by Marie Antoinette. Unusual that a false quote, created for propaganda purposes is assumed to be true and accurate by many people.

emul8ter25

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Heh, claiming a phone isn't needed.

What's next? You don't need an address?

I see you lack reading comprehension skills.

I said a cell phone and internet connection is not needed.

I never mentioned a house phone.

Sin City

emul8ter25 wrote: »

I see you lack reading comprehension skills.

I said a cell phone and internet connection is not needed.

I never mentioned a house phone.

House phone can be even more expensive the a mobile phone these days

scdublin

This would be a great option if there was a way they could determine who is receiving too much and could cut down on their payments (while leaving the people who really need it).....eg: college graduate living at home with parents who pay for everything they need. I knew plenty of people like this who were getting close to €200 a week, about a year or two ago.

Tombi!

emul8ter25 wrote: »

I see you lack reading comprehension skills.

I said a cell phone and internet connection is not needed.

I never mentioned a house phone.

So you think paying a bill for a house phone is needed but buying a sixty euro phone with little to no cost (fiver credit every two weeks at most) isn't a necessity?

mitosis

Welfare payments are not limited to dole. There's also single parents, child allowance, medical cards, rent allowance and more. There surely needs to be cuts.
We can't keep taxing the employed, we need to cut costs also. Investment is needed to create jobs, and that money could readily be gleaned from welfare payments. I'd start with the rent allowance scheme - that's a farce that needs severe pruning. If you can't afford to pay more than €35.00 rent per week you should be back with your parents.

And obviously there will be exceptions and individual cases.

And the dole. You should not be able to afford a car, or to smoke when on the dole. But you are.

emul8ter25

Sin City wrote: »

House phone can be even more expensive the a mobile phone these days

That is true. Basic cell service can be cheap.
Cell service can also be very expensive and can be considered a luxury. It all depends what you get.

Im sure no one would argue someone on the dole needs a 70 euro a month cell plan with unlimited everything etc...

starbelgrade

The thread title is completely misleading, as is the spin put on the story by BreakingNews.ie

It's lazy journalism aimed at the Joe Duffy brigade.

The IMF report is easy enough to find online & it doesn't take much reading to realise that they haven't called for cuts in the dole. What they have suggested is that elimintating the payment of universal certain flat rate benefits, such as non-means tested child benefit, would result in significant cost savings to the government budgets.

It also recommends a review of the entire social welfare system - again in order to increase savings - but in a way that continues to protect the poor.


The full report is available to read here: http://www.imf.org/external/np/ms/2012/071812.htm

But I wouldn't want to spoil the party by letting the truth get in the way of a good rabble.

Tombi!

emul8ter25 wrote: »

That is true. Basic cell service can be cheap.
Cell service can also be very expensive and can be considered a luxury. It all depends what you get.

Im sure no one would argue someone on the dole needs a 70 euro a month cell plan with unlimited everything etc...

Oh, I see. You assume a mobile means a billpay phone.

Carry on.

Sonics2k

emul8ter25 wrote: »

I see you lack reading comprehension skills.

I said a cell phone and internet connection is not needed.

I never mentioned a house phone.

A house phone is often more expensive than a mobile. In fact I spend less than €10 a month actually making calls from my mobile.

And how exactly do you expect people to apply for jobs? You do realise that the -vast- majority of companies get people to apply online now, right?

Try it yourself, walk into any business from Gloria Jeans, HMV, O2 or even the clothes stores, and they'll tell you to apply online.

And how exactly do you expect him to look for work? Most companies use sites like jobs.ie to advertise instead of the old sign in the shop window technique, because they know they'll get to a wider audience.

So yeah, the internet is actually quite essential these days, it's not just for youtube and boards after all.

DEFTLEFTHAND

scdublin wrote: »

This would be a great option if there was a way they could determine who is receiving too much and could cut down on their payments (while leaving the people who really need it).....eg: college graduate living at home with parents who pay for everything they need. I knew plenty of people like this who were getting close to €200 a week, about a year or two ago.

Your right, it really needs to be means tested. I know a couple of people myself around my own age (24) who are finished up with college and back living at home with the parents paying for everything. There's no way these people should be getting the full amount every week.

puffishoes

christmas2012 wrote: »

thats not the point really the point is that there was a 15 minute journey to a hospital in roscommon that was near her,but because our government (some frauds in there too)decided to CUT this hospital and not CUT their own wages..

whats good for the goose is good for the gander..

but they wont want to hear that at all,there is really one rule for them and one rule for us,the fact that there has been no strong uproar on RTE shows you who really is boss,not the public taxpayer but the governemnt who pay themselves with the taxpayers good money..

they are even going after the DOLE small fry they are going after instead of chasing the big bucks in the dail,senates,ceos,and consultant and business sharks double jobbing in the dail..

but they said regardless of what hospital she went to she wouldn't have lived?

emul8ter25

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Oh, I see. You assume a mobile means a billpay phone.

Carry on.

ignore my obvious intention.

carry on.

Tombi!

emul8ter25 wrote: »

ignore my obvious intention.

carry on.

Your intentions to claim I'm on a 70 euro billpay since I'm on the dole?

You do realize if I even got a billpay phone, I'd never use it?

Most people I know on the dole use the 20 euro per month and free texts.

Sin City

emul8ter25 wrote: »

That is true. Basic cell service can be cheap.
Cell service can also be very expensive and can be considered a luxury. It all depends what you get.

Im sure no one would argue someone on the dole needs a 70 euro a month cell plan with unlimited everything etc...

70 a month is taking the piss.

Mine is 20 a month and I would never exceed any of the limits and its far cheaper than owning a house phone, plus you dont have to be home if a job calls while your out

war_child

I think it needs serious looking at , im not going to speak illof anyone or anything but i personally know of plenty of people who are getting supported living , child benefit rent allowance , medical card that shouldnt be entitled to these things.

My partner has a medical card because she attends the hospital 3 times aa month and attends her local GP 4 times a month she also has a standing prescription for 5 different medication. Those people who have nothing wrong with them claiming medical cards should be cut off without hesitation.

I cant speak for other only myself , we dont have children we dont get rent allowance i dont receive a medical card , we pay our rent out of our own pockets. So the government needs to be more stringent with its means assessment. And in regards to foreign nationals i seriously think there should be an lengtened time scale before they can claim social assistance like 3-5 years so they can contribute to the economy before beingpaid by the government. Thats not me being racist but were assessed on our stamps and so should they be.

puffishoes

Our shopping bill is aprox 50-60e a week for two people.

if you're on the dole you have in excess of 800e a month disposable income.

how the hell would one starve with more disposable income than most low paid workers?

Tombi!

puffishoes wrote: »

Our shopping bill is aprox 50-60e a week for two people.

if you're on the dole you have in excess of 800e a month disposable income.

how the hell would one starve with more disposable income than most low paid workers?

188 x 4 = 800+?

emul8ter25

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Your intentions to claim I'm on a 70 euro billpay since I'm on the dole?

You do realize if I even got a billpay phone, I'd never use it?

Most people I know on the dole use the 20 euro per month and free texts.

I didnt claim YOU are on anything. I dont care about your situation.

my point was an expensive bill pay phone is certainly a luxury. And if you think its not, it just goes to show what lazy self entitled wasters the Irish have become.

Sin City

puffishoes wrote: »

Our shopping bill is aprox 50-60e a week for two people.

if you're on the dole you have in excess of 800e a month disposable income.

how the hell would one starve with more disposable income than most low paid workers?

If your on the dole you have limited or no disposible income

Tombi!

emul8ter25 wrote: »

I didnt claim YOU are on anything. I dont care about your situation.

my point was an expensive bill pay phone is certainly a luxury. And if you think its not, it just goes to show what lazy self entitled wasters the Irish have become.

Ooh, but you said on the dole.

But yeah, if anyone was on a 70 per month bill phone, they're an idiot. Nobody needs it.

But hey, if you can afford it on the dole, I need to know how. Mind telling me how?

emul8ter25

Sin City wrote: »

If your on the dole you have limited or no disposible income

wait... what?

tell that to my cousin who goes to Vegas every year and drinks like a fish.

puffishoes

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

188 x 4 = 800+?

wow, you're not great at math.

What job are we going to get you into at all

188 X 52 = 9776

9776 / 12 = 814.60

so yes, in excess of 800e a month.

next question genius.

Sin City

emul8ter25 wrote: »

wait... what?

tell that to my cousin who goes to Vegas every year and drinks like a fish.

On the dole?

I think your cousin is having you on

Logical Fallacy

puffishoes wrote: »

Our shopping bill is aprox 50-60e a week for two people.

if you're on the dole you have in excess of 800e a month disposable income.

how the hell would one starve with more disposable income than most low paid workers?

Out of interest, how come you guys only have 50-60eu a week? Paying bills? Got rent to pay? Things like that?

emul8ter25

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

But hey, if you can afford it on the dole, I need to know how. Mind telling me how?

i wouldnt know. im not on the dole, nor could i afford such a plan for myself.

puffishoes

Logical Fallacy wrote: »

Out of interest, how come you guys only have 50-60eu a week? Paying bills? Got rent to pay? Things like that?

shopping bill.....