The Dark Knight Rises - seen thread *SPOILERS WITHIN* See Mod Warning in first post

humanji

Handsome Bob wrote: »

I think the person who happily stayed to die was one of the lads brought onto the plane with Bane, just a brainwashed disciple. As for the lads who attacked the plane, impressive, but could have just been hired guns themselves, a throwback to the skyhook method Bruce used in TDK in order for Bane to serve as a mirror to Bruce.

Look at the buildup to the first fight with Bane, Bruce easily disposed of Bane's goons. They were akin to Falcone's goons rather than LOS.

I'd have thought that it'd be a mix of mostly being those that Bane "hired" in Gotham, but since he'd been a mercenary for years before, he'd have also developed a highly trained team of "true believers". This team were the ones who we saw at the start and would be the main lieutenants in the army.

spankmaster2000

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Look at the buildup to the first fight with Bane, Bruce easily disposed of Bane's goons. They were akin to Falcone's goons rather than LOS.

Yeah, but Bruce easily disposed of 4 samurai-sword wiedling League of Shadows members in Batman Begins, along with their leader.
Alfred even manages to knock one of them out. Men personally trained by Ras Al Ghul himself.

Anyway; I suppose it doesn't matter really. It's not something I'd even noticed during the film; nor would it change anything in the story!

Fishooks12

IamMetaldave wrote: »

Well, I have been to see this 5 times now (and another tomorrow, with an IMAX viewing in London on the 10th of August) and have loved every showing of it. I've read 90% of the 60+ pages and the nit picking is just beyond a joke! Personally, if I was that irritated by a film, I wouldn't bother writing anything about or waste my time by doing so.

I find it very hard to watch a film, even one I've really enjoyed, more than once during a short space of time.

So because someone didn't enjoy it they shouldn't bother writing their opinion?

al28283

humanji wrote: »

I'd have thought that it'd be a mix of mostly being those that Bane "hired" in Gotham, but since he'd been a mercenary for years before, he'd have also developed a highly trained team of "true believers". This team were the ones who we saw at the start and would be the main lieutenants in the army.

Wasn't it the orphans and homeless who went to work in the sewers that Bane was using?

Overheal

PhiloCypher wrote: »

I wondered that myself initially but have since come to the conclusion(to be confirmed on a 2nd viewing) that the front wheel doesn't roll sideways at all only the back one.

both wheels definitely roll - he does a seriously sharp drift turn into the alley where he parked The Bat and both wheels surely flipped to allow him to pull it off (and what a damn epic drift!!!)

Not my biggest criticism by any means. I like all the engineering stuff; hell I doodle battlesuits (think Iron Man) all the time. Further nitpickery abounds when you wonder how a batpod got into the Tumbler design and wasn't present in the other Tumblers [Because he's batman] and that bit in TDK where he flips the Slaughter truck (a little unreal, but ok that **** was a "Ha Ha" moment) he just runs the batpod into the wall of a bank or something, flips the bike completely vertical and spins around. Its one of those things I cant help but always notice (like falling out of the penthouse with Rachel) but for the life of me, it's not enough to ruin these movies It's more like little things I'm sure they could have cleaned up with a little extra time in post production or a little extra stunt shooting (fire a grapple hook or something) but who the hell really cares enough.

Mickeroo

al28283 wrote: »

Robin has been pretty cool for a long time, just not on film.

You mean Damien Wayne? Wouldn't that be a great route to take for the reboot if they hadn't killed Tahlia in this, just substitute Blake for Grayson and have that little psycho as his sidekick!

I've given up on trying to read the whole thread, just too damn much!!

Saw the film on Tuesday night. I'm very much in the camp of thinking it was brilliant. It was a glorious mash-up of Knightfall and No Man's Land. I was slack jawed during the back-breaking scene. I thought the ending was brilliant too and was delighted at the way they manage to work Robin into the story without him really being Robin but still fulfilling a similar role. They even managed to have the Lazarus Pit in there, sure it was in a more metaphorical sense but in the end he still got his back broke, was put in the pit and came out healed.

It was much more similar in tone to BB rather than TDK and really braught the trilogy full circle in a very satisfying way. Much like the other movies they managed to deal with some pretty lofty themes for a summer blockbuster and unlike prometheus managed to deal with them successfully too.

There were flaws of course but only very minor, the biggest gripe I had was the whole nuclear bomb countdown, it was a bit generic for what I've come to expect of this series and funnily enough i was left thinking of Iron Man sacrificing himself at the end of Avengers when Batman had to do something similar in this. It didn't really spoil my enjoyment of the film at all though. It was also a bit rushed in a few other parts, the film obviously takes place over a period of 6 months to a year but they didn't do a great job of conveying that i thought.

i thought this was by far the most emotional of the three films though. Alfred was brilliant, the scene at the grave especially and when he comes clean about the letter, though I felt he should have been in the film more than he was. When bruce finally climbed out of the pit was great too.

The whole cast were really brilliant in this particularly Caine, Hardy, Levitt and Hathaway, but I can't really fault anyone apart from the bit where Tahlia died, her acting seemed a bit off to me for those few seconds. Hardy was great as Bane, even if he did sound a bit like a bond villain sometimes and his voice did feel like it was dubbed over a lot of the time but I'm willing to let that slide.

Overall I genuinely can't decide where I'd rate this in comparison to the other two. Each film has it's own theme and I like each one for different reasons. I think this was easily as good as BB and almost borderline with TDK, the only think that edges TDK maybe is the presence of Joker. Would love to see how they would have worked him into this somehow if Heath Ledger hadn't passed away, I think we might have just seen a very different film tbh!

Along with LOTR & Toy Story this stands up as one of the strongest most consistent trilogies out there imo!

Scanlas The 2nd

spankmaster2000 wrote: »

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Look at the buildup to the first fight with Bane, Bruce easily disposed of Bane's goons. They were akin to Falcone's goons rather than LOS.

Yeah, but Bruce easily disposed of 4 samurai-sword wiedling League of Shadows members in Batman Begins, along with their leader.
Alfred even manages to knock one of them out. Men personally trained by Ras Al Ghul himself.

Anyway; I suppose it doesn't matter really. It's not something I'd even noticed during the film; nor would it change anything in the story!

That wasn't easy, he basically lost the final fight against Ra's only for he was distracted by the explosion ahead.

Pomplamousse

fruvai wrote: »

Batman getting his back broken didn't wow you? I was like :eek:

Honestly? No it didn't. Probably because personally I'm just not a fan of that kind of beating someone to a pulp kind of violence, find it hard to watch. Give me exploding a bomb in someone's stomach/having half your face burnt off scenes over that any day:D

Grimebox

I didn't even realise his back was broken till the old guy in the prison mentioned his vertebrae was out of place. I never read any of the comics so didn't realise it was such a big deal

silvine

Who says Batman isn't realistic?

ronoc 1

i read a review of the film in hotpress and one of their criticisms is that christain bale was too wooden in the role,i was surprised at this becuse to me he has been an excellent batman.His scenes with michael caine in particular were outstanding.Just wondering what other people made of him in the series and whether he lacked charisma in the role.

Handsome Bob

Hot Press? Don't they have a sex advice columnist conveniently called Anne Sexton? Does anyone take them seriously?

Fishooks12

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Hot Press? Don't they have a sex advice columnist conveniently called Anne Sexton? Does anyone take them seriously?

What would that have to do with the guy who writes the reviews?

Turtyturd

Maybe his name is Mike Movieton.....although I would rubbish the claim that Bale is wooden, the scene where he stands over looking the party alone conveyed almost everything the character had been through to take him to the point he was at.

Handsome Bob

Fishooks12 wrote: »

What would that have to do with the guy who writes the reviews?

That one thing would tell me that they're a gimmicky outlet, and will thus say things that go against the grain. Of all the criticisms I've heard about TDKR, most I'm not even bothered about, to accuse Bale of being wooden in this film has to be the most ludicrous criticism I've read yet.

Fishooks12

Handsome Bob wrote: »

That one thing would tell me that they're a gimmicky outlet, and will thus say things that go against the grain. Of all the criticisms I've heard about TDKR, most I'm not even bothered about, to accuse Bale of being wooden in this film has to be the most ludicrous criticism I've read yet.

I felt he was a bit wooden in TDK. He loosened up for this though

While Bale was good as batman it's not close to many of his better performances.

dRNk SAnTA

Bane was a poor character. Difficult to understand, apart from his size I didn't think he was very menacing, and the mask completely removed Tom Hardy's ability to act. Some people will say "Tom Hardy acted with his eyes", but I consider it a massive failure of this movie.

The plot was convoluted and while the story was interesting, it was ruined by the rushed ending that resorted to clichés and ridiculous throw away comments in order to tie up the loose ends. Cliche - ticking time bomb, strap it to my flying machine and I'll take it out to sea. We've seen it before in countless super hero movies, we've even seen it in the camp 1960s Batman movie.

Then Lucius Fox at the end finding out that "Bruce Wayne ran a patch to fix the auto-pilot issue". OH COME ON. What a cop out, that is just insulting. So Batman is alive, I guess some people in the audience are happier knowing that he's met a nice lady and moved to Europe.

Does anyone else feel they missed the point of the whole "Hold the city hostage until the bomb goes off" social experiment? What exactly did it result in? The general public seemed to do little, there was a kangaroo court run by the criminal henchmen, but society basically did nothing. You just had the police guys running around with impunity, knocking on the sides of the bomb trucks to see what's inside. It was just dull.

The B.A.T. flying machine was a bit of a crutch I felt, a bit ridiculous, it was a vehicle (haha geddit?) to allow the script writers cut corners in a number of scenes.

And finally, to repeat, Bane and the villians were just so forgettable.

I'm a big batman fan but I think it's time for a bit of realism. Batman Begins wasn't THAT good, The Dark Knight WAS that good, and this one falls somewhere in between. TDK is probably the best super hero movie ever, but TDKR falls behind "Batman Returns" in the all-time Batman rankings.

I've got plenty more but I think I'll leave it there for now.

Grimebox

ronoc 1 wrote: »

i read a review of the film in hotpress and one of their criticisms is that christain bale was too wooden in the role,i was surprised at this becuse to me he has been an excellent batman.His scenes with michael caine in particular were outstanding.Just wondering what other people made of him in the series and whether he lacked charisma in the role.

While I would agree, I thought that was what Bruce Wayne/Batman's character was meant to be? In all the other films its similar. I wouldn't call him wooden as that is a bit insulting, apathetic maybe? Bale can't be faulted for playing his character perfectly

Handsome Bob

dRNk SAnTA wrote: »

We've seen it before in countless super hero movies, we've even seen it in the camp 1960s Batman movie.

Besides for the 1960s series (where you could argue that this film was paying a homage to), where exactly have you seen this in other superhero films?

I'm not exactly a fan of the bomb plot device, but to suggest that you've seem similar in other superhero franchises is folly I'm afraid.

Ape X

I haven't taken Hot Press seriously for about fifteen years. The final straw? A music review slated an album, with one of the reasons given being that the reviewer thought the lead singer of the band would be the type of guy to follow a particular football team, whom the reviewer hated

al28283

Mickeroo wrote: »

You mean Damien Wayne?

I prefer Tim Drake or Carrie Kelly myself but all of the Robins have been pretty cool at one stage or another, or at the very least lead to very interesting stories and situations for Batman himself.

humanji

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Besides for the 1960s series (where you could argue that this film was paying a homage to), where exactly have you seen this in other superhero films?

I'm not exactly a fan of the bomb plot device, but to suggest that you've seem similar in other superhero franchises is folly I'm afraid.

Well it happened in the Avengers, to name a recent film.

Mickeroo

dRNk SAnTA wrote: »

Then Lucius Fox at the end finding out that "Bruce Wayne ran a patch to fix the auto-pilot issue". OH COME ON. What a cop out, that is just insulting. So Batman is alive, I guess some people in the audience are happier knowing that he's met a nice lady and moved to Europe.

The autopilot thing was foreshadowed through out the whole film, fox tells wayne he wants him to fix it when he shows him the aircraft.

His living at the end makes a lot more sense too, both in terms of him finally moving on and being happy (like what Alfred was trying to get him to do) and also by passing the baton on to Blake. It also provided closure for Alfred to get on with his life and know he wasn't a failure like he thought. I don't think it would have been as satisfying if he was actually dead tbh.

Mickeroo

al28283 wrote: »

I prefer Tim Drake or Carrie Kelly myself but all of the Robins have been pretty cool at one stage or another, or at the very least lead to very interesting stories and situations for Batman himself.

True, even the most hated Robin(jason was it?) lead to one of the most iconic events in Batman's history with Death in the Family.

Was Carrie Kelly the one in The Dark Knight Returns?

humanji

Mickeroo wrote: »

Was Carrie Kelly the one in The Dark Knight Returns?

Yeah, that's her.

Handsome Bob

humanji wrote: »

Well it happened in the Avengers, to name a recent film.

I can't even remember the ending of The Avengers, says it all. :pac:

Just looked it up, it's a missile, not a bomb. Bomb was central to the plot of TDKR, whereas the missile, while being nifty, was simply an excuse for a heroic moment for the up until then underused Stark.

EDIT The more I think about it, the more I'm intolerant of the bomb complaints. It was introduced an hour into the film and was always given precedence, it was never cliche.

Mickeroo

Handsome Bob wrote: »

I can't even remember the ending of The Avengers, says it all. :pac:

Just looked it up, it's a missile, not a bomb. Bomb was central to the plot of TDKR, whereas the missile, while being nifty, was simply an excuse for a heroic moment for the up until then underused Stark.

Ah now, it was still nuclear bomb with a race against time which culminated in a hero offering to sacrifice their life to dispose of it no matter how it was propelled :pac:

krudler

also its a neutron bomb not a nuclear one, hence why no tidal wave at the end?

Phoenix Park

Fishooks12 wrote: »

I felt he was a bit wooden in TDK. He loosened up for this though

While Bale was good as batman it's not close to many of his better performances.

One heck of an actor if thats the case. I thought he was great, i can't imagine anyone else in Nolan's trilogy as Batman. I'm surprised quite a few people think he wasn't great in this. What has Bale been better in....The Fighter maybe? I thought he was superb in The Prestige. Overall he is exceptionally talented. I can't picture anyone else in Nolan's trilogy as Bruce Wayne (imagine Leo DiC :pac: )

Professey Chin

Mickeroo wrote: »

True, even the most hated Robin(jason was it?) lead to one of the most iconic events in Batman's history with Death in the Family.

Was Carrie Kelly the one in The Dark Knight Returns?

And the other managed to start a full out war in Gotham (Stephanie Brown) :pac:

dRNk SAnTA

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Besides for the 1960s series (where you could argue that this film was paying a homage to), where exactly have you seen this in other superhero films?

I'm not exactly a fan of the bomb plot device, but to suggest that you've seem similar in other superhero franchises is folly I'm afraid.

Honestly, are you being serious? That ending was an homage to the comedy Batman movie from the 1960s?

The ticking timebomb is the oldest trick in the fricken book. I don't know why I need to justify criticizing it. Everyone has seen it before. If you need another example, I'm sure I've seen Superman in movie or tv series carry a bomb/torpedo/something into space for it to explode. Someone else might help me on that.

dRNk SAnTA

Where have we seen the ending to this movie before....

paddy kerins

Hey I made that joke :mad:

:pac:

tony1kenobi

dRNk SAnTA wrote: »

The ticking timebomb is the oldest trick in the fricken book. I don't know why I need to justify criticizing it. Everyone has seen it before. If you need another example, I'm sure I've seen Superman in movie or tv series carry a bomb/torpedo/something into space for it to explode. Someone else might help me on that.

Superman does it at the start of Superman 2 with the bomb from the Eiffel Tower.

Batman does it in Batman the Movie if you replace space with the sea.

Batman does it in Batman 89 if you replace ticking bomb with poisonous balloons.

Fishooks12

Phoenix Park wrote: »

One heck of an actor if thats the case. I thought he was great, i can't imagine anyone else in Nolan's trilogy as Batman. I'm surprised quite a few people think he wasn't great in this. What has Bale been better in....The Fighter maybe? I thought he was superb in The Prestige. Overall he is exceptionally talented. I can't picture anyone else in Nolan's trilogy as Bruce Wayne (imagine Leo DiC :pac: )

Rescue Dawn and the Machinist are just two examples of films where Bales is far better IMO. The Fighter too even though I didn't really care for the film.

He's good as Batman but I don't think any of the scripts bar maybe the third one really allowed him to flex his acting muscles as much as he has done in other films. But you'd expect that from a comic book film anyway so it was never a huge issue

Josey Wales

dRNk SAnTA wrote: »

The B.A.T. flying machine was a bit of a crutch I felt, a bit ridiculous, it was a vehicle (haha geddit?) to allow the script writers cut corners in a number of scenes.

I had no problem with the BAT. I think it was a great addition to Batman's armory. We were introduced to the Tumbler in Batman Begins and the Batpod in The Dark Knight. They needed something new for this film. We haven't seen Batman with a flying vehicle in this franchise yet so it was something new. At least it was better than the Batwing in Tim Burton's 1989 version that was shot down with one bullet.

I don't see how it allowed the writers to cut corners either. It led to one of the great lines from John Blake when he escapes in the BAT plus Batman's oneliner to Catwoman.

In short, I loved the BAT.

Handsome Bob

dRNk SAnTA wrote: »

Honestly, are you being serious? That ending was an homage to the comedy Batman movie from the 1960s?

The ticking timebomb is the oldest trick in the fricken book. I don't know why I need to justify criticizing it. Everyone has seen it before. If you need another example, I'm sure I've seen Superman in movie or tv series carry a bomb/torpedo/something into space for it to explode. Someone else might help me on that.

Even taking your word for it, how many have used it in the same way as TDKR? How many have used it as a means to fake the superhero's death and put him into retirement?

tony1kenobi

Handsome Bob wrote: »

Even taking your word for it, how many have used it in the same way as TDKR? How many have used it as a means to fake the superhero's death and put him into retirement?

Metro Man did it in Megamind.He did exactly that.

shadowcomplex

If Heath Ledger hadnt have died would this movie have been a whole lot different

Chancer3001

the warden from the shawshank redemption...

did anybody else see/notice him as one of the first people out of the stock exchange with hands up?!!

Before banes crew came out on their motorbikes.

al28283

Chancer3001 wrote: »

the warden from the shawshank redemption...

did anybody else see/notice him as one of the first people out of the stock exchange with hands up?!!

Before banes crew came out on their motorbikes.

So the warden must have helped them smuggle the motorbikes into the stock exchange, that explains it;)

humanji

shadowcomplex wrote: »

If Heath Ledger hadnt have died would this movie have been a whole lot different

I'd say it would be exactly the same except it would be the Joker playing judge instead of Scarecrow.

amacca

humanji wrote: »

I'd say it would be exactly the same except it would be the Joker playing judge instead of Scarecrow.

oh boo...now that would be disappointing...death by exile! for you my friend.


(I know if that were the case, just the merest glimpse of the nolan/ledgers joker would leave me psychologically baying for more and disappointed in the extreme if I didn't get it)

Mickeroo

humanji wrote: »

I'd say it would be exactly the same except it would be the Joker playing judge instead of Scarecrow.

I seriously doubt it, after Ledger braught the house down in TDK I think they would have given him a fairly big role in this. he's obsessed with Batman too so I don't think he would have been happy to hold court while Bane has all the fun. I'm not even sure they would have gone for Bane at all. Purely speculation on my part of course.

PhiloCypher

Mickeroo wrote: »

I seriously doubt it, after Ledger braught the house down in TDK I think they would have given him a fairly big role in this. he's obsessed with Batman too so I don't think he would have been happy to hold court while Bane has all the fun. I'm not even sure they would have gone for Bane at all. Purely speculation on my part of course.

I think you're right the Joker is Batman's Arch nemesis he plays second fiddle to no one , that said I think it would have been wrong of the Joker to play the main antagonist two films in a row .

tony1kenobi

PhiloCypher wrote: »

I think you're right the Joker is Batman's Arch nemesis he plays second fiddle to no one , that said I think it would have been wrong of the Joker to play the main antagonist two films in a row .

Could have just had the Joker on the roof seeing the fixed Bat signal in place of Gordon and say "well well".

Just back from seeing it and I absolutely loved it. It was a fitting end to the series that left it open for a number of interesting possibilities. While there were a number of plot holes and the film did feel a little rushed there was just so much to enjoy that they were easily over looked. Will be posting my thoughts in depth once I get behind my PC.

B.A._Baracus

Am i the only one who, from the trailers, thought it was Alfred who said "rise" while bruce was in the prison?

Even in the movie that grey haired dude is out of focus when he says that line. lol. I honestly thought alfred and bruce got thrown into prison before seeing the movie.

Jame Gumb

If I was Bruce Wayne, I'd have been on to the SEC about getting my readies back...Anglo-esque goings on. Who was gonna pick up the tab in the restauarant at the end - Catwoman?

An incredible movie...the best of the trilogy in my view. If it does $1b at the box office, I'd be shocked if there isn't a fourth movie.

paddy kerins

Jame Gumb wrote: »

If I was Bruce Wayne, I'd have been on to the SEC about getting my readies back...Anglo-esque goings on. Who was gonna pick up the tab in the restauarant at the end - Catwoman?

An incredible movie...the best of the trilogy in my view. If it does $1b at the box office, I'd be shocked if there isn't a fourth movie.

There won't be. Unless Christopher Nolan says so