The Dark Knight Rises - seen thread *SPOILERS WITHIN* See Mod Warning in first post

hardCopy

I think I preferred The Dark Knight, but that may change after a couple of watches.

I did almost laugh out loud at the strobe light bullet dodging scene. It was like a cross between Gun-Kata and a Prodigy video.

efb

Maybe we could have a ratings poll?

Out of 5?

I'm giving it 3.5

amacca

efb wrote: »

Maybe we could have a ratings poll?

Out of 5?

I'm giving it 3.5

I give it 4/5

TDK = 4.9/5 (not sure why I deducted 0.1)

BB = 4.5/5

efb

amacca wrote: »

I give it 4/5

TDK = 4.9/5 (not sure why I deducted 0.1)

BB = 4.5/5

TDK 4
BB 3

amacca

efb wrote: »

TDK 4
BB 3

BB 3...really, I'm as intrigued as if I just accidentally stumbled unsuspectingly into the batcave

can I ask you what action/blockbuster films you would give more than 4/5 to?

Otacon

efb wrote: »

Maybe we could have a ratings poll?

Out of 5?

I'm giving it 3.5

Not sure why you say out of 5 and then introduce fractions. Why not say out of 10 and give it 7?

While I won't rate them in order or via some numerical value, I will say that IMO TDKR is a suitable end to Nolan's trilogy. It is certainly on par with the previous 2 entries and I enjoyed them all immensely.

efb

amacca wrote: »

BB 3...really, I'm as intrigued as if I just accidentally stumbled unsuspectingly into the batcave

can I ask you what action/blockbuster films you would give more than 4/5 to?

None I've seen yet- Fight Club would be the closest too the genre at 4.5

seraphimvc

I will tell people the trilogy is a 9/10, flawed but a very very very well done trilogy, a must watch for anyone unless the person hated batman. The thing is i doubt anyone can stop watching after he/she watched BB :pac:

Grimebox

phil1nj wrote: »

You don't like super-hero films? Sound to me like you were always going to be disappointed by this then. I'm actually surprised that you liked the other 2 Batman films consdiering the central premise of both - an ordinary guy, with almost super-human athletic abilities decideds to don a high-tech costume and wage a one man war on crime only to come up against a host of equally outlandish villains? Gritty realism or not, this is the very essence of many super hero movies just with the various elemenst toned down or amped up. There are plenty of unrealistic situations from both BB and TDK (a guy gettting pulled along by a train through a major city, another guy walking around with half his face burnt off etc). As for the comment about two gusy duking it ot whilst wearing costumes, both previous films also had that to a certain extent (more so TDK but there was ninjas and the Scarecrow in BB).

Well I was a little off put by all the hype surrounding this film, but why was I always going to be disappointed by it? TDK was one of the best films I have ever seen and left a huge impression on me.

I think you are missing the point of what I was saying a little bit. It isn't these individual events in these films that are ridiculous alone, although pointing one out myself maybe wasn't such a good idea. It is not the unrealistic stunts. Its heavily dependant on the atmosphere that Nolan creates, and in TDKR Nolan fails in my opinion. The characters don't hold as much weight any more. Their motivation isn't as clear as before, Bane just seems pure evil. The cheesyness just takes over. I actually can't fully articulate why exactly I felt this way. Perhaps the poor dialogue didn't help. (Remember the last fight with Bane "You come here to die?" "No I came here... to stop... you").


To try and used a contrived extreme example: Compare the original Star Wars trilogy to the prequels. The originals is TDK and the prequels is TDKR. Both trilogies are outrageously unrealistic obviously but the world created in the originals is believable, we relate to the characters and are rooting for the protagonist. The prequels, not so much.

Mickeroo

Grimebox wrote: »

You pretty much take the words right out of my mouth! The first two films also sold me gritty realism. This one failed as you have pointed out to a degree. The cheesyness really does come across in this and it feels like a comic book film, the other two did not. This is a huge problem for me. I believed in the world that was created in the last film. My disbelief was truly suspended. You have to relate and believe in characters to enjoy their struggle. The fights between Bane and Batman were ridiculous. I was just watching to men in costumes duking it out. The beauty of the previous films is that it didn't feel like a comic book film. It felt as if they could have happened in the real world. This is aside from plot holes, they don't bother me to be honest.

All that said, I actually don't like super hero films. Batman was an exception because of how "real" it felt. This was a disappointing return to form for comic book films.

At the start of The Dark Night Batman bends the barrel of a machine gun with one hand. Midway through the film both him and Rachel fall from the penthouse of a sky scraper and survive. There was also the magic sonar machine. In BB we had the magic steam bomb. I didn't have to suspend my disbelief in this movie anymore than I had to in the other two. These are not realistic films.

BB felt every much as bit of comic book movie to this imo, they were very similar in tone. TDK less so. All 3 films have scenes and plotlines straight off the pages of the comics.

I got to see the film last night at last, will post my thoughts properly after I've read the thread. Over 1000 posts already, seriously could everyone just hold off until I catch up please? :pac:

Professey Chin

Grimebox wrote: »

To try and used a contrived extreme example: Compare the original Star Wars trilogy to the prequels. The originals is TDK and the prequels is TDKR. Both trilogies are outrageously unrealistic obviously but the world created in the originals is believable, we relate to the characters and are rooting for the protagonist. The prequels, not so much.

Ah now. I know not everyone liked it but thats a bit harsh :pac:

Grimebox

The Great Chinholio wrote: »

Ah now. I know not everyone liked it but thats a bit harsh :pac:

Sorry let me back track a bit. TDKR is a million times superior to the star wars prequels. I was just using the two as an example of TDKR's failings. It is still a good film, I just don't think its a masterpiece as some people are claiming.

My review of the three would be:

BB 7/10
TDR 9/10
TDKR 6.5/10

whereas the star wars prequels get around 1.5/10

phil1nj

Grimebox wrote: »

Well I was a little off put by all the hype surrounding this film, but why was I always going to be disappointed by it? TDK was one of the best films I have ever seen and left a huge impression on me.

I think you are missing the point of what I was saying a little bit. It isn't these individual events in these films that are ridiculous alone, although pointing one out myself maybe wasn't such a good idea. It is not the unrealistic stunts. Its heavily dependant on the atmosphere that Nolan creates, and in TDKR Nolan fails in my opinion. The characters don't hold as much weight any more. Their motivation isn't as clear as before, Bane just seems pure evil. The cheesyness just takes over. I actually can't fully articulate why exactly I felt this way. Perhaps the poor dialogue didn't help. (Remember the last fight with Bane "You come here to die?" "No I came here... to stop... you").


To try and used a contrived extreme example: Compare the original Star Wars trilogy to the prequels. The originals is TDK and the prequels is TDKR. Both trilogies are outrageously unrealistic obviously but the world created in the originals is believable, we relate to the characters and are rooting for the protagonist. The prequels, not so much.

I do see your point. With regard to TDK (and I don't want to go off topic here) but it was seen as the holy grail of comic book movies in so much as it had mass appeal and was viewed as being a damn good movie first and a comic-book movie second. It still is at its heart very much a super-hero movie which is why I find its appeal to people like your goodself unusual (non-comic book/super-hero movie fans). Anyway, your poinst are valid (especially the Star Wars comparions) but that's a topic for another thread.:)

All the best.

Grimebox

whatislife wrote: »

However just with the bit in bold. I am going to try and be as objective and unbiased as possible. Have you seen the new Spiderman? If not I implore you too, not because it is a movie of quality but so that you can compare it with TDKR. Nolan's Batman franchise set a new standard for comic book films and it's Spiderman that is the disappointing return to form for comic book films, not TDKR.

The TDKR has disappointed you compared to the rest of Nolans franchise, but to compare it poorly to other comic books films is blasphemy.

When I saw the ad for the new Spider-man film, I was raging! I was thinking would they ever just fúck off! I think I only saw the 1st and 3rd films but they were absolutely terrible. All I could see was Hollywood and $$$. I will see it on your recommendation however. I will try my best to remain objective throughout

folan

whatislife wrote: »

I agree that this movie doesn't slot easily in with the other two but after a poke and a prod I think it squeezes in and can hold it's head up high sat next to the other two before it.

during lunch, a suggestion was made. Watch BB and DKR together and see how i feel then.

I think theyre right and that DKR is more related to BB than TDK, and theres a good chance that going from Begins to this would have me at it a different way, with a differing view point.

Its something i definatly will try.

p.oconnor

Seen the dark knight rises last night and I have to say its fantastic, a great ending to the trilogy. I think TDKR falls just below the standard of TDK but only just and taking into account the TDK was for me one of the all time greats, Heath Ledger's performance in TDK is what seperates the two for me. Here's how I would rate the three.

BB - 8/10
TDK - 10/10
TDKR - 9/10

best trilogy I have seen to date....

Fishooks12

whatislife wrote: »

Explain to me how and why you found this movie inferior to The Dark Knight?

Some people went into this movie determined not to like it.

I think the same could be said for people who went in determined to love it and ignore any flaws

phil1nj

Fishooks12 wrote: »

I think the same could be said for people who went in determined to love it and ignore any flaws

I think the main problems come down to:

1) the level of nit-picking that has been highlighted about certain aspects (how did such and such appear on the island after this had happened, why wasn't the prison filled with rapists/kitten killers/ kitten-rapers if it was suppossed to be hell on earth, how did it go from day to night so quickly in such and such a scene etc etc)

2) Way too many comparisons and sky-high expectations when compared against TDK.

No film is perfect, very few films in trilogies match each other in terms of quality and absolutely no film will stand up to over-excessive scrutinizing of plot/dialogue/editing/premise. But there are a few people on this thread who are determined to knock the film and not judge it on it's own merits. The posts giving this 3 or 4 out of 10 are laughable IMHO. I openly admit that I'm fan of these type of movies and comic-book movies in general but I'm not so blind as to see that the film isn't perfect (far from it) but ultimately I ask myself if I was entertained once the credits role and in this case it was a resounding yes for me. Some people don't appear to feel like that which is fair enough but there are some who come across as just knocking this movie for the sake of it.

MJ23

BB - 9.5/10
TDK - 9.9/10
TDKR - 9.1/10

The only reason TDK does not get the perfect 10 from me, is that embarrassing scene where Bruce Wayne comes in to the party after getting out of the helicopter. The "i believe in Harvey Dent" bit.

Handsome Bob

MJ23 wrote: »

The only reason TDK does not get the perfect 10 from me, is that embarrassing scene where Bruce Wayne comes in to the party after getting out of the helicopter. The "i believe in Harvey Dent" bit.

I liked that moment, it was a brief moment where Bruce let down the billionaire airhead facade and show his real self.

Fishooks12

phil1nj wrote: »

I think the main problems come down to:

1) the level of nit-picking that has been highlighted about certain aspects (how did such and such appear on the island after this had happened, why wasn't the prison filled with rapists/kitten killers/ kitten-rapers if it was suppossed to be hell on earth, how did it go from day to night so quickly in such and such a scene etc etc)

2) Way too many comparisons and sky-high expectations when compared against TDK.

No film is perfect, very few films in trilogies match each other in terms of quality and absolutely no film will stand up to over-excessive scrutinizing of plot/dialogue/editing/premise. But there are a few people on this thread who are determined to knock the film and not judge it on it's own merits. The posts giving this 3 or 4 out of 10 are laughable IMHO. I openly admit that I'm fan of these type of movies and comic-book movies in general but I'm not so blind as to see that the film isn't perfect (far from it) but ultimately I ask myself if I was entertained once the credits role and in this case it was a resounding yes for me. Some people don't appear to feel like that which is fair enough but there are some who come across as just knocking this movie for the sake of it.

I'm not a huge comic book movie fan, but if I was to take TDKR as its own film I'd have to say that I'd have it on a par with X-Men: First Class. Which I found good fun but nothing more

Taking TDKR as part of the trilogy I think that it's lacking much of the well balanced tension and improved characterization of the other two.

I just didn't have the same interest in Bane and Robin that I did for Harvey Dent and the joker who were two wonderfully fleshed out characters

phil1nj

Fishooks12 wrote: »

I'm not a huge comic book movie fan, but if I was to take TDKR as its own film I'd have to say that I'd have it on a par with X-Men: First Class. Which I found good fun but nothing more.

Would you give it a 3 or 4 out of 10 based on this opinion though?

Fishooks12 wrote: »

Taking TDKR as part of the trilogy I think that it's lacking much of the well balanced tension and improved characterization of the other two.

And this is what I was saying about movies in a trilogy. Look at the great movie trilogies down through the years (The Godfather, Star Wars, LOTR etc) there will always be one that is not as liked as the others for various reasons. Looks like TDKR will be the one for this trilogy in some peoples minds.

Personally, I don't believe Christopher Nolan set out to make a trilogy when he made Batman Begins (BB is very different in tone/style to TDK, where as TDKR is very similar in style to its predecessor) but after the success of TDK he felt obliged to complete his Batman/Bruce Wayne story. Maybe the reason for flaws that are being highlighted. Just a guess mind.

Fishooks12

phil1nj wrote: »

Would you give it a 3 or 4 out of 10 based on this opinion though?

If I had to quantify the film like that I'd give it a 6.5/10, prob give BB a 7/10 and TDK an 8/10

podgemonster

Begins 10/10
TDK 9.5/10
RISE 9/10

Initially when i watched TDK, i was stunned completly at what a beast of a movie it was. However after numerous rewatching the movie is at frantic pace, plough though scenes quickly. it could easily have been 2 movies. Other than that its fantastic piece of cinema.

With Begins I enjoyed it immensely also, rented it 1st time viewing. Since then I have watched it numerous times and cant seem to change the channel when its on the telly. The film has grown on me. The story his told and developed so well, from the Los training, to the flashbacks to Batman saving Gotham. I simply love the escalation of the villians. Falcone, then Scarecrow and finally Ra's. All this comparison of Joker and Bane, don't forget Neeson did a cracking job as the suave sophisticated & motivated Ra's Al Ghul.

TKDR is also a beast of a movie, loads of subplots, also it wanned slightly in the middle. However I have never been so eager to return to the cinema to see the movie again, not even for TDK. I think like begins it is a film that will grow on me. TDKR is the dramatic and climactic finish the trilogy needed.

krudler

MJ23 wrote: »

BB - 9.5/10
TDK - 9.9/10
TDKR - 9.1/10

The only reason TDK does not get the perfect 10 from me, is that embarrassing scene where Bruce Wayne comes in to the party after getting out of the helicopter. The "i believe in Harvey Dent" bit.

Thats a great scene imo, Bruce drops the billionaire airhead act and says something genuine. It works after the scene in the restaurant where after verbally sparring with Dent and making fun of him once Dent starts talking about how proud Gotham should be of Batman there's a look on Bale's face that says everything with him saying a word, like he sees Dent is genuinely looking to change the city for good and do it without wearing a mask and cape, and he's not just another politician with empty words. people don't give Bale his props for his performances in all three movies.

me-skywalker

I've read some great reviews; some that were 9/10's and some that were 5/10's. I've read plenty of balanced views and some erratic views from cycnical people. Opinions that are well formulated and explained while elaborating in a friendly manner when questioned or their point ripped apart. I've also seen some vultres picking apart every post and every scene; dissecting each and every word uttered and motion captured and wll able to express their dissatisfaction for it.

But what I cannot abide is rubbish posts of; "I'm using me phone. It was awful." "Christian Bale didn't even sparkle."

For that I am thankfully that no matter what I read I know in my own heart of hearts exatly why I loved the movie and what I didn't like about it no matter what anyone else says my opinion is my own.

Professey Chin

me-skywalker wrote: »

I've read some great reviews; some that were 9/10's and some that were 5/10's. I've read plenty of balanced views and some erratic views from cycnical people. Opinions that are well formulated and explained while elaborating in a friendly manner when questioned or their point ripped apart. I've also seen some vultres picking apart every post and every scene; dissecting each and every word uttered and motion captured and wll able to express their dissatisfaction for it.

But what I cannot abide is rubbish posts of; "I'm using me phone. It was awful." "Christian Bale didn't even sparkle."

For that I am thankfully that no matter what I read I know in my own heart of hearts exatly why I loved the movie and what I didn't like about it no matter what anyone else says my opinion is my own.

Please say somebody actually said this! Please!! :pac:

whatislife

Fishooks12 wrote: »

I think the same could be said for people who went in determined to love it and ignore any flaws

Disagree. Who goes into something determined to like something?

Societal culture has dictated that it is "cool" to go against mainstream opinion. Mainstream opinion is that this is a very good movie despite it's flaws. Hence "cool" find the movie horrendous, tedious etc

Grimebox

The Great Chinholio wrote: »

Please say somebody actually said this! Please!! :pac:

Twilight series is far better!

Cantona's Collars

Loved it,I didn't get bogged down in the minute details of the whole Batman universe & went into the cinema expecting a huge blockbuster of a movie & I wasn't disappointed.
It tied up the trilogy nicely and for a change it's one movie that I'll be watching again as soon as possible.