Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 12/13

gaelicred

Brendan has worked with Allen before so he knows what he can do on the pitch.I will reserve judgement until i have seen him play a few games.But i think he is a good player

Leiva

People need to realise what £15mil would get you outside the Premiership and then they will have their eyes opened.

Justifying Allens excessive purchase price by filling the gap between 10 and 15mil with hope is madness .

Spending £15mil should get you a proven player not more buy and hope Johnny come latelys.

Its not all doom and gloom from me as I think Allen was bought for a bigger picture (system) rather than as an individual, and he will be loved if it clicks, but again I'm hoping folk don't expect tika taka in the short term.

mike65

Quit yo' jibba jabbin' - you are a merely an observer not a player. Let those who actually manage, manage. You just watch.

BorneTobyWilde

Leiva wrote: »

People need to realise what £15mil would get you outside the Premiership and then they will have their eyes opened.

Justifying Allens excessive purchase price by filling the gap between 10 and 15mil with hope is madness .

Spending £15mil should get you a proven player not more buy and hope Johnny come latelys.

Its not all doom and gloom from me as I think Allen was bought for a bigger picture (system) rather than as an individual, and he will be loved if it clicks, but again I'm hoping folk don't expect tika taka in the short term.

What would you have done?
What till final day of window , have a 8m pound bid on the table at swansea,,,,

Maybe you're right, We rush in a lil,,,,,,,

SlickRic

we don't know if it's £15m yet.

i wouldn't call that fee "retarded"; i don't think we can until we see how he does. but there's no doubt we've paid the British tax.

overpaying doesn't automatically equal retarded.

the big plus is he knows our manager, and our manager has a lot of faith in him.

we'll see.

I'll reserve judgement on Allen until I see him play for us.

It's an underwhelming signing though for the money spent.

Leiva

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

What would you have done?
What till final day of window , have a 8m pound bid on the table at swansea,,,,

Maybe you're right, We rush in a lil,,,,,,,

Put Charlie Adam (and others) on the transfer list and get as close to £4mil for him as possible .

Put that to the £15 = £19million and gone to Mountpellier for Bellhanda.

Simples !

Oh if they (Mountpellier) refused then I would offer them the English Messie;)

Knex*

Leiva wrote: »

Put Charlie Adam (and others) on the transfer list and get as close to £4mil for him as possible .

Put that to the £15 = £19million and gone to Mountpellier for Bellhanda.

Simples !

Oh if they (Mountpellier) refused then I would offer them the English Messie;)

If we were to sell Adam in the morning we would get at least 7/8m for him tbh.

Also, that doesn't solve the CM issue and we would still need someone able to actually regularly find Belhanda with the ball.

Leiva

Knex. wrote: »

If we were to sell Adam in the morning we would get at least 7/8m for him tbh.

You get your contacts to call Ian Ayre immediately

RasTa

Lloyd is correct

BorneTobyWilde

Leiva wrote: »

Put Charlie Adam (and others) on the transfer list and get as close to £4mil for him as possible .

Put that to the £15 = £19million and gone to Mountpellier for Bellhanda.

Simples !

Oh if they (Mountpellier) refused then I would offer them the English Messie;)

O well, Fools rush in where Angels fear to tread

Chucky the tree

Leiva wrote: »

Put Charlie Adam (and others) on the transfer list and get as close to £4mil for him as possible .

Put that to the £15 = £19million and gone to Mountpellier for Bellhanda.

Simples !

Oh if they (Mountpellier) refused then I would offer them the English Messie;)

He said he waned to stay with Montepellier and play CL with them.

Pro. F

Was anybody on here thinking about James McCarthy as an option before Allen was bought?

I think he is a guy with similar ability and potential as Allen (just weighted more towards creative rather than defensive) and would have been much cheaper.

I think McCarthy is generally underrated at the moment.

tok9

Zak Flaps wrote: »

Oh please God, Jesus ,Mary, the 3 wise men, let this be true....

http://www.liverpoolfcnews.net/west-ham-prepare-6m-bid-for-joe-cole/link/99548/

There is no way that could be true! Surely, no one would be stupid enough to pay that for him.

I'd be happy if someone just took him off the wage bill, getting 6 million too would be like some form of euphoria.

RasTa

Glen Johnson
Andy Carroll
Stewart Downing
Charlie Adam
Joe Allen
Jordan Henderson

Almost 95million spent on the above?!

opr

Pro. F wrote: »

Was anybody on here thinking about James McCarthy as an option before Allen was bought?

I think he is a guy with similar ability and potential as Allen (just weighted more towards creative rather than defensive) and would have been much cheaper.

I think McCarthy is generally underrated at the moment.

Cheaper? The club have been long time admirers of his. We tried to buy him from Hamilton but he went to Wigan as he felt it would better serve his progress. Over the years we've enquired a few times. Last time we enquired I remember £20m was the figure Wigan were asking for him.

Opr

LuckyLloyd

mike65 wrote: »

Quit yo' jibba jabbin' - you are a merely an observer not a player. Let those who actually manage, manage. You just watch.

Wasn't your attitude last year or in 2010 though huh?

BorneTobyWilde

RasTa wrote: »

Glen Johnson
Andy Carroll
Stewart Downing
Charlie Adam
Joe Allen
Jordan Henderson

Almost 95million spent on the above?!

Yea but we got 50m off of Chelsea lol :P
45 million for 5 players, awesome lol

JK

Pro. F

opr wrote: »

Cheaper? The club have been long time admirers of his. We tried to buy him from Hamilton but he went to Wigan as he felt it would better serve his progress. Over the years we've enquired a few times. Last time we enquired I remember £20m was the figure Wigan were asking for him.

Opr

:eek:

I would have thought he'd be gettable for £10m as he would probably be happy with the move. I see he's contracted until 2016 (according to transfermarkt.de), so I suppose Wigan are in a strong position with him.

Mr Alan

RasTa wrote: »

Glen Johnson
Andy Carroll
Stewart Downing
Charlie Adam
Joe Allen
Jordan Henderson

Almost 95million spent on the above?!

Glen Johnson has been an excellent buy for us.

Adam is fine for the fee paid too, good squad player.

Allen hasn't kicked a ball for us either, whatever about thinking its a tad overpriced, it could well turn out to be a good buy. Similar for Henderson.

To say they represent money wasted is stupid.

LuckyLloyd

It should be very obvious at this stage that certain elements of the club are being very poorly run. FSG have improved commercial revenue intake, but they have poorly handled management and playing staff decisions.

Zak Flaps

tok9 wrote: »

There is no way that could be true! Surely, no one would be stupid enough to pay that for him.

I'd be happy if someone just took him off the wage bill, getting 6 million too would be like some form of euphoria.

mike65

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Wasn't your attitude last year or in 2010 though huh?

*checks calendar to see who was in charge that year...*

Are you referring to the fag end of Rafa or the start of Roy? Both were rubbish in that year. Brendan is a clean sheet and a fresh start who hasn't bought an Alberto Aquilani, Milan Jovanovic, Paul Konchesky or Christian Eriksen and nor is he likely to. He has hardly begun and some here have written off a whole new era.

Oh nearly and all of them imports....hmmmm!

BorneTobyWilde

I would love to see us sign a big name, A name that is first name on team sheet,So tired of all these average players we pay big money for and they sit on the asses on the bench or at home on day of game
drinking smooties!!

LuckyLloyd

RasTa wrote: »

Glen Johnson
Andy Carroll
Stewart Downing
Charlie Adam
Joe Allen
Jordan Henderson

Almost 95million spent on the above?!

6 British players coming in at an average of £15m+ per head

NO BRITISH PLAYERS

8-10

mike65 wrote: »

Brendan is a clean sheet and a fresh start who hasn't bought an Alberto Aquilani, Milan Jovanovic, Paul Konchesky or Christian Eriksen and nor is he likely to. He has hardly begun and some here have written off a whole new era.

I'm sure most pool fans would be delighted if he signed Christian Eriksen!!!

(you meant Poulsen)

Leiva

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

It should be very obvious at this stage that certain elements of the club are being very poorly run. FSG have improved commercial revenue intake, but they have poorly handled management and playing staff decisions.

I think they know that aswell and tried to address the imbalance by the DOF structure. But unfortunately it seems that got thrown out to accommodate Rodgers hiring.

So it's over to you then Brendan ..

opr

Pro. F wrote: »

:eek:

I would have thought he'd be gettable for £10m as he would probably be happy with the move. I see he's contracted until 2016 (according to transfermarkt.de), so I suppose Wigan are in a strong position with him.

I guess given the way the market is, it would be hard to argue that with his experience at such a high level for a 21 year old he isn't at least worth £15m. I can't see him moving for anything less. He seems to have a good head on his shoulders and I think he will make a move when he feels it's right rather than jumping at the first big offer.

Martinez wrote:

“I have always been a big admirer of James and I followed his career for a long time. When a youngster gets to play at such a young age it makes you sit up and take notice.

“That meant I was delighted when he made that rather strange decision not to go to a top, top club like Liverpool. I think that decision is being proved right now.”

Wise enough to turn us down at 17.

Opr

Mr Alan

mike65 wrote: »

*checks calendar to see who was in charge that year...*

Are you referring to the fag end of Rafa or the start of Roy? Both were rubbish in that year. Brendan is a clean sheet and a fresh start who hasn't bought an Alberto Aquilani, Milan Jovanovic, Paul Konchesky or Christian Eriksen and nor is he likely to. He has hardly begun and some here have written off a whole new era.

Your logic is so stupid that it hurts my brain.

Basically, Rodgers deserving of huge faith, patience & respect despite having done nothing for us & our activity this summer having been pretty disappointing so far (at best).

Whereas, Rafa, the FA Cup & Champions League winning, PL record point setting Liverpool manager was more than deserving of your blade into his back cause he had a poor season.

Head scratching stuff.

gaelicred

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

Yea but we got 50m off of Chelsea lol :P
45 million for 5 players, awesome lol

JK

We got 63 million of chelsea dont forget Mereles:D

mike65

Mr Alan wrote: »

Your logic is so stupid that it hurts my brain.

Basically, Rodgers deserving of huge faith, patience & respect despite having done nothing for us & our activity this summer having been pretty disappointing so far (at best).

Whereas, Rafa, the FA Cup & Champions League winning, PL record point setting Liverpool manager was more than deserving of your blade into his back cause he had a poor season.

Head scratching stuff.

So? By 2010 Rafa was burnt out and fighting a war with the owners that he was destined to lose. I'm not going give anyone a free pass cos they won the CL. That was already done and gone by 2010

I said Rodgers is the new man in town and as such I'm giving him every chance, in his actions so far he has done nothing wrong. Sure I'd like a couple more signings of the right sort but as there are 19 days of the window remaining and some rumblings of deals being done I'm happy to KEEP AN OPEN MIND! That you would do likewise.

opr

mike65 wrote: »

So? By 2010 Rafa was burnt out and fighting a war with the owners that he was destined to lose. I'm not going give anyone a free pass cos they won the CL. That was already done and gone by 2010

A battle he was destined to lose? Who gives a ****? It was a battle that needed to be fought. The fact Rafa waged that war knowing he was likely to come out the worse but it was for the good of the club should be something every fan is eternally grateful for not something used as a stick to beat him with. ffs this **** makes me so angry.

Opr

Mr Alan

mike65 wrote: »

So? By 2010 Rafa was burnt out and fighting a war with the owners that he was destined to lose. I'm not going give anyone a free pass cos they won the CL. That was already done and gone by 2010

I said Rodgers is the new man in town and as such I'm giving him every chance, in his actions so far he has done nothing wrong. Sure I'd like a couple more signings of the right sort but as there are 19 days of the window remaining and some rumblings of deals being done I'm happy to KEEP AN OPEN MIND! That you would do likewise.

You're keeping an open mind, until he signs a bad player or has an average/poor season, then you'll be all for knifing him :rolleyes:

Ape X

Mr Alan wrote: »

You're keeping an open mind, until he signs a bad player or has an average/poor season, then you'll be all for knifing him :rolleyes:

All of us? Really?

So better to knife him now then, yeah?

mike65

opr wrote: »

A battle he was destined to lose? Who gives a ****? It was a battle that needed to be fought. The fact Rafa waged that war knowing he was likely to come out the worse but it was for the good of the club should be something every fan is eternally grateful for not something used as a stick to beat him with. ffs this **** makes me so angry.

Opr

Fine be angry I wasn't taking about the evil of G&H just that they were always likely to leave after Benitez. Had it been the other way around well who knows...but that's just history and I'm trying to look forward not back. (rather too much of that regarding LFC these days)

Mr Alan wrote: »

You're keeping an open mind, until he signs a bad player or has an average/poor season, then you'll be all for knifing him :rolleyes:

If Rodgers turns out to as clueless as Dalglish was last season I won't be happy you are right. If the results don't go the right way but the ideas are right I'll temper my disappointment. I will base my commentary on what has happened rather than make predictions based on biased clap trap.

daithijjj

You have to love the random United fan stickin his snout in about prices paid. It tends to be a bit less obvious when you have cover and werent neglected as a squad for 3 years. Where is that midfield colossus Anderson these days?, how much was spunked on him?........managers take punts, some get longer to realise the potential they bought, some dont.

Im sure id be met with welcoming arms if i stuck my snout into the United thread and started spouting about the money splashed on De Gea (savagely over rated imo). But.......im not a complete tool like some who reside around these forums because sometimes you spend more based on the length of future they have and the amount of wages they get.

How many more fkin retards do i have to read posting about transfer fees before it sinks into their thick nuggets that xfer fees are only half the issue and wages are ever more important?.

Ashley Young is on 40k per week more than Borini and Allen put together. Lots of those new Liverpool players are on miserly wages compared to some of their peers ........but still folk bang on about xfer fee's.....why?..........its retarded.

opr

mike65 wrote: »

Fine be angry I wasn't taking about the evil of G&H just that they were always likely to leave after Benitez. Had it been the other way around well who knows...but that's just history and I'm trying to look forward not back. (rather too much of that regarding LFC these days)

The thing is you're talking about the fact that Rafa didn't deserve our support because he spent much of his time waging a war against H&G that it left him burn out. If those owners had managed to get in some patsy who had fallen in line with their plans to run this club into the ground for as much money as they could make god knows where we would be today.

One of my major concerns with the new owners removing Kenny was that at least I was assured no matter what Kenny wouldn't let that happen. I knew Kenny had Liverpool's best interest embedded in his psyche as it came to be with Rafa. I'm not saying Brendan won't look out for us with the same vigour but I have no reason to think that he will and the whole Agger thing has left me a little uneasy in that regard.

Opr

willmunny1990

Another transfer window, and another overpriced British player signs for Liverpool. Some things just don't change.

I see Liverpool have a tough start to the season from looking at the fixture list. No doubt the knives will be out for Rodgers from some of the people backing him now if he doesn't hit the ground running.

It also seems to me that owners are almost happy to consolidate the club to mid table. They would have hired Capello, Benitez or Van Gaal if they'd had any serious ambition but they went down the cheap route and set their sights firmly on Martinez or Rodgers.

Rumours of the potential sale of Agger sound worrying for the club too. Would you ever see United try to actively sell Vidic or Chelsea attempt to push John Terry out the door? No, these clubs have ambition. They want to keep their best players, not downgrade and take the extra cash.It's entirely different if the palyer wants to leave or if he played in a position that was well stocked with quality, but this clearly isn't the case here. The current backup is an over the hill Carragher and an extremely raw Coates. Those two cannot be relied upon.

Where do posters realistically think Liverpool can finish this year? What would constitute progress and what would be 'not be good enough'?

I personally expect the club to finish 7th or 8th, with a 6th place finish being real progress. But somehow I think if Rodgers was to finish 6th this season with no challenge for 4th, the knives would be out from a large section of the fan base. This is why I think he's up against it and will probably leave the club within the next 18 months/two years.

Kess73

Did not think Daithi's point would be proven quite so quickly.

Ape X

lol, speak of the devil!

Pro. F

opr wrote: »

I guess given the way the market is, it would be hard to argue that with his experience at such a high level for a 21 year old he isn't at least worth £15m. I can't see him moving for anything less. He seems to have a good head on his shoulders and I think he will make a move when he feels it's right rather than jumping at the first big offer.

Wise enough to turn us down at 17.

Opr

Yeah, that's an interesting quote. He seems like a sensible chap all right. But still, a £15m fee would be more a sign of how messed up the PL transfer market is rather than what he is worth imo.

SlickRic

easy to criticise when you're a Chelsea fan, and have pretty much the pick of players from all of Europe, since you're the European champions, in London, and have shedloads of cash to pay players and agents.

for what it's worth Willy, there needs to be signs of progress - in other words a better league campaign, and the team generally looking like they have a clue.

he needs to have 2 years at least in the job before he's under serious pressure, but we all know that's unlikely to be the case unless Rodgers exceeds expectations.

LuckyLloyd

daithijjj wrote: »

You have to love the random United fan stickin his snout in about prices paid. It tends to be a bit less obvious when you have cover and werent neglected as a squad for 3 years. Where is that midfield colossus Anderson these days?, how much was spunked on him?........managers take punts, some get longer to realise the potential they bought, some dont.

Im sure id be met with welcoming arms if i stuck my snout into the United thread and started spouting about the money splashed on De Gea (savagely over rated imo). But.......im not a complete tool like some who reside around these forums because sometimes you spend more based on the length of future they have and the amount of wages they get.

How many more fkin retards do i have to read posting about transfer fees before it sinks into their thick nuggets that xfer fees are only half the issue and wages are ever more important?.

Ashley Young is on 40k per week more than Borini and Allen put together. Lots of those new Liverpool players are on miserly wages compared to some of their peers ........but still folk bang on about xfer fee's.....why?..........its retarded.

Wage spend equates to success with few exceptions though, and in any case - even if they are half the battle - a deal like Joe Allen still indicates that we're getting Transfer Fees wrong.

The downward trend is not being stemmed by this window anyway is unfortunately the point.

LuckyLloyd

SlickRic wrote: »

[
he needs to have 2 years at least in the job before he's under serious pressure, but we all know that's unlikely to be the case unless Rodgers exceeds expectations.

Rightly or wrongly, if the fanbase is calling for Dalglish's head in a double cup final season they'll be calling for Rodger's head if we fall out of the CL race before March 01. That's where we are I think.

opr

A Chelsea fan talking about money wasted is some serious lol.

Opr

Kess73

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Wage spend equates to success with few exceptions though, and in any case - even if they are half the battle - a deal like Joe Allen still indicates that we're getting Transfer Fees wrong.

The downward trend is not being stemmed by this window anyway is unfortunately the point.

Unfortunately Liverpool FC has proven to be one of those exceptions over the past few years .



Whilst I agree that Allen, in terms of transfer fee only, does seem to be an over spend (myself I rate him currently at being around the £10m mark), it could be argued that the purchase of Borini for £10m is a sign that the club is not getting all it's transfer fees wrong.


But Daithi is correct to say that wages being paid out to new players needs to be taken into account as much as their transfer fees.

LuckyLloyd

Kess73 wrote: »

Unfortunately Liverpool FC has proven to be one of those exceptions over the past few years .



Whilst I agree that Allen, in terms of transfer fee only, does seem to be an over spend (myself I rate him currently at being around the £10m mark), it could be argued that the purchase of Borini for £10m is a sign that the club is not getting all it's transfer fees wrong.


But Daithi is correct to say that wages being paid out to new players needs to be taken into account as much as their transfer fees.

Or an argument that:

NO BRITISH PLAYERS

is how to not get bent over in the transfer market

Kess73

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Rightly or wrongly, if the fanbase is calling for Dalglish's head in a double cup final season they'll be calling for Rodger's head if we fall out of the CL race before March 01. That's where we are I think.

This gets used a lot. At the end of the day it was a one cup season and should be called that.


2005 was a two final season but I don't ever hear anyone bragging about the cup final we lost in. Now the FA cup run was great to be a part of, but it is the club that finishes the final with the silverware that gets all the bragging rights.

LuckyLloyd

Kess73 wrote: »

This gets used a lot. At the end of the day it was a one cup season and should be called that.


2005 was a two final season but I don't ever hear anyone bragging about the cup final we lost in. Now the FA cup run was great to be a part of, but it is the club that finishes the final with the silverware that gets all the bragging rights.

Fine!

If our fanbase is calling for a manager's head the year we win our first trophy in six years I think they'll be calling for Rodger's head if we're out of the CL race before March 01.

opr

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Or an argument that:

NO BRITISH PLAYERS

is how to not get bent over in the transfer market

In fairness Lloyd many of the positive points that were made when we pursued this policy under Kenny/Comolli still stand. Just because we bought the wrong players doesn't mean overpaying for British talent is wrong. Real reasons exist as to why they cost more. We all know the heartache involved with developing some of the best Spanish/Foreign talent. Ferguson has made United the dominant force with a huge part of it involving overpaying for the right British players.

Opr