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The Music of Charles Manson

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    #92
    Namlub
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,298 ✭✭✭Namlub


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Do you know what a metaphor is ?

    Go and look it up.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nggE3jrIbj4&feature=related




    Charlie in death row 13, the same cell his mother cleaned out after an execution, and told him about as a child.

    Man of destiny.
    No I don't, I'm illiterate as well.

    It's not a metaphor, it's just a shitty shitty lyric. Don't patronise me.


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    #93
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Time wrote: »
    At the end of the day he was present at (and probably ordered) the murder of one of his own "family" and was also present at the La Bianca murder. So he's guilty under the felony murder rule

    So you can say he was railroaded all you want, that docent reduce his culpability under US law which says that any participant in the commission of a felony that results in the death of someone is guilty of murder.

    More lies, no he was not present at the La Bianca murder, he left before the murders took place.


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    #94
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Namlub wrote: »
    No I don't, I'm illiterate as well.

    It's not a metaphor, it's just a shitty shitty lyric. Don't patronise me.

    Its beyond your little mind.

    The world of the little man.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnysrP_Kgqs


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    #95
    Time
    Registered Users Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    More lies, no he was not present at the La Bianca murder, he left before the murders took place.

    Yeah he was at the house when they first broke in and thats still enough under the felony murder rule i'm afraid, and what about the murder of Gary Hinman?


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    #96
    viadah
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭viadah


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Prosecutions invent scenarios all the time idiot.

    Now THAT'S what I call a rebuttal. The explanation for why Bugliosi invented Helter Skelter is that prosecutions invent scenarios all the time? And rather than using the testimony to prove Manson led the group and made the important decisions for them, Bugliosi said:

    'No guys, just no. I've got this far out idea that's sure to work - Manson believes that.....let's see.....yeah, he believes that there's gonna be a race war right? And the only white folk who'll survive will be him and his brain donor family right? So he'll take over the world because he thinks black people can't operate the world properly, they need a white man to tell them what to do.'

    And the district attorney is all like:

    'Dude, that idea needs more Beatles.'

    And Bugliosi is all like:

    '**** man that's a great idea. How about the Beatles are sending him like messages and **** through 'Love Me Do' or something?'

    And the D.A. says:

    'Nah man that's a **** idea. No one would believe it.'

    And Bugliosi takes another hefty bang off a pipe and goes:

    'The ****ing White Album dude. That **** is crazy.'

    And the D.A. says:

    '**** yeah it is! We've got this peace loving hippy nailed! Can't have someone like him free to roam the streets spreading love to the kids. Pass that mother****ing pipe.'


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    #97
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Time wrote: »
    Yeah he was at the house when they first broke in and thats still enough under the felony murder rule i'm afraid, and what about the murder of Gary Hinman?

    No when they got killed as you tried to claim.


    Manson was not there when Hinman was killed either.


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    #98
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    viadah wrote: »
    Now THAT'S what I call a rebuttal. The explanation for why Bugliosi invented Helter Skelter is that prosecutions invent scenarios all the time? And rather than using the testimony to prove Manson led the group and made the important decisions for them, Bugliosi said:

    'No guys, just no. I've got this far out idea that's sure to work - Manson believes that.....let's see.....yeah, he believes that there's gonna be a race war right? And the only white folk who'll survive will be him and his brain donor family right? So he'll take over the world because he thinks black people can't operate the world properly, they need a white man to tell them what to do.'

    And the district attorney is all like:

    'Dude, that idea needs more Beatles.'

    And Bugliosi is all like:

    '**** man that's a great idea. How about the Beatles are sending him like messages and **** through 'Love Me Do' or something?'

    And the D.A. says:

    'Nah man that's a **** idea. No one would believe it.'

    And Bugliosi takes another hefty bang off a pipe and goes:

    'The ****ing White Album dude. That **** is crazy.'

    And the D.A. says:

    '**** yeah it is! We've got this peace loving hippy nailed! Can't have someone like him free to roam the streets spreading love to the kids. Pass that mother****ing pipe.'



    He became a multi millionaire from the book and film.

    Its all speculation he invented.


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    #99
    Time
    Registered Users Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    No when they got killed as you tried to claim.

    Your right he wasn't there when they were killed but he was in or at the house before that (which you have admitted) and that makes him guilty under american law of felony murder. So he is guilty. Look up the case of Ryan Holle who found found guilty of first degree murder for less under the same rule.

    So the fact that he's rotting away in some hole is perfectly justified.


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    #100
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Time wrote: »
    Your right he wasn't there when they were killed but he was in or at the house before that (which you have admitted) and that makes him guilty under american law of felony murder. So he is guilty. Look up the case of Ryan Holle who found found guilty of first degree murder for less under the same rule.

    So the fact that he's rotting away in some hole is perfectly justified.



    Hes not morally guilty, he was not there when it happened.

    If you spent the night with friends and you left them and they killed someone, would you be morally guilty ?


    The law is long abolished in Ireland and the UK.

    Ireland
    The rule was abolished in the Republic of Ireland by section 4 of the Criminal Justice Act 1964 which codified the mens rea for murder as intention to kill or seriously injure another person.


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    #101
    Namlub
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,298 ✭✭✭Namlub


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Its beyond your little mind.

    The world of the little man.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnysrP_Kgqs

    This coming from someone who misspelled his own username? Haha, bye.


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    #102
    Time
    Registered Users Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Hes not morally guilty, he was not there when it happened.

    If you spent the night with friends and you left them and they killed someone, would you be morally guilty ?


    The law is long abolished in Ireland and the UK.

    Ireland
    The rule was abolished in the Republic of Ireland by section 4 of the Criminal Justice Act 1964 which codified the mens rea for murder as intention to kill or seriously injure another person.

    Irish law is absolutely non applicable here. We're talking about the US, and under there (very well known) felony murder rule, yes he is guilty in physical and moral sense because he was the one who helped and encouraged others to commit crimes that led to the deaths of 2 people, beyond all reasonable doubt, which is the true test of guilt.

    Also your analogy is not similar, if i directed my friends to drive me to a house broke in and then went out and brought them inside, and they ended up murdering the occupants even though i had left again, then your damn right id be guilty, in every sense of the word. Thats a better analogy of what actually happened.


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    #103
    viadah
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭viadah


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Hes not morally guilty, he was not there when it happened.

    If you spent the night with friends and you left them and they killed someone, would you be morally guilty ?


    The law is long abolished in Ireland and the UK.

    Ireland
    The rule was abolished in the Republic of Ireland by section 4 of the Criminal Justice Act 1964 which codified the mens rea for murder as intention to kill or seriously injure another person.

    If I tied them up first before I left I wouldn't be too shocked if I got done for it myself.

    And since none of the murders committed by the Manson Family happened in Ireland, telling us about abolished laws in Ireland is pretty shaky grounds for proving Manson was wrongly convicted.


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    #104
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Morally Manson is not guilty.


    Just to show what a nonsense Helter Skelter is :

    "At Beausoleil's two trials for the murder, the defense mentioned nothing about the murder being the result of a drug transaction gone wrong. His first revelation of this came in 1981, 12 years after the murders, in an interview published in Oui magazine.[1] "


    Hinman was killed over a drugs deal.

    http://www.beausoleil.net/


    .....I am friends with Bobby and Squeaky they are beautiful Souls.


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    #105
    Time
    Registered Users Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    Morally Manson is not guilty.


    Just to show what a nonsense Helter Skelter is :

    "At Beausoleil's two trials for the murder, the defense mentioned nothing about the murder being the result of a drug transaction gone wrong. His first revelation of this came in 1981, 12 years after the murders, in an interview published in Oui magazine.[1] "


    Hinman was killed over a drugs deal.

    Fair enough take Hinman out of it and go back to the La Biancas, it was mansons idea to go rob the place, if it wasn't for him they would not have been murdered so yes morally he is guilty.

    Can you post any sort of law or constitutional right that says otherwise? because if you can't then you have to accept that the US are a democracy and as such have a right to choose its own moral standards, which are generally in line with western society and by the standards they have chosen as a people, he is guilty.

    He might not be guilty by whatever few morals you have (based on your unwavering support for his involvement in crime, i'd remind you that he himself said everyone is responsible for their own actions) but he is by Americas.

    So yes he is guilty. you don't have to pull the trigger to be responsible


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    #106
    viadah
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭viadah


    What? How the hell does that statement prove 'Helter Skelter' is nonsense?

    And you're friends with Bobby and Squeaky? Wow. You're special.

    And just to keep in on topic (though a mod will prolli lock this thread soon): Manson's music is still crap. Whether he's guilty or innocent of murder.


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    #107
    Da Shins Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,048 ✭✭✭Da Shins Kelly


    This is so funny. I hope this thread stays open just to see what this guy says. Even if Charles Manson weren't a psycho, his songs are sh*t anyway. Nobody would care if he wasn't a psycho.


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    #108
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Time wrote: »
    Fair enough take Hinman out of it and go back to the La Biancas, it was mansons idea to go rob the place, if it wasn't for him they would not have been murdered so yes morally he is guilty.

    Can you post any sort of law or constitutional right that says otherwise? because if you can't then you have to accept that the US are a democracy and as such has a right to choose its own moral standards, which are generally in line with western society and by the standards they have chosen as a people, he is guilty.

    He might not be guilty by whatever few morals you have (based on your unwavering support for his involvement in crime, i'd remind you that he himself said everyone is responsible for their own actions) but he is by Americas.

    So yes he is guilty. you don't have to pull the trigger to be responsible



    How can he be guilty for a murder he was not part of ?

    That flies against any morality.

    Stop telling lies, he said he is not guilty.

    Obviously people are responsible for their actions, he was not there, he is not morally guilty, as he has stated.


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    #109
    viadah
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭viadah


    Guilty of conspiracy, Jesus dude keep up.


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    #110
    Time
    Registered Users Posts: 993 ✭✭✭Time


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    How can he be guilty for a murder he was not part of ?

    That flies against any morality.

    Stop telling lies, he said he is not guilt.

    Obviously people are responsible for their actions, he was not there, he is not morally guilty, as he has stated.

    He said he's not guilty, well then it must be true:rolleyes:, i mean what person being accused of murder, who didn't want to spend their life in prison would say they are guilty???

    I haven't told any lies, the La Biancas wouldn't have been killed if it was not for the choices he made. Thats a fact. So he was a part of it by breaking into there house and tying them up. Look clearly you can't back up what your saying with actual facts so i'll leave it at that as clearly you aren't open to seeing any other perspective than your own.

    So back on topic, personally i thing the music you've posted is rubbish.


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    #111
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    viadah wrote: »
    What? How the hell does that statement prove 'Helter Skelter' is nonsense?

    And you're friends with Bobby and Squeaky? Wow. You're special.

    And just to keep in on topic (though a mod will prolli lock this thread soon): Manson's music is still crap. Whether he's guilty or innocent of murder.

    You really are a nasty piece of work.


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    #112
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Da Shins Kelly wrote: »
    This is so funny. I hope this thread stays open just to see what this guy says. Even if Charles Manson weren't a psycho, his songs are sh*t anyway. Nobody would care if he wasn't a psycho.

    So are you.

    The music is beyond those whos minds are so small and bigoted and full of anger.


    It would be better if the small mind guys stay off this thread.

    Its beyond your capacity. No shame in that, but your bitter comments just show you as the little men you are.


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    #113
    Da Shins Kelly
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,048 ✭✭✭Da Shins Kelly


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    So are you.

    The music is beyond those whos minds are so small and bigoted and full of anger.


    It would be better if the small mind guys stay off this thread.

    Its beyond your capacity. No shame in that, but your bitter comments just show you as the little men you are.

    LOL.


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    #114
    Halloween Jack
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,658 ✭✭✭Halloween Jack


    David koresh > manson ;)


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    #115
    Bobby Baccala
    Registered Users Posts: 7,342 ✭✭✭Bobby Baccala


    HE'S A FÚCKING PSYCHO AND HIS MUSIC IS BOLLOCKS.

    THE END.


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    #116
    viadah
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭viadah


    cruasder777 wrote: »
    So are you.

    The music is beyond those whos minds are so small and bigoted and full of anger.


    It would be better if the small mind guys stay off this thread.

    Its beyond your capacity. No shame in that, but your bitter comments just show you as the little men you are.

    Another stinging rebuke, and a flagrant attempt to sidestep a serious debate on your questionable beliefs. I went so far as to say I'd stand behind you 100% if you told me the argument that convinced you personally of Manson's innocence and convinced me, you won't respond though. Humans evolve through the exchange and expansion of ideas, and you are making no effort to join in a debate, merely recycling the pro-Manson material you've been exposed to but in a less than coherent manner. Lot of people here have open minds, but because they ain't buying what you've got to sell you respond with ineffective insults.

    You're on the stand here, maybe that isn't fair, but you're the only one involved in the pro-Manson portion of proceedings, we've no one else to turn to for your side of the argument. It's frustrating to argue the toss of a one sided coin. The anti-Manson camp has proliferate exposure, if I believed he was innocent, and I had an 'ignorant' captive audience as you do here with this highly controversial topic, I'd make more of an attempt to justify my views.


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    #117
    viadah
    Registered Users Posts: 445 ✭✭viadah


    And, if everyone stayed off the thread with their small minds, it'd just be you and Charlie here.


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    #118
    Rothko
    Registered Users Posts: 12,891 ✭✭✭✭Rothko


    I've listened to his album before and it's nothing great.


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    #119
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Suas11 wrote: »
    I've listened to his album before and it's nothing great.

    Its highly unlikely you understand it. There are 9 albums.

    Its like giving a book to someone who cant read.


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    #120
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    A More recent recording.


    Hobos lament


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTnrbiMyowA&featrue=relmfu


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    #121
    cruasder777
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,332 ✭✭✭cruasder777


    Beautiful song

    In the Infinite Mind


    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ij3OjtHE11o&feature=relmfu


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