Should I jump ship?

cintra

Hello all,

Bit of advice needed, or more a bit of a reality check if I am being a bit of a walkover.

Ive know my current boyfriend for 2 years. We had a casual no strings thing before he went to Oz for a year (was already booked before we met). When he came back at Christmas he began pretty aggressively chasing me, wanting us to be together as he had thought a lot about me while in Oz, despite having a girlfriend over there at the time.

So I caved, and the day before he went to France for the infamous cancelled 1st rugby game in February, after asking me for the third time, I very happily told him that I was totally down for it. Despite reservations about our more casual history, I was convinced that he was serious and that we could be pretty happy.

Fast forward 6 months, and we are still together, happy and totally in love.

Until I receive an email from a french girl,a travel friend my boyfriend met in Australia, who having not heard from my boyfriend put 2 and 2 together, and contacted me. Apparently the original rugby trip they had planned together and he stayed with her and kissed her the day after asking me out and stayed with her the whole weekend. When he attended the re-match again in March, they had sex. He told her we started going out in April.

I confronted him about it 2 days ago, and he confessed to all of it, saying that the argument we had before he left the second time had left him needing comfort. He couldn't really explain why, and I guess in these situations its a futile quest looking for whyfores.

I love him terribly and am deeply wounded. He doesn't want to lose me, and it has been nearly 5 months since and we have grown a lot. He says it never happened again, and that he ceaseD communication with this girl in April.

God, I'm such a hypocrite. In these situations with other couples I was always the ardent feminist, saying you cannot change a cheater. And now faced with it, the temptation to forgive and sweep it all under the carpet is huge. But I'm scared that I wont be able to refrain from not ever bringing it up again in arguments, that I will become petty and bitter. And does he deserve such forgiveness?

I'm not sure.

strandroad

cintra wrote: »

I confronted him about it 2 days ago, and he confessed to all of it, saying that the argument we had before he left the second time had left him needing comfort. He couldn't really explain why, and I guess in these situations its a futile quest looking for whyfores.

This bit stands out for me. I am sure there will be situations in his life with you when he'll need comfort again, that's life. He gives himself the permission to stray pretty easily, especially that he did it twice and the argument did not even happen for the first time they got together. He also kept you secret for a good while, making progress with her. Not cool.

Piliger

Hi OP.

Firstly this is not about justification. Justification for him in what he did, or justification for you to forgive him or not. Only you can make a choice on what to do, and you can do whatever the heck you like - if it's right for you. Personally I think what he did was wrong, but I also believe fervently in forgiveness and not making knee jerking reactions to mistakes people make.

Chronologically you were just barely going out when that game happened, after he was chasing you, it seems. We also have to remember that your previous 'relationship' together was a purely no strings casual sex thing. So there must have been an 'air' of that continuing in at least HIS mind if not yours, or subconsciously, and I think you need to take that into account in your judgement of him.

His choice to sleep with this French girl was still wrong. I am not going to latch on to your wording of his reaction because it may be just that ... your wording of it. People are vulnerable to seductive company after a fight and finding themselves in a convenient situation abroad. Such is life.

So OP. Only you know him. Only you know if he has fundamentally altered his attitude to your relationship from a no strings casual thing to a real relationship with commitment and loyalty. Only you can judge if this was an early blip.

I myself, as I said above, believe that we shouldn't throw people under a train because of one slip up, if there is good evidence that it can be repaired and it is worth while.

Best of luck.

cintra

I think you are both right, and I have always been a big believer at looking at the context of the mistake. Hence why I am avoiding the melodramatic reaction and told him to give me space to think things through. Its funny, the sex thing doesn't bother me as much as his making these travel plans and kissing her, the very day after he asked me out. Especially with a sort of anniversary coming up, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Probably a bit naive but I always thought that the first few months 'honeymoon period' were a bit sacred. I was so happy I danced home to my house that night when he asked me, but he was able to forget about me enough to spend a weekend with this girl the very next day. Seems awfully cold, just at the beginning.

P. Breathnach

I could accept the contact with her on the weekend of the aborted match: it had probably already been arranged, and you and he were a "new item". It was wrong for him to kiss her, but it was an odd situation. You could forgive that, while not being too pleased about it.

But on the second visit to Paris, he was probably aware that this girl was available to him. As you and he were in a relationship, it would have been sensible of him to avoid contacting her - but he didn't. I would be highly sceptical of his excuse for having sex with her. It looks to me that he saw a chance to have some recreational sex, and he took it. Even if his excuse had some basis in reality, going off to shag somebody else is not an appropriate reaction to a row with your partner.

I am also interested in the French girl's motives in contacting you. It suggests to me that she was hurt by him. I imagine that he played her, holding out the prospect of a continuing relationship, and then she found out that he was, in effect, cheating on both of you. Of course, I could be misreading the situation: she might just be a troublemaker. Look back over what she wrote, and try to interpret the tone and her intentions in contacting you.

Your call, OP. A difficult one: I hope you get it right.

[Your latest post arrived while I was composing mine. I'd still stand by my first paragraph, and think that the greater wrong was contacting her the next time he went to Paris.]

Piliger

cintra wrote: »

I think you are both right, and I have always been a big believer at looking at the context of the mistake. Hence why I am avoiding the melodramatic reaction and told him to give me space to think things through.

Wise decision I think. However I would be concerned about whether he thinks he has a license to wander while you're thinking .... ? this is NOT a break, so he had better be celibate imho.

Its funny, the sex thing doesn't bother me as much as his making these travel plans and kissing her, the very day after he asked me out. Especially with a sort of anniversary coming up, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

I do understand. As a guy 50+ I would just say to you that the truth of life is that men can do this. We are built to compartmentalise and though ghastly, it is the way men are.

Probably a bit naive but I always thought that the first few months 'honeymoon period' were a bit sacred. I was so happy I danced home to my house that night when he asked me, but he was able to forget about me enough to spend a weekend with this girl the very next day. Seems awfully cold, just at the beginning.

Yet ... the truth is your previous relationship was ... cold, dispassionate sex. I really think that has to be taken into account, though that does NOT give him a pass. if you chose to forgive him he needs to accept the grievous nature of his action and atone for it.

LegacyUser

Hi OP, just wanted to add to this and point some things out.

While in Oz he was disloyal to his girlfriend by thinking about you. Anyone would take that and feel special, yet he does what he did to you - twice, essentially. Once with the kiss, twice with sex. In the meantime he would see you at home with no evident remorse.

I was the same as you and thought I'd never stay with a cheater, got cheated on, made excuses...the usual. Dumped that ex about 2 weeks later and it's the best decision I've ever made. Don't waste your time, you won't change him. I'm so sorry to hear what happened but there is absolutely no excuse for it. You deserve better!

Lorna123

cintra wrote: »

Hello all,

Bit of advice needed, or more a bit of a reality check if I am being a bit of a walkover.

Ive know my current boyfriend for 2 years. We had a casual no strings thing before he went to Oz for a year (was already booked before we met). When he came back at Christmas he began pretty aggressively chasing me, wanting us to be together as he had thought a lot about me while in Oz, despite having a girlfriend over there at the time.

So I caved, and the day before he went to France for the infamous cancelled 1st rugby game in February, after asking me for the third time, I very happily told him that I was totally down for it. Despite reservations about our more casual history, I was convinced that he was serious and that we could be pretty happy.

Fast forward 6 months, and we are still together, happy and totally in love.

Until I receive an email from a french girl,a travel friend my boyfriend met in Australia, who having not heard from my boyfriend put 2 and 2 together, and contacted me. Apparently the original rugby trip they had planned together and he stayed with her and kissed her the day after asking me out and stayed with her the whole weekend. When he attended the re-match again in March, they had sex. He told her we started going out in April.

I confronted him about it 2 days ago, and he confessed to all of it, saying that the argument we had before he left the second time had left him needing comfort. He couldn't really explain why, and I guess in these situations its a futile quest looking for whyfores.

I love him terribly and am deeply wounded. He doesn't want to lose me, and it has been nearly 5 months since and we have grown a lot. He says it never happened again, and that he ceaseD communication with this girl in April.

God, I'm such a hypocrite. In these situations with other couples I was always the ardent feminist, saying you cannot change a cheater. And now faced with it, the temptation to forgive and sweep it all under the carpet is huge. But I'm scared that I wont be able to refrain from not ever bringing it up again in arguments, that I will become petty and bitter. And does he deserve such forgiveness?

I'm not sure.

Sounds to me like he wanted his cake and eat it. He wasn't sure whether you and him would be an item when he made the first arrangements to visit this woman, so I would let him off the hook for this, but he should have told her shortly afterwards that he was in a relationship and would not be meeting her again. However, he decided to let this run, knowing that he would be over there a second time and he could hook up with this woman second time around. That is just a mortal sin as far as I am concerned. There is no excuse for this. He wasn't going to tell you about it either because he knows it was wrong. He thought he was getting away with it until you got the letter. Now he is faced with making up excuses to get him out of a hole.

This is what I think now OP. I think that he is into you alright and wants the relationship to continue but I am not sure if he has sewn all of his wild oats yet. He likes to have you but if he got another opportunity of sleeping with someone again and thought you would not find out then I am not sure if he would turn it down. He cheated and that is about the size of it. I suppose you could turn a blind eye this time but if it ever happens again then shoot him.

I am not a man but I think that men can do this kind of thing but still think the world of their g/f. Oftentimes they will do this until they settle down and then they will be faithfull for the rest of their lives. It is cold comfort to you though OP. You have decide if you can trust him now after that.

Ellsbells

I dunno Lorna I would worry that if he gets away with it now it will be a licence to do it again. He knew what he was at the second time so obviously is willing to cheat. I would find it too hard to trust him again.

Strange that the French girl made contact though? How did she have your details?

Mighty_Mouse

It's very early stages in a potentially long-term relationship.
Ye were no strings for a full 2 years prior to deciding to give it a shot.
It's just a bit of overlap. Old habits die hard and all that.

cintra

Hey Guys,

Many thanks for all the replies, its funny how helpful it can be to see the issues laid out by others in both sympathetic and analytic lighting.

Probably should clarify a few things

When I said we were no strings when we first met, I didn't mean it in the traditional sense. We met and unfortunately he had already booked his flights to Australia. But for the 4 months before he left we were a couple, met families, dated, didn't (or at least I didn't) see anyone else. Ha, now that I think of it, who knows what he was up to!

I believe the reasons the french girl contacted me was a case of woman scorned. Some pictures of myself and my boyfriend were tagged on Facebook dated from late February onwards, and they are overtly couple-ey pics, so I believe she put 2 and 2 together. I have to say her tone in the messages weren't vindictive, and seemed more concerned that I should know what happened for my own sake. But who knows the motives of strangers.

He really wants to make it work. But I've already come from the emotional wreckage of a cheating partner, a fact he well knew and promised not to repeat. Probably an idiotic thing to say as you cannot avoid trouble forever, but I was hoping that any problems in our future would be ones to be faced together, work, moving etc. Just not sure I have it in me again to suddenly have to work at solving an issue that was not my causing.

Going to meet with him today, to discuss things. Things change when you see the person in the flesh, and I'm hoping that maybe my feelings for him will overshadow the severe doubts I now harbor. We are 6 months on Thursday and it does seem to be a waste to give up on that, but part of me cant help thinking its always going to be there in the back of my mind, and at 24 I would like not to have trust issues!!!

Thanks again for the advice, Il let ye know how it went

cintra

cintra wrote: »

He really wants to make it work. But I've already come from the emotional wreckage of a cheating partner, a fact he well knew and promised not to repeat. Probably an idiotic thing to say as you cannot avoid trouble forever, but I was hoping that any problems in our future would be ones to be faced together, work, moving etc. Just not sure I have it in me again to suddenly have to work at solving an issue that was not my causing.

Going to meet with him today, to discuss things. Things change when you see the person in the flesh, and I'm hoping that maybe my feelings for him will overshadow the severe doubts I now harbor.

OP of course he really wants to make it work. He wants everything. When he was here he wanted you, when he went to Australia he wanted you and a girlfriend, came back and wanted you as a girlfriend, went to France and wanted you as a girlfriend but also a French girl as a girlfriend. So he led you on, led her on, and who knows the situation he left his last girlfriend in.

I'm all for second chances and trying to work through issues instead of giving up on someone, but this guy has all the traits of a serial cheater. Even down to the way you said he aggressively pursued you and told you he had been thinking of you the whole time he was in Australia.

You say things change when you see a person in the flesh, and they do - it becomes easier to forgive. I was cheated on repeatedly by an ex, and every time I said I was leaving, he'd beg for me to meet up, so we could "just talk". He knew that if I saw him face to face I'd lose my conviction and be too tempted to fall for his bull. He managed to manipulate me so many times I'd be embarrassed to tell you how many. Please be on guard, and remember that words are easy to say, and just because you want to believe them doesn't mean they're true.

Piliger

Hi OP. That additional information makes me a lot more sceptical of him now

Best of luck !

LegacyUser

To be honest, I think that some of this advice might be a bit over cautious IMO.

Like I know that you guys had a history and had dated, albeit with an expiration date, before however I can't ignore that this was at the very, very early stages of your relationship. You had obviously been rejecting him for a while seeing as you describe it as 'caving' when you eventually agreed to give it a go so I think that the boundaries here, for me at least, are a little bit blurred.

I think the initial one in Feb would not be the more worrying of the two for me, however I think that they are both forgiveable tbh.

In the very initial stages of a relationship, who knows where it's going? I know a lot of people will slate me probably saying you can't start a relationship with lies and cheating but I don't think that until it's been properly defined it can be classed as cheating at all. I'm a very loyal person, I have never cheated on anybody I have been in a relationship with. That's not to say though that in the very early stages of seeing someone, I haven't kissed someone else. Two years in - I would say it's very worrying. At the very beginning I would be more inclined to give someone a chance and see it as an undefined period where noone is really fully committed yet.

Nowadays how many relationships does anyone truly know around them where both partners are completely faithful for the entirety? I hate to say it but the percentage that have not been are fairly high. Obviously premeditated and regular playing away is never forgiveable, but in the circumstances here I think that I would be willing to forgive

Piliger

rgffgergfgfgfg wrote: »

Nowadays how many relationships does anyone truly know around them where both partners are completely faithful for the entirety? I hate to say it but the percentage that have not been are fairly high. Obviously premeditated and regular playing away is never forgiveable, but in the circumstances here I think that I would be willing to forgive

I agree with you 1000%. Unfortunately the media and parents and our culture create this fiction of 'perfection', where a partner must be perfectly loyal, and perfectly truthful and perfectly available, and if they do anything to break that perfection, they are to be rejected and trashed even after years of what otherwise are wonderful and happy relationships.
Too many people are willing to trash these beautiful relationships because of what are very often a temporary weakness to temptation by their partner. I think it is dreadfully dreadfully sad myself. And the result is a huge number of lonely people desperately trying to find another relationship, in the deluded fantasy that the next partner will be that perfect partner..... Sad really.

Mighty_Mouse

^^^ what he said.

This fantasy of perfection which takes no account for human imperfection is a reoccurring theme in here.

The OP is not being asked to suffer infidelity or be a doormat of any kind.

The relationships is in such an early stage it's hard to even define it as serious.

OP, if he's worth it (which he clearly is), cut him some slack.
Allow him the chance to prove himself.

LegacyUser

^^^^ Completely agree.

Take the example of someone being attracted to someone else, say work colleagues for argument sake. They naturally spend a lot of time together. They exchange regular correspondence of some nature, they are both involved with other people but they are only 'friends' so no harm done. They text/email a good bit etc etc, flirty but never overly inappropriate. There have been a few nights out where it's come close to 'crossing the line' but they've never kissed etc etc.

Then take a scenario where someone goes out, gets drunk and kisses someone random while in a relationship. It really meant nothing more than a drunken grope in a nightclub but it's seen as 'crossing the line' somehow and people might never consider the first scenario as being the worse of the two. I would. I've seen both happen with friends of mine and I always see the emotional cheating as so much more dangerous.

I can completely understand that mistakes can happen and I'd be more worried about inappropriate tension between people that interact with my partner on a long term basis than a random score in a club.

Basically the lad is with you now....this happened at the very start of your relationship, he made a mistake - possibly on the back of being rejected a bit by you and wasn't thinking clearly, it's clear she's no longer in his life and there isn't prolonged contact. Give him the benefit of the doubt I say.

sski

I think the fact that he did it twice and continued seeing her means he has conscience issues..it wasn't just a one time accidental incident..but that's just my opinion..doesn't mean it's correct so you should do what your gut tells you..

OldNotWIse

cintra wrote: »

Hello all,

Bit of advice needed, or more a bit of a reality check if I am being a bit of a walkover.

Ive know my current boyfriend for 2 years. We had a casual no strings thing before he went to Oz for a year (was already booked before we met). When he came back at Christmas he began pretty aggressively chasing me, wanting us to be together as he had thought a lot about me while in Oz, despite having a girlfriend over there at the time.

So I caved, and the day before he went to France for the infamous cancelled 1st rugby game in February, after asking me for the third time, I very happily told him that I was totally down for it. Despite reservations about our more casual history, I was convinced that he was serious and that we could be pretty happy.

Fast forward 6 months, and we are still together, happy and totally in love.

Until I receive an email from a french girl,a travel friend my boyfriend met in Australia, who having not heard from my boyfriend put 2 and 2 together, and contacted me. Apparently the original rugby trip they had planned together and he stayed with her and kissed her the day after asking me out and stayed with her the whole weekend. When he attended the re-match again in March, they had sex. He told her we started going out in April.

I confronted him about it 2 days ago, and he confessed to all of it, saying that the argument we had before he left the second time had left him needing comfort. He couldn't really explain why, and I guess in these situations its a futile quest looking for whyfores.

I love him terribly and am deeply wounded. He doesn't want to lose me, and it has been nearly 5 months since and we have grown a lot. He says it never happened again, and that he ceaseD communication with this girl in April.

God, I'm such a hypocrite. In these situations with other couples I was always the ardent feminist, saying you cannot change a cheater. And now faced with it, the temptation to forgive and sweep it all under the carpet is huge. But I'm scared that I wont be able to refrain from not ever bringing it up again in arguments, that I will become petty and bitter. And does he deserve such forgiveness?

I'm not sure.

Does this not depict how he is likely to treat you when you become his gf?

Forgiveness is easier said than done. Forgetting is impossible. I found out my current gf cheated on me shortly after we started sleeping together (I know the jury will be out on this one as some people say we weren't exclusive, in my way of thinking, sleeping with someone implies exclusivity, but anyway, it felt like a betrayal so that was the main thing) and I "forgave" her because I didn't want to let her go and lose what we had, but it actually took a looooooong time to really forgive her in my heart, and a loooooooooooonger time to be able to trust her again. I'm not trying to be melodramatic but just wanted to say that even when we want to forgive, and even when it is the right decision, it can be still a difficult road, and can be a lonely, insecure one too, until the trust is regained.