British and Irish Lions Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

danthefan

Swiwi wrote: »

Bowe with better service from his centres would do alright. Welsh backs dreadful last 2 games (Halfpenny aside). I guess both Bowe & North need to press their claims in the 6N.

I'm not just talking about for Ireland. He wasn't at his best for the Ospreys last season nor has he been for Ulster this season.

Was thinking both could travel but since both are basically just right wingers not sure there'd be room for both.

maroondog

Gatland I can see being heavily Welsh biased come next summer, similar to recent tours where coaches involved favour player they are over/were over as national coach.

Woodward was head coach in 05 and heavily biased to English players. He stayed very loyal a lot of aging WC 2003 winners, a side well on the decline after 2003 exploits. Neil Back was selected even thou he retired from international rugby and became oldest ever Lions test player.
There 8 English included to start in 1st Test and 4 subs were:
Jason Robinson, Josh Lewsey, J Wilkinson, J White, Ben Kay, Richard Hill & Martin Corry. Replacements used included Will Greenwood, Matt Dawson, Steve Thompson & Danny Grewcock.

In 2005 Wales were Grand Slam winners but only had 4 starters so form didnt count much in 05.

09 head coach was McGeechan, not involved with Scotland for quite a while and Scots would hardly be big influence (seems to be involved with most tours). However Wales head coach Gatland & his assistant Edwards involved with Lions and had a good sprinkling of Welsh.
Starting in 1st Test were 6 Welsh and also used 3 as subs:
Lee Byrne, Jamie Roberts, Stephen Jones, Mike Philips, Gethin Jenkins & Alun W Jones. Replacements used included Matthew Rees, Adam Jones & Martyn Williams.

In 2009 Ireland after the Grand Slam win had 5 starters, not bad I guess. Kearney didnt even start 1st Test after a super season he had. He did come on as sub in 1st test and kept his place and was super in the 2 tests after that.

cgpg5

maroondog wrote: »

Gatland I can see being heavily Welsh biased come next summer, similar to recent tours where coaches involved favour player they are over/were over as national coach.

Woodward was head coach in 05 and heavily biased to English players. He stayed very loyal a lot of aging WC 2003 winners, a side well on the decline after 2003 exploits. Neil Back was selected even thou he retired from international rugby and became oldest ever Lions test player.
There 8 English included to start in 1st Test and 4 subs were:
Jason Robinson, Josh Lewsey, J Wilkinson, J White, Ben Kay, Richard Hill & Martin Corry. Replacements used included Will Greenwood, Matt Dawson, Steve Thompson & Danny Grewcock.

In 2005 Wales were Grand Slam winners but only had 4 starters so form didnt count much in 05.

09 head coach was McGeechan, not involved with Scotland for quite a while and Scots would hardly be big influence (seems to be involved with most tours). However Wales head coach Gatland & his assistant Edwards involved with Lions and had a good sprinkling of Welsh.
Starting in 1st Test were 6 Welsh and also used 3 as subs:
Lee Byrne, Jamie Roberts, Stephen Jones, Mike Philips, Gethin Jenkins & Alun W Jones. Replacements used included Matthew Rees, Adam Jones & Martyn Williams.

In 2009 Ireland after the Grand Slam win had 5 starters, not bad I guess. Kearney didnt even start 1st Test after a super season he had. He did come on as sub in 1st test and kept his place and was super in the 2 tests after that.

Byrne was in the form of his life in 2009 and deservedly started ahead of Kearney. kearney only got in cos Byrne got injured iirc

Tox56

danthefan wrote: »

I'm not just talking about for Ireland. He wasn't at his best for the Ospreys last season nor has he been for Ulster this season.

Was thinking both could travel but since both are basically just right wingers not sure there'd be room for both.

North started every game in the 6N for Wales on the left wing? I don't think that will be the problem, if they both have good 6 Nations I would expect them both to travel.

clsmooth

What's the opinion on Andrew Sheridan? Will he get on the tour? And just how good is he? Put it to an English mate the other day that Healy was world class in my opinion and would be in my Lions team. He's not much of a fan citing his discipline (which I think is much improved compared to 3yrs ago). He thinks Sheridan is currently the best LH in the world and cites him keeping Jenkins out of the team as one of his points although i think Jenkins is in decline. Forum thoughts?

Higher

If we are completely honest then the only Irish players that would start in the Lions currently are Healy and Sexton.

Deano7788

Higher wrote: »

If we are completely honest then the only Irish players that would start in the Lions currently are Healy and Sexton.

If we're only talking currently fit players, I'd add in Strauss and Heaslip

Ciaran-Irl

Higher wrote: »

If we are completely honest then the only Irish players that would start in the Lions currently are Healy and Sexton.

England & Scotland have been as bad as us, and Wales have been diabolical lately.

Fishooks12

Higher wrote: »

If we are completely honest then the only Irish players that would start in the Lions currently are Healy and Sexton.

Heaslip is head and shoulders above the other 8's

POC was in serious form his last game before he got injured and if he plays anywhere near that and stays injury free he'll be on the team too I reckon

totallegend

Higher wrote: »

If we are completely honest then the only Irish players that would start in the Lions currently are Healy and Sexton.

Kearney? Or are you only counting fit players?

Higher

Deano7788 wrote: »

If we're only talking currently fit players, I'd add in Strauss and Heaslip

Forgot about Strauss.

Don't see POC making the starting team though.

Higher

totallegend wrote: »

Kearney? Or are you only counting fit players?

Currently playing players.

Although that said I don't think BOD or POC will start even if they regain full fitness.

durkadurka

POCs injuries are mounting up though.

I wonder how much more we'll see of him.

Fishooks12

Higher wrote: »

Currently playing players.

Although that said I don't think BOD or POC will start even if they regain full fitness.

If BOD gets fully fit again he'll take some stopping. He was still the best 13 in the NH last season

Higher

durkadurka wrote: »

POCs injuries are mounting up though.

I wonder how much more we'll see of him.

There is a lot of talk in circles of himself and Fitzgerald not returning.

Fishooks12

Higher wrote: »

There is a lot of talk in circles of himself and Fitzgerald not returning.

of POC not returning!? First I've heard of it. What circles pray tell?

Higher

Higher wrote: »

If we are completely honest then the only Irish players that would start in the Lions currently are Healy and Sexton.

excuse me

totallegend

Fishooks12 wrote: »

of POC not returning!? First I've heard of it. What circles pray tell?

Speculation only. Just that he keeps coming back from injury only to break down again very rapidly. It just reminds me a lot of Flannery's situation.

ScissorPaperRock

Higher wrote: »

There is a lot of talk in circles of himself and Fitzgerald not returning.

Fitzgerald? Really?! That would be such a shame.

.ak

That PR article is very kind on the Irish all things considering... However, whilst we might not have many starters I think we will have a decent share of tourists when you look at the shortlist they've produced.

Fishooks12

That PR article is odd. Some of the players on standby especially

Trimble on stand-by over Earls?!

Scioch

Fishooks12 wrote: »

That PR article is odd. Some of the players on standby especially

Trimble on stand-by over Earls?!

Can he have any hopes of being in with a shout if he's not playing on the wing ?

Fishooks12

Scioch wrote: »

Can he have any hopes of being in with a shout if he's not playing on the wing ?

I think he'll travel given he's able to cover so many positions and there's not too many utility backs in the home nations right now. Not to mention that he's a better winger than Trimble, who on current form shouldn't be starting for Ulster

irishbucsfan

Fishooks12 wrote: »

I think he'll travel given he's able to cover so many positions and there's not too many utility backs in the home nations right now. Not to mention that he's a better winger than Trimble, who on current form shouldn't be starting for Ulster

Of course Trimble should be starting for Ulster FFS, he was man of the match the last time he played for them!

Fishooks12

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Of course Trimble should be starting for Ulster FFS, he was man of the match the last time he played for them!

I'd have Gilroy ahead of him tbh. Think he offers a lot more in attack. Many Ulster fans would say the same, and Trimble was hardly lighting things up before that game

Although "current form" was probably a bad choice of words considering Trimble was very good in his last match before the international break

Having Trimble over Earls for Lion selection is very odd

Scioch

Earls being a better winger is also debatable. What has Earls done in the last year to show he's a better winger than Trimble ?

Fishooks12

Scioch wrote: »

Earls being a better winger is also debatable. What has Earls done in the last year to show he's a better winger than Trimble ?

It's pretty hard to debate considering Earls is a better finisher, he's faster, a better kicker and fielder and offers more of a breaking threat.

I thought Earls was Irelands best back bar Kearney in last years six nations while Trimble was rather abject

Scioch

Fishooks12 wrote: »

It's pretty hard to debate considering Earls is a better finisher, he's faster, a better kicker and offers more of a breaking threat.

Earls was Irelands best back bar Kearney in last years six nations while Trimble was rather abject

Easy to debate. Earls's kicking is no better than Trimbles. They are evenly matched under the high ball. Trimble is a greater attacking threat as he's better able open a defence and offload to put guys through. Earls being more inclined to back himself. Earls has more pace and Trimble is a better defender.

As for finishing I dont see it. They are both well able score if they are in the position but Trimble work ethic often moves him around the pitch so he's not always last man out to dot it down.

And Trimble was out best player going into the world cup and kept that form when he got whatever scraps Kidney gave. On current evidence Trimble is the better winger. And I cant see Gatland selecting Earls on anything other than current appearances so he will need to have a good 6 nations (on the wing) to be in with a shout. I dont see him being brought as a utility back either ahead of better players, Gatland will be bringing x amount in each position right ?. I dont see Trimble travelling either btw.

Fishooks12

Scioch wrote: »

Easy to debate. Earls's kicking is no better than Trimbles. They are evenly matched under the high ball. Trimble is a greater attacking threat as he's better able open a defence and offload to put guys through. Earls being more inclined to back himself. Earls has more pace and Trimble is a better defender.

As for finishing I dont see it. They are both well able score if they are in the position but Trimble work ethic often moves him around the pitch so he's not always last man out to dot it down.

And Trimble was out best player going into the world cup and kept that form when he got whatever scraps Kidney gave. On current evidence Trimble is the better winger. And I cant see Gatland selecting Earls on anything other than current appearances so he will need to have a good 6 nations to be in with a shout. I dont see him being brought as a utility back either ahead of better players. I dont see Trimble travelling either.

I suppose we'll have to agree to disagree so because I don't really agree with any of that

Tox56

Fishooks12 wrote: »

It's pretty hard to debate considering Earls is a better finisher, he's faster, a better kicker and fielder and offers more of a breaking threat.

I thought Earls was Irelands best back bar Kearney in last years six nations while Trimble was rather abject

But Earls was playing 13 not wing in that 6N (assuming we are talking 2012 here?).

It's a difficult one. I think it's quite clear Earls would be a better if he actually played on the wing , but the question was what has he done there in the last year to show he is better, and at the moment he isn't playing there regularly enough.

With the emergence of Cave (eventually..), the winding down of BOD and the young Irish wingers it will be interesting to see what happens to Earls in the next 18 months.