British and Irish Lions Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

Not Playing Tiddlywinks Vinny

Lions be serious lacking an outstanding option at 12 and hooker in fairness! Roberts and Barritt doing the same with Roberts doing it better, solid defending and running hard at the opposition 10. Best playing poorly, Youngs not great, Hibbard could nearly be the best option..........or Strauss

sting60

Where are all the heads that had 6,7,8, Irish in the test team.There is no doubt that Ireland are by far the worst team in the 6 nations.I Have said before a game started we will be lucky not to get the wooden spoon and at very best we may get two into the first test.We will get none and infact we will have a very small list travelling on the panel.I also said wait till the big two play each other before we decide which fiftheen start.I was wrong about some of the English players based on todays result .Its now pick the Welsh team and see who is better from England.It should now be called the Welsh and English Lions.

trouttrout

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

Jones is a concrete starter. Philips is too, Halfpenny will be kicking so Bigger might as well start 10 with the added advantage of knowing Philips game

Ofcouse politics will force a number of deserving Welsh players out

Sense, this makes little

matthew8

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

Jones is a concrete starter. Philips is too, Halfpenny will be kicking so Bigger might as well start 10 with the added advantage of knowing Philips game

Ofcouse politics will force a number of deserving Welsh players out

They play one good game and all of a sudden they're the greatest team ever. They didn't win the slam. Even when Ireland won the slam (and the H-Cup) we only had 5 starters. Sexton's all round game is superior to Biggar's. Cole is every bit as good as Jones. And Mike Philips may have marshaled today's game but Murray did the same thing against France and he's not even considered, and rightly so. Youngs is the better SH.

I just think the Welsh hype today is way too much. Wales came to Australia with a slam last year and lost 3-0 to a team that had just been defeated by Scotland.

trouttrout

matthew8 wrote: »

They play one good game and all of a sudden they're the greatest team ever. They didn't win the slam. Even when Ireland won the slam (and the H-Cup) we only had 5 starters. Sexton's all round game is superior to Biggar's. Cole is every bit as good as Jones. And Mike Philips may have marshaled today's game but Murray did the same thing against France and he's not even considered, and rightly so. Youngs is the better SH.

I just think the Welsh hype today is way too much. Wales came to Australia with a slam last year and lost 3-0 to a team that had just been defeated by Scotland.

Wouldn't say that at all now. Cole is after getting stuffed a few times during thsi championship while Jones has been a weapon

TimeToShine

I don't see Davies starting and I think Gatland might push BOD out to 12 and stick Tuilagi in at 13 and drop Roberts to the bench. Tuilagi may not have been great this tournament but he's a proven centre and Gatland won't forget that.

Swiwi

trouttrout wrote: »

Wouldn't say that at all now. Cole is after getting stuffed a few times during thsi championship while Jones has been a weapon

Yeah Cole's star has definitely waned. I think Jones has it locked down after today's game, barring injury.

Tigerandahalf

Adam Jones is a legend. Best TH in the world for last 5 years.

matthew8

trouttrout wrote: »

Wouldn't say that at all now. Cole is after getting stuffed a few times during thsi championship while Jones has been a weapon

Aussies won't stuff him though, and he seems a little bit better around the park.

FellasFellas

Aye, think Jones will start with Cole on the bench. The Aussie scrum is nothing to fear really though, just have to ensure we're solid in the position.

.ak

In the same way that a lot of people were heralding a squad full of Irish after the first game, likewise a lot of people will herald a squad full of welsh now. It's very short sighted. Wales were fairly average for some of their games during the championship and were poison in autumn.

It'll be an even selection.

Dublin Red Devil

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

.............

Swiwi

.ak wrote: »

In the same way that a lot of people were heralding a squad full of Irish after the first game, likewise a lot of people will herald a squad full of welsh now. It's very short sighted. Wales were fairly average for some of their games during the championship and were poison in autumn.

It'll be an even selection.

I agree. The main difference today was the Welsh backrow, and a handy number of scrum penalties. Wales played very well, but they have also been desperate at times, never more so than v France. I would still have Youngs ahead of Phillips for example.

Tigerandahalf

In fairness Walsh the ref gave Wales carte blanche at the breakdown. Good few breakdown decisions could have gone the other way but you would have to admire the tenacity of the Welsh at the breakdown.

Swiwi

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

In fairness Walsh the ref gave Wales carte blanche at the breakdown. Good few breakdown decisions could have gone the other way but you would have to admire the tenacity of the Welsh at the breakdown.

I don't see Irishbucsfan around today, but as he said you have to play the ref, and Wales did it pretty well.

schools rugby

TimeToShine wrote: »

I don't see Davies starting and I think Gatland might push BOD out to 12 and stick Tuilagi in at 13 and drop Roberts to the bench. Tuilagi may not have been great this tournament but he's a proven centre and Gatland won't forget that.

He will 100 per cent not do that. BOD wont play 12. Tuilagi is one of the most overrated players in the four nations - He is good in the Premiership but is pretty average in most internationals . I only remember a handful of international games that i can say he is a world class 13

Podge_irl

It'll be a cold day in hell before Biggar starts a Lions test. I actually quite like him as a player (when he's not dicking over Leinster) but he's just not of the same class as Sexton and I'd probably take Farrell ahead of him too.

Tigerandahalf

Tuilagi is fine if he is up against small centres. The Aussie centres arent big so it is possible. However he is limited, pace onto the ball and that is it. His hands dont look great and I dont think he has any great vision either to put other players through.
The Lions are weak and lack depth in a few positions and 13 is one as well as hooker.

schools rugby

Tigerandahalf wrote: »

Tuilagi is fine if he is up against small centres. The Aussie centres arent big so it is possible. However he is limited, pace onto the ball and that is it. His hands dont look great and I dont think he has any great vision either to put other players through.
The Lions are weak and lack depth in a few positions and 13 is one as well as hooker.

If Tommy Bowe is fit he will travel . He can play 13 (not saying he will, but he is a backup) and he played well against South Africa in the 3rd test in 2009. Gatland will remember players from that tour very well - Bowe being one of them

trouttrout

So who's stock has risen since the six nations, and who's has fallen?

Wing: Really not the area of strength it could have been due to injury and loss of form. Cuthbert has come up trumps for Wales in big games for two years now. More or less cemented his place in the squad with today's performance. North has improved as the championship has progressed and will still push hard for a starting berth. Maitland has shown a bit more than Visser over the course of the tournament and it's hard to see the two Scottish wingers make the plane. Ashton has had a dreadful few weeks, would have been seen as a near guaranteed tourist a few weeks ago but not anymore. Gilroy will be looking to put his hand up in the quarters but bar defense, he wasn't seen much for Ireland (largely down to awful back play really). Earls seems to have been done by injury and Brown simply isn't good enough on the wing considering the competition.

Fullback: Halfpenny has a hand on the jersey after a brilliant six nations. Top quality kicker in every regard, faultless under a high ball and a rock in defense. Kearney had a poor opening game, but his form is slowly returning, even if he's prone to the odd brainfart. Hogg's versatility will probably see him travel ahead of Goode (although, in fairness, Goode is pretty versatile too, but in different ways)

Center: Jamie Roberts put himself back in the running with a storming display in defense and attack today, which is a relief considering the lack of quality options at 12. Tualagi is only back from injury but he was found out badly against Wales, still going to travel but he's by no means the finished article yet. BOD is my choice for captain, didn't have the best six nations, but a large part of that can should be put down to the lack of direction the we had as a unit, he would relish playing alongside the likes of North and Cuthbert. Barritt is solid defensively, but doesn't offer enough in attack to make the plane. Davies is capable of more, but he hasn't had a great championship which could throw the door open for Scott or Marshall.

Fly Half: Injury to Sexton added fuel to the fire of those making the argument for an Owen Farrell starting berth, but he was woeful with ball in hand today and simply doesn't have anything near the same all round game as our Johnny, who's injury recovery could be crucial to the hopes of the Lions. Dan Biggar has grown into the Welsh ten jersey and should travel now.

Scrum half: An area of concern. Youngs and Care seem to put in a bad game for every solid appearance they put in. Very hard to see them both travel. Murray has been good over the course of the championship, still some issues surrounding his decision making and it could be argued that his similarity in style to Mike Phillips, who put in a good shift today, could see only one of the big 9's travel. The versatility of Laidlaw is hard to ignore too (although I'll admit I really have yet to sit down and watch him properly so I'll reserve my judgement on him as a 9)

Number 8: After a bad start Jamie Heaslip has come roaring back into contention with three good performances, but he's still going to have serious competition in Falataeu and Beattie. Wood isn't in the same class really

Backrow: Huge competition. O'Brien has been brilliant throughout the tournament and Robshaw has been very good too bar his final game. But Kelly Brown has been a thorn in the side of everyone he's come across for Scotland and might be worth considering. Then you have the duo of Tipuric and Warburton who are both world class on their day. Then you've got the likes of Dan Lydiate coming back from injury and youngsters like Rob Harley and Peter O'Mahoney playing well too. Not to mention Stefon Armitage ripping it up in France. I really don't envy Gatland here, because I certainly can't pick four.

Second row: The return of Alan Wyn Jones from injury is a boost, and he should travel along with D Ryan. Launchbury, Evans, Parling, Hamilton have all had good championships and could well be in the mix. The class and aggression of Nathan Hines shouldn't be ignored. And there's also the small matter of a certain former Lions captain regaining fitness in Munster.

TH: Adam Jones is basically the only nailed on starter in the entire squad imo. Cole is probably the pick of the bunch in the loose but he's capitulated in the scrum in virtually every game in the six nations, should still travel over Murray and Mike Ross who's had a mixed championship, got the better of Jenkins in the opener but has struggled since.

LH: Before the return to form of Jenikins it looked like Healy would be a shoe in for the number 1 shirt. Both will travel, and could compliment each other off the bench. Marler has had an awful championship and could be pipped for a third spot by Cross

Hooker: Rory Best is still the favorite, but he hasn't had a great championship by his own high standards. In saying that he's still a class above Ford,Youngs and Hartley. But if Hibbard seems to have upped his game after an inspired performance today, if a little shaky with the darts.

Dublin Red Devil

trouttrout wrote: »

So who's stock has risen since the six nations, and who's has fallen?

Index

Stock up - /\
Stock down - \/
Unchanged - =


Wing

Cuthbert /\ Starter
Maitland /\ Out
Visser /\ Tourist
Ashton \/ Tourist
Gilroy /\ Out
Earls = Out
Brown /\ Out

Fullback

Halfpenny /\ Starter
Kearney \/ Probably Out
Hogg's /\ Tourist
Goode /\ Possible Tourist ( Between him and Kearney for 3rd choice FB)

Center

Jamie Roberts /\ Starter
Tualagi \/ Tourist
BOD = Starter
North and Cuthbert /\ Both Starters
Davies \/ Tourist
Scott /\ Out
Marshall /\ Out

Fly Half

Sexton \/ Tourist (Fitness permitting)
Owen Farrell /\ Starter
Dan Biggar /\ Tourist

Scrum half

Youngs = Tourist (Starter if Farrell starts)
Care = Out
Murray /\ Tourist (If Sexton tours) Starter (if Sexton Starts)
Mike Phillips /\ Tourist (Starter if Sexton Starts and Murray doesn't tour)
Laidlaw /\ Out

Number 8

Jamie Heaslip \/ Tourist
Falataeu /\ Starter (Between him a Heaslip)
Beattie = Out
Wood= Out

Backrow

O'Brien /\ Tourist
Robshaw/\ Starter
Kelly Brown /\ Out
Tipuric /\ Starter
Warburton \/ Tourist
Dan Lydiate \/ Out
Rob Harley = Out
Stefon Armitage = Out

Second row

Alan Wyn Jones = Tourist
D Ryan. /\ Tourist
Launchbury, /\ Possible Tourist
Evans /\ Out
Parling /\ Possible Tourist
Hamilton /\ Possible Tourist
Nathan Hines \/ Out
POC \/ Wouldn't rule him out

TH

Adam Jones /\ Starter
Cole \/ Tourist
Murray =Tourist
Mike Ross = Out

LH

Jenikins /\ Possible Starter
Healy \/Possible Starter
Marler \/ Tourist
Cross /\ Out

Hooker

Rory Best \/ Starter
Ford =Tourist
Youngs = Out
Hartley =Possible Tourist
Hibbard.=Out

totallegend

RTE panel selection for test XV, only counting guys who could play tomorrow, i.e. excludes injured players so not sure how relevant it is.

Healy
Hibbard
A Jones
Hamilton
AW Jones
O'Brien @ six
Tipuric
Faletau
B Youngs
Farrell
North
O'Driscoll @ 12, captain
Tuilagi
Cuthbert
Halfpenny

.ak

Rte panels selection (excluding injured players sexton etc)

1. Healy
2. Hibbard
3. Jones
4. Hamilton
5. Aulwyn jones
6. Sob
7. Tipuric
8. Falateu
9. Youngs
10. Farrell
11. North
12. BOD
13. Tuilagi
14. Cuthbert
15. Halfpenny

EDIT: Beaten to it!

its_phil

Interesting that O'Shea picked BOD as his tour captain over Robshaw who is his captain at Quins

Principal Skinner

totallegend wrote: »

RTE panel selection for test XV, only counting guys who could play tomorrow, i.e. excludes injured players so not sure how relevant it is.

Healy
Hibbard
A Jones
Hamilton
AW Jones
O'Brien @ six
Tipuric
Faletau
B Youngs
Farrell
North
O'Driscoll @ 12, captain
Tuilagi
Cuthbert
Halfpenny

Mental with tuilagi at 13 and BOD at 12... should be the other way around

Kiwi_knock

Would have liked them to pick a squad as well, rather than just a first XV. Pretty similar squad to what most on here have chosen.

jamiedav2011

totallegend wrote: »

RTE panel selection for test XV, only counting guys who could play tomorrow, i.e. excludes injured players so not sure how relevant it is.

Healy
Hibbard
A Jones
Hamilton
AW Jones
O'Brien @ six
Tipuric
Faletau
B Youngs
Farrell
North
O'Driscoll @ 12, captain
Tuilagi
Cuthbert
Halfpenny

Can Conor O'Shea have realistic claims to Irish manager? Ferris at SR and BOD at 12 calls? WTF like?!

trouttrout

jamiedav2011 wrote: »

Can Conor O'Shea have realistic claims to Irish manager? Ferris at SR and BOD at 12 calls? WTF like?!

I think his fantastic managerial record with Quins is far more relevant than something thrown around in a studio panel known for making controversial calls

Conas

totallegend wrote: »

RTE panel selection for test XV, only counting guys who could play tomorrow, i.e. excludes injured players so not sure how relevant it is.

Healy
Hibbard
A Jones
Hamilton
AW Jones
O'Brien @ six
Tipuric
Faletau
B Youngs
Farrell
North
O'Driscoll @ 12, captain
Tuilagi
Cuthbert
Halfpenny

Whoever makes the bench will also be important.

jamiedav2011

trouttrout wrote: »

I think his fantastic managerial record with Quins is far more relevant than something thrown around in a studio panel known for making controversial calls

Is it a 'fantastical managerial record'? He's director of rugby.