Judge up on refusing breathalyser charges

RATM

I've seen it all now. An Irish Circuit Court judge getting convicted and fined €600 for refusing to do a roadside breathalyser test. And it wasn't the first time he was caught either. Luckily his colleague the District Court Judge let him away with a fine, I had thought that refusing a breathalyser test was akin to admitting guilt for drink driving but clearly I was mistaken :rolleyes:

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/judge-fined-for-failing-to-give-sample-3182238.html

A JUDGE has been fined €600 after pleading guilty to failing to provide a sample of his breath at the request of a garda.

Judge James O'Donohue (54) was convicted at Clifden district court on Thursday.

The circuit court judge had previously appeared on the same charge in Clifden court in May.

The court heard that the incident had taken place at Ballyconneely, Clifden, on August 19 last year when a car, driven by Judge O'Donohue, was stopped by Garda Dean Landers.

Judge O'Donohue was charged that he failed to provide a specimen of his breath when required to do so by Gda Landers, contrary to section 12 (3) of the Road Traffic Acts.

- Tom Brady

B.A._Baracus

So lets be honest. he must of had drunk drivers appearing in his court and sentencing them. But ... different story when he is drunk driving :rolleyes:

this world is so fucking corrupt.

Motorist

RATM wrote: »

I've seen it all now. An Irish Circuit Court judge getting convicted and fined €600 for refusing to do a roadside breathalyser test. And it wasn't the first time he was caught either. Luckily his colleague the District Court Judge let him away with a fine, I had thought that refusing a breathalyser test was akin to admitting guilt for drink driving but clearly I was mistaken :rolleyes:

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/judge-fined-for-failing-to-give-sample-3182238.html

A JUDGE has been fined €600 after pleading guilty to failing to provide a sample of his breath at the request of a garda.

Judge James O'Donohue (54) was convicted at Clifden district court on Thursday.

The circuit court judge had previously appeared on the same charge in Clifden court in May.

The court heard that the incident had taken place at Ballyconneely, Clifden, on August 19 last year when a car, driven by Judge O'Donohue, was stopped by Garda Dean Landers.

Judge O'Donohue was charged that he failed to provide a specimen of his breath when required to do so by Gda Landers, contrary to section 12 (3) of the Road Traffic Acts.

- Tom Brady

He wasn't drunk. Refusing road side breath test is different to refusing to give a sample after you have been arrested on suspicion of drink driving.

JonathanAnon

wow that is some disgrace... If Liveline ever decides to start covering things in the 21st century again, I'm sure this will be top of the agenda..

B.A._Baracus

Motorist wrote: »

He wasn't drunk. Refusing road side breath test is different to refusing to give a sample after you have been arrested on suspicion of drink driving.

Do you honestly think the judge was sober?

Pompey Magnus

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

So lets be honest. he must of had drunk drivers appearing in his court and sentencing them. But ... different story when he is drunk driving :rolleyes:

this world is so fucking corrupt.

Ah now don't blame the world, not everywhere is as light on wrongdoings by it's social hierarchy as the Repubic of Ireland is.

SocSocPol

Motorist wrote: »

He wasn't drunk. Refusing road side breath test is different to refusing to give a sample after you have been arrested on suspicion of drink driving.

In almost all cases refusing to give a sample leads to disqualification.
But sure the Judges need to look after each other.

Diego Maradona

He probably couldn't afford a taxi, circuit court judges only earn €160,00 per year.

JonathanAnon

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Do you honestly think the judge was sober?

If a judge can use that excuse and get away with it, then it should be the same for everybody else... But it's hardly the first time that the judicial system have looked after themselves really is it?

Yamanoto

Motorist wrote: »

He wasn't drunk.

Odd course of action then, that he'd find it preferable to have the episode made public, appear before a colleague in the district court and receive a conviction, while parting with €600.

My name is URL

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

So lets be honest. he must of had drunk drivers appearing in his court and sentencing them. But ... different story when he is drunk driving :rolleyes:

this world is so fucking corrupt.

How so? He's subject to the same laws and penalties as everyone else. Of course he should have more cop on being a judge himself, but it's not as if that fact is being used to get him out of trouble. He's been fined and convicted of an offense just as anyone else would be.

mikemac1

This garda is a legend

He takes in a circut court judge

And earlier this year he arrested a county councillor

Garda Dean Landers and Garda Owen Millar were on routine patrol in the early hours of March 13 when they heard the “roar” of a vehicle revving very loudly in the town centre. They then saw a black Mercedes driving at high speed through the junction of Hulk Street and Bridge Street, without heeding the yield sign.

They pursued the car, which was travelling in the direction of Ballyconneely, but it took them some time to catch up with it, due to its speed. They saw the same car swerve over the wrong side of the road.

The vehicle eventually came to a stop at Clifden Community College, and Garda Millar was the first to recognise the car as belonging to the defendant.

Garda Landers said that after making a number of attempts to take the roadside test, to detect the presence of alcohol, Mr Conneely failed it and was arrested at 4.55am under suspicion of drink driving.

But wait, there's more

A former County Councillor who refused to give a breath sample to Gardaí after his arrest on suspicion of drink driving, and asked to speak to the Superintendent “to sort it out”

Why am I not suprised :rolleyes:

It's crooked out whest

Anyway, well done to the young garda, he doesn't take nonsense from anyone

GerM

My name is URL wrote: »

How so? He's subject to the same laws and penalties as everyone else. Of course he should have more cop on being a judge himself, but it's not as if that fact is being used to get him out of trouble. He's been fined and convicted of an offense just as anyone else would be.

He was convicted and fined. Other people have had their license taken off them for a couple of years and banned from driving. A simple fine for such an incident is a very lenient judgement especially to someone that has a high salary.

opinion guy

So wait,

Can a judge still be a judge if he is convicted of an offense ??

Has he now lost his job/career ?

Motorist

SocSocPol wrote: »

In almost all cases refusing to give a sample leads to disqualification.
But sure the Judges need to look after each other.

"Under section 12 of the 1994 Road Traffic Act, a garda who is of the opinion that a person “in charge of a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place” has consumed alcohol, he or she may require that person to provide a specimen through a breathalyser.

Section 12 (2) of the Act says that a person “who refuses or fails to comply . . . shall be guilty of an offence and shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £1,000” or the equivalent in euro, or to “imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months, or both”."

Disqualification is not a penalty.

If the garda formed the opinion he had alcohol taken, he would have been arrested and would have to give a sample at that stage. Refusal then would lead to disqualfication.

blindsider

Motorist wrote: »

"Under section 12 of the 1994 Road Traffic Act, a garda who is of the opinion that a person “in charge of a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place” has consumed alcohol, he or she may require that person to provide a specimen through a breathalyser.

Section 12 (2) of the Act says that a person “who refuses or fails to comply . . . shall be guilty of an offence and shall be liable on summary conviction to a fine not exceeding £1,000” or the equivalent in euro, or to “imprisonment for a term not exceeding six months, or both”."

Disqualification is not a penalty.

If the garda formed the opinion he had alcohol taken, he would have been arrested and would have to give a sample at that stage. Refusal then would lead to disqualfication.

But surely he was arrested - it's usually a precursor to appearing in Court.

According to the report, he was asked for a sample and refused to provide it, hence the arrest.

What appears strange though, is the penalty imposed. €600? Nice message to the rest of us - DD will cost you €600 but you keep your licence.

M cebee

seems like he wasn't actually drunk and refused the indignity(cough!) of being bagged

Motorist

blindsider wrote: »

But surely he was arrested - it's usually a precursor to appearing in Court.

According to the report, he was asked for a sample and refused to provide it, hence the arrest.

What appears strange though, is the penalty imposed. €600? Nice message to the rest of us - DD will cost you €600 but you keep your licence.

As far as I am aware, he was taken to the station and a sample was taken. He was not over the limit.

The €600 he was fined is a substantial penalty for refusing a road side breath test. He was not a drunk driver. It is still serious that a judge refused to give the sample, but not nearly as serious as a judge drunk driving.

woodoo

There is definitely a class of people Ireland that the law doesn't properly apply to. This is a man who has probable handed down bans for drink driving but he thinks its OK for him to drink and drive. Its a joke but sadly its the way it is in Ireland.

The judge who didn't ban him should be called upon to explain his sentence.

Somebody call Joe about it on Monday. At least embarrass the two judges involved.

later12

RATM wrote: »

I've seen it all now.

Have you seen a pony riding a bicycle?

juan.kerr

GerM wrote: »

He was convicted and fined. Other people have had their license taken off them for a couple of years and banned from driving. A simple fine for such an incident is a very lenient judgement especially to someone that has a high salary.

Plus it has happened twice now.

juan.kerr

later12 wrote: »

Have you seen a pony riding a bicycle?

No, but he saw a mexican prostitute riding a donkey - does that count?

Motorist

woodoo wrote: »

There is definitely a class of people Ireland that the law doesn't properly apply to. This is a man who has probable handed down bans for drink driving but he thinks its OK for him to drink and drive. Its a joke but sadly its the way it is in Ireland.

The judge who didn't ban him should be called upon to explain his sentence.

Somebody call Joe about it on Monday. At least embarrass the two judges involved.

That penalty is not allowed under law. He wasn't drunk driving.

johngalway

mikemac1 wrote: »

It's crooked out whest

You can say that again.

randylonghorn

RATM wrote: »

And it wasn't the first time he was caught either.

Um ... where does it say that?

tayto lover

That Garda will probably suffer by being transferred to the a*** hole of Ireland for doing his job. Ireland is a land of hypocrites who think they are above the law.
I remember the late Brian Lenihan Snr on the Late Late Show many years ago telling a story about himself and a number of politicians in a pub late at night when a young Garda entered and demanded their names. Lenihan told Gay Byrne and the audience that he asked the young Garda if he wanted "a pint or a transfer". This was greeted by howls of laughter.
Things don't seem to have changed much.

squod

Motorist wrote: »

As far as I am aware, he was taken to the station and a sample was taken. He was not over the limit.

What was the time frame in all of this anyone know? Sitting some lad ina station for three hours will only make him less drunk.

woodoo

tayto lover wrote: »

Lenihan told Gay Byrne and the audience that he asked the young Garda if he wanted "a pint or a transfer". This was greeted by howls of laughter.
Things don't seem to have changed much.

Just shows how crooked this country was/is. We have moved a bit since then as i just couldn't imagine a politician today saying it. But we still have a very very long way to go to get rid of that mindset.

Its still alive and well in Tipperary when 14,000 hicks will vote a crook into office.

Motorist

squod wrote: »

Motorist wrote: »

As far as I am aware, he was taken to the station and a sample was taken. He was not over the limit.

What was the time frame in all of this anyone know? Sitting some lad ina station for three hours will only make him less drunk.

His refusal to do road side test would not have had impact on that. Road side test is just a screen, positive or negative to determine if further testing is needed.

Colmustard

I am just curios as to what the law is, I to thought a refusal is an admission of guilt, but obviously not. Does anyone know.

tuxy

Refusing to give a sample is not an admission of guilt it is a separate offence. It normally has a harsher penalty than conviction of drink driving.

delw

Motorist wrote: »

His refusal to do road side test would not have had impact on that. Road side test is just a screen, positive or negative to determine if further testing is needed.

So let me get this right,if you refuse a road side drink test you get a €600 fine for refusing & dragged down the station regardless if proved positive or negative at the station

tuxy

delw wrote: »

So let me get this right,if you refuse a road side drink test you get a €600 fine for refusing & dragged down the station regardless if proved positive or negative at the station

Yes, although the fine may vary.
Why would someone refuse a roadside test?

delw

tuxy wrote: »

Yes, although the fine may vary.
Why would someone refuse a roadside test?

If you have nothing to hide you would have no reason but if you know how to play the law if might have something to do with it

tuxy

delw wrote: »

If you have nothing to hide you would have no reason but if you know how to play the law if might have something to do with it

Exactly, if you felt were a little over there are ways you could buy yourself some time to sober up.
Although I can't see much time gained by refusing to provide at the side of the road.

Motorist

tuxy wrote: »

Exactly, if you felt were a little over there are ways you could buy yourself some time to sober up.

What do you mean by this. A positive road side test means nothing. The amount of alcohol in your system is only determined, after you have been arrested, with a breath sample at the garda station, urine or blood sample. And yes a refusal at that stage carries a penalty of an automatic disqualification.

A refusal to do the initial road side test carries a penalty of fine or imprisonment, or both. The judge was fined €600.

The Judge gained nothing by refusing this test. Some motorists get indignant when they are sober and asked to blow (I'm not talking about a random checkpoint). No reason to refuse, but unfortunately often you do get a garda who is just being a prlck and forms his opinion out of thin air, just so he can throw his weight around. In the judges case, I imagine he felt it was beneath him to blow or something.

jonsnow

tayto lover wrote: »

That Garda will probably suffer by being transferred to the a*** hole of Ireland for doing his job.

He's already there.Given that this guard has done a county councillor and a judge it indicates that he is somewhat independently minded and reckons that as hes in the back of beyond anyway that he can,t be punished.Like mcnulty on the boat messing with the tidal charts!

ruthloss

"Step out of the car please your Honour"

tayto lover

jonsnow wrote: »

He's already there.Given that this guard has done a county councillor and a judge it indicates that he is somewhat independently minded and reckons that as hes in the back of beyond anyway that he can,t be punished.Like mcnulty on the boat messing with the tidal charts!

I thought Clifden was a nice wee place and would be nice to work in.

JustAThought

Fair dues to that gaurd; keep it up man.

You're a beacon in a wilderness of corruption.

I wonder was it the judge who thought a 6 months sentence for z convicted rapist was enough ; judge Desmond.

The Judge who thought rape wasn't a serious crime because the ( particular) woman raped wasn't " really hurt" ; Judge Herbert

It the retired with full pension Judge, Judge Curtain who had thousands of pictures of hardcore child pornography on his PC & got off because the warrant was a day out of date.

Who are these monsters & who allows them to be in charge.

Motorist

There is a story doing the rounds now that the judge was not actually tested at the Garda station. It appears there was some problem in getting the doctor to take a urine or blood sample. Why the judge was not brought to another station to give a sample of breath is unclear. It's an absolute disgrace if he was not tested in the 3 hour window from when he was stopped driving.

tuxy

Motorist wrote: »

There is a story doing the rounds now that the judge was not actually tested at the Garda station.

How reliable is the source of this story?

Motorist

tuxy wrote: »

How reliable is the source of this story?

It's somewhat reliable. Unfortunately, nothing more concrete has been reported in the media. If true, it's a problem with the gardai rather than the judge.
(Even if he had blown a positive road side breath test, it would have meant nothing without further testing)

Jay D

It's absolute fact that failing to supply a sample is an automatic admission of guilt.

Or at least it was in 3 out of 3 cases I know it to have happened in.

Clearly not here though. Oh and may I also say they were all banned as well as fined.

Where's case law examples in this case I wonder.

What we need to do is get the fúck out there and wreak exactly how angry we are with this poxy kip of a place.

Motorist

Jay D wrote: »

It's absolute fact that failing to supply a sample is an automatic admission of guilt.

Or at least it was in 3 out of 3 cases I know it to have happened in.

Clearly not here though. Oh and may I also say they were all banned as well as fined.

Where's case law examples in this case I wonder.

What we need to do is get the fúck out there and wreak exactly how angry we are with this poxy kip of a place.

See there is a difference between failing to blow at the road side and then separately at the station after you have been arrested. Automatic disqualification only happens when you refuse in the station to blow into the intoxilyzer. Refusal to provide a sample at the road side into the hand held kit can only result in fine or imprisonment or both.

MagicSean

RATM wrote: »

I've seen it all now. An Irish Circuit Court judge getting convicted and fined €600 for refusing to do a roadside breathalyser test. And it wasn't the first time he was caught either. Luckily his colleague the District Court Judge let him away with a fine, I had thought that refusing a breathalyser test was akin to admitting guilt for drink driving but clearly I was mistaken :rolleyes:

http://www.independent.ie/national-news/judge-fined-for-failing-to-give-sample-3182238.html

You thought wrong. Don't let inaccuracy ruin your rant though.

Lapin

JonathanAnon wrote: »

wow that is some disgrace... If Liveline ever decides to start covering things in the 21st century again, I'm sure this will be top of the agenda..

2 fukin hopes of that.

First sniff at the mere mention of a judge and Joe hits the red button.



As for this (and other cases in the news recently) -

I've always said, Ireland has the best legal system in the world.

Its just a shame we don't have a justice system.

john o malley

what next in rural Ireland