The Quinn Saga - Pt 52: They can't find him anywhere! O' look - He's at a GAA match!

delad

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

The Quinns may be guilty of some things, however they have never stooped as low as to wish cancer on someone.

Mods must be asleep this morning.

Do you have any idea how many people will die and how much suffering will be caused as a direct result of the actions of the Quinn family?!

The Quinns may be laughing now, but I'm sure they will get whats coming to them, karma gets everyone in the end.

Pantsface

delad wrote: »

Do you have any idea how many people will die and how much suffering will be caused as a direct result of the actions of the Quinn family?!

The Quinns may be laughing now, but I'm sure they will get whats coming to them, karma gets everyone in the end.

HUH?

Mr.Crinklewood

delad wrote: »

Do you have any idea how many people will die and how much suffering will be caused as a direct result of the actions of the Quinn family?!

The Quinns may be laughing now, but I'm sure they will get whats coming to them, karma gets everyone in the end.

No, throw me the stats please, I tried finding this online, but only found reference to the amount of people that he employed ( got me wondering how many are indirectly employed )

While you are at it please tell me the relavence of one individual wishing cancer on a family.

My post was more to do with the mindset and character of the individual that I replied to.

I did not defend the actions that the Quinns have carried out ( which I alluded to in my post )

V_Moth

DebDynamite wrote: »

You're going to love this Biggins!

GAA Legends March In Defence Of The Quinn Family

http://www.balls.ie/2012/07/29/gaa-legends-march-in-defence-of-the-quinn-family/

What an embarassment.

Some more photos here - including the poster:

"Bring back Quinn & let him create jobs" :rolleyes:

I just can't figure out why anybody would want to support these wasters.

efb

V_Moth wrote: »

Some more photos here - including the poster:

"Bring back Quinn & let him create jobs" :rolleyes:

I just can't figure out why anybody would want to support these wasters.

Give every slack jawed yokel in Cavan a job in the quarry and the sister with the secretarial course in the insurance...

delad

Mr.Crinklewood wrote: »

No, throw me the stats please, I tried finding this online, but only found reference to the amount of people that he employed ( got me wondering how many are indirectly employed )

While you are at it please tell me the relavence if one individual wishing cancer on a family.

My post was more to do with the mindset and character of the individual that I replied to.

I did not defend the actions that the Quinns have carried out ( which I alluded to in my post )

Why do his crony's keep trotting out that tired old line "oh he created a lot of employment, isn't he wonderful!". Hitler employed a lot of people, big whoop. (yes yes thread has been godwinned).

Obviously we won't know the exact figures as to how many people will die as a result of his actions until a few years time. We will need to compare stats for hospital waiting lists, stats as to how many people died while on waiting lists etc.

In the meantime, it doesn't take a genius to realise that funding cuts = staff cuts= longer waiting lists = more deaths and suffering.

Mr.Crinklewood

So you could not answer my first question ( well you claim you will have the answer in a few years )

I asked "While you are at it please tell me the relevance of one individual wishing cancer on a family?". Could you please answers this, and not divert the conversation to your own agenda.

To recap I was not defending Sean Quinn, I was showing my disgust at the individual that wished cancer upon his family.

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

admiralofthefleet wrote: »

GAA should be chardged with harboring a criminal

Why? Because he went to a football match? Don't be ridiculous.

Our man in Havana

They are a despicable organisation.

Grayson

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/thousands-march-in-support-of-quinn-561104.html

Elsewhere Father Brian D’Arcy compared Anglo, rebranded as the IBRC, to the institutions of the Catholic Church.

“The main reason I’m here tonight is because as Christians and good neighbours we have a right, a duty, to and stand by our families and neighbours when they are in trouble,” the outspoken priest said.

“And nobody will take that away from us.”

Jesus.

I know people were giving out because someone wished the Quinns got cancer. But I wouldn't mind seeing them get something smaller. Like herpes or chronic diarrhea

V_Moth

Grayson wrote: »

http://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/thousands-march-in-support-of-quinn-561104.html



Jesus.

I know people were giving out because someone wished the Quinns got cancer. But I wouldn't mind seeing them get something smaller. Like herpes or chronic diarrhea

They have been blighted with verbal diarrhea for a good few months now.

fatalll

Did not Mr.Quinn Snr promise to pay all the money back etc a few years back??
Also it suits them to be british at times too...ie for Bankrupty, for avoiding jail in the republic

Yes they created jobs, they got well thanked for it, then greed took over like a lot of people in this country.

They do not want to pay the consequences, if it was me or you owning money to the Banks or anyone, it would be paid back or your assets taken.

I cant believe anyone would support them. Im disgusted with thos people supporting them....
Yes I feel sorry for them but no one forced him to borrow.

afterburn1

efb wrote: »

Give every slack jawed yokel in Cavan a job in the quarry and the sister with the secretarial course in the insurance...

Fantastic obsevation! What a fcuking genius you must be.:mad:

Yamanoto

DebDynamite wrote: »

You're going to love this Biggins!

GAA Legends March In Defence Of The Quinn Family

http://www.balls.ie/2012/07/29/gaa-legends-march-in-defence-of-the-quinn-family/

What an embarassment.

It's the same mindset that rushes to the defense of specimens like Lowry - spouting the usual guff of Dublin-based media witch-hunts, D4 contempt for daycent country folk and suchlike.

Anything to deflect from honestly addressing how the actions of men such as Quinn (and their own community's indulgence of it), will ultimately be every bit as corrosive to their interests as those of the political and business establishment they so decry.

ArmaniJeanss

There will eventually be criminal charges and then an arrest warrant can be issued.

However it's technically difficult to have both a criminal charge and a 'chase the money' civil case at the same time ; the criminal charge would take priority, and unpalatable as it may be for us all the civil case and getting the money back is an urgent matter and needs to take priority. So the criminal charges may be 2-5 years away.


rabble rabble rabble hang 'em all.

steelcityblues

The GAA needs to publicly condemn the managers who went to this rally.

Biggins

steelcityblues wrote: »

The GAA needs to publicly condemn the managers who went to this rally.

Aye, they are using the name of the GAA organisation to espouse that the org even in part, is backing the Quinns (and their antics, money shuffling and defying Irish courts, etc!)

Yamanoto

steelcityblues wrote: »

The GAA needs to publicly condemn the managers who went to this rally.

Biggins wrote: »

Aye, they are using the name of the GAA organisation to espouse that the org even in part, is backing the Quinns (and their antics, money shuffling and defying Irish courts, etc!)

They were there in a personal capacity, as friends and acquaintances of Sean Quinn. The fact they are prominent figures within the organisation undoubtedly lends their support some weight, but I doubt they've broken any rules and as such would not leave themselves subject to sanction.

steelcityblues

Yamanoto wrote: »

They were there in a personal capacity, as friends and acquaintances of Sean Quinn. The fact they are prominent figures within the organisation undoubtedly lends their support some weight, but I doubt they've broken any rules and as such would not leave themselves subject to sanction.

They are using their high profile identities as GAA names known nationally to support this man. Has to be at least condemned by GAA HQ in a statement.

Yamanoto

steelcityblues wrote: »

They are using their high profile identities as GAA names known nationally to support this man. Has to be at least condemned by GAA HQ in a statement.

They are friends of Sean Quinn's, attending the march in a personal capacity. The fact they are sporting personalities is incidental.

I'd imagine the GAA will stay out of it, as they should.

Biggins

Yamanoto wrote: »

They were there in a personal capacity, as friends and acquaintances of Sean Quinn. The fact they are prominent figures within the organisation undoubtedly lends their support some weight, but I doubt they've broken any rules and as such would not leave themselves subject to sanction.

Officially they might not have broken any rules (maybe they have!) but if they were announced to the people there and/or to the press as "This is Mr X from the XXXXXX GAA club", then they are possible associating the national org with the activities of the Quinn's.

Our man in Havana

They are already mixed up in it. Clubs making statements of support. Sickening stuff.

http://www.broadsheet.ie/2012/07/24/sean-quinns-local-gaa-club-writes/

Biggins

Our man in Havana wrote: »

They are already mixed up in it. Clubs making statements of support. Sickening stuff.

http://www.broadsheet.ie/2012/07/24/sean-quinns-local-gaa-club-writes/

Terrible - just terrible.

The national organisation will have to clarify this matter alone now.

Yamanoto

Our man in Havana wrote: »

They are already mixed up in it. Clubs making statements of support. Sickening stuff.

http://www.broadsheet.ie/2012/07/24/sean-quinns-local-gaa-club-writes/

That's a different dynamic at play though.

There's a clear-cut example of where HQ should act - that club should most probably be warned and /or sanctioned, and left in no doubt as to its responsibilities to the organisation as a whole.

Biggins

Yamanoto wrote: »

There's a clear-cut example of where HQ should act - that club should most probably be warned and /or sanctioned, and left in no doubt as to its responsibilities to the organisation as a whole.

The Quinns have now dragged the GAA into their mess and the GAA will now (or should) have to state that regardless of what any previous individual has done previously for a club, their actions outside of sporting activities, are still accountable to the courts of the land and that the GAA agrees with this position.

Anything less and the GAA now will be seen to be siding with the Quinns, their antics and their basically giving two fingers to the Irish courts and nation!

Yamanoto

Biggins wrote: »

Officially they might not have broken any rules (maybe they have!) but if they were announced to the people there and/or to the press as "This is Mr X from the XXXXXX GAA club", then they are possible associating the national org with the activities of the Quinn's.

If they themselves sported County attire or made explicit reference to the GAA, then perhaps issues may arise from same.

I'd imagine no introductions were necessary tbh. I'm no fan of Gaelic games, but even I'd recognise who those fellas were.

Biggins

Our man in Havana wrote: »

They are already mixed up in it. Clubs making statements of support. Sickening stuff.

http://www.broadsheet.ie/2012/07/24/sean-quinns-local-gaa-club-writes/

So to sum up by that letter they wrote, they are also espousing "Aaa sure they are a great bunch of lads for us - so let them off" ?

No wonder cronyism is still alive in this country with possible backward thinking like that!

Yamanoto

Biggins wrote: »

The Quinns have now dragged the GAA into their mess and the GAA will now (or should) have to state that regardless of what any previous individual has done previously for a club, their actions outside of sporting activities, are still accountable to the courts of the land and that the GAA agrees with this position.

I'd imagine words to that effect may be communicated to the club in question. Why some feel it necessary for the organisation to state the bleedin' obvious through their press office however, is a wee bit baffling.

I've nothing but disdain for Quinn and his supporters, but there's certainly no compelling reason to believe their actions enjoy the tacit approval of HQ.

policarp

Yamanoto wrote: »

I've nothing but disdain for Quinn and his supporters, but there's certainly no compelling reason to believe their actions enjoy the tacit approval of HQ.

Bertie couldn't have put it better. . .

Biggins

Yamanoto wrote: »

...there's certainly no compelling reason to believe their actions enjoy the tacit approval of HQ.

There isn't but as long as underlings think they can get away associating their names/ranks within the GAA also with the Qunins and their defiance of the Irish courts, then the GAA is seen to be linked with law breakers.

Not a cosy image an association might wish for on any level if they are to remain the good graces alone of the state and seek/gain later advantages from such.

CiaranC

GAA: Enemies of the state

Seanchai

Biggins wrote: »

The Quinns have now dragged the GAA into their mess and the GAA will now (or should) have to state that regardless of what any previous individual has done previously for a club, their actions outside of sporting activities, are still accountable to the courts of the land and that the GAA agrees with this position.

Anything less and the GAA now will be seen to be siding with the Quinns, their antics and their basically giving two fingers to the Irish courts and nation!

Biggins wrote: »

There isn't but as long as underlings think they can get away associating their names/ranks within the GAA also with the Qunins and their defiance of the Irish courts, then the GAA is seen to be linked with law breakers.

Not a cosy image an association might wish for on any level if they are to remain the good graces alone of the state and seek/gain later advantages from such.

Sweet suffering Jesus. The GAA has about 1,000,000 members out of the country's entire population of around 6 million people. Well over a million attendances were recorded at matches last year. Given this reality, the likelihood of rogues being among the attendees at matches, or being GAA members, is very high. If the GAA is expected to apologise for one alleged rogue attending a match then it might as well continue into the 22nd century with apologies for the rest of the rogues who attend matches/ are GAA members.

Meanwhile I'm still waiting for the FAI to apologise for Seán Fitzpatrick appearing at an Irish soccer match in Poland earlier this year....

Seanchai

CiaranC wrote: »

GAA: Enemies of the state

Given that the state is led by clowns, parasites, shítehawks and overpaid grade A idiots, this can only be a positive development.

SocSocPol

Seanchai wrote: »

Sweet suffering Jesus. The GAA has about 1,000,000 members out of the country's entire population of around 6 million people. Well over a million attendances were recorded at matches last year. Given this reality, the likelihood of rogues being among the attendees at matches, or being GAA members, is very high. If the GAA is expected to apologise for one alleged rogue attending a match then it might as well continue into the 22nd century with apologies for the rest of the rogues who attend matches/ are GAA members.

Meanwhile I'm still waiting for the FAI to apologise for Seán Fitzpatrick appearing at an Irish soccer match in Poland earlier this year....

Can you provide a link to the source showing he was on the run at the time?

Jester252

Why are people pissed with the GAA?

keysersoze0330

The Quinns provided many jobs, fair enough and that was great. Then with one fell swoop they decimated families who took out mortgages thinking said jobs were for life. Thus putting these families lights out.

Can't understand this rallying around for them.

Biggins

Seanchai wrote: »

Sweet suffering Jesus. The GAA has about 1,000,000 members out of the country's entire population of around 6 million people. Well over a million attendances were recorded at matches last year. Given this reality, the likelihood of rogues being among the attendees at matches, or being GAA members, is very high. If the GAA is expected to apologise for one alleged rogue attending a match then it might as well continue into the 22nd century with apologies for the rest of the rogues who attend matches/ are GAA members.

Meanwhile I'm still waiting for the FAI to apologise for Seán Fitzpatrick appearing at an Irish soccer match in Poland earlier this year....

The point is that nationally, the GAA is blameless in the Quinn matter.
However the Quinns its seems don't mind using the Org to try win over the population in attempted persuasion that they should just be let off because maybe they were grand lads who threw a few bob at a branch locally.

No one is "pissed with the GAA" as one poster put it. I'm not.
The GAA at national level though, as they unfortunately now have been dragged into their Quinns antics, should distance themselves - if only to cover their own national reputation and ass.

Thats my point.

...Meanwhile I'm still waiting for the FAI to apologise for Seán Fitzpatrick appearing at an Irish soccer match in Poland earlier this year....

Seán Fitzpatrick went to a game as a spectator - he wasn't on a podium along side sporting representatives whom it seems now have also made representations in official format!
Its unfortunate that you cannot see the difference.

Biggins

The following is copied from a posting someone made on journal.ie in the comments section.
http://www.thejournal.ie/in-pictures-thousands-gather-for-quinn-rally-in-cavan-537591-Jul2012/

This is why The Quinns are not innocent as they would have the nation fooled into thinking:

A. Insurance – a taste for other people’s money

It would appear that he fundamentally misunderstood or ignored the nature of insurance in the pursuit of his own gain.
Insurance is a trust business, you seek to provision correctly out of current premia the risks which you are underwriting. People take out insurance trusting that that the insurer is taking in appropriate premia to guard against the aggregate risk of all insurance policies (which is largely predictable) together with a profit element for the insurer. They also trust that the funds and assets held to guard against the risk will be will be available to discharge such liabilities to the intent that their insurance will work.

It has been alleged that the Quinns did three things in relation to the insurance business.

Firstly, they used aggressive tactics to try and make consumers (who are by definition vulnerable) to settle earlier than they should settle and for less than the full value of their claim. It is alleged that retired Gardai were used in this regard. Insurance is supposed to cover risk, not to avoid risk.

Secondly, it is alleged that they under provisioned to try and gain market share. This is particularly evident in relation to their foray into professional indemnity insurance I the UK where they got flayed alive until the receivers stopped it. It is alleged that this was done in the interests of gaining cash-flow and market share ahead of abiding by proper principals.

Thirdly, and most seriously, it is alleged that by way of guarantees between group companies and loans to family members which were written off, that they put the assets of the insurance business at risk in support of the wider Quinn Group and thereby the Quinn family.

These are allegations of heinous activity. Sean Quinn has been fined a huge amount in this regard, the regulator has stepped in and taken the companies away and all insurance holders in Ireland have been hit with a levy to pay off the loss so that the company can be sold as a going concern without the loss which nobody would take on.


B. Anglo Gamble – Moral Hazard

After getting a taste for the potential megabucks that they now understood could be garnered by getting their hands on other people’s hard earned cash, Sean Quinn then decided he would buy a bank. (In this regard maybe John Waters right – SQ is like the traders who risked billions of other people’s money in pursuit of their bonus). He decided he would do it by leveraging himself way beyond his wealth. He further decided to avoid the rules where by the integrity of the stock market and companies are protected by doing it via contracts for difference.

When the sh1t hit the fan, the bank was faced with a situation where Sean Quinn’s failed gamble was going to destroy the bank unless they devised a dodgy scheme to clean it up. His personal actions were at the root cause of this particular ****-storm.

Sean Quinn may say he did not contract with the state, and he only contracted with a private institution and that is correct. However, he saw a moral hazard situation and went quids-in. He thought they would never call him out on his insurance business or on his bank dealings and if it wasn’t for the global financial disaster he may have succeeded at our expense in the face of lesser difficulties.

However, this line that he was willing to take the hit on his losses and walk array was bull-crap. Any effort by him to divest himself of his humongous lump of Anglo shares held on foot of CFD’s would have collapsed the share price leaving him nursing a loss for the full amount.

Don’t forget that apart from the losses taken by his family which may be on foot of illegal contracts, he also off-loaded a huge portion of his problem onto Anglo which they tried to get other borrowers to take on.


C. Contempt of Court

Let’s be clear here. The main problem the Court has is not that Sean Quinn and co have sought to protect their assets but rather that they did so after the Court ordered that the assets must be protected for Creditors.

The Court believes (and nobody other than the Quinns disagee after the Daily Mail videos) that the Quinns acted against a direct order of the High Court. We have rules called laws and we have independent Courts who we go to if we disagree on what should happen according to the rules. (This is what the Quinn family are doing in saying the loans made to them to buy shares were illegal – I think they are right on that score). The Court has seen that the Quinns have decided they are above the law of the land.

The Quinns have said (i) that they put their scheme in place before the injunctions and (ii) that their scheme has somehow backfired and they have been duped of the cash. The Court is saying in relation to (i) that it has been proved beyond a reasonable doubt that they did not do it before the injunction was in. In relation to (ii) Judge Dunne has further said that she does not believe the cash is beyond their reach.

This seems to be based on the fact that (a) the Quinns are not that stupid, (b) the Quinn story does not add up (i.e., they are still lying about what happened), and (c) even if it is true, it is their actions in contempt of court that have put the assets at risk and beyond their reach – it is their illegal actions that have brought them to this situation so they should bear the punishment the same as if the assets were within their reach and they refused.

So, the answer to John Waters is that the Quinns have been brought to this sorry situation as a result of three serious sins – they sinned morally and legally against consumers in Quinn direct, they sinned morally against the population in destabilising the banking system through under-the counter deals they could not finance, and they sinned morally and legally against the taxpayers and the state and the rule of law by seeking to asset strip and take monies which they were not entitled to out of companies which should have had their assets applied to debts.

DB10

SocSocPol wrote: »

The arrogant little twerp.
I hope the lot of them get fcuking cancer:mad:

What a scummy thing to say, your opinion is not worth a jot after that comment.

StephenHendry

very dissappointed to see people like mickey harte supporting the quinns as the quinns seem to think that they are above the law. one only has to think of the amount of public support that mickey harte got over his ordeal and he supports this family who have gone down so much in people minds in ireland over the last few years.

Yamanoto

Biggins wrote: »

The GAA at national level though, as they unfortunately now have been dragged into their Quinns antics, should distance themselves - if only to cover their own national reputation and ass.

Biggins, they sat up and took notice.

In doing so, they've set themselves a precedent, whereby they may be called upon to distance themselves from the actions of their members, however tenuous the connection to the organisation itself. Though admittedly, the circumstances surrounding this sorry mess have more than a touch of the GUBU about them.

I couldn't locate the statement on the GAA site, I'd imagine it's a sketchy and bland enough affair.

THE GAA has issued a statement stressing that it did not formally support last Sunday evening’s rally in Ballyconnell, Co Cavan, in support of the Quinn family.

The rally – close to the former Quinn Cement site, and close to the family’s original home of Derrylin in Co Fermanagh – had been attended by a number of prominent figures from the world of Gaelic games.

http://www.thejournal.ie/gaa-no-involvement-quinn-rally-ballyconnell-544910-Aug2012/