Rally for The Quinn-were you there?

Pal

These people are shockingly misguided to support Quinn and his family. Simple as.

I now have to pay for his misdeeds. So do you. And the ones he is still trying to commit.

Enough.

The GAA should not expect to see me coming through their turnstiles any time soon.

Dr.Silly

Can anyone point me to website or article to show the history of this story. There is obviously alot of stories on the web, but I'm looking for one article which will have the explanation of the borrowings, to swindling of the companies/assetts, to the contempt of court etc etc.

Happyman42

Pal wrote: »

The GAA should not expect to see me coming through their turnstiles any time soon.

And people on this thread say that the people of Cavan need mental help? :rolleyes:

Come out of your tabloid mentality, try and see that the people on that march are real people, just like you and me. Try and understand what the grievances are here, try and see that there is a huge gulf in the information about what happened here being made available to these people and to us all. In other words, try some common empathy, you don't have to agree, but you can understand. You might think you have all the info...you don't and neither do we.
These people feel they owe SQ something for the 40 years he invested in them, we owe it to ourselves to demand the truth about all of this, then and only then can you begin to throw stones.

Brain Stroking

Happyman42 wrote: »

These people feel they owe SQ something for the 40 years he invested in them, we owe it to ourselves to demand the truth about all of this, then and only then can you begin to throw stones.

And would they be out marching if Quinn had been convicted of murder, rape, assault? Or is white collar crime still ok in Ireland in 2012? Because in all this guff, tears and hand-wringing the point needs to be reiterated that Sean Quinn and family members have clearly broken the law and must be punished.
Would you be as lenient on a 20 year old from Finglas up on his first assault charge?

Roisy7

Happyman42 wrote: »

These people feel they owe SQ something for the 40 years he invested in them, we owe it to ourselves to demand the truth about all of this, then and only then can you begin to throw stones.

I only wish I could bold on mobile. This. This is what gets me. The people of Cavan owe Sean Quinn nothing. He did not employ them from the goodness of his heart. He needed workers. He paid them for their services. It's called capitalism for goodness sake.

Less of this tugging the forelock please.

For example, if he was such a noble-hearted man of simple tastes explain the house, the daughter's wedding, etc.

I hold no brief for Anglo but by god he gambled and could not take the hit. Again, capitalism relies on the notion of personal responsibility- if you gamble and lose, you take the hit.

folan

Bullseye1 wrote: »

If they had let the bank fail we wouldn't be talking about Quinn and his billions owed to to bank. This point seems to have gotten conveniently lost in all of this.

not sure if this point is serious, but i sincerely hope not.

if the bank had been allowed to fail, as it should have been, these debts would still have been been a serious issue. Debts like this would have been sold off to recover as much money as possible for the banks creditors.

handlemaster

Happyman42 wrote: »

And people on this thread say that the people of Cavan need mental help? :rolleyes:

Come out of your tabloid mentality, try and see that the people on that march are real people, just like you and me. Try and understand what the grievances are here, try and see that there is a huge gulf in the information about what happened here being made available to these people and to us all. In other words, try some common empathy, you don't have to agree, but you can understand. You might think you have all the info...you don't and neither do we.
These people feel they owe SQ something for the 40 years he invested in them, we owe it to ourselves to demand the truth about all of this, then and only then can you begin to throw stones.

What are the grievences ?

Happyman42

Brain Stroking wrote: »

And would they be out marching if Quinn had been convicted of murder, rape, assault? Or is white collar crime still ok in Ireland in 2012? Because in all this guff, tears and hand-wringing the point needs to be reiterated that Sean Quinn and family members have clearly broken the law and must be punished.
Would you be as lenient on a 20 year old from Finglas up on his first assault charge?

Far as I can see SQ has not been convicted of any wrongdoing in relation to Anglo. There are some high profile figures facing trial (a long delayed trial btw, would you have any suspicions about that at all? Isn't it all just a bit neat that they attempt to finish off Quinn before any of this comes before a court?)
I have not made up my mind on Quinn and what he is guilty off. I see a business culture that wasn't regulated at all by those who shold have been regulating. I will wait until I have all the facts before I damm anybody because I know in my heart of hearts that had it been me and they took my hard born business from me on the basis of illegality, I would have done exactly what the Quinns are doing, screw you and your moralising, screw you and your rotten country. Would you do anything differently, would you?

Roisy7 wrote: »

For example, if he was such a noble-hearted man of simple tastes explain the house, the daughter's wedding, etc.

There are very few people on this island who don't over indulge and over spend at wedding times and a short drive aroun the country will show you that 99.9% will build ostentatious OTT houses given the chance. It is part of the reason we are in the ****.
Give over with the holier than thou nonsense, you may cut your cloth to suit, the majority don't and didn't.

hardCopy

Happyman42 wrote: »

And people on this thread say that the people of Cavan need mental help? :rolleyes:

Come out of your tabloid mentality, try and see that the people on that march are real people, just like you and me. Try and understand what the grievances are here, try and see that there is a huge gulf in the information about what happened here being made available to these people and to us all. In other words, try some common empathy, you don't have to agree, but you can understand. You might think you have all the info...you don't and neither do we.
These people feel they owe SQ something for the 40 years he invested in them, we owe it to ourselves to demand the truth about all of this, then and only then can you begin to throw stones.

There's nobody like me marching up there. I'm not a short sighted, parochial minded moron.

handlemaster

Happyman42 wrote: »

Far as I can see SQ has not been convicted of any wrongdoing in relation to Anglo. There are some high profile figures facing trial (a long delayed trial btw, would you have any suspicions about that at all? Isn't it all just a bit neat that they attempt to finish off Quinn before any of this comes before a court?)
I have not made up my mind on Quinn and what he is guilty off. I see a business culture that wasn't regulated at all by those who shold have been regulating. I will wait until I have all the facts before I damm anybody because I know in my heart of hearts that had it been me and they took my hard born business from me on the basis of illegality, I would have done exactly what the Quinns are doing, screw you and your moralising, screw you and your rotten country. Would you do anything differently, would you?



There are very few people on this island who don't over indulge and over spend at wedding times and a short drive aroun the country will show you that 99.9% will build ostentatious OTT houses given the chance. It is part of the reason we are in the ****.
Give over with the holier than thou nonsense, you may cut your cloth to suit, the majority don't and didn't.

Is that you Mrs Quinn ?

Happyman42

hardCopy wrote: »

There's nobody like me marching up there. I'm not a short sighted, parochial minded moron.

Perhaps you are an uninformed one then. NO!, make that, definately an uninformed one.

Happyman42

handlemaster wrote: »

Is that you Mrs Quinn ?

You and others like you are no better than those on the march. You have leapt to judgement without the full facts. Exactly what is being said of those on the march. 'Ignorant', 'short sighted' 'reactionary allegiance to a system, proven over and over again to be corrupt at it's core' etc etc.:rolleyes:

handlemaster

Happyman42 wrote: »

You and others like you are no better than those on the march. You have leapt to judgement without the full facts. Exactly what is being said of those on the march. 'Ignorant', 'short sighted' 'reactionary allegiance to a system, proven over and over again to be corrupt at it's core' etc etc.:rolleyes:

A little reading is in order: http://www.newstalk.ie/2012/news/recommended/high-court-ruling-on-sean-quinn-son-nephew-in-full/


small extract below:

Sean Quinn Senior was also a witness who was evasive and uncooperative. On a number of occasions during the hearing, rather than answer questions put to him, he embarked on lengthy criticisms of Anglo. I will highlight two aspects of his evidence. First of all, it is clear that I do not accept his evidence that steps were taken to put assets beyond the reach of Anglo by the signing of the various assignments and other documents referred to in April 2011. Secondly, I find it impossible to accept the evidence of Sean Quinn Senior to the effect that he had no hand, act or part in the matter after April 2011 following the appointment of the share receiver. His evidence to that effect is not credible in my view. I am satisfied that not only did he give Peter Quinn his imprimatur to implement the plan described in evidence, but also that he took whatever steps were required of him by signing documents as required as and when necessary. I am satisfied that he was au fait with the arrangements taking place to implement the plan. It may be that he did not have every detail required to implement the plan, but I am satisfied beyond any doubt that he was fully supportive of it and actively involved in doing what was required to implement the plan as and when necessary. By necessary implication, it is clear that he signed the Galfis agreements after the Orders were made. The Gurniak documents were, in my view, brought into existence after the date of the Orders with a view to getting over the uncomfortable fact that Galfis did not exist at the time the assignments were supposed to have been entered into.
I have to say that in relation to Sean Quinn Junior I came to the conclusion that he too was not telling the truth in giving his evidence to the Court.

Pal

Happyman42 wrote: »

try some common empathy, you don't have to agree, but you can understand.
.

Try it yourself.

Empathise my disappointment in looking at my depleted wagecheck every week. Empathise my gratitude to Sean Quinn for the magnitude of my tax deductions.

Pumpkinseeds

I saw a woman being interviewed on Rte news on Sunday at this rally and she had this ridiculous tone of mourning to her demeanour. If I hadn't being paying attention at the time I could easily have mistaken her as a mourner at a funeral. She said something along the lines of her being there to support them 'at a time like this'. At the time I just wanted to scream at the television. The Quinns must be laughing out of their arseholes at these poe paced idiots.

There must have been some serious inbreeding in Cavan over the generations, in order to produce so very many half wits.:D

Pumpkinseeds

Yep seems as though I'm correct.

Incidentally if you will insist on posting such long posts would you at least have the decency to make sure that the words are spaced properly. As it stands it just makes your moral outrage seem that little bit more ridiculous.

handlemaster

The reason Quinn borrowed the money to buy the shares in Anglo was because of the position he had taken with the CFD in the bank. Now if the big gamble was to have come off for him we would all have done well with the profits as he would have distributed to this followers !! It didn't so we all will pay as the Government had to introduce a 2 per cent levy to raise €65 million annually to finance the ICF over a 12-year period. This plus more will be needed to cover the gamble.

andrewdeerpark

I do believe in all this Sean Quinn should have had his case against Anglo held ahead of his contempt hearing and even before Anglo destroyed his companies. Their is definite injustice their, which the Quinn's have every right to feel hard done by, so the points made are indeed very valid.

donalg1

Happyman42 wrote: »

You and others like you are no better than those on the march. You have leapt to judgement without the full facts. Exactly what is being said of those on the march. 'Ignorant', 'short sighted' 'reactionary allegiance to a system, proven over and over again to be corrupt at it's core' etc etc.:rolleyes:

The Quinns have screwed every citizen of this country over by their reckless business dealings, we will be paying for their mistakes for years to come and people actually defend and march in support of these people. Seems to me those on the marches are absolutely delusional maybe they like paying levies on their insurance for the next couple of decades but I for one dont.

The Quinns risked everything on thier business and lost, they should be accountable for thier losses but they arent instead you me and every other citizen in this country is. And do the Quinns care? Hardly they couldnt care less about you or I, they are putting the poor me face on while still living a pretty comfortable life while everyone else that is struggling pays for people like this.

Not only that but when taken to court over their dodgy dealings they disobey court orders showing thier arrogance by continuing to conduct some pretty dodgy business transactions. And not for the good of you or I, no they do this to hide their assets from the state that they owe a fortune too, hide them so they can continue to live like kings, hide them knowing its us that will pay their debts if their assets dont.

bbam

Pumpkinseeds wrote: »

Yep seems as though I'm correct.

This isnt a Cavan thing at all.
This involves a number of local people to the Quinn factories who refuse to see the criminal activity of the Quinn family. It's baffling beyond belief!

Yer man needs a blog rather than making posts like that!

The quinns are guilty of stripping the assets beyond the reach of those they owe money to. These yocals just don't see what wrong with that but it's a criminal act. And every euro that the quinns keep away from IRBC is a euro the tax payer will have to stump up, and that's on top of the damn insurance levi.

Ordinary decent hard working Cavan people would be glad to see the quinns beaten on this and behind bars where all criminals belong. I for one will see their prosecutions as a victory for those of us who pay their debts and face the music when the going gets tough. The quinns are a shameful cowardly bunch.

andrewdeerpark

handlemaster wrote: »

The reason Quinn borrowed the money to buy the shares in Anglo was because of the position he had taken with the CFD in the bank. Now if the big gamble was to have come off for him we would all have done well with the profits as he would have distributed to this followers !! It didn't so we all will pay as the Government had to introduce a 2 per cent levy to raise €65 million annually to finance the ICF over a 12-year period. This plus more will be needed to cover the gamble.

The point is he invested in a company that had crooked books cooked up the board and signed of by Ernst and Young, and he did not know the dire state of the bank pre his investment decision. Its a very valid point.

Note in the US when Enron collapsed because of the crooked auditing it closed Arthur Anderson WORLDWIDE but in the US their is a real justice system not a mickey mouse banana republic!

Happyman42

handlemaster wrote: »

The reason Quinn borrowed the money to buy the shares in Anglo

When that and the events surrounding it, is tested in a court, with all concerned sworn to the truth and all the paperwork and evidence produced, then we will be able to judge.

andrewdeerpark

Happyman42 wrote: »

When that and the events surrounding it, is tested in a court, with all concerned sworn to the truth and all the paperwork and evidence produced, then we will be able to judge.

This hearing keeps getting pushed out with Anglo's vendetta against Quinn and family taking precedence that is their big grievance.

handlemaster

andrewdeerpark wrote: »

The point is he invested in a company that had crooked books cooked up the board and signed of by Ernst and Young, and he did not know the dire state of the bank pre his investment decision. Its a very valid point.

Note in the US when Enron collapsed because of the crooked auditing it closed Arthur Anderson WORLDWIDE but in the US their is a real justice system not a mickey mouse banana republic!

aggree about US they dish out some good judgements. If I invested in a business that ended up going bust would I be just in defying the law and would I be listened to if I demanded that the people of Ireland paid me back.

handlemaster

Happyman42 wrote: »

When that and the events surrounding it, is tested in a court, with all concerned sworn to the truth and all the paperwork and evidence produced, then we will be able to judge.

From your previous postings you have your mind made up already. I was just going by the court rulings and the facts that are already out there. What of the undisputed loans ? Why are they refusing to pay thoses also ?

Happyman42

andrewdeerpark wrote: »

This hearing keeps getting pushed out with Anglo's vendetta against Quinn and family taking precedence that is their big grievance.

And we can guess why.
The real idiots are those who stand by while the system maintains and protects itself. Nothing will ever change in this country until the majority root out the corruption that is and was at the heart of this.
They'll all go to sleep happy that Quinn has been taken down, they confuse their begrudery with a desire to see REAL change. Because if they wanted real change, then they wouldn't stand for this sham.
I have no doubt that Quinn broke the law by putting assets beyond reach, no doubt at all. But in my heart of hearts I know I would do the same after a lifetime of work.
Our lazy 'journalists' pontificating from the moral high ground while a whole raft of corruption goes uncovered and uninvestigated. How would it be, when the media is controlled by those at the trough?

J Mysterio

mikemac1 wrote: »

Dell still employ 1,000 people here

And Dell were there for decades

Dell did employ 3000 people here. These people made Dell. They ****ed off to Poland because they could pay their employees dirt there. Thankfully their operation has suffered as a result and they are now about to pull out again. Serves them flucking right.

handlemaster

Happyman42 wrote: »

And we can guess why.
The real idiots are those who stand by while the system maintains and protects itself. Nothing will ever change in this country until the majority root out the corruption that is and was at the heart of this.
They'll all go to sleep happy that Quinn has been taken down, they confuse their begrudery with a desire to see REAL change. Because if they wanted real change, then they wouldn't stand for this sham.
I have no doubt that Quinn broke the law by putting assets beyond reach, no doubt at all. But in my heart of hearts I know I would do the same after a lifetime of work.
Our lazy 'journalists' pontificating from the moral high ground while a whole raft of corruption goes uncovered and uninvestigated. How would it be, when the media is controlled by those at the trough?

is the court not independent ?

bbam

The other thing I'm hearing lots of talk about is the pressure and essentially intimidation people are being put under to be seen at the rallies.
I'd say lost of brown envelope "favours" are being called in to keep the numbers up.
Shame on the people arranging these gatherings.

andrewdeerpark

handlemaster wrote: »

aggree about US they dish out some good judgements. If I invested in a business that ended up going bust would I be just in defying the law and would I be listened to if I demanded that the people of Ireland paid me back.

What I do not understand is how Ernst & Young have been able to walk away from the Anglo wreckage without being sued by the state or the now new IRBC board, or anybody? Its an easy case as they are headquarted in London so the same legal system, they are worth Billions so worth a shot.

Baffles me??