I have a problem (Soccer Forum related)

Insect Overlord

Samich wrote: »

I got figures for a transfer from wikipedia once and a poster layed into me for using wikipedia as a source.

Once. The plural of anecdote is not "data"...

Samich

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Once. The plural of anecdote is not "data"...

Read the rest of the post. It continues. Still waiting on a mod to come back, they've been "discussing" it now for long enough.

The charter was broken, now mod has said why the posts were allowed.

SlickRic

Samich wrote: »

Well well well, people are engaging with me in a largely friendly manner. I got figures for a transfer from wikipedia once and a poster layed into me for using wikipedia as a source.

laid into you? really?

Also been told many times I'm talking BS, idiotic, retarded etc.

people are allowed to say what they like about your opinion. as long as they don't call you a retard, moron etc.

Why didn't the poster interview the other person about the job interview?

why are you so against people getting along?

also, i've seen you many times try to clarify, on thread, if someone is calling you a troll. what the fúck is that? are you trying to "catch people out". are you trying to get people banned? because i'd suggest that is another reason why you haven't been getting on great with people.

it's not always everyone else. sometimes you have to think to yourself that it might be something to do with what you're doing.

put some effort into getting on with people on the forum. if you spent as much energy doing that as you do trying to get people infracted or banned, you'd probably not have this problem.

Samich

SlickRic wrote: »

laid into you? really?



people are allowed to say what they like about your opinion. as long as they don't call you a retard, moron etc.



why are you so against people getting along?

also, i've seen you many times try to clarify, on thread, if someone is calling you a troll. what the fúck is that? are you trying to "catch people out". are you trying to get people banned? because i'd suggest that is another reason why you haven't been getting on great with people.

it's not always everyone else. sometimes you have to think to yourself that it might be something to do with what you're doing.

put some effort into getting on with people on the forum. if you spent as much energy doing that as you do trying to get people infracted or banned, you'd probably not have this problem.

Yes, laid into.

My problem is you posting excrement in this thread, citing wikipedia as a source when trying to establish the fee paid. Jimmy explained to you why that is utterly stupid, although it really shouldn't need explaining.

You may think it is a bit of fun and not important, but everybody else either has to waste their time reading your bullshìt or has to put you on ignore which makes threads confusing. It would be nice if you would take the slightest bit of intellectual responsibility for what you write and at least try to not act like a retard when you're posting in here. It would be the sound thing for you to do, just to show respect to everybody else who shares this thread and forum with you.

Cool, actually knocked both points out there with the one stone

Samich

Oh and I'm allowed say what I like about anyones opinion.

Mikeyt086

Samich wrote: »

Of course I'm going to reply to each and every post that's aimed at me, why wouldn't I?

Because sometimes you could just let it go. Often I've seen you miss a reply if you were away or whatever, and in the meantime the discussion has fizzled out, only for you to see it and reply and resurrect an argument. The Carrick incident is a prime example of this, that thing could have been ended several times earlier than it did.

Samich wrote:

Yes I'm 2nd highest poster, that doesn't make a difference.

Well I personally feel if it was 110 posts instead of 210, you would have no issues. Sometimes you get upset by someone's response and it effects your judgement, which can lead to others being drawn in even if your original post was fine.

Myself and SlicRic are only offering advice, trying to poke holes in our suggestions only enhances the idea that you struggle to acknowledge any fault in your own posting style. The feedback thread is for feedback after all.

Samich

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

Because sometimes you could just let it go. Often I've seen you miss a reply if you were away or whatever, and in the meantime the discussion has fizzled out, only for you to see it and reply and resurrect an argument. The Carrick incident is a prime example of this, that thing could have been ended several times earlier than it did.



Well I personally feel if it was 110 posts instead of 210, you would have no issues. Sometimes you get upset by someone's response and it effects your judgement, which can lead to others being drawn in even if your original post was fine.

Myself and SlicRic are only offering advice, trying to poke holes in our suggestions only enhances the idea that you struggle to acknowledge any fault in your own posting style. The feedback thread is for feedback after all.

I'm allowed respond to every post that is aimed at me, there's nothing wrong with this at all.

No one is actually responding to the main points I've made in this thread so far.

oscarBravo

Samich wrote: »

No one is actually responding to the main points I've made in this thread so far.

I'll respond, as an admin with no interest in Soccer.

It seems to me that you're looking for the charter to be applied to the absolute letter, with zero discretion on the part of the moderators under any circumstances whatsoever. If that's what you're asking for - and you're not the first to do so - it's not going to happen.

If, on the other hand, you recognise that the moderators need to be able to exercise their personal judgement in moderating one of the busiest forums on the site, then I'm not clear what it is you're asking for.

SlickRic

yep, it's all everyone else's fault. not an ounce of blame is yours. you are right, everyone else is wrong.

you picking fights endlessly is not going to allow this to end well, for you. as long as you're on this crusade, you're never going to enjoy the boards experience and you're making it a chore for many others.

you know these rules you're so keen for the mods to enforce?

there's also a "don't be a díck" rule that you should be aware of.

and by the way, if mods were to enforce all these rules like the Nazi you want them to seemingly, there'd be barely anyone left on the forum, including you.

you, a fair few times, have accused people, on thread, of calling you a troll, as well as telling people on thread when a post has been reported, as well as commenting on posts that you deem off-topic. did the mods infract you for all of them?

no, i didn't think so.

look at yourself a bit.

Samich

SlickRic wrote: »

yep, it's all everyone else's fault. not an ounce of blame is yours. you are right, everyone else is wrong.

you picking fights endlessly is not going to allow this to end well, for you. as long as you're on this crusade, you're never going to enjoy the boards experience and you're making it a chore for many others.

you know these rules you're so keen for the mods to enforce?

there's also a "don't be a díck" rule that you should be aware of.

and by the way, if mods were to enforce all these rules like the Nazi you want them to seemingly, there'd be barely anyone left on the forum, including you.

you, a fair few times, have accused people, on thread, of calling you a troll, as well as telling people when a post has been reported, as well as commenting on posts that you deem off-topic. did the mods infract you for all of them?

no, i didn't think so.

look at yourself a bit.

Still got more infractions then the others. :rolleyes:

Samich

oscarBravo wrote: »

I'll respond, as an admin with no interest in Soccer.

It seems to me that you're looking for the charter to be applied to the absolute letter, with zero discretion on the part of the moderators under any circumstances whatsoever. If that's what you're asking for - and you're not the first to do so - it's not going to happen.

If, on the other hand, you recognise that the moderators need to be able to exercise their personal judgement in moderating one of the busiest forums on the site, then I'm not clear what it is you're asking for.

Exercise their judgement? Basically you're saying, let the popular posters off with anything they like, sure they're grand.

I was under the impression soccer was one of the strictest fora on boards.

Still haven't answered the questions. Why did the 2 posts in the original thread go unpunished? I got a yellow for backseat modding this evening. No doubt my posts were reported by others in the thread.

oscarBravo

Samich wrote: »

Exercise their judgement? Basically you're saying, let the popular posters off with anything they like, sure they're grand.

Once again, you're making it clear that you don't want moderators to be able to exercise judgement, and once again I'm going to reply that that's not going to happen. I won't be repeating that much more often.

I was under the impression soccer was one of the strictest fora on boards.

I was under the same impression.

Still haven't answered the questions. Why did the 2 posts in the original thread go unpunished?

Presumably because the moderators used the discretion you don't want them to be allowed to use and decided not to punish them.

I got a yellow for backseat modding this evening.

Presumably because the moderators used their discretion and decided that your post warranted punishment.

If you want to make this a conversation about something other than denying moderators the right to exercise discretion in moderating, please do so. If you're going to continue on that track, the conversation won't be lasting much longer.

Samich

oscarBravo wrote: »

Once again, you're making it clear that you don't want moderators to be able to exercise judgement, and once again I'm going to reply that that's not going to happen. I won't be repeating that much more often. I was under the same impression. Presumably because the moderators used the discretion you don't want them to be allowed to use and decided not to punish them. Presumably because the moderators used their discretion and decided that your post warranted punishment.

If you want to make this a conversation about something other than denying moderators the right to exercise discretion in moderating, please do so. If you're going to continue on that track, the conversation won't be lasting much longer.

Ha, refusing feedback now? In the feedback thread of all places. You're refusing to see, posters tend to gang up on other posters when they go against the popular opinion.

Strict - characterized by or acting in close conformity to requirements or principles

Are you now saying it's not strict?

Are you now saying I can tell people I'm putting them on ignore?

oscarBravo

Samich wrote: »

Ha, refusing feedback now?

No, I'm telling you (for the third time now) that we're not going to be re-writing a sitewide policy to suit your particular desires.

You're refusing to see, posters tend to gang up on other posters when they go against the popular opinion.

You haven't really made the thread about that, though. If you want to make the thread about that, rather than demanding that moderation be carried out in a manner that suits you, then let's do so.

Are you now saying it's not strict?

No, I'm not saying that. You can tell that I'm not saying that by the fact that I didn't say that. Don't read between the lines; I didn't write between them.

Are you now saying I can tell people I'm putting them on ignore?

That's something else I very specifically didn't say.

I won't be responding any further before the morning, so have a think before you reply again. If you genuinely feel that there's an issue with the moderation of the Soccer forum that is to the detriment of the forum generally rather than something that pisses you personally off, say so and we'll have a conversation about it. If, on the other hand, you come back with an argumentative post similar to your last one, I'll stop entertaining the discussion.

Samich

oscarBravo wrote: »

No, I'm telling you (for the third time now) that we're not going to be re-writing a sitewide policy to suit your particular desires. You haven't really made the thread about that, though. If you want to make the thread about that, rather than demanding that moderation be carried out in a manner that suits you, then let's do so. No, I'm not saying that. You can tell that I'm not saying that by the fact that I didn't say that. Don't read between the lines; I didn't write between them. That's something else I very specifically didn't say.

I won't be responding any further before the morning, so have a think before you reply again. If you genuinely feel that there's an issue with the moderation of the Soccer forum that is to the detriment of the forum generally rather than something that pisses you personally off, say so and we'll have a conversation about it. If, on the other hand, you come back with an argumentative post similar to your last one, I'll stop entertaining the discussion.

Where was the argumentative post?

You agreed the forum was one of the strictest on boards but then say it's down to mods judgement, that's not a strict forum.

I've told the soccer mods to come to this thread yet there have been no replies (apart from one saying they're discussing it).

Paul Tergat

If the mods were as strict as you want them to be there would be no forum. Nobody would want to be a member where the tiniest little off topic comment is given a yellow, all posters would be banned.

Regarding the actual comment I made last night, I was just letting people know why I wouldnt be commenting further the IPO. I feel a few of the lads sorta know me on the forum and kindly asked how I got on. Thats really all it was and as others have said it can nicely break up a thread and fosters a good environment for discussion

I don't think you are a bad poster at all but I reckon that you are maybe seeing arguments that arent really there in the first place.

Just my 2c any Samich

Samich

Paul Tergat wrote: »

If the mods were as strict as you want them to be there would be no forum. Nobody would want to be a member where the tiniest little off topic comment is given a yellow, all posters would be banned.

Regarding the actual comment I made last night, I was just letting people know why I wouldnt be commenting further the IPO. I feel a few of the lads sorta know me on the forum and kindly asked how I got on. Thats really all it was and as others have said it can nicely break up a thread and fosters a good environment for discussion

I don't think you are a bad poster at all but I reckon that you are maybe seeing arguments that arent really there in the first place.

Just my 2c any Samich

Ok forget that part then of my posts.

The first 2 still stand though. I'm all for the little guy, someone with 100 posts comes in and says they're putting someone on ignore, they'll get a yellow card and will be referred to the charter. I got a yellow for calling someone a troll before. Fair enough it was a yellow, but when someone does it and it's allowed, it's not fair.

PeterStrauss The Second

All this hassle over a previously site banned troll.

Ironic that mink_man is upset for being labelled a troll tbh.

Mikeyt086

PeterStrauss The Second wrote: »

All this hassle over a previously site banned troll.

Ironic that mink_man is upset for being labelled a troll tbh.

SlickRic

SOTS tbh.

by the way Samich, you're doing everything you can to avoid your own indiscretions.

if you want the mods to be that strict, then you'll have to accept a banning yourself for your "off-topic posting" and "back seat modding".

the forum would die though.

posting "i've still got more infractions than others" really is quite a thin argument IMO. and how would you know? i saw Pro F was infractioned earlier for instance. the mods are largely very fair.

you don't know all the infractions that the soccer mods have handed out unless you've got a super sad amount of time on your hands.

you're just sore because you feel picked on, because you've rubbed people up the wrong way in the Utd thread.

oscarBravo

Samich wrote: »

You agreed the forum was one of the strictest on boards but then say it's down to mods judgement, that's not a strict forum.

I'll take this as you asking, yet again, for the moderators to be denied discretion in the exercise of their roles, and - for the fourth time - I'll explain that that's not going to happen.

That's the end of my involvement in this conversation. I'm not interested in being a sounding board for a rant. If you want to have a reasoned discussion about perceived issues in the Soccer forum, I'm afraid you're going to have to approach it differently.

Will I Amnt

The United superthread has become painful reading over the last few weeks and it's in no small part down to you Samich.
Your pigheadedness and insistence on picking at irrelevant parts of people's points while ignoring the main point they are trying to make is infuriating to say the least.

There is nobody ganging up on you,it's just that virtually everybody is either in disagreement with what you're saying or how you are approaching saying it.
I have had plenty of disagreements with posters in that thread but sometimes you have to agree to disagree and move on.
You might just happen to agree with that person on the next topic.

Roger Sterling

Ah yes the old soccer forum troll cycle:

(a) Post controversial opinions in increasingly erratic style until you've made a "name" for yourself

(b) Develop persecution complex about unanimous disagreement on club thread with deliberately inflammatory posts

(c) Use forum rules about being labelled a troll and back seat modding to score the odd point against generaly decent posters

(d) Create feedback thread to increase "notoriety" when furore reaches a peak, all the while maintaining a stance of injured, outraged innocence.

(e) 6 month ban which is appealed to the nth degree

(f) Attempt multiple re-reg's until Admins become wise to his tricks

(g) Retreat to Mammy's basement in search of new footy forum to repeat cycle, whil all the time losing the constant battle with ever increasing dampness of chin

Beasty

Samich wrote: »

I've told the soccer mods to come to this thread yet there have been no replies (apart from one saying they're discussing it).

Your OP was timed at 3.40 yesterday afternoon. I'm not sure when you "told" the soccer mods to come to this thread, but maybe your expectations of an immediate contribution to the thread are indicative of you general attitude both here and in the Soccer Forum

I have a life outside of Boards and have not had chance to look at the points you are raising (and you've not PM'd me as a CMod to raise any concerns about the modding of the forum - I've only just come across this thread now). When I get chance I will have a look at them, and also discuss any issues with the local mods with a view to posting back here (but please don't expect that to happen immediately - these things take time to review)

Tom Dunne

This thread has served the following purposes:

1: brought Samich up on the mods/cmods and admins radar, along with associated previous bans, infractions and accounts. Not A Good Thing.

2: demonstrated an impatience with other users of the site, along with an inability to appreciate (a) the policies and procedures we have for dealing with these matters and (b) the fact that mods/cmods/admins are not at your beck and call when you throw a little strop to demand attention

3: demonstrated your inability to accept that the people who make up this community are human and as such, nothing is ever black and white. We trust mods/cmods and admins to take decisions based on the facts available, not to act like robots making "yes/no" decisions. That's what makes a community.

4: that you persisted with a point, despite the countless counterarguments from users, cmods and an admin

5: reinforced the feeling among the volunteers that manage this site that it is people like you who suck the enjoyment out of it for us. Your persistent arguing, your constant demanding, your inability to "let it go". Well newsflash, we no longer tolerate people like you. We are now at the point where if a poster is deemed to be more trouble than they are worth, action will be taken.

You are rapidly approaching this point.

So I strongly advise you take on board all that is being said to you on this thread. Otherwise, rest assured, action will be taken.

In short, let it go.

LuckyLloyd

If you are going to consistently hold a minority opinion and argue it vigorously then you are going to be in for some stick. That's life. Sport is an emotional subject and people hold their opinions dearly - and can find plenty of reinforcement for their views in the wide ranging sports media landscape. As such, it follows that they may not always be fully courteous when responding to you.

Seems to me that reporting lots of posts; getting into lots of petty squabbles and eventually taking it to feedback is a less than optimal way to handle the situation.

5starpool

If it ever got to the stage where someone was infracted for an off topic comment such as 'how did the interview go' then the soccer forum would be a wasteland in no time I'd say. What a stupid thing to report. I'm sure there are rules against such frivolous reports, but as I don't read charters of forums I'm familiar with, I can't say for sure.

Pro. F

SlickRic wrote: »

posting "i've still got more infractions than others" really is quite a thin argument IMO. and how would you know? i saw Pro F was infractioned earlier for instance. the mods are largely very fair.

Just to be clear, that infraction was overturned after the mod reflected on it.

But your point still stands, the mods are fair and nobody gets preferential treatment in the United thread. There is no evidence of it being any other way.

Tom Dunne

As the user has now closed his account, I think it is best that this thread is also closed.