Phrases of the moon, do they make a difference?

spirit_77

found it very hard to sleep last night, im going to blame it all on the moon:pac:

yeppydeppy

It would seem some people are not clicking on the link about confirmation bias to learn something new:
Confirmation bias (also called confirmatory bias or myside bias) is a tendency of people to favor information that confirms their beliefs or hypotheses.[Note 1][1] People display this bias when they gather or remember information selectively, or when they interpret it in a biased way. The effect is stronger for emotionally charged issues and for deeply entrenched beliefs. For example, in reading about gun control, people usually prefer sources that affirm their existing attitudes. They also tend to interpret ambiguous evidence as supporting their existing position. Biased search, interpretation and memory have been invoked to explain attitude polarization (when a disagreement becomes more extreme even though the different parties are exposed to the same evidence), belief perseverance (when beliefs persist after the evidence for them is shown to be false), the irrational primacy effect (a greater reliance on information encountered early in a series) and illusory correlation (when people falsely perceive an association between two events or situations).

A series of experiments in the 1960s suggested that people are biased toward confirming their existing beliefs. Later work re-interpreted these results as a tendency to test ideas in a one-sided way, focusing on one possibility and ignoring alternatives. In certain situations, this tendency can bias people's conclusions. Explanations for the observed biases include wishful thinking and the limited human capacity to process information. Another explanation is that people show confirmation bias because they are weighing up the costs of being wrong, rather than investigating in a neutral, scientific way.

Confirmation biases contribute to overconfidence in personal beliefs and can maintain or strengthen beliefs in the face of contrary evidence. Poor decisions due to these biases have been found in military, political, and organizational contexts.

V_Moth

Blondini wrote: »

These are my favourite phrases of the Moon :

"Many say our world is at a tipping point. If we do not act together, if we do not act responsibly, if we do not act now, we risk slipping into a cycle of poverty, degradation, and despair."
– Ban Ki Moon


"Together we want to help the world see and believe in a better future."
– Ban Ki Moon


"Women must be full partners in development, so they can lift themselves and their communities out of poverty."
– Ban Ki Moon

But the question is, have these phrases made a difference?

Bad Panda

girl in the striped socks wrote: »

A friend of mine works in a residential unit for mentally disabled people & it does affect them. In a bad way.
One of them tried to strangle her a few months ago.

Yep, it was definitely the moon!

Sorry for speeding Garda, it was the bloody moon! *Shakes fist at moon*

Seriously though: I do believe it can have an affect alright, but I doubt it affects every one of us...that much.

Etc

There was a young man from Rangoon, who farted in a balloon, the balloon went so high, it stank out the sky, and killed the man on the moon.

Here endith my phrases of the moon.

Realtine

senorwipesalot wrote: »

Any psychriatric nurse will tell you the full moon definetly has a strange effect on patients.
Theyre not called lunatics (lunar) for nothing.

...or an A&E dept, when I worked in one for a couple of years some nights were definitely more crazier than others and someone would always ask if there was a full moon out - an ambulance guy told me once that research had been done on whether the moon affects people in strange ways and apparently it doesn't.
But I don't believe it.

I love the moon - always gazing at it.

Tope

It really does come down to confirmation bias. We're all guilty of this to some extent I'm sure - if you hold a certain belief, you see evidence for it and subconsciously ignore any evidence against it.
Anecdotal evidence from people who already believe the myth does not make for reliable statistics.


For example, a friend of mine totally believes the full moon brings out the craziness, while I don't.
We used to go out on the town every weekend, and we'd often get chatting to random people during the night, the odd weirdo sometimes, some nights more eventful than others.
Whenever she noticed on the way home that it was a full moon, she'd exclaim “No wonder there were so many weirdos out tonight!”. I'd remind her of something equally mad that happened the previous week, or some strange guy we got talking to two weeks before, but she'd be totally convinced that this night was genuinely crazier than usual because of the moon, and nothing would convince her otherwise. People see what they want to see.


I wasn't raised to believe the myths, so I've never noticed any monthly strange behaviour. Not in school, not in myself, not in others. I'm always surprised when people claim things like Queen-Mise above, “you can see it in the schools - kids are looper around the time of the full moon.” as if it's plain fact. No, I've honestly never noticed that kids are looper around the full moon. I've never noticed any increase in strange behaviour at any given time of the month. I don't see a pattern because I'm not looking for a pattern.


Oh and for heaven's sake, it's phases, not phrases, OP. Please make the hilarious moon-related sayings stop!

kraggy

JustAThought wrote: »

Brilliant Sydneyfyfe!

I used to live in Holland down by the zoo ( not in it!) and roundabout once or twice a month the animals would go bananas at night; elephants roaring, howling etc; a whole lot of crazy. It was always full moon nights.

I'm sure it affects some of us too :0

That's just Lorcan the lion saying "will ye ever turn off that feckin light, I'm tryin ta shleep.

Dave!

Pretty surprising that so many here apparently believe this crap... I'd imagine a similar thread about Astrology or other such nonsense would be (rightly) greeted with all manner of eye rolling and derisory comments.

Must be the moon f*cking with people's critical faculties.

Tope

Same here, Dave! – I'm always surprised when I discover an otherwise seemingly rational person believes this stuff, just the same as if they announce they're a typical Libra, or that they're worried about Friday the 13th.


Look, obviously if the moon is full, it'll be brighter - sometimes amazingly bright if the sky is clear.
Naturally this might lead to people and animals staying awake longer than usual. Hence a completely understandable slight increase in activity, and possibly slight changes in behaviour due to lack of sleep. But no more so than if someone kept shining a light in your face during the night. That's as far as it goes though – nothing spooky going on, no inherent mood changes due to gravitational forces.
That's not to say that I have no reaction to the moon myself. I love looking at it; had a lovely view of it two nights ago, almost full and surrounded by wispy clouds - very atmospheric. If it's a clear night later I'll probably go for a stroll after dark and have a look at the full moon. A photographer friend of mine is also planning to head out with her camera. It may be that more people will be out and about than usual. That may lead to more strange encounters than if I stayed in watching TV. Spooky? Not really.

Diapason

I'm singing the theme from Button Moon in my head now, so it definitely has an effect.

Nux

Isn't the word lunatic itself was derived in Latin from the word luna, meaning "moon" ?

Tope

Yes it is, Nux - the myths surrounding the moon obviously go way, way back.

Doesn't make them true though.

dyer

just speaking for myself, id certainly argue the contrary. i know for a fact the moon affects my mood.. it always has done.. it makes me hyper and completely restless.. not just for the night of the full moon itself, but for the entire week that precedes it.. doesn't matter whether its completely overcast or a clear black sky full of stars so light has nothing to do with it.

you wrote about confirmation bias etc.. granted it makes sense, but you can't account for peoples physical or emotional experiences scientifically... and in a way, your own beliefs just prove your own confirmation bias because that's what you allude to!

do you really think it's such a daft idea?

its more than likely there would be no life on earth whatsoever if the moon did not exist. why do you think when scientists search for extra solar planets they look for ones such as ours with similar moons? ..because the moon is an integral part of the process of how they believe life evolved here on earth... let alone how the earth itself evolved to be what is today.

i don't think it's silly at all.

dd972

I tend to notice everything and everybody being restless and somewhat hyper on the days leading up to moon fullness and then a sense of relief once it culminates, also an odd feeling around the new moon period, difficult to describe but utterly different to the full moon experience.

later12

Tope wrote: »

Same here, Dave! – I'm always surprised when I discover an otherwise seemingly rational person believes this stuff, just the same as if they announce they're a typical Libra, or that they're worried about Friday the 13th.

Get over it! I say that sort of thing all the time; you don't have to believe in it to have a little fun with it. A friend of mine is "a tarot reader" and I used to tell her I needed my future told just as a fun way to have her drive over here, spend the day together,talking about life and having a natter in a way that is a little alternative and less boring than going for coffee.

You people should learn a little tolerance; it has nothing to do with you or Dave! whether or not people engage in this sort of folly, or why. Sometimes people just find this stuff amusing; we won't ask you join in if you don't ask us to desist.

If you spend long enough thinking of all the silly, harmful, irrational things that people engage in, you'll come to realise that a little fun with so-called mysticism should be nowhere near the top of your list.

im invisible

what is gravity anyway?

FanadMan

TIMEisMONEY wrote: »

This is known to be a myth.

Read the same in quite a few books - all hokum!

mud

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzlTOWrad6M

RobbieTheRobber

later12 wrote: »

Get over it! I say that sort of thing all the time; you don't have to believe in it to have a little fun with it. A friend of mine is "a tarot reader" and I used to tell her I needed my future told just as a fun way to have her drive over here, spend the day together,talking about life and having a natter in a way that is a little alternative and less boring than going for coffee.

You people should learn a little tolerance; it has nothing to do with you or Dave! whether or not people engage in this sort of folly, or why. Sometimes people just find this stuff amusing; we won't ask you join in if you don't ask us to desist.

If you spend long enough thinking of all the silly, harmful, irrational things that people engage in, you'll come to realise that a little fun with so-called mysticism should be nowhere near the top of your list.

Some people might have a problem with the fact these co called mystics prey on the vulnerable, if you and your friend want to deal a deck of cards thats fine.

If your friend wants to charge someone who may be in a vulnerable state of mind for telling them them a load of crap that may make their state of mind worse then yes I can understand why people might have a problem.

later12

RobbieTheRobber wrote: »

Some people might have a problem with the fact these co called mystics prey on the vulnerable, if you and your friend want to deal a deck of cards thats fine.

But sure everyone's opposed to "preying on the vulnerable". That's a strawman, nobody here is going to be in favour of that.

I described a different situation, in response to some users' disbelief at "otherwise sane, rational people" going in for this sort of folly. If they're just having a laugh, who cares?

It reminds me of the way some people of unspectacular intelligence use their atheism as an intellectual crutch to make up for a lack of mental prowess in more established academic disciplines, or indeed to beat others with.

Tope

later12 wrote: »

You people should learn a little tolerance; it has nothing to do with you or Dave! whether or not people engage in this sort of folly, or why. Sometimes people just find this stuff amusing; we won't ask you join in if you don't ask us to desist.

But that's just the thing later12 – I'm constantly being asked to “join in”, and when I politely refuse because I'm not interested, I get accused of being a spoil-sport, or even worse when it's someone who really takes this stuff seriously, having no 'spiritual side', said with genuine pity. It's pretty insulting, actually.
Whether it's the horoscopes in the paper being read out at work, or someone at a party offering to do everyone's Angel card readings, if I say “No thanks, it's not my thing”, they keep insisting, and get upset when I refuse to take part.

It never just ends there, it turns into a big debate, with me being the one trying to defend my position, and them ganging up and insisting I'm ruining the fun. It ends up with me trying to explain why I find the whole thing ridiculous while trying not to hurt anyone's feelings, (which is practically impossible), and I get stuff like “Well, what do you believe in?”, “Are you a nihilist?” and “Ha ha, Tope only believes in things she can physically touch, she has no imagination!”. I hate these situations and avoid them as much as possible.


I don't enjoy getting into these arguments, but a polite refusal to tell someone my star-sign leads to me being attacked or pitied for not joining in. Intolerance isn't a one way street.

Dave!

later12 wrote: »

Get over it! I say that sort of thing all the time; you don't have to believe in it to have a little fun with it. A friend of mine is "a tarot reader" and I used to tell her I needed my future told just as a fun way to have her drive over here, spend the day together,talking about life and having a natter in a way that is a little alternative and less boring than going for coffee.

You people should learn a little tolerance; it has nothing to do with you or Dave! whether or not people engage in this sort of folly, or why. Sometimes people just find this stuff amusing; we won't ask you join in if you don't ask us to desist.

If you spend long enough thinking of all the silly, harmful, irrational things that people engage in, you'll come to realise that a little fun with so-called mysticism should be nowhere near the top of your list.

I don't think I've ever grabbed the deck from a tarot card reader, this is a discussion forum, and a topic about this very subject, so I just gave my opinion. Noone's stopping you having your fun.

later12

Tope wrote: »

when I politely refuse because I'm not interested, I get accused of being a spoil-sport, or even worse when it's someone who really takes this stuff seriously, having no 'spiritual side', said with genuine pity. It's pretty insulting, actually.

Dave! wrote: »

I don't think I've ever grabbed the deck from a tarot card reader, this is a discussion forum, and a topic about this very subject, so I just gave my opinion. Noone's stopping you having your fun.

With all due respect, for two people who were lamenting a dearth of rationale, you're both putting forward a completely irrelevant response to the point at hand.

The original quote was

Tope wrote: »

Same here, Dave! – I'm always surprised when I discover an otherwise seemingly rational person believes this stuff, just the same as if they announce they're a typical Libra, or that they're worried about Friday the 13th.

My point is not that people should accept being dogged into partaking, nor was I accusing one of you of 'snatching the cards' from a tarot reader.

I just made the point that in my experience, partaking is not necessarily a sign of irrationality. I wouldn't be surprised if I saw a nuclear physicist having his tea leaves read, I'd just assume he was in it for a joke. Most of the fun anyone I'm acquainted with has derived from one of these things is ridiculing how predictable they are.

Dave!

later12 wrote: »

With all due respect, for two people who were lamenting a dearth of rationale, you're both putting forward a completely irrelevant response to the point at hand.

The original quote was



My point is not that people should accept being dogged into partaking, nor was I accusing one of you of 'snatching the cards' from a tarot reader.

I just made the point that in my experience, partaking is not necessarily a sign of irrationality. I wouldn't be surprised if I saw a nuclear physicist having his tea leaves read, I'd just assume he was in it for a joke. Most of the fun anyone I'm acquainted with has derived from one of these things is ridiculing how predictable they are.

Well I'm not sure how the topic got onto tarot cards, but the original post was about the moon 'phrases', and my response was regarding the amount of people here who seemingly believe that they have a direct affect on behaviour.

You surely can't take the same angle on that -- either you believe it to be the case, or you don't. "Maybe they just believe it for the laugh" is not a realistic response.

28064212

http://i.imgur.com/nZc4s.png

Tope

later12 wrote: »

With all due respect, for two people who were lamenting a dearth of rationale, you're both putting forward a completely irrelevant response to the point at hand.

Later12, my post was in direct response to your statement that “Sometimes people just find this stuff amusing; we won't ask you join in if you don't ask us to desist.” I simply related my experience of this not being the case. Not irrelevant at all. Though we have moved slightly off topic.

You say “partaking is not necessarily a sign of irrationality... Most of the fun anyone I'm acquainted with has derived from one of these things is ridiculing how predictable they are.” So obviously you (and your acquaintances) are not the people I'm referring to. I'm talking about people who genuinely believe in it. People who pay money to fortune-tellers and are amazed at their insights, or people who cry because their horoscope implies they won't do well in their exams. These are people I know in real life, and there are plenty of them.

The people in this thread who say they definitely feel different or notice strange behaviour around the time of the full moon are being equally irrational. They don't think “hey, it's a bit of fun”, they clearly believe it's a real phenomenon, and they're ignoring all the evidence to the contrary. And I find that surprising.

That cartoon 28064212 posted above is exactly what I'm talking about - this is what people are doing, they just don't realise they're doing it!

Cú Giobach

later12 wrote: »

Get over it! I say that sort of thing all the time; you don't have to believe in it to have a little fun with it.

No you don't have to believe in it to have a little fun with it (if you are on about Astrology or other such nonsense) but you certainly have to believe it to believe it, and if you are refering to people who have a little fun with this Moon phrases stuff, well they also have to believe it to believe it.
No matter what way you read the conversation above, Tope referred to people who "believe this crap" not people who "partake" "have fun with" or any kind of action with, but quite specifically "believe".
So what the hell are you waffling on about??

Lippy C

I will say myself and other staff hated working the night shift if there was a new/full moon it made for an eventual night shift.

Tope

Cú Giobach wrote: »

No matter what way you read the conversation above, Tope referred to people who "believe this crap" not people who "partake" "have fun with" or any kind of action with, but quite specifically "believe".
So what the hell are you waffling on about??

You put it better than I could!

Anyway, back on topic:

dyer wrote: »

you wrote about confirmation bias etc.. granted it makes sense, but you can't account for peoples physical or emotional experiences scientifically... and in a way, your own beliefs just prove your own confirmation bias because that's what you allude to!

So basically we can agree that people who believe the full moon affects behaviour will notice strange behaviour, and those who don't won't. Fair enough, confirmation bias at work on both sides.

The difference is that statistical evidence backs up my belief. If it didn't, I'd be happy to consider the alternative viewpoint.

Saying science can't account for people's personal emotional experiences is a bit of a cop out. What science can do is examine the facts and present them in an unbiased way. Despite the many stories from psychiatric nurses, hospital staff, etc., studies have shown that there is no increase in unusual behaviour during the full moon.

PSYCHIATRIC VISITS: A 2005 study by Mayo Clinic researchers, reported in the journal Psychiatric Services, looked at how many patients checked into a psychiatric emergency department between 6 p.m. and 6 a.m. over several years. They found no statistical difference in the number of visits on the three nights surrounding full moons vs. other nights.
EMERGENCY ROOM VISITS: Researchers examined 150,999 records of emergency room visits to a suburban hospital. Their study, reported in American Journal of Emergency Medicine in 1996, found no difference at full moon vs. other nights.

dodderangler

Aaawwooooooooooooo( changes into Werewolf)

mud

From personal experience I have more energy around full moon time and am not ashamed to say it. My mam will back me up on that as I've always reacted to the moon since I was a small girl. Who knows what's happening but the moon has such a huge effect on tides and we are made up of so much water ourselves that I think the full moon does affect me.

Cú Giobach

mud wrote: »

From personal experience I have more energy around full moon time and am not ashamed to say it. My mam will back me up on that as I've always reacted to the moon since I was a small girl. Who knows what's happening but the moon has such a huge effect on tides and we are made up of so much water ourselves that I think the full moon does affect me.

Gravity doesn't just work with water, it works on anything with mass, even light. It's mass that determines the forces exerted between things, not what they're made of.

If you use a laser pointer the beam of light is pulled towards the Earth at the same rate a cup of coffee would be if you dropped it, that is= 9.81 m / s^2 , the light is just travelling so fast that in the half second it takes the coffee to hit the floor the light has travelled over 93,000 miles, well away from the Earth and your living room carpet.

The Moon also pulls on the rocks making up the Earth and raises a slight bulge in the very rocks under your feet every day, one of the reasons scientists are looking for a correlation between the moon and earthquakes.
That effect is seen at its best on (for example) Io.

The gravitational effect of the Moon on smaller bodies of water is much less than on something as big as an ocean, The Great Lakes for example are considered non-tidal because the effects of wind and barometric pressure completely swamp the very small changes caused by the Moon's passage overhead, and you won't find any tides at all on our own Lough Neagh.

The forces generated between two objects depends on 3 variables, #1+#2 the mass of each object and #3 the distance between them (actually the square of the distance) if you do the maths the effect on a tiny human is vanishingly small, if the insignificant force from the moon has an effect on us then we would also notice changes every time we drove past a mountain or went to the top of a tall building.

weirdtodamoon

bluewolf wrote: »

How do you know - maybe it thinks you're perfectly normal

What are you on about love???

weirdtodamoon

weirdtodamoon wrote: »

What are you on about love???

you said the moon thinks you're weird

.ak

Feck off, next you'll be telling us they can put a man on the moon. :rolleyes:

weirdtodamoon

bluewolf wrote: »

you said the moon thinks you're weird

My name is weirdtodamoon

weirdtodamoon

weirdtodamoon wrote: »

My name is weirdtodamoon

Hi, my name is bluewolf

weirdtodamoon

bluewolf wrote: »

Hi, my name is bluewolf

Take a hike! lol