Child dies in fall from apartment.

Jesus Shaves

robbie7730 wrote: »

You said you had not had any kids fall out windows. Was that not to indicate you are a great parent?

No that would indicate that I have put all the safety measures in place that I mentioned above

Zoria

Duiske wrote: »

Leaves me wondering how you have survived all this time with no sleep.

I thought of this too. I have children myself, and when they were babies they would be one minute happy enough on their backs and sides. before you know it they learn to roll onto their front, then you are beside yourself in case they roll over onto their face and smother themselves. Baby - toddler stage tests the coping skills of any human being, I don't care what anyone says. It's all about building strength at that particular age. Even though I made sure I had that bump proof lining at the edges of the cot the bump itself gave them a fright and put them into hysterics. Every stage of development is a surprise to a parent because some start doing something earlier than another. They leave your heart in your mouth half of the time. When I told my mam that I took the babies into the bathroom with me while I went for a wee she had to tell me to calm down. I put them in the beginners car seat and wee'd with them faced away from me. I thought they'd choke on their soothers and what not, my nerves were wrecked.

It must be remembered that years and years ago there were no such thing as child locks and all of these things, freak accidents happened in those days I'm sure, and I'm also sure there were people willing to point the finger then too. There always will. Not every freak accident means a parent doesn't care, and they have to suffer in the hands of the critics and finger pointers.

jessiejam

Jesus Shaves wrote: »

No that would indicate that I have put all the safety measures in place that I mentioned above

I wonder if that poor little mite had died in a fire in the appartment, where there were locked windows (which are illegal in upstairs bedrooms btw) would the blame brigade still be out in force, saying that the windows shouldn't have been locked etc?

hoochis

Zoria wrote: »

I thought of this too. I have children myself, and when they were babies they would be one minute happy enough on their backs and sides. before you know it they learn to roll onto their front, then you are beside yourself in case they roll over onto their face and smother themselves. Baby - toddler stage tests the coping skills of any human being, I don't care what anyone says. It's all about building strength at that particular age. Even though I made sure I had that bump proof lining at the edges of the cot the bump itself gave them a fright and put them into hysterics. Every stage of development is a surprise to a parent because some start doing something earlier than another. They leave your heart in your mouth half of the time. When I told my mam that I took the babies into the bathroom with me while I went for a wee she had to tell me to calm down. I put them in the beginners car seat and wee'd with them faced away from me. I thought they'd choke on their soothers and what not, my nerves were wrecked.

It must be remembered that years and years ago there were no such thing as child locks and all of these things, freak accidents happened in those days I'm sure, and I'm also sure there were people willing to point the finger then too. There always will. Not every freak accident means a parent doesn't care, and they have to suffer in the hands of the critics and finger pointers.

How is a toddler falling out a sixth floor window while unsupervised a freak accident? A freak accident would be getting struck by lightning. It was an accident caused by neglect. Could have been so easily prevented. Terrible parenting!

mydearwatson

Zoria wrote: »

I thought of this too. I have children myself, and when they were babies they would be one minute happy enough on their backs and sides. before you know it they learn to roll onto their front, then you are beside yourself in case they roll over onto their face and smother themselves. Baby - toddler stage tests the coping skills of any human being, I don't care what anyone says. It's all about building strength at that particular age. Even though I made sure I had that bump proof lining at the edges of the cot the bump itself gave them a fright and put them into hysterics. Every stage of development is a surprise to a parent because some start doing something earlier than another. They leave your heart in your mouth half of the time. When I told my mam that I took the babies into the bathroom with me while I went for a wee she had to tell me to calm down. I put them in the beginners car seat and wee'd with them faced away from me. I thought they'd choke on their soothers and what not, my nerves were wrecked.

It must be remembered that years and years ago there were no such thing as child locks and all of these things, freak accidents happened in those days I'm sure, and I'm also sure there were people willing to point the finger then too. There always will. Not every freak accident means a parent doesn't care, and they have to suffer in the hands of the critics and finger pointers.

Would you be happy to leave your 18 month old baby alone in a 6th floor apartment with a large window wide open?

Think about it. Really.

If not - why not?

This does not seem to be a freak accident - it seems like simple negligence (i.e. failing take the reasonable precautions that the average person would take in similar circumstances.)

Zoria

hoochis wrote: »

How is a toddler falling out a sixth floor window while unsupervised a freak accident?

If it was a ground floor apartment fall it wouldn't get quite this much attention, wouldn't you agree?

Bruthal

Jesus Shaves wrote: »

No that would indicate that I have put all the safety measures in place that I mentioned above

99.9999% of parents wont have kids fall out windows. I doubt 99.999% of parents are perfect.

mydearwatson

Zoria wrote: »

If it was a ground floor apartment fall it wouldn't get quite this much attention, wouldn't you agree?

Well, when you're assessing risk, it's a matter of considering the likelihood of an incident occurring, and the severity if it does occur.

While a child could certainly die from a fall from a ground floor window, it's much more likely that they'll escape uninjured, or with minor injuries.

No child will end up OK after a six-floor drop onto concrete.

This is why a responsible parent/guardian will do whatever is in their power to prevent their child falling from such a height.

A child falling from a ground-floor level window, and dying, would be considered a tragic freak accident, in my opinion, because it was pure bad luck that they landed the way that they did, at a relatively low height.

A child falling from a sixth-floor window is a different matter altogether. I truly don't see how the parents didn't foresee this possibility and take the necessary (and normal) precautions.

hoochis

robbie7730 wrote: »

99.9999% of parents wont have kids fall out windows. I doubt 99.999% of parents are perfect.

Of course they are not perfect. They are probably not stupid either though.

Zoria

mydearwatson wrote: »

This does not seem to be a freak accident - it seems like simple negligence (i.e. failing take the reasonable precautions that the average person would take in similar circumstances.)

What about when those precautions weren't available? Are parents going to be nailed to the wall for everything that happens to children get up to? I recall two of my children got into a bit of a barney over a toy (as they do), as soon as I heard them quarreling I went straight to them and one and pushed the other, and one hit his head off the edge off a radiator. I was in the kitchen cooking their dinner. I turned the lot off and drove him straight to hospital. Children, no matter what the age, you cannot be around them 100% of the time. I've often left them watching little einsteins or something at that little girls age, while I cooked and blended their dinner. I did that often through postnatal depression. While you love your children, sometimes you don't feel yourself, and lack of sleep is a killer. It may also take some time for you to notice you're not coping well, because you're so hard on yourself. We all know nothing here really.

Cienciano

BarnhallBull wrote: »

Yes, why?

Ghandee wrote: »

Whoa, whoa whoa Buddie.

You've kids i presume?

BarnhallBull wrote: »

Yes, why?

Out of interest, how old are your kids?

chatterpillar wrote: »

How does that make the slightest bit of difference?

He wouldn't be entitled to an opinion, if he wasn't a parent himself?

Of course everyones entitled to give an opinion, but I'm guessing the reason Ghandee asked if he had kids, or even minding a child at least once for an entire day will shut the "never ever let a child out of your sight for a second" brigade.

Jesus Shaves

jessiejam wrote: »

I wonder if that poor little mite had died in a fire in the appartment, where there were locked windows (which are illegal in upstairs bedrooms btw) would the blame brigade still be out in force, saying that the windows shouldn't have been locked etc?

Not illegal if a key is available to open them

Bruthal

hoochis wrote: »

Of course they are not perfect. They are probably not stupid either though.

Well, no shortage of the flawless on boards anyway. They always come out in threads like this one.

themandan6611

if my little baby fell and died I won't be on the front page of the evening herald the next day

jessiejam

Jesus Shaves wrote: »

Not illegal if a key is available to open them

Not true.
Lockable windows are never installed on 2/3 storey houses. That doesn't stop people buying lockable handles and installing them. But original houses never have key lockable windows upstairs. Its fire safety regulations.

Jesus Shaves

jessiejam wrote: »

Not true.
Lockable windows are never installed on 2/3 storey houses. That doesn't stop people buying lockable handles and installing them. But original houses never have key lockable windows upstairs. Its fire safety regulations.

There are safety locks that you can buy which are not illegal to install, anyway that is not the point, a window was left open and a child was left alone in that room.
I really don't understand why people are making excuses for that

hoochis

robbie7730 wrote: »

Well, no shortage of the flawless on boards anyway. They always come out in threads like this one.

And no shortage of the far from flawless either!

hoochis

I think there is far too much sympathy given to the carers of children in cases like these. It is very sad but my sadness would be felt for the innocent child and not the careless people that are responsible for the death.

Jesus Shaves

hoochis wrote: »

I think there is far too much sympathy given to the carers of children in cases like these. It is very sad but my sadness would be felt for the innocent child and not the careless people that are responsible for the death.

Exactly

Bruthal

hoochis wrote: »

And no shortage of the far from flawless either!

Everyone is far from it. Except jesus.

leggo

mydearwatson wrote: »

leggo wrote: »

Stopped reading when you shrugged off the damage that losing a child can do. Her life is destroyed, end of story.

Oh wait...sorry, you read a story about it in a tabloid?? Well excuse me then, you're clearly well informed enough in making a perfectly reasonable judgement so...

Well the story was based on discussions with the mother (and they could hardly fake that, seeing as they had a photo of the mother.) According to the article, the mother was babysitting someone else's child, came into the bedroom, looked around it for the child (who was called Nicola), eventually thought to look out the window, and saw her baby on the ground. She had left the window open.

I sure as hell don't trust tabloids, but to be fair, if they were talking to the mother, I'm sure they at least have the general gist of it correct. I'm sure the full facts will come out in time.

They probably won't. For all we know, there could be something sinister here, or anything. You're just taking a tabloid newspaper's interpretation of a story from a grieving mother. Now if this was celeb gossip...treating that kind of flimsy sourcing as fact for the sake if conversation is fine, but this is a horrible situation with only sadness for everyone involved. So to cast judgements based on that is massively rash.

There's a quote that comes to mind, I think it was from the Skeptoid podcast, saying that for all the people who say "Don't believe what you read in the papers," a massive amount of that number still will.

We, in truth, know nothing about this except that a child has died. Can we not just leave it at RIP and save the witch hunt for another story?