Migrant workers demand new residency scheme

IrishAm

steel header wrote: »

As for those at home saying deport the US Irish that are living illegally here...where have you ever been? ******* mommy's boys.

Lived in the US legally. Why should they not be deported? Quite hard now to gain a green card, but during the 80s and 90s it was easy enough. The Irish who are illegally there didn't bother their hole going through the correct channels.

Deport them.

alastair wrote: »

That would be a 'yes' then?

It would. We are a small rock. Quite easy to police our borders, with the political will.

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

It would. We are a small rock. Quite easy to police our borders, with the political will.

'with massive increase in manpower and significant changes in our laws'.

I guess that's why there's no drugs coming into Ireland.

hooradiation

IrishAm wrote: »

Of course we can. Create an All Ireland immigration force, implement legislation that gives labour inspectors more power and jail employers whom hire illegals.

Guess what kid, there is a point where the money you're spending on this far outweighs any kind of savings you making and just leads to increased hassle for those playing by the rules.
Well done, you're special taskforce achieves fuck all, costs a fuck load and we'd still have illegal immigrants.

IrishAm wrote: »

Badly needed as is. It would clamp down on welfare abuse and numerous other things, too. Mostly by Irish citizens.

But it seems most people don't seem to want it, can't have it both ways.

IrishAm wrote: »

So?

Really, you see no possible problems with your fantastical "All Ireland Immigration force" and racial profiling?
Leaving out just how shitty it is in and of itself, you can't see a possible downside in targeting people based on the colour of their skin?

Come on, try really hard for a second.
I know you can do this.

IrishAm

alastair wrote: »

'with massive increase in manpower and significant changes in our laws'.

I guess that's why there's no drugs coming into Ireland.

People are easier to detect than drugs.

What has this to do with the topic on hand?

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

People are easier to detect than drugs.

What has this to do with the topic on hand?

It's patently ridiculous to propose that we could stop illegal immigrantion through your army of immigrant police and new laws. That's the point.

IrishAm

alastair wrote: »

It's patently ridiculous to propose that we could stop illegal immigrantion through your army of immigrant police and new laws. That's the point.

The Greeks caught 6,000 in one weekend. Its quite easy really. Extremely easy, in fact.

All thats needed is the political will to do it.

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

The Greeks caught 6,000 in one weekend. Its quite easy really. Extremely easy, in fact.

All thats needed is the political will to do it.

So - that's the end of illegal immigrants in Greece, and no more will get in?

Easy!

Oh wait...

Up to 100,000 illegal immigrants are estimated to enter Greece every year

http://www.euractiv.com/migrations/greece-cracks-illegal-immigrants-news-514241

IrishAm

alastair wrote: »

So - that's the end of illegal immigrants in Greece, and no more will get in?

Easy!

Oh wait...


http://www.euractiv.com/migrations/greece-cracks-illegal-immigrants-news-514241

The Greeks should build a wall on the border and man it with machine guns.

Crack down on illegals and treat them like criminals. The rest will self deport.

Problem solved.

Guess what kid, there is a point where the money you're spending on this far outweighs any kind of savings you making and just leads to increased hassle for those playing by the rules.
Well done, you're special taskforce achieves **** all, costs a **** load and we'd still have illegal immigrants.

So, we should only stop criminals if it is economically viable?

But it seems most people don't seem to want it, can't have it both ways.

Most people on boards. Hardly a fair sample of the population. The majority of people don't like paying taxes. Tough shit.

Really, you see no possible problems with your fantastical "All Ireland Immigration force" and racial profiling?
Leaving out just how ****ty it is in and of itself, you can't see a possible downside in targeting people based on the colour of their skin?

Come on, try really hard for a second.
I know you can do this.

Not when it comes to targeting illegals. Heres a hint, the majority aint european or of european descent.

Or do you think racial profiling should be banned?

steel header

alastair wrote: »

So - that's the end of illegal immigrants in Greece, and no more will get in?

Easy!

Oh wait...


http://www.euractiv.com/migrations/greece-cracks-illegal-immigrants-news-514241

This ***** wants his own people deported ffs..

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

The Greeks should build a wall on the border and man it with machine guns.

Crack down on illegals and treat them like criminals. The rest will self deport.

Problem solved.

As long as you're not engaging in hypoerbole. :rolleyes:

IrishAm

steel header wrote: »

This ***** wants his own people deported ffs..

I am not a hypocrite.

I don't want to see the illegal Irish in America in deported. I actually am acquaintances with a few. On a human level I would feel pity for them. But, truth be told, they should have went through the correct channels.

When entering another country, you play by their rules.

Are you an illegal in America?

IrishAm

alastair wrote: »

As long as you're not engaging in hypoerbole. :rolleyes:

Open border loons talk about "fortress europe." We should start making that phrase a reality.

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

Open border loons talk about "fortress europe." We should start making that phrase a reality.

Best of luck with that (loonery).

IrishAm

alastair wrote: »

Best of luck with that (loonery).

Do you believe Europe's present immigration procedures shall continue and continue?

There's a Golden Dawn arising, bud. T'is a beautiful thing.:cool:

hooradiation

IrishAm wrote: »

The Greeks should build a wall on the border and man it with machine guns.

Crack down on illegals and treat them like criminals. The rest will self deport.

Problem solved.

No. Not in the slightest.
Though it is ample proof of the maxim that for every complex problem there is an answer that is clear, simple, and wrong.


Also, I'm curious what you're going to do with these machine guns on the border walls. Well not really curious, but wondering if you're really that amazingly sheltered from what your own words actually mean.

IrishAm wrote: »

So, we should only stop criminals if it is economically viable?

We pretty much do this already, it's why, for example, suppliers and distributors of drugs are targeted over sellers.
Also, this is really a more complex issue than simple illegality, despite your constant refrain to the contrary.

I understand that hard-line fantasies like yours rely on ignoring complexities and indeed reality itself, but don't expect others to share your willingness to do so.

IrishAm wrote: »

Most people on boards. Hardly a fair sample of the population.

Prehaps not, but I'm willing to bet you'd find this trend plays out into the wider population.

IrishAm wrote: »

Not when it comes to targeting illegals. Heres a hint, the majority aint european or of european descent.

If you target people based on their skin colour, you're going to miss people on that basis and waste time on people that have done nothing wrong.
For your imaginary immigration force to do half as well as you think it will, they'll need to apply a little bit more thinking then "get the darkies".

Shocking, I know, but then again I'm beginning to suspect that you've not put anything approaching a thought into this.

IrishAm wrote: »

Or do you think racial profiling should be banned?

Pretty much, it's a worthless endeavour.

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

There's a Golden Dawn arising, bud. T'is a beautiful thing.:cool:

Heh. People are wise to your 'Golden Dawn', bud. You'll be waiting.

IrishAm

alastair wrote: »

Heh. People are wise to your 'Golden Dawn', bud. You'll be waiting.

In the long grass, bud. In the long grass.

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

In the long grass, bud. In the long grass.

Yawn.

fasttalkerchat

IrishAm wrote: »

Europe is the most resource poor continent on the planet. Africa the opposite.

Make of that what you will.

By current measurements Africa is resource rich but historically this was not the case. Gold and oil are something that are captured for long term gain. Food and water are basic nutrients of little value to anyone beyond the countries' borders.

hooradiation

IrishAm wrote: »

In the long grass, bud. In the long grass.

What do wild Pokémon have to do with this?
You leave them alone.

Nodin

IrishAm wrote: »

The Greeks should build a wall on the border and man it with machine guns.

...........

Ja! Ja! Ja!

steel header

IrishAm wrote: »

I am not a hypocrite.

I don't want to see the illegal Irish in America in deported. I actually am acquaintances with a few. On a human level I would feel pity for them. But, truth be told, they should have went through the correct channels.

When entering another country, you play by their rules.

Are you an illegal in America?

Not anymore, but I used to be. I understand the need to control immigration. What I have a problem with, is the type of people this issue attracts. They tend to be loser's in general who see an immigrant as less than. So they bash on them to give their own miserable lives a sense of meaning. Now they have a cause and this usually goes under the guise of patriotism. You don't need any special education or qualifications so they come out of wood. Usually during hard economic times. I see it here in the US. "blame the Mexicians"

IrishAm

steel header wrote: »

You don't need any special education or qualifications so they come out of wood. Usually during hard economic times. I see it here in the US. "blame the Mexicians"

I found the opposite. Americans tend to get p*ssed at all illegals, not just the Mexicans.

Illegal immigration is not a racial issue in America. They welcome legal immigrants of all nationalities.

EDIT: I see Nodin is learning German. Good lad.

hooradiation

steel header wrote: »

Usually during hard economic times. I see it here in the US. "blame the Mexicians"

Best thing about that rampant stupidity? Arizona, Alabama, Georgia and a few others passed the kind of racial profiling based immigration laws that has IrishAM tenting like teenager.

That.... kinda didn't work out too well for them.

It's almost like you have to think this shit through before doing something stupid.

Amazing, I know.
But apparently this lesson didn't implant itself in several minds here when they were younger, and it's causing no end of problems now.

steel header

IrishAm wrote: »

I found the opposite. Americans tend to get p*ssed at all illegals, not just the Mexicans.

Illegal immigration is not a racial issue in America. They welcome legal immigrants of all nationalities.

EDIT: I see Nodin is learning German. Good lad.

Where did you find this?

NYC does not allow it's immigrants to be harassed by immigration authorities legal or not, because without them the city stops period....**** holes like Arizona is what your referring to.

IrishAm

steel header wrote: »

Where did you find this?

General discussions with people across the country.

How did you legalise your situation? Marry a yank?

Crann na Beatha

This post has been deleted.

steel header

There was an amnesty at the beginning of the 90'. Most of us who applied got it.

IrishAm

Aquila wrote: »

IrishAm do you agree that immigration has positive benefits to this country?

Yeah. Once its from Europe or east asia.

tigger123

IrishAm wrote: »

Yeah. Once its from Europe or east asia.

What benefits does immigration from Europe or East Asia bring specifically? As opposed to immigration from any other part of the world?

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

Yeah. Once its from Europe or east asia.

It's 'not a racial issue' though. :rolleyes:

hooradiation

alastair wrote: »

It's 'not a racial issue' though. :rolleyes:

He just doesn't like Americans, is all.

IrishAm

tigger123 wrote: »

What benefits does immigration from Europe or East Asia bring specifically? As opposed to immigration from any other part of the world?

I could type up a ten paragraph response but I shall simplify it a bit.

Look at European countries and countries who are populated by those of european descent. Look to east Asia.

Compare and contrast to the rest of the globe.

alastair

IrishAm wrote: »

I could type up a ten paragraph response but I shall simplify it a bit.

Look at European countries and countries who are populated by those of european descent. Look to east Asia.

Compare and contrast to the rest of the globe.

You're right - He doesn't like Americans.

Hilly Bill

hooradiation wrote: »

Because it's an amazingly simplistic outlook.
It seems to imagine a world where both perfect border controls are possible. And paradoxically that it's preferable to maintain what is effectively a shadow labour market.

Given that we can neither stop illegal immigration from occurring nor can we "clamp down" in the manner people would like, at least not without massive increase in manpower and significant changes in our laws. We'd effectively need some kind of national ID system - something we don't seem to care for if another recent thread on here is anything to go by.
And there's the problems of racial profiling that comes with that kind of system but I digress.

Anyway given the above instead of simply ignoring the problem, save for the usual suspects bemoaning phenomenons they don't understand, it makes more sense both financially and practically to offer a method for long term illegal immigrants to 'go legit'.
By offering a method of gaining residency (and residency is not citizenship, lest you forget) we can have these people pay taxes (a minor win for the state) and by making them not fear the authorities making it possible to remove the leverage less than scrupulous types would have over them (a win for everyone, pretty much).

It's the most rational solution, regardless of how much of the above you'll attempt to bat away with yet another trite and worthless soundbite.




Well, of course you do.
Heaven forbid that people actually disagree with your poorly reasoned opinion. That's impossible so they clearly must be "spoofing".

*slow clap*

SPOOF.

Hilly Bill

alastair wrote: »

So - that's the end of illegal immigrants in Greece, and no more will get in?

Easy!

Oh wait...


http://www.euractiv.com/migrations/greece-cracks-illegal-immigrants-news-514241

This country is only a small Island so it shouldnt be that hard to cut down on illegals.

driver02

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Basically they want anyone who has got away with living here illegally for five years to be given the right to stay. Its stupid.

we cant afford to that at this stage in fact they got a very easy ride comming in here in the first place as against other countries.

alastair

Hilly Bill wrote: »

This country is only a small Island so it shouldnt be that hard to cut down on illegals.

An Island you say? Well I never.

http://www.isleofman.com/businessandfinance/news.aspx?article=255

steel header

alastair wrote: »

An Island you say? Well I never.

http://www.isleofman.com/businessandfinance/news.aspx?article=255

I'm sure they got their own blowhards on the case!

hooradiation

Hilly Bill wrote: »

SPOOF.

Yeah, truth be told, I wasn't expecting much by way of a reasoned response.
And I was right.

See now why I had no real enthusiasm in engaging you?
No, I suppose not. But at least it's an ample demonstration why, on this topic at least, you are not to be bothered with.

Hilly Bill

alastair wrote: »

An Island you say? Well I never.

http://www.isleofman.com/businessandfinance/news.aspx?article=255

Yep, send them home as well. You will be complaining that the Isle of Man is sexist next .

Hilly Bill

hooradiation wrote: »

Yeah, truth be told, I wasn't expecting much by way of a reasoned response.
And I was right.

See now why I had no real enthusiasm in engaging you?
No, I suppose not. But at least it's an ample demonstration why, on this topic at least, you are not to be bothered with.

Basically its because ive a different opinion on it .

I couldnt give a monkey's if you engaged or not, you are still a spoofer

You try and put people down just because they dare to disagree with you.
SPOOF.

alastair

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Yep, send them home as well.

I think you're missing the point. The Isle of Man is a pretty small spot, with a small population, and highly restricted access points - and even they can't keep illegal immigrants out. You're simply wrong when you state we could do better.

alastair

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Basically its because ive a different opinion on it .

I couldnt give a monkey's if you engaged or not, you are still a spoofer

You try and put people down just because they dare to disagree with you.
SPOOF.

A modicum of a reasoned position might help you. But you've opted not to go that route.

Ah well.

hooradiation

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Basically its because ive a different opinion on it .

I couldnt give a monkey's if you engaged or not, you are still a spoofer

You try and put people down just because they dare to disagree with you.
SPOOF.

You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

Hilly Bill

alastair wrote: »

I think you're missing the point. The Isle of Man is a pretty small spot, with a small population, and highly restricted access points - and even they can't keep illegal immigrants out. You're simply wrong when you state we could do better.

Are you for real? Of course we could do better until the problem goes away.

Hilly Bill

hooradiation wrote: »

You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means.

You think?

Hilly Bill

alastair wrote: »

A modicum of a reasoned position might help you. But you've opted not to go that route.

Ah well.

pot kettle black etc .

alastair

Hilly Bill wrote: »

Are you for real? Of course we could do better until the problem goes away.

Which it won't.

alastair

Hilly Bill wrote: »

pot kettle black etc .

Compelling. :rolleyes: