Irelands road deaths

NIMAN

I have noticed that nearly all of the recent road deaths in the country are 'single' vehicle incidents.

Are these tragedies all down to poor driving? Excessive speed? Alcohol?

delta_bravo

All three sometimes

Voltex

Bit of a downer this thread

Solair

To be honest, I think the media needs to stop reporting drunk driving / crazy driving incidents as 'accidents'.

The correct phrasing is "X was killed in a reckless driving incident"
or "Y was killed in a Drunk driving / drug driving incident"

The whole use of the term 'accident' is inappropriate as it implies that it was just some kind of tragic error.

Wacker The Attacker

NIMAN wrote: »

I have noticed that nearly all of the recent road deaths in the country are 'single' vehicle incidents.

Are these tragedies all down to poor driving? Excessive speed? Alcohol?

Ignorance, poor driving and poor decision making

NIMAN

May be a bit of a downer, but surely its something we need to be concerned about?

Did news reports in the past not mention the word 'single', as I don't remember it? Maybe it did. Or are we seeing more 'single' car crashes?

I think a deterrent would be to have Gatso vans in random places, not announcing where they are going to be. This is plain stupid imho.

delta_bravo

Completely agree with solair. while it may be tough to say a person caused death through their actions it means people don't look objectively at how deaths are caused and can be prevented

Mr Benevolent

Alcohol, speed, poor surfaces and suicide.

kerry4sam

NIMAN wrote: »

I have noticed that nearly all of the recent road deaths in the country are 'single' vehicle incidents.

Are these tragedies all down to poor driving? Excessive speed? Alcohol?

Any number of factors, the above would be some yeah. It could also be fatigue or any health issue where the driver looses focus for even a split second. In a number of cases, we never know the reason as the unfortunate driver would have lost their battle to live.

It is tragic when people loose their lives on these roads. I am not sure that the campaigns by RSA are all that effective either, but at least they are doing something!

amacca

NIMAN wrote: »

May be a bit of a downer, but surely its something we need to be concerned about?

Did news reports in the past not mention the word 'single', as I don't remember it? Maybe it did. Or are we seeing more 'single' car crashes?

totally without any sort of proof

but I often wonder if some of the single vehicle, single driver ones are in fact suicides rather than accidents

Hardonraging

Just keep her between the ditches and we'll all be grand, seriously like, it's not that hard, it's the big green things either side of ye ..

marshbaboon

amacca wrote: »

totally without any sort of proof

but I often wonder if some of the single vehicle, single driver ones are in fact suicides rather than accidents

Doubtful. Killing yourself is difficult & unreliable enough without resorting to gambling on a car crash.

Shryke

Solair wrote: »

To be honest, I think the media needs to stop reporting drunk driving / crazy driving incidents as 'accidents'.

The correct phrasing was "X was killed in a reckless driving incident"
or "Y was killed in a Drunk driving / drug driving incident"

The whole use of the term 'accident' is inappropriate as it implies that it was just some kind of tragic error.

There's a scene in Hot Fuzz where Simon Pegg tells his partner not to call them accidents but collisions as accident implies it was nobodies fault. I would assume that The Met probably do have such guidelines.

amacca

marshbaboon wrote: »

Doubtful. Killing yourself is difficult & unreliable enough without resorting to gambling on a car crash.

yeah normally I'd agree with you.......but the details of one or two I know about defy explanation as simply an "accident"....crash details + drivers personal situation


of course it could still simply have been an accident, its sort of something that can never be proven I suppose

JohnMarston

Careless, fatigue, alcohol, using your mobile phone, you name it

marshbaboon

amacca wrote: »

yeah normally I'd agree with you.......but the details of one or two I know about defy explanation as simply an "accident"....crash details + drivers personal situation


of course it could still simply have been an accident, its sort of something that can never be proven I suppose

Only takes a minor lapse in concentration to have a crash. Cars aren't as safe as we like to believe.

I'm sure there are some suicides this way, but the numbers would be incredibly low. Even if they were planning it, it would be unusual to not leave a note to explain the action... unless they were attempting to make it look like an accident, which wouldn't match typical suicidal behaviour.

fasttalkerchat

Hardonraging wrote: »

Just keep her between the ditches and we'll all be grand, seriously like, it's not that hard, it's the big green things either side of ye ..

That's all well and good but on the way home from the pub the ditches move of their own accord.

robman60

marshbaboon wrote: »

Doubtful. Killing yourself is difficult & unreliable enough without resorting to gambling on a car crash.

You're forgetting that anyone who attempts suicide this way does it so people will interpret it as an accident rather than a deliberate act. The method isn't chosen for effectiveness, but to prevent the terrible mental health stigma surrounding their death.

It's terribly sad, but true in an unknown number of cases.

Rippy

marshbaboon wrote: »

Doubtful. Killing yourself is difficult & unreliable enough without resorting to gambling on a car crash.

Many suicidal people would be worried about the devastating effects of their actions on their families and loved ones. They feel an 'accidental' death would be the best option. Also, to the best of my knowledge, life insurance (especially on mortgages) will not pay out for an obvious suicide.

zenno

yeah, i'm sure there are some suicides because of the hardship on a lot of folks but i have seen so many near misses from people using their phones while driving.
I was almost run into head on a while back on the forest road in swords as a stupid person was on their phone and veered onto my lane and he only managed to violently swerve back onto his lane while almost mounting the pedestrian path.

kincsem

Falling asleep is another major factor.
Lack of sleep plus alcohol is five times more dangerous than alcohol alone.

Jimoslimos

Solair wrote: »

To be honest, I think the media needs to stop reporting drunk driving / crazy driving incidents as 'accidents'.

The correct phrasing was "X was killed in a reckless driving incident"
or "Y was killed in a Drunk driving / drug driving incident"

The whole use of the term 'accident' is inappropriate as it implies that it was just some kind of tragic error.

And given that the full circumstances of the crash would unlikely have been investigated by the time the media report on it, would it not be a bit presumptuous to call it a drunk driving / drug driving incident?

Especially if there is any risk of legal proceedings following on from any investigation.

Brian_Zeluz

The sex and age of the occupants as well as the make and model of the car generally tell you all you need to know. For instance: male, 20s, Honda, civic, sound familiar? I would say a large amount of these types of collisions are down to "racing".

mathepac

Brian_Zeluz wrote: »

... I would say a large amount of these types of collisions are down to "racing".

Why would you say that? Do you have evidence?

There was an investigation initiated (by the HSE?) a couple of years ago into the increasing number of male deaths in single vehicle driver-only RTIs. Having ruled out alcohol, drugs, racing, mechanical defects, etc as possible contributory or common factors, the suspicion at the time centred on suicide.

bleepp

amacca wrote: »

but I often wonder if some of the single vehicle, single driver ones are in fact suicides rather than accidents

It's often believed that suicide car crashes are far more prevalent in society than one would think. I remember hearing a County Coroner on the Frontline on RTE saying that many single vehicle car crashes involving young males are often believed to be suicides but of course this can't be officially recorded as there needs to be some sort of proof such as a note etc. This then leads them to be classified as "accidents".
It's a very sad issue to be talking about

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_methods#Traffic_collisions

ahnowbrowncow

I don't mind hearing about single car crashes as much as I do a multiple car crash because there is nothing worse than hearing about some morons driving while pissed and they end up crashing into some unlucky individual or family who just happened to be on the same road as these idiots

Brian_Zeluz

mathepac wrote: »

Brian_Zeluz wrote: »

... I would say a large amount of these types of collisions are down to "racing".

Why would you say that? Do you have evidence?

There was an investigation initiated (by the HSE?) a couple of years ago into the increasing number of male deaths in single vehicle driver-only RTIs. Having ruled out alcohol, drugs, racing, mechanical defects, etc as possible contributory or common factors, the suspicion at the time centred on suicide.

I have second hand knowledge that the most recent crash of the type that I described was down to racing however my stating that a large amount of these types of collisions as described in my previous post is an opinion, based on the way I have seen most men my age drive. Unfortunately we can never truly know the full story as you can't ask a dead person why they're dead and so all we have are suspicions like you said which are no more than well informed opinions not evidence.

hiram

NIMAN wrote: »

I have noticed that nearly all of the recent road deaths in the country are 'single' vehicle incidents.

Are these tragedies all down to poor driving? Excessive speed? Alcohol?

Suicide. The elephant in the A and E.

pontia

its like calling the crash in donegal where 8 died an accident,it was a hit and run,they hit a car and kept going before crashing themselves and killing a pensioner in process.the usual parish priest guff ect.inquest disappeared.dont know why we glorify this type of thing

mickydoomsux

It annoys me greatly when a young lad/group of young lads wrap themselves around a pole at 3 in the morning in their riced-up Starlet and it is described in the media as a "tragedy".

It not tragic, it's idiotic and pretty much a prime example of natural selection at work.

GTDolanator

Does anybody notice why pretty much all these accidents you hear of are down the country.....You just dont hear of this kinda thing happening in the citys

MagicSean

Shryke wrote: »

There's a scene in Hot Fuzz where Simon Pegg tells his partner not to call them accidents but collisions as accident implies it was nobodies fault. I would assume that The Met probably do have such guidelines.

Hospitals are removing the word accident from accident and emergency rooms too.

stephendevlin

Hardonraging wrote: »

Just keep her between the ditches and we'll all be grand, seriously like, it's not that hard, it's the big green things either side of ye ..

What about the nicely positioned poles all the way up the road, so if you did loose control the would slow you down safely ... right?

rainbowtrout

mickydoomsux wrote: »

It annoys me greatly when a young lad/group of young lads wrap themselves around a pole at 3 in the morning in their riced-up Starlet and it is described in the media as a "tragedy".

It not tragic, it's idiotic and pretty much a prime example of natural selection at work.

It also annoys me when I hear people make assumptions about a crash without knowing the full facts. The lad that died in last night's crash was a passenger. I'm sure his parents will take lots of comfort from knowing that natural selection (according to you) is the reason their son is dead this morning.

rainbowtrout

GTDolanator wrote: »

Does anybody notice why pretty much all these accidents you hear of are down the country.....You just dont hear of this kinda thing happening in the citys

Speed/dangerous driving is certainly a factor in some road crashes. Cities are built up, lots of traffic, traffic lights etc. Far harder to get long stretches of road with little traffic where speed can be built up to a point where a crash will be fatal.

pontia

if people had taken drink/drugs before crashing its self inflicted and they broke the law,also jamming 8 people into a car is asking for trouble.its not a tragic loss,its stupidity.driver should be jailed if still alive

RaRaRasputin

I don't care about people who cause their own death by driving in intoxicated, greatly fatigued or just reckless conditions. It just pisses me off when you hear about others being dragged into the whole situation because a stupid driver drove into their car.

At one stage you will always hear some people even defending drunk driving by recalling "the past" when it was legal and accepted to drive home after having been to the pub. That's something I really don't get..

polominted

Lots must be put down to fatigue.Woke up myself after side-swiping crash barrier on Fermoy by-pass last year.Luck little traffic on road.Wife got a stiff neck - - - we could have both been stiff all over forever.

Son Of A Vidic

marshbaboon wrote: »

Doubtful. Killing yourself is difficult & unreliable enough without resorting to gambling on a car crash.

Gambling? There's nothing difficult or unreliable about deliberately hitting a tree or wall at 70mph +. You certainly won't be waking up after it.

NIMAN

Another single vehicle death since this thread started last night

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0819/17-year-old-male-dies-in-co-roscommon-crash.html

rainbowtrout

NIMAN wrote: »

Another single vehicle death since this thread started last night

http://www.rte.ie/news/2012/0819/17-year-old-male-dies-in-co-roscommon-crash.html

This was the crash I was referring to in earlier posts.

mikemac1

Tiredness is a huge factor

People are working all sorts of crazy shifts, I spent years on 3 cycle or 4 cycle or nights myself

After a day in college and then travel 2 hours home, then pull a 12 hour shift of hard physical work like barwork and hotel porter work, realy you are in no fit state to drive at 8am the next morning

mitosis

Seatbelts.

Acting the arse.

In some of the USA, for example, you (unaccompanied by an over 25 year old licence holder) may not carry a passenger in their teens for a year after you pass your test, and may not drive between midnight and 0500. Stick five 17 year olds in a car late at night and expect them not to be horsing around?

jetfiremuck

The medications that people are on for back pain depression etc combined with stress from work,family does take a toll on alertness and oordination. The newer cars though smaller leave very little margin in the event of a rollover or headon. The car may survive somewhat intact however the forces are transferred to the occupants.

Look up you tube on the smart car test against a concrete barrier

rainbowtrout

mitosis wrote: »

Seatbelts.

Acting the arse.

In some of the USA, for example, you (unaccompanied by an over 25 year old licence holder) may not carry a passenger in their teens for a year after you pass your test, and may not drive between midnight and 0500. Stick five 17 year olds in a car late at night and expect them not to be horsing around?

Maybe if you knew the five lads in question, or knew the stretch of road they crashed on last night ( a place where there have been a lot of accidents) you mightn't be so quick to judge.

marshbaboon

Corvus Maximus wrote: »

Gambling? There's nothing difficult or unreliable about deliberately hitting a tree or wall at 70mph +. You certainly won't be waking up after it.

Can I borrow your car?

amacca

amacca wrote: »

totally without any sort of proof

but I often wonder if some of the single vehicle, single driver ones are in fact suicides rather than accidents

I would suspect that some of these are suicides, simply because the drivers are often local so should know the road and what would be a safe speed to drive on this section of road.

Solair

And given that the full circumstances of the crash would unlikely have been investigated by the time the media report on it, would it not be a bit presumptuous to call it a drunk driving / drug driving incident?

Especially if there is any risk of legal proceedings following on from any investigation.

Then call it "an incident"
saying it's am accident is equally presumptuous.

I find that media outlets still call these incidents accidents even if the cause we're established legally.

Wanderer2010

A huge amount of them are careless young men risking their lives to overtake a car and then SPLAT, they are killed stone dead. Why oh why oh why are people in such a rush on the roads these days? Is there really anything worth risking your life for just to save a few seconds? I see it all the time on the roads, people who are in a mad rush and overtake you only to see them a few seconds down the road, having not gained anything, WHATS THE BIG RUSH? If most of these people just took their time and used the roads as they were intended there wouldnt be half as many deaths on the road, but no....everything has to be now now now. :rolleyes:

Mikros

Driver suicides are very much the minority of single vehicle collisions. All the research both national and international would tend to support that. No doubt that it does happen and it is possibly under reported but they still only make up a tiny fraction of road deaths. (one research example: http://www.monash.edu.au/miri/research/reports/muarc216.pdf)

Most single vehicle collisions occur on rural roads where the roadside is very unforgiving - trees, telegraph poles, ditches, fences etc. There are no crash barriers or hard shoulders. Drivers leave the road for a number of reasons - they were drunk, speeding, distracted, on the phone, tired, on medication, bald tyres on wet roads or simply misjudged a corner because they are only driving a few months. Accidents will always happen, but many of the factors involved are under the individuals control.

The expanded motorway/dual carriage way system reduced the number of multi-vehicle collisions which were usually head on collision. The proportion of single vehicles collisions has increased as a result. However all fatal collisions have been reducing in recent years because of better driver behaviour, especially the change in drink driving.

For whatever reason the suicide theory is far more popular with people than the cold fact that the factors that cause a collision are things we all probably have done at some stage. Safer roads for the most part are under the control of each driver.

minidazzler

NIMAN wrote: »

I have noticed that nearly all of the recent road deaths in the country are 'single' vehicle incidents.

Are these tragedies all down to poor driving? Excessive speed? Alcohol?

Of course the thing you are not mentioning for fear of back lash, which is probably a huge cause of single vehicle crashes, Suicide. But it's never recorded as such because Life insurance doesn't pay out then.