Hunting/working dogs living arrangements

ISDW

Following on from another thread that is now closed (apologies mods if this is inappropriate, please delete if it is) an assertion was made that hunting dogs have to live outside in kennels, that they cant live in the house. Has this got any scientific fact behind it? Does it have an impact on how well they work? I'd appreciate if this didnt turn into a pro or anti hunting debate, so maybe widen it to include all working dogs.

homerhop

This debate was had over in the hunting section a while back, my take on it is that is not the case. My springer is in the house and treated worse than a child. He is fussed over to the degree that often leaves me shaking my head as I look on. Yet as soon as he sees the whistle around my neck it is as if a switch has been turned on, he is at the door waiting and shaking with excitment. A dog will either have it or they wont, just as people will have a talent or not. It is hard wired in their genes.

cocker5

I have a cocker spaniel, is extremely driven by scent and birds (we believe he is part field cocker), and is a good bit taller than your average cocker and he lives in the house with us, sleeps in the kitchen and is very much part of the family. he does require alot of exercise but he thrives on it, as do we, he is a wonderful dog, and we enjoy life with him and he being very much part of the family.

for me i just dont see the point in having a dog and having them sleep outside, and not treated as one in the family or in a pen down the end of a garden etc, whats the point al all? Just my opinion.

carav10

There are longtime experienced working dog handlers (hunting/ search etc) who say you can make a pet out of a working dog, but not a working dog out of a pet. Science behind this? I'm not too sure. And the exact reasons I'm not too sure.

My understanding is, a working dog is not considered to be a pet but a working dog, i.e. it has a purpose and a job to do. Everything else is considered to be distraction. This is not to say that the dog is excluded from all things human life and before some people jump to conclusions (oh this is cruelty not to be made part of the family in the house!) , not the case at all.

But in order to make a working dog out of a dog, then everyday living tasks from the time it comes into a household are done with the view that the dog will be a working dog. Every single interaction, every action, every bit of 'chat', every bit of obedience training, you have to ask yourself, will this contradict the kind of training I'm trying to do and cause a problem further down the line. Maybe some handlers are under the impression that having a dog integrated fully into a household especially at the early age can cause problems and confusion from the training perspective later on.

I'm not sure some pet owners realise the difference in training a working dog, and think it's all the same, having a dog for some people is about the love of training dogs and then the job that dog is being trained to do (& the reward they get for doing it!) whether it's hunting, finding people etc. Most working dogs love what they're doing, it's definitely not something they'll do if they're not 'switched into' it. About the whole live in/live out, it probably depends on your individual setup and then striking the balance that's good for the dog.

I'll be curious to see the answers that come back from experienced working dog people if there are some on this forum.

PS. There's probably also the muck into the house factor especially if someone has a number of hunting dogs!!

ISDW

I have working dogs, and they all live in the house, at the moment there are 13 dogs here, not all of them are workers though. Yep, the house is hard to keep clean, but thats my choice, they (some of them, they wouldn't all fit) sleep on my bed, so my bedding probably gets changed more often than non dog owners but again, a choice I'm making.

carav10, I can see your points about the training, I have huskies and they are trained to pull, so I haven't trained them to walk nicely on a lead and collar, maybe if I only had one or two I would, but its not just the time, I like them to pull when they're working, so have to embrace it when we're walking Most people that I know who work their dogs in harness to pull are the same, they don't train to heel as well. Not all, some people show their dogs very successfully and are also successful on the trails, so it can be done.

My dogs get fed in the kennels, just for ease, and are left in there for an hour or more after feeding, and if I'm out for a few hours as well, thats where they go. They accept being in the kennels, but settle quicker in the house. They are also used to sleeping in crates in the van when we travel, we often spend a night or two in forests and they and I sleep in the van, they all jump into the van very happily when we go, as they know it means either a walk or they will be working, and they love to run. They also spend time on a stake out line, and again, seem to accept that. I do try and get all of my dogs used to being in a kennel, in case they have to go into boarding but, as I look at 2 of my dogs fast asleep on my bed at the moment, and the others flaked out around the house, on the furniture or the floor, I can't see that them being in the house has any adverse effect on their working ability, when the harnesses come out, they all get hyper and excited.

TooManyDogs

Have to say I've never come across the idea that working dogs have to be outside, guide dogs and assistance have to be some of the most hard-working working dogs out there and they live inside. My lot are constantly training and competing in agility and the minute they see the agility training toys they switch on, regardless of where they are so I can't see it would make a difference where they slept.
Only thing I could think of is if hunting dogs weren't cleaned and brushed out it might make it unpleasant to have them in the house but that's not an influence on ability to work I wouldn't have thought. I regularily go up the fields with my lot and they all come back an attractive mud colour but I hose them down, towel dry them and lock them in their shed with a heater on for an hour until they are dry and then they come back in the house.

betsie

I think once the dogs are happy and healthy it doesnt matter either way, we have 4 Sheepdogs (1 retired, 1 working, 1 trainee and 1 pet/watchdog!!) they are allowed into the house during the day but are usually outsude around the farm with my dad and they sleep outside at night, this has always worked well for us and our dogs seem very happy and any dog we have had has lived a (very) long and healthy life. There is no 1 size fits all living arrangement, every household is different.

JustAThought

Hmm; interesting question.

Mine is a hunting dog & a total pet ; lives in the house ; spoiled but trained, loves her comforts, very affectionate & loving & full of personality & little idiosyncrasies .

I go to hunting training classes with " proper" hunters & gundog breeders: serious guys. one of the guys dog is a robot machine; knows his name, the commands fetch, no, sit & stay. It wins everything & is an amazing dog.

The others are equally disciplined outdoor working gundogs & are good but not amazing.

One guys dog is afraid of water. Anothers just isn't up to speed . The variations are wide.

Mine is a big softie & the most pampered , but when we go out something primitive triggers in her head & she is all hunter ; with commands/obedience.( mostly: working on that ; raw meat is sometimes hard to leave)

I think it depends on the " luck" of the genes; the master/ dog relationship & discipline & the " drive" of the dog to naturally hunt.

IMO they can still enjoy a dry night & soft bed too.

Private Piles

ISDW wrote: »

I have working dogs, and they all live in the house, at the moment there are 13 dogs here, not all of them are workers though. Yep, the house is hard to keep clean,

Lord Jesus that's mad! How do you cope, are they all really well behaved?

My partner recently got a black lab pup, for shooting, the pup lives in his parents house. I would always get up in my hat when my partner would talk about pedigrees and the importance of good breeding (for hunting dogs), I'd call him a snob, but the pup is only about 3 months old and I swear he is like an old soul, he just seems so 'together', he's not like any pup I've ever come across before. So I definitely agree with the statement that a working dog can be a pet but not the other way around!

This pup sleeps inside with his cuddly toys! My partners father doesn't think that this is a good idea, and thinks that he shouldn't be made in to an 'ejet' as this will ruin his ability to perform. Now by this I only mean he thinks the pup, who has become his best bud, should sleep in the utility room and he shouldn't be spoke to in a baby voice, ie 'whos a wute wittle wuppy, wu are, wu are' .......Guilty

Also, I went with my partner to pick the pup up, the breeder (very reputable) had the mother and a few other hunting dogs there. They were in dog runs, technically the runs were sufficient but all they had were wooden houses with a little blanket on the floor. You could see the breeder did have genuine affection and love for the dogs, but it was more along the lines of somebody caring about their car, they were his pride and joys, but the dogs weren't 'furry family members' if you get me?

We would know a good few people with hunting dogs as well and they are all treated like pets and it hasn't 'ruined' them. As another poster said, it's hard wired into their DNA. So, I would feel very strongly that 'working' dogs should be treated as pets, sleep in doors, and just be part of the family really.