Leap card - refused boarding by bus driver

another9

I was in the situation below and I am wondering if I should look for compensation and what amount it should be.
I put 5 euro on my leap card and when got on the bus the device was not working. The driver "tried" to fix it but it didn't work and he asked me to pay by change. I didn't have enough money and showed him the receipt from the leap card - he said "Don't show me". well...he stated that I either pay or get off the bus. This was also the issue with a friend of mine who also had a leap card. Meanwhile I asked if there is a supervisor or other who I can talk to /or he can call to resolve the issue - the driver said "I don't have a manager. You can call someone if you want". He refused to give us his name too.
At some point he told us that we can pay the flat fare on the other device (2.40 instead of 1.95). The difference for me is not a big deal for one time but my problem was that he refused us service for which I put 5euro on the card.
I received reply from Dublin bus that the driver is identified and received the extra training - that's all.
I believe that the situation above is equal to breach of a contract and I am entitled to compensation. Could someone advise if I am correct in my assumption and if yes - how much is reasonable amount in this case.

Thank you.

Paulw

No, you are not entitled to any compensation.

What contract were Dublin Bus in breach of?

another9

When I paid the amount on the leap card I should have entered into some kind of agreement. I purchased a service. The thing is that it was not directly to Dublin bus but still - they offered the method of payment and initially I was refused to purchase the ticket by this way and no other option was provided - the option was "get off the bus". (I don't count the change as option as I had already put my money for travel on the leap card).

Jarren

What compensation ?

Rabies

I'd look at it like this.

You happen to walk in to Dunnes to do the weekly shop. Get to the check out and process it all. The bill is e100 and you want to pay by credit card, but the lines are all down. No electronic payments accepted. Asked to pay by cash. Don't have cash? Walk away, get some and come back to pick up the shopping.

An alternative method of using the service was offered, that is reasonable.

They are out of pocket, not you.

Looking for compensation is a joke! Crap like that is ruining the world. You might want to live in America.

another9

I do understand your comparison but it's not quite precise - in my case they already took 5 euro and the only purpose of the card is trip with Dublin bus (as there's no Luas to my destination). This is not another "electronic debit card". With Laser, for example, I can pay for other service s / goods. I can't use the leap card for any other way of transport or company, neither can I take my money back.

marcus2000

another9 wrote: »

At some point he told us that we can pay the flat fare on the other device (2.40 instead of 1.95).

Did he not offer to give u a refund to make up the difference?? I had a similar problem before and when I questioned the difference, he gave me a refund of 45c from the ticket machine to compensate.

Six months later, that 45c refund is still in my wallet. I hate those refunds!!

Rabies

Ok, I thought it was like our Snapper card. Can be used for small in store purchases as well as transport.

Still, its only a few Euro and its not like its gone from you. The money is still there. Consider yourself pre topped up for the next journey.
An alternative solution was given.

Anita Blow

I'd tend to agree with the OP.
What's the benefit in having a leap card if you have to carry around change for the bus anyway?

another9

marcus2000 wrote: »

Did he not offer to give u a refund to make up the difference?? I had a similar problem before and when I questioned the difference, he gave me a refund of 45c from the ticket machine to compensate.

Six months later, that 45c refund is still in my wallet. I hate those refunds!!

He didn't offer refund. We (my friend too) had to remind him (twice). The refund is ridiculous system - in order to go to city center to get my 40 cents refund I have to pay 2.40 for ticket. and eventually get out of work (an hour at least!)
My point is about all that happened before paying the flat fare and the way he replied.

another9

Rabies wrote: »

Ok, I thought it was like our Snapper card. Can be used for small in store purchases as well as transport.

Still, its only a few Euro and its not like its gone from you. The money is still there. Consider yourself pre topped up for the next journey.
An alternative solution was given.

So, I had to wait 40 minutes until the next bus and pray that the device there work? If not, get off and wait...wait...until my luck works.

another9

Anita Blow wrote: »

I'd tend to agree with the OP.
What's the benefit in having a leap card if you have to carry around change for the bus anyway?

If I had 5 euro in my pocket and my friend had 5 euro - we could get a taxi. But with that leap cards we couldn't use anything else.

OldNotWIse

"The driver will receive extra training" seems to how Dublin Bus get out of everything. I reported a driver for being verbally abusive and was told, "Oh he'll get extra training" - it's a lot more than extra training he needs :rolleyes:

OldNotWIse

Anita Blow wrote: »

I'd tend to agree with the OP.
What's the benefit in having a leap card if you have to carry around change for the bus anyway?

Agree completely. Buy a leap card. carry around change just in case it doesn't work. Find yourself without change and happen upon a bus with a broken leap card machine and what? Wait for the next one??

OneIdea

I was literately man-handled off a bus once... had my leapCard, paid the fare and was told you cant sit there?

Guards were called and everything... after 10-15minutes of arguing I gave up... "Fu*K-it I said... didn't really want to drive anyway":D

Rabies

Anita Blow wrote: »

I'd tend to agree with the OP.
What's the benefit in having a leap card if you have to carry around change for the bus anyway?

Because technology isn't 100% all of the time. Things break down.

OldNotWIse

Rabies wrote: »

Because technology isn't 100% all of the time. Things break down.

Surely the onus should be on Dublin Bus to make allowances in such circumstances (given that they have elected to have LEAP machines on their buses). I've seen drivers allowing people on free when the coin machine etc is broken.

foggy_lad

Paulw wrote: »

No, you are not entitled to any compensation.

What contract were Dublin Bus in breach of?

It was always the case with Dublin Busthat if the machine was not working you get the journey free but this must have changed in the current financial strife the CIE group of companies find themselves in. some communication on this to customers would be nice but they dont really do communication with passengers.

ArmaniJeanss

I thought there was 'unwritten rule' on DB that if a payment method wasn't working that customers got a freebie.
e.g., if for whatever reason the cash bucket is broken I've seen customers ushered on, ditto if the ticket validator is not working I've heard drivers just tell customers to get on, (which obviously makes no difference to monthly/weekly commuter tickets but those using Travel90s would get a freebie).

Why would Leap be treated differently?

ct5amr2ig1nfhp

I agree - the driver should have just let you on for free.
But compensation? No.
What sort of compensation do you expect???

You informed Dublin Bus - they've said that the driver has had extra training. Hopefully the same driver will be able to handle the situation better next time.

Solair

I've been on Cork City busses recently where the ticket machine was down and they were nine and friendly and just waved me on.

Sounds like the driver was having a bad day.

ironclaw

While I agree with the freebie rule, its sometimes happened to me. It can't really apply to the card unless the machine is broken. Someone could easily damage a card, claim the machine is broken (When it is working fine for others) and then be expected to be waved on. I've never had a problem with the Leap card except being charged the wrong fare (To which you have no comeback) The Leap card should be a flat fare on the bus in my eyes as well.

Either way, an alternative payment was offered and declined. The bus offers two payment methods and it would be unfair to expect them to guarantee 100% uptime on both.

Guy:Incognito

Anita Blow wrote: »

I'd tend to agree with the OP.
What's the benefit in having a leap card if you have to carry around change for the bus anyway?

Because stuff breaks sometimes. I suppose the driver could have just headed back to the depot and not run the bus at all.........

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Surely the onus should be on Dublin Bus to make allowances in such circumstances.

The do, they offer an alternative way to pay.

Seifer

If the ticket scanner on the right isn't working the bus driver will usually just wave people with passes on. So it should've been the same if the driver's leap card reader wasn't working.
Just a bus driver being a bus driver; not much to be done about it except be happy you're not a bus driver.

stehyl15

happened me on the dart but they let me on for free

magicbastarder

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

The do, they offer an alternative way to pay.

this is the rub though; the OP has already paid for the service. using a ticketing system which is often sold as a way of being able to avoid carrying loose change around with you.

Guy:Incognito

magicbastarder wrote: »

this is the rub though; the OP has already paid for the service. using a ticketing system which is often sold as a way of being able to avoid carrying loose change around with you.

He paid for a service to be used at an unspecified time. They didnt take money off him for that trip that they are now keeping. He still has the money to use again.

MagicMarker

Sounds like you got a bit of an asshole driver OP. He should have just let you on under the circumstances.

I had issues with my card when I first got it whereby it wouldn't work and I was just waved on.

Anita Blow

Rabies wrote: »

Because technology isn't 100% all of the time. Things break down.

Which means the Leap card is completely pointless if that's their attitude. If I have to carry around the money for every trip I take incase a machine doesn't work, then there's no point in having a leap card at all.

The onus is on Dublin Bus if their scanner breaks

Guy:Incognito

Anita Blow wrote: »

Which means the Leap card is completely pointless if that's their attitude. If I have to carry around the money for every trip I take incase a machine doesn't work, then there's no point in having a leap card at all.

Credit card machines/systems go down plenty of the time. Are credit and Debit cards completely pointless?

Anita Blow wrote: »

The onus is on Dublin Bus if their scanner breaks

The Onus is on them to provide an altenative, which they did.

Raladic

From the leapcard terms and conditions which the OP read carefully before buying a leap card and using it:

Limitation of Liability

13.1 Notwithstanding anything to the contrary contained herein, the Authority shall not be liable for any loss, damage, expenses, claims, liability or costs which you as the Leap Card customer may suffer or incur in connection with:
....

(d) any period during which any equipment, software or system is unavailable for processing the Leap Card for payment;

https://www.leapcard.ie/PageSetting/ContentViewer.aspx?Val=CG%2fCj953WkPB%2b7fwjkLFshsyP7wecX6fiV0VBn3Q632F20yhboVXGTVmv%2b2bImvcFvyDWv8wk%2bd4E5kAGPCvjpJvBUgOhvVEg%2fB6ZgVyLiI6nLqx13jMpsQIKgDUASmGM793kdSI9FJOtf2oYKBBrP3uRbgVAG0ZGo31awr2Vmg%3d