Serie A Superthread 2012/13

snowblind · 02-01-2013 12:58pm

Seaneh wrote: »

I think he's be the best player in Seria A this season. And easily better than Jojo and Cavani.
His over all game has been amazing, not just his goal scoring.

If his form carrys on I can see him picking up Seria A player of the season, Italian Player of the Season and Young Player of the Season at the end of the year.

Cavani has been his usual self but Jojo has been oout for the guts of 2 months with injuries and Fiorentina haven't missed him, Toni's done pretty well for them in his place. He's havign a good season but not on the same level as SES has.
I think Pirlo took a lot longer to get going than usual, at the start of the season he looked tired or off the pace and it's only been since october that he's been at his usual best and Cheillini hasn't been as good this year as he was last year, I think Bonucci has been better than him in a lot of games.

Surely that's a testament of the Fiorentina team's greatness this season than anything else, no? He was out for a couple of months, yes. But you are crowning SES already even when there are 5 months left. Toni is nowhere near the overall quality of Jojo, in which scoring goals is only one of the traits for the guy. From what I've seen, Jojo and Cavani own SES, but we'll see what it looks like by the end of the season. Anyways saying SES has been EASILY better than Jojo and Cavani is a big big hyperbole, and obviously partial.

I have seen every Juve game this season and last. Chiellini was mistake-prone last season and his game seemed off a lot of the time. This season he has been better than maybe ever before. Solid, brave, nearly mistake free. On the level of Cannavaro at the '06 WC. Pirlo has been as good as ever on average. Individual games vary a bit, but that often depends on strategy / what kind of roles the other midfielders are playing etc.

Pinturicchio · 02-01-2013 1:02pm

Bonucci has been sensational this season IMO. He's cut the silly mistakes out of his game and his play on the ball has improved so much.

He's gone from being one of the few weak spots in that team to being essential to the way they play.

snowblind · 02-01-2013 1:07pm

Pinturicchio wrote: »

Bonucci has been sensational this season IMO. He's cut the silly mistakes out of his game and his play on the ball has improved so much.

Agreed. I've always disagreed with the detractors, but early 2012 was a tough time to believe in him. He's still got work to do in the mistake department, but he's definitely shown that he's there to stay. His long balls are a thing of joy.

This Mourinho quote popped up during the holidays, let's read it again:

I'll be honest, I don't like Juventus because I fear them. I say they can win the Champions League. They represent an extremely compact collective, like an almost unsinkable vessel.

Seaneh · 02-01-2013 1:16pm

snowblind wrote: »

But you are crowning SES already even when there are 5 months left.

I clearly meant so far this season.
He could break a leg in training tomorrow and be out for the rest of the season ffs.

Pinturicchio · 02-01-2013 1:24pm

Oh and Inter are signing Tommaso Rocchi.

Seaneh · 02-01-2013 1:35pm

Yeah. I don't get that one at all at all...

dor83 · 02-01-2013 2:06pm

Seaneh wrote: »

Yeah. I don't get that one at all at all...

It's only until the end of the season and is cheap, short term cover incase anything happens to Milito, in which case there would need to be a change of system or play Livaja, who could also be going out on loan. I think it will be what it is intended to be and he will only get a few mins here and there, then in the summer he will be let go and a younger player will be brought in or Livaja and Longo will be given a chance to step up.

snowblind · 02-01-2013 2:09pm

Regarding seasons best players:

http://www.whoscored.com/Regions/108/Tournaments/5/Seasons/3512/Stages/6739/PlayerStatistics/Italy-Serie-A-2012-2013

If you sort the players by Average Rating, I think it's nearly spot on.

population · 02-01-2013 2:27pm

Campagnaro has been dodgy this year. Don't know how he is up there

Seaneh · 02-01-2013 2:31pm

population wrote: »

Campagnaro has been dodgy this year. Don't know how he is up there

It's just one website's own rating system. God knows what they base their system on.

snowblind · 02-01-2013 2:52pm

Seaneh wrote: »

It's just one website's own rating system. God knows what they base their system on.

God knows what people base their opinions on

I don't think I presented it as anything else than one websites own rating system. I also think it is implicit that this won't represent the absolute truth, as does neither my opinion or yours. I think this is pretty basic stuff.

Whoscored stats have actually been pretty consistent with my opinions for quite a while, it performs surprisingly well and is used by a bunch of journalists to highlight important points.

MD1990 · 02-01-2013 3:25pm

Pinturicchio wrote: »

Bonucci has been sensational this season IMO. He's cut the silly mistakes out of his game and his play on the ball has improved so much.

He's gone from being one of the few weak spots in that team to being essential to the way they play.

he must be one the best ball playing centre half's in the world
been superb for Juventus this season

grenache · 03-01-2013 3:14am

population wrote: »

Campagnaro has been dodgy this year. Don't know how he is up there

Agreed. Surely if any Napoli defender deserves to be on the list it should be Gamberini. He's been very solid in his debut season.

snowblind · 03-01-2013 3:29am

Agreed on Campagnaro. It seems to be one of those things that doesn't manifest so well in stats though. He's been very solid in my fantasy team so far too.....

03-01-2013 3:27pm

from goal;

Some unsavoury news emanating from Italy - AC Milan players reportedly walked off the pitch during a friendly match against Pro Patria after Kevin-Prince Boateng, Sulley Muntari and M'Baye Niang were subjected to racist chants. The match was then shortly abandoned.

Pighead · 03-01-2013 3:36pm

Deleted User wrote: »

from goal;

Here's the video of the incident. Apparently Allegri said that the team would do exactly the same thing again if any player was racially abused regardless of the competition.

Jimmy Iovine · 03-01-2013 4:08pm

Pighead wrote: »

Here's the video of the incident. Apparently Allegri said that the team would do exactly the same thing again if any player was racially abused regardless of the competition.

FYP

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nXyqFZ_fghI

Fair play to Boateng. You'd want to be awfully ignorant to racially abuse players nowadays.

Wonder will Sepp have anything to say about this? Another handshake?

The sooner they treat it seriously the more likely it will be to go away hopefully.

Pinturicchio · 03-01-2013 7:00pm

Fair play to Boateng and the players. They did the right thing. It's ridiculous that this still has to happen.

Seaneh · 05-01-2013 4:03am

Milan only have Acerbi fit this weekend at CB. I expect Acerbi and Ambrosini to start at CB with Muntari on the bench.

Mlian really need to sign a proper CB before the window ends!

population · 05-01-2013 12:10pm

Seaneh wrote: »

Milan only have Acerbi fit this weekend at CB. I expect Acerbi and Ambrosini to start at CB with Muntari on the bench.

Mlian really need to sign a proper CB before the window ends!

I just cannot understand their reluctance to spend any money. The race for Champions League places is so open and with a bit of luck, effort and obviously keeping El-Sharwaay fit, they could still claim one. Surely the potential revenue from a Champions League campaign far outweighs giving Allegri say 10 million to invest in a decent defender?

MaroonAndGreen · 05-01-2013 12:21pm

Whats the story with Sneijder?

Why would Inter be willing to let him leave?

dor83 · 05-01-2013 12:39pm

MaroonAndGreen wrote: »

Whats the story with Sneijder?

Why would Inter be willing to let him leave?

Inter want him to sign a new contract which would lower his wages as he is the highest paid player at the club and Inter are trying to reduce wages, he doesn't want to lower his wages and Inter have basically told him that he won't play again until he signs the new contract and he either signs or leaves.

I can't see anyone paying a big fee for him now, €10m maybe €15m if we get lucky and find a club willing to pay his wages. I think it might even end up with him staying because nobody will give him the money he wants. He really is being paid too much at the moment for a player who has missed so much time over the last couple of seasons with injury, and when he has played has generally been average at best. A lot of people only seem to remember how he played in the treble season, but he has not even come close to playing that well since and I have said for a while that I'd be happy if he is sold.

Corholio · 06-01-2013 6:00pm

Fantastic from Samp today, 1-0 down to Juventus and down to 10 men after Berardi was sent off. Then winning it with 2 goals from Icardi.

Great to see Palombo back.

Pinturicchio · 06-01-2013 6:54pm

Fair play to Samp. It was a great second half performance with 10 men.

That was the worst Buffon and Barzagli have ever played for Juve. It should've been 3-1, there was no reason to disallowed that one Buffon fumbled.

I hope the injury to Marchisio wasn't as bad as it looked.

mitosis · 06-01-2013 7:51pm

Pinturicchio wrote: »

Fair play to Samp. It was a great second half performance with 10 men.

That was the worst Buffon and Barzagli have ever played for Juve. It should've been 3-1, there was no reason to disallowed that one Buffon fumbled.

I hope the injury to Marchisio wasn't as bad as it looked.

I agree. I fear for Marchisio. Chiellini looks like his absence will cost BIG.

Perhaps you can explain to me the point of Giovinco? His shooting is poor, his passing haphazard and when crossing to a fellow striker always seems to do his utmost to make his partner look bad.

Pinturicchio · 06-01-2013 7:57pm

I don't rate Giovinco at all. He's never come close to living up to the hype of 5 or 6 years ago.

Seaneh · 06-01-2013 10:55pm

milam are now within touching distance of 3rd place after today. if we can get in one or two defenders before the window closes id fancy us to get a cl spot.

Rekop dog · 07-01-2013 12:00am

Yeah great results today, Fiorerntina are perennial chokers.

Andersonisgod · 07-01-2013 12:22am

Just watching a replay of Napoli vs Roma on ESPN. At the 67th minute mark De Sanctis makes a pretty good double save and them celebrates Bradley missing an open goal in ott fashion, there's definitely an amusing gif in there somewhere.

Rekop dog · 09-01-2013 5:17pm

All the noises coming out of Milan re signings last few days is a complete focus on youth and trying to rebuild the squad with an view to seriously competing in a few years time and going forward from that. This in itself is fine (although prob a cover up for lack of funds) but talk about the most dramatic turn around in transfer policy ever, from being famed for signing golden oldies (or just oldies) to this, from one extreme to the other.

seriousfizz · 09-01-2013 9:00pm

Giovinco looks like the opposite to El Shaarawy, who made a lovely finish for Milan's goal. Having said that, Giovinco just scored a very nice free kick. 1-1, 12 mins gone.

population · 09-01-2013 9:17pm

Armero looks like he has signed for Napoli. Decent addition but I would feel a lot better if a few defenders make their way south

grenache · 10-01-2013 1:06am

Anyone watch the Juve - Milan game in the Coppa tonight? Juve hanging on a bit at times but defended well and a tidy finish from Vucinic saw them win it 2-1 in extra time. Bojan impressed me when he came on for Pazzini. He seemed to be popping up everywhere. Giaccherini defied his critics with an energetic display for Juve, I wonder is he the most fouled player in Serie A, relative to the minutes he spends on the pitch.

MD1990 · 10-01-2013 1:18am

population wrote: »

Armero looks like he has signed for Napoli. Decent addition but I would feel a lot better if a few defenders make their way south

great signing
perfect for Napoli's system

population · 10-01-2013 10:06am

MD1990 wrote: »

great signing
perfect for Napoli's system

I agree, he is a welcome addition, but he is another signing made with thoughts again focussed on how we attack. Cannavaro is going to be missing for quite a while and still there have been no substantial efforts made to address the defensive shortcomings.

snowblind · 10-01-2013 11:21am

I'll have to disagree with a bunch of you on Giovinco. I was hesitant when he arrived, and still am frustrated with him fairly often. BUT he has scored a bunch of important goal. He actually leads us in goals AND assists.

Being critical, I agree that his finishing is often poor from clear cut chances and he needs to improve this. Also partly because of his physique, he often ends up dribbling until falling looking for FK's. I see this as desperation which is also a key factor when looking at the poor passes after his often great runs. We need a prima punta who can click with him. I mean we need a great prima punta, that's it. Giovinco can provide great passes, but often the time runs out before such a chance arrives, he is closed down, and that's the end of it - either a desperate pass or falling down after physical confrontation follows.

Yesterday, despite missing a couple of good chances again, he was the prime danger against Milan's defence. When he was subbed, Matri didn't have anything to work with and Milan took back control of the game. He also had two excellent FK's and his dribbling was very good. I find it strange to criticize him for his efforts yesterday. Our main threat in a win against Milan? I'll take that.

mitosis · 10-01-2013 1:44pm

I can only think of one important goal - last night's. His crossing and passing were poor again, he missed the target from what - 8metres? - with only the keeper to beat.

Compare him with Vucinic.

grenache · 10-01-2013 2:54pm

snowblind wrote: »

I'll have to disagree with a bunch of you on Giovinco. I was hesitant when he arrived, and still am frustrated with him fairly often. BUT he has scored a bunch of important goal. He actually leads us in goals AND assists.

Being critical, I agree that his finishing is often poor from clear cut chances and he needs to improve this. Also partly because of his physique, he often ends up dribbling until falling looking for FK's. I see this as desperation which is also a key factor when looking at the poor passes after his often great runs. We need a prima punta who can click with him. I mean we need a great prima punta, that's it. Giovinco can provide great passes, but often the time runs out before such a chance arrives, he is closed down, and that's the end of it - either a desperate pass or falling down after physical confrontation follows.

Yesterday, despite missing a couple of good chances again, he was the prime danger against Milan's defence. When he was subbed, Matri didn't have anything to work with and Milan took back control of the game. He also had two excellent FK's and his dribbling was very good. I find it strange to criticize him for his efforts yesterday. Our main threat in a win against Milan? I'll take that.

I agree I thought Giovinco was Juve's best player last night. Him and Lichsteiner were the two standout players. I thought Matri was his usual rubbish self when introduced. Juve would do well to get rid of him. He's only going to fall further down the pecking order if and when Llorente signs.

snowblind · 10-01-2013 3:00pm

mitosis wrote: »

I can only think of one important goal - last night's. His crossing and passing were poor again, he missed the target from what - 8metres? - with only the keeper to beat.

Compare him with Vucinic.

He's definitely scored a few clinchers. Plus the stats tell something, the assists and not just the goals. From what we have, he has been most consistent. Plus for me it is clear from what I've seen from him on pitch - his grinta, his willingness to go forward and surprise the opponent defence.

Our attack is work in progress. I agree that poor finishing is unforgiveable for a striker, but other than that it is still teamwork. He gets into the positions, his control is good. Finishing can get better through confidence etc. As long as we don't have better options, we have time to wait! If he cannot fit into the system, he should be out of favour. But currently he is the best we have. Whoever will come, we will see how things progress. I have more faith with him fitting in with someone else than Vucinic because of consistency and attitude.

Both have good technique and can produce magic occasionally. With Giovinco I see more dedication and willingness to take criticism onboard & develop. I'd say give him 2 years and let's see where we're at. Some "fans" are just so knee-jerky handing out criticism. Remember people willing to sell Bonucci last year? Made me so angry, and I've felt vindicated ever since.

snowblind · 10-01-2013 3:01pm

grenache wrote: »

I agree I thought Giovinco was Juve's best player last night. Him and Lichsteiner were the two standout players. I thought Matri was his usual rubbish self when introduced. Juve would do well to get rid of him. He's only going to fall further down the pecking order if and when Llorente signs.

The Matri situation makes me sad. I genuinely like the guy, and it would be awesome to see him succeed again. But he has been out of favour and his confidence is totally shot. He deserves another chance, but it looks like that will have to happen elsewhere...

Rekop dog · 13-01-2013 4:31pm

Udi with their usual 2nd half of the season march for Europe after a very poor start. Fiorentina with their usual pathetic collapse. Different season same story...

Moneymaker · 13-01-2013 4:46pm

Di Natale is immortal. Hero of a man.

Jelle1880 · 13-01-2013 5:08pm

Lazio closing the gap to 3 points...

Pinturicchio · 13-01-2013 5:42pm

A very poor start to the year for Juve. 1 point from 6. The whole team looks fatigued.

Rekop dog · 13-01-2013 7:41pm

Niang starting up front for Milan. That's a seriously young front three out there tonight.

Moneymaker · 13-01-2013 9:22pm

Very poor from Milan so far. Shocking passing.

dor83 · 15-01-2013 10:59pm

Inter v Bologna in the coppa is just finishing the 90 mins 2-2 and about to start extra time, been a good game and both keepers have made some very good saves, well worth watching the extra time if it's anything like the rest of the game.