Scottish Football Reconstruction (Mod Note #55)

blahfckingblah

only just reading up on this now, so far it seems like a farfetched system to me.

I think we should do the charlie green drinking game, every time he says 'celtic' we all have to drink

Dempsey

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21010647

Rangers are proposing three leagues of 14 as an alternative to the 12-12-18 format to be voted on at the end of the month.

They've no vote, lucky to have membership to Scottish Football and is set to take legal action to leave Scottish Football yet Green thinks he knows best for Scottish Football? He can fúck off!

Jelle1880

So he can't propose another idea ?

Maybe you should take Lennon's advice.

'Set to take legal action', you just read what you want to read don't you ?

Dempsey

Jelle1880 wrote: »

So he can't propose another idea ?

Maybe you should take Lennon's advice.

'Set to take legal action', you just read what you want to read don't you ?

I rather listen to people that have been involved in Scottish Football longer than 6 months, people that arent threatening to quit Scottish Football on a whim, threatening to stop playing games if they dont get their way, people that actually have a vote in future of Scottish Football. Those are the indisputable facts Jelle, tough shít if you dont like it.

TheBuilder

Lol. Dont let an actual better basic plan get in the way of a bitter, inaccurate rant.

Dempsey

TheBuilder wrote: »

Lol. Dont let an actual better basic plan get in the way of a bitter, inaccurate rant.

Nothing bitter or inaccurate about it. I'm sure you are going to quantify how its actually better rather than just blindly back everything he says as per usual?

TheBuilder

Dempsey wrote: »

Nothing bitter or inaccurate about it. I'm sure you are going to quantify how its actually better rather than just blindly back everything he says as per usual?

Well for a start it wouldnt have that ludicrous league split nonsense that has a real possibility of resulting in no promotion or relegation. It may still have a split but at least one that makes a bit of sense.

It also doesnt make this season a complete non-event for the third division, which Regan and Doncasters masterplan does. What is the point of this season, if he rconstruction goes through it makes as much sense to finish last as win the league this year because it achieves nothing.

Dempsey

This season will be a non event for SFL3 if reconstruction happens

BhoscaCapall

TheBuilder wrote: »

It also doesnt make this season a complete non-event for the third division, which Regan and Doncasters masterplan does.

How so? You win a trophy (your first ) and next season you're in the third tier, which you would be whether it's D2 or the "National Regional League" or whatever.

Jelle1880

So the SPL have approved the 12-12-18 set up.
The SFL will vote next, but I expect them to vote for it too.

“You can’t ignore fans. Any business which ignores its customers is doomed to fail". Stephen Thompson, Dundee United. 9th June 2012.

Unless they disagree with you then.

LiamoSail

So where next for rangers following Charles green's threat to quit Scottish football if this went ahead?

While reconstruction does involve rangers staying in the bottom tier, they'll still be a tier higher next season then this season and all things going as planned, will still be back in the spl in the same timeframe. So is their big issue with this? The obvious thing would be justifying an increase in st prices while facing many of the same sides as this season, but is that justification for pulling out of Scotland? And where do they plan to go?

Jelle1880

LiamoSail wrote: »

So where next for rangers following Charles green's threat to quit Scottish football if this went ahead?

While reconstruction does involve rangers staying in the bottom tier, they'll still be a tier higher next season then this season and all things going as planned, will still be back in the spl in the same timeframe. So is their big issue with this? The obvious thing would be justifying an increase in st prices while facing many of the same sides as this season, but is that justification for pulling out of Scotland? And where do they plan to go?

You seriously think Rangers fans are the only ones against this ?

As for the 'big issue with this': It's all based on promises.

Smaller clubs are promised more money, where will it come from ?
The SPL is already skint.

A better TV contract maybe ?
Highly unlikely.

Bigger attendances ?
Lol.

All they can tell the clubs is 'It might work'.
Which isn't exactly a strong argument for reconstruction.

edit: The reason why a 12-12-18 set up is the only one being considered is because it's backed by sponsors.
They see that, outside Rangers and Celtic the bigger attendances are with relegation- or promotion-battling teams.
The 12-12-18 creates an 8-team division of relegation/promotion contenders by zero-ing their points and putting them on an even keel going into the final stages of the season.

It's an attempt to get a new or improved tv contract going, but it's not in the best interest of the Scottish game in the long run.

Whether fans like it or not, and personally THAT is my issue with it, apart from the fact it's already been tried and failed.
Twice.

LiamoSail

Jelle1880 wrote: »

You seriously think Rangers fans are the only ones against this ?

As for the 'big issue with this': It's all based on promises.

Smaller clubs are promised more money, where will it come from ?
The SPL is already skint.

A better TV contract maybe ?
Highly unlikely.

Bigger attendances ?
Lol.

All they can tell the clubs is 'It might work'.
Which isn't exactly a strong argument for reconstruction.

I'm not saying rangers are the only ones against it, but they've been the most vocal and have threatened to quit Scottish football over it hence why I questioned it

Jelle1880

I guess we'll hear from Green after the SFL vote.

But not that I'd put too much worth on those words, the whole 'We need to get out of Scotland' thing is getting quite boring.

LiamoSail

Jelle1880 wrote: »

I guess we'll hear from Green after the SFL vote.

But not that I'd put too much worth on those words, the whole 'We need to get out of Scotland' thing is getting quite boring.

Is he using this as an excuse to test the waters in terms of getting out of Scotland, or is it concern over the ticket prices or what do you think?

Lennonist

Is it the case that there will be no automatic promotion/relegation in the lower divisions in this proposal, that the end of season will become a mini league play-offs type system where teams will start at zero? The play-offs in England have been a great success. This seems to be a more radical version of that.

You'd imagine that Rangers will romp away with lower division titles 'til they get to the SPL, so I guess they wont like the notion of being flung into a mini league play off type system at seasons end. They'll still most likely get promoted, but it increases the possibility that they could lose out with a few shock defeats.

Eirebear

Lennonist wrote: »

Is it the case that there will be no automatic promotion/relegation in the lower divisions in this proposal, that the end of season will become a mini league play-offs type system where teams will start at zero? The play-offs in England have been a great success. This seems to be a more radical version of that.

You'd imagine that Rangers will romp away with lower division titles 'til they get to the SPL, so I guess they wont like the notion of being flung into a mini league play off type system at seasons end. They'll still most likely get promoted, but it increases the possibility that they could lose out with a few shock defeats.

Dude, it's not at the end of the season - it would be half way through the damn thing!

Play everyone twice (22 games) then split into 3 divisions of 8 - with each and every division resetting to zero and each theam plays eachother twice again (14 games)
i.e - Celtic are leading the top division by 15-20 points after 22 games, everything rests to 0 and the find themselves in what is basically a 14 game season with absolutely no reward for the 20pt lead they had built up.

It's lunacy - 2 or 3 bad results in a 14 game league will have massive consequences.

Eirebear

Also, the english play-offs work because they make a point of not punishing the sides who finish in the top 2 of their division - while being inclusive of those who were "nearly" there.

Pro. F

Eirebear wrote: »

Dude, it's not at the end of the season - it would be half way through the damn thing!

Play everyone twice (22 games) then split into 3 divisions of 8 - with each and every division resetting to zero and each theam plays eachother twice again (14 games)
i.e - Celtic are leading the top division by 15-20 points after 22 games, everything rests to 0 and the find themselves in what is basically a 14 game season with absolutely no reward for the 20pt lead they had built up.

It's lunacy - 2 or 3 bad results in a 14 game league will have massive consequences.

Might that be not such a bad thing? I know it's not nearly as fair, but the added unpredictability might be a bonus for Scottish football. If the second class teams have a chance to get lucky and win a title (and it wouldn't be all luck, they'd still have to be good) that could give the fans of those teams something to hope for.

Like the play-offs at the end of a league you see in other sports. The best teams still are most likely to win, but the added luck factor means everybody has a chance.

What you say about the big team winning the first period by a big margin and getting no reward still stands though.

Eirebear

Pro. F wrote: »

Might that be not such a bad thing? I know it's not nearly as fair, but the added unpredictability might be a bonus for Scottish football. If the second class teams have a chance to get lucky and win a title (and it wouldn't be all luck, they'd still have to be good) that could give the fans of those teams something to hope for.

Like the play-offs at the end of a league you see in other sports. The best teams still are most likely to win, but the added luck factor means everybody has a chance.

What you say about the big team winning the first period by a big margin and getting no reward still stands though.

I agree to a point, however it also renders a lot of matches entirely pointless for fans- and to make matter worse, these meaningless games will be mid-season.

In a set up such as this, there will be a certain points tally which will guarantee qualification for the "top 8". (I'm not going to sit and work it out right now)
I would suggest it would be feasible for a team like Celtic to get those points within the first round of fixtures, or not long into the second.
Everything after that is entirely meaningless for Celtic and their fans, as there is no distinction between finishing 1st or 8th.

So while the unpredictable nature of a 14 game race may be one which brings an excitement factor, there is an awfully boring 10-15 games for many people prior to that.

Pro. F

Eirebear wrote: »

I agree to a point, however it also renders a lot of matches entirely pointless for fans- and to make matter worse, these meaningless games will be mid-season.

In a set up such as this, there will be a certain points tally which will guarantee qualification for the "top 8". (I'm not going to sit and work it out right now)
I would suggest it would be feasible for a team like Celtic to get those points within the first round of fixtures, or not long into the second.
Everything after that is entirely meaningless for Celtic and their fans, as there is no distinction between finishing 1st or 8th.

So while the unpredictable nature of a 14 game race may be one which brings an excitement factor, there is an awfully boring 10-15 games for many people prior to that.

I see what you mean there. That is a big problem all right.

In leagues that end in play-offs that is negated by more favourable draws for the top finishing teams. Nothing like that here. This proposal looks quite bad now that I see that.

Lennonist

Eirebear wrote: »

Dude, it's not at the end of the season - it would be half way through the damn thing!

Play everyone twice (22 games) then split into 3 divisions of 8 - with each and every division resetting to zero and each theam plays eachother twice again (14 games)
i.e - Celtic are leading the top division by 15-20 points after 22 games, everything rests to 0 and the find themselves in what is basically a 14 game season with absolutely no reward for the 20pt lead they had built up.

It's lunacy - 2 or 3 bad results in a 14 game league will have massive consequences.

The reset to zero mechanism after 22 games does not apply to the "Title Group" after the split, they carry their points forward. The reset to zero only applies to the relegation and promotion from the lower leagues. That's what this article from the STV website says anyway.

Title Group
The Premiership clubs finishing in the top eight positions in phase one would split into a eight-team league, which we will call the “Title Group” for the purposes of explaining the system.
Those eight teams would carry their points forward from phase one of the season, playing each other again twice, once at home and once away, to complete a further 14 fixtures.

http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/aberdeen/209239-explained-how-the-scottish-football-league-reconstruction-model-would-work/

Lennonist

Actually looking at that article again, the reset to zero only applies to the middle 8 group. The lower 8 group - like the top 8 group - will also carry their points forward.

Eirebear

Lennonist wrote: »

The reset to zero mechanism after 22 games does not apply to the "Title Group" after the split, they carry their points forward. The reset to zero only applies to the relegation and promotion from the lower leagues. That's what this article from the STV website says anyway.




http://sport.stv.tv/football/clubs/aberdeen/209239-explained-how-the-scottish-football-league-reconstruction-model-would-work/

That's a new development, interesting. (or at least something i didn't realise)

Lennonist

You'll always have dead rubber games no matter what you do. The bottom teams in the top 8 would have little to play for after the split if they were too far adrift of a Euro spot, but under normal circumstances they'd be middle table teams with little to play for towards the end of the league season anyway. This proposal would make the middle 8 group the most competitive, where they reset at zero after the split and the top 4 play in the top flight the next season with the bottom 4 starting the next season in the 2nd flight.

The possible changes will make no difference to Celtic and under normal circumstances wouldn't matter to Rangers either. However there might be a banana skin or two for Rangers in their present predicament making their way to the SPL, that could be their real reason for their objection to it. Still you'd imagine they'd still sail through, they'd be better off getting on with it I reckon.

Broxi_Bear_Eire

Lennonist wrote: »

You'll always have dead rubber games no matter what you do. The bottom teams in the top 8 would have little to play for after the split if they were too far adrift of a Euro spot, but under normal circumstances they'd be middle table teams with little to play for towards the end of the league season anyway. This proposal would make the middle 8 group the most competitive, where they reset at zero after the split and the top 4 play in the top flight the next season with the bottom 4 starting the next season in the 2nd flight.

The possible changes will make no difference to Celtic and under normal circumstances wouldn't matter to Rangers either. However there might be a banana skin or two for Rangers in their present predicament making their way to the SPL, that could be their real reason for their objection to it. Still you'd imagine they'd still sail through, they'd be better off getting on with it I reckon.

Really it does't matter what is more annoying from fans of all clubs is once more they have not been listened to and that is the real problem.
It is also very strange that Doncaster is going on about it bring unanimous but there was no vote taken

Broxi_Bear_Eire

Looks as though its not as cut and dried as some would have us believe

http://www.saintmirren.net/pages/?p=19758

Broxi_Bear_Eire

Oops

SFL clubs set to veto SPL reform plan and propose four league idea when they meet at Hampden


'SFL clubs are ready to veto SPL proposals for league reconstruction in favour of introducing four leagues of 12-12-10-10 when they gather at Hampden tomorrow.

The SPL declared on Monday that their members had unanimously agreed to the 12-12-18 league
structure, which will also herald structural and financial changes to the game in Scotland.

But RecordSport understands top-flight chairmen will now give their backing to the growing number of lower league clubs who want to ditch the three-tier motion in favour of their own expanded format which would see two further clubs added to the senior ranks.

The mood of some SPL bosses is to wave through the wishes of SFL clubs to create a four-league structure as they attempt to agree a compromise which could be implemented this summer.

A 12-12-10-10 format is thought to be more palatable for bottom-rung clubs who find an 18-team basement unattractive.'

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/f...e-four-1563082

Dempsey

Looks like the colt idea has been shelved and rightfully so. Not sure why Longmuir waited so long to table the idea when there was no real appetite for it.

Dempsey

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22001371

A majority of fans want a larger top flight, according to the first Scottish National Football Survey.

There have been plenty of fans survey's indicating this long before now. Not listening to the fans is suicide for Scottish Football in the long term.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21985299

Neil Doncaster wants to ram the current proposal down the throat of the clubs this summer in an all or nothing approach.

This approach & the 12-12-12-18 is motivated by Doncaster looking to secure his own job and make the SFL merge with the SPL and not the other way around. The end doesn't justify the means and someone in authority to do so should be making him accountable for his actions before its too late.

BhoscaCapall

What reasons do people have for wanting a larger top flight?

RoryMac

For me playing each team 3 or 4 times has killed a lot of the excitement around the games, even the games against Rangers had lost their edge. A 16 or 18 team league with an early start and winter break, playing each team home and away would be my preferred choice.

What are the arguments for a smaller top league?

BhoscaCapall

RoryMac wrote: »

For me playing each team 3 or 4 times has killed a lot of the excitement around the games, even the games against Rangers had lost their edge. A 16 or 18 team league with an early start and winter break, playing each team home and away would be my preferred choice.

What are the arguments for a smaller top league?

I'd rather play Dundee Utd 4 times than Livingston twice. The games against Rangers never lost their edge, that is absurd.

Dempsey

BhoscaCapall wrote: »

I'd rather play Dundee Utd 4 times than Livingston twice. The games against Rangers never lost their edge, that is absurd.

Its not all about Celtic and Rangers and what they want. Thats why Scottish Football is in the mess it is, i.e. the concept of the SPL. Everything is geared to suit 2 clubs instead of suiting all the professional clubs.

BhoscaCapall

Dempsey wrote: »

Its not all about Celtic and Rangers and what they want. Thats why Scottish Football is in the mess it is, i.e. the concept of the SPL. Everything is geared to suit 2 clubs instead of suiting all the professional clubs.

The problem with the Scottish game is there's already far too many "professional" clubs as it is. I don't see how the quality of the SPL will be increased by including a load of even worse teams.

The only way you can bump up the quality is through investment. Look at the EPL, by rights that should only be 10-12 teams but the other 8-10 ****e clubs are propped up by 30-50m a year from Sky so it works. Would TV companies put more money into the Scottish game if the number of 'big' matches were halved in favour of Morton v Raith Rovers twice a season?

RoryMac

BhoscaCapall wrote: »

The problem with the Scottish game is there's already far too many "professional" clubs as it is. I don't see how the quality of the SPL will be increased by including a load of even worse teams.

The only way you can bump up the quality is through investment. Look at the EPL, by rights that should only be 10-12 teams but the other 8-10 ****e clubs are propped up by 30-50m a year from Sky so it works. Would TV companies put more money into the Scottish game if the number of 'big' matches were halved in favour of Morton v Raith Rovers twice a season?

I agree there are too many professional clubs in Scotland but you can't simply ignore them because you don't think they're up to your standards.

I'm not sure adding 4 or 6 teams to the SPL would cause too many issues in terms of the quality, it may actually help as teams won't spend 2 thirds of the season kicking the sh!t out of eachother in an attempt to make the top half of the split.

It may well lead to a drop in the money or maybe even SKY ignoring scottish football altogether but that won't have a massive affect on Celtic as the amount is pretty small in the grand scheme. Other clubs will feel the pinch more but they'll adjust.

I'm not sure Morton vs Raith is any less appealing than Inverness vs Ross County which ESPN showed earlier in the season

Dempsey

BhoscaCapall wrote: »

The problem with the Scottish game is there's already far too many "professional" clubs as it is. I don't see how the quality of the SPL will be increased by including a load of even worse teams.

The only way you can bump up the quality is through investment. Look at the EPL, by rights that should only be 10-12 teams but the other 8-10 ****e clubs are propped up by 30-50m a year from Sky so it works. Would TV companies put more money into the Scottish game if the number of 'big' matches were halved in favour of Morton v Raith Rovers twice a season?

There is far more to this reconstruction than just the league structures. The distribution of the wealth generated by the 'product' is geared wrongly at the moment. The governance rules allowed Celtic & Rangers to block anything that didnt suit them. Those two key points have led to a situation where clubs got weaker whilst Celtic and Rangers consolidated their position at the top over the lifetime of the SPL.

They've effectively shot themselves in the foot because they didnt realize until it was too late that the quality of the league is paramount to their own objectives in many many ways.

I do believe that the amount of professional licenses should be reduced. We should have a pyramid system aswell. Colt teams for some shouldnt be even a consideration.

I still believe that a 14 team top flight with a 5 year plan to expand to 16 team is the best way forward. 2 teams relegated with a 3rd going by playoff.

6 & 8 split would allow clubs in the top to slug it out in the european spots and the bottom get extra fixtures as financial compensation for larger relegation dogfight.

All the current proposals for governance, wealth distribution would work with this and the broadcasters get all they want and more. Plus a proper time frame for what the fans want to be implemented.

Boom! Job Done, can I have Doncasters job :pac:

BhoscaCapall

Dempsey wrote: »

I still believe that a 14 team top flight with a 5 year plan to expand to 16 team is the best way forward. 2 teams relegated with a 3rd going by playoff.

I can see 14 working, sure. Definitely needs to be more than one relegation/promotion spot too as I think the SFL1 is far too hard for a lot of teams due to there only being one spot up for grabs and the rest being pretty much thankless.

Also by having 2-3 teams move each season there's more chance of spreading the money about a bit.

Overall though they can stuff league reconstruction, it's the ticket prices and treatment of fans that needs to be revamped. Not for this thread though I suppose (just got a month ban for telling someone not to post off topic :rolleyes:)

Dempsey

BhoscaCapall wrote: »

I can see 14 working, sure. Definitely needs to be more than one relegation/promotion spot too as I think the SFL1 is far too hard for a lot of teams due to there only being one spot up for grabs and the rest being pretty much thankless.

Also by having 2-3 teams move each season there's more chance of spreading the money about a bit.

Overall though they can stuff league reconstruction, it's the ticket prices and treatment of fans that needs to be revamped. Not for this thread though I suppose (just got a month ban for telling someone not to post off topic :rolleyes:)

The proposed financial model is far better for the majority of clubs than the current no matter what league format we end up with tbh

Cant expect clubs to do anything about ticket prices when they are operating under a financial model that only suits Celtic & Rangers.

Dempsey

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22051362

Proposals to change Scotland's league structure in time for next season are unlikely to gain enough support for Scottish Premier League approval.

BBC Scotland has learned Ross County and St Mirren plan to vote against the plans, with an 11-1 majority required at SPL level.

I wonder what the 3 stooges will do now! You'd hope that clubs would listen to fans, the want all the reforms on the table but not that league structure.

Dempsey

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22088117

SFL clubs are due to vote on the proposal next Friday.

Following a meeting between Scottish football's three governing bodies, the SFL had requested assistance from the Scottish Football Association in providing financial due diligence.

That is seen as vital to help clubs decide how to vote on the proposed new set-up, which would result in a merger between the two league bodies.

However, it is believed that, despite requests from the SFA, the SFL has still not allowed access to its financial details.

That information was originally expected last Wednesday.

Very strange carry on! Everything in the expense accounts must be getting relabelled to "office supplies"!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22063775

"The concept of playing 22 games prior to breaking into three leagues of eight, including the middle eight losing their points gained in the first series of games, is not a system we see as taking the game forward in the long term.

"You will be aware that other countries have tried this system and have since rejected such a set up.

"We also feel that this system is not fair to fans who buy into their club by way of a season ticket, who are then unsure of what they are purchasing.

"It is also against the basic wishes of the fans for larger leagues as highlighted in all recent fan surveys.

"In the proposed rules the voting structure is remaining, in all items that are of importance, an 11-1 vote. In our opinion, this is fundamentally wrong in any structure and is the principle reason why Scottish League Football has not been able to restructure prior to this time, a view St Mirren have held for some time."

Gilmour added: "We fundamentally disagree with what we call 'big ticket items' like the league reconstruction formula.

"Also, the 11-1 voting structure hasn't been properly sorted and that's a huge thing.

"We want one league body; an all-through distribution model but we have to listen to what fans are telling us. And they want larger leagues.

"I hope we can get back round the table and I think we've tried to rush this."

Whilst I agree with what he's saying, he has offered no alternative and he hasnt addressed, at all, what happens to Scottish Football if things stay as they are, even for another season. If clubs dont like the something about the current plans, they should suggest an alternative proposal with due diligence done on it to show that its viable. Saying no whilst offering nothing meaningful to the debate has gone on for long enough in Scottish Football

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22073506

"Everyone has to compromise to come up with a system that keeps 42 clubs happy," Gardiner told BBC Scotland.

"I'm afraid it's utopian and doesn't relate to real life to think that some clubs can cherry-pick what they want."

"A vote against isn't just a vote against 12-12, it's a vote to keep the status quo, and the boot will be kept on the neck of Scottish football.

"Because there's no more compromises; everyone's given in something, so, for some clubs to say 'we'd like also that and we'd like also that', that's a red line for us.

"I think it's self-interest."

"It's easy to make statements where you say 'we shouldn't do this and we shouldn't do this'," he said.

"There's been an enormous amount of compromise from clubs all over the country.

"I put my hand up against in January, but there are very good arguments for keeping it when you get into the detail.

"The 11-1 is there for protected matters, and that means protecting everyone, not jsut one or two clubs."

"We have a sick patient here," he said.

"Crowds are going down, sponsorship is going down, TV audiences are disastrous and the First Division is effectively a basket case.

"Our game is in dire need of change.

"I believe, if things are explained properly about where we're at, then fans can realise this is the situation we're in," he said.

"PR-wise, could things be handled better? Absolutely.

Perspective of a club heading for Division 1, where relegated clubs end up with financial problems because there is no meaningful parachute payment.

Dempsey

Seems Celtic, Dundee United, Dundee, ICT, Hearts, Aberdeen, St Johnstone & Motherwell

Ross County wont reveal what way they are voting and are holding out for a compromise

St. Mirren are against the proposal

Dempsey

St Mirren and Ross County vote against the 12-12-18 proposal.

Thats the end of that!

BhoscaCapall

Dempsey wrote: »

Thats the end of that!

And the start of SPL2 with Sevco invited into the top tier :rolleyes:

RoryMac

Surely Regan & Doncaster have to resign if they can't push through what they described as the only workable solution.

Dempsey

RoryMac wrote: »

Surely Regan & Doncaster have to resign if they can't push through what they described as the only workable solution.

Their necks are too thick to resign over this.

RoryMac

I'm sure you're right

Dempsey

SPL statement

"At this morning's general meeting, all 12 Scottish Premier League clubs were present to consider proposals for restructuring of the Scottish professional game. The proposals would have delivered:

* an expansion of play-offs, creating more opportunities for promotion and relegation between divisions

* a single merged league with meaningful games at every level

* a pyramid structure for the entire game

* opportunities for materially increased revenues coming into the game

* substantial redistribution of revenues to lower league clubs

The proposals required 11 votes in favour to be approved. Ten votes in favour were received, with two against. The proposals were not therefore approved.

"During the meeting, and in an effort to break the deadlock, an amendment to the League's rules on voting was proposed. This major and progressive change would have allowed future league structure to be determined by a 9-3 vote, rather than the current 11-1 majority.

"Prior to the meeting, a number of clubs had suggested that voting change would enable league structure change to be voted through. Unfortunately, this amendment was also defeated in principle on a show of hands, with the same two clubs voting against.

"The SPL board wishes to express its sincere thanks to every member of the SPL's Restructure Working Group and to Harper Macleod for their hard work over many months. The chief executive and his team have worked tirelessly over the last three years to bring about positive change in the SPL.

"The board would like to place on record its deep disappointment that proposals to benefit the entire game in Scotland have been blocked."

Gilmour/St. Mirren wouldnt comment to the media why he voted no since the issue of the 11-1 vote was removed from the equation. Lawwell proposed a 9-3 vote in now & in future for reconstruction votes

SPL chairman Ralph Topping

"An overwhelming majority of SPL clubs voted for these proposals to go through. The proposals foundered on the opposition of two clubs. The package involved concessions from all clubs and was for the betterment of Scottish football as a whole.

"I would like to thank those who have supported these proposals, including those full-time professional clubs outside of the SPL who find themselves let down by today's vote. Scottish football needs to change. I had previously announced my intention to step down once a successor had been identified.

"I have today advised the board that I will not be seeking re-election at the SPL's AGM this July."

Red Crow

What a disaster. Despite that the whole suggestion was flawed anyway. But on the table it was the best decision to move forward.

Lennonist

What's the real agenda going on here. Why did St Mirren and Ross County vote against, is it because Div 1 would become harder to qualify out of if they were to get relegated. In the new proposal was there 2 up and 2 down into the SPL as opposed to the current 1 up and 1 down? Whatever about the arguments against the failed proposals, maintaining the status quo is not the answer. Sad after all that talking that they got nowhere at all as regards restructuring the leagues.