Haters

Johro

I watch the english television channels as I have a free to air satellite box and no Irish channels are yet, if ever, available on it, so I've a choice of BBC, ITV, Channel 4 and such, and I'm just wondering if anyone else has noticed the depresssing negativity, and regularity, of shows like 'Saints and Scroungers' (in particular, and featuring No. 1 annoying twat Dominic Littlewood of 'Don't get done, get Dom' fame), 'Grimefighters', 'Tricks of the Tradesmen', and some the names of which I don't remember at the minute, one about fly tipping and another one which no doubt also features the words 'conned' and 'cheats', your taxes' and 'rotten tricks' etc.
Then there are the 'Cowboy Builders', 'The Cowboy Trap' and 'Neighbours from Hell' type of shows to round it all off nicely, all giving us the impression that every living soul is just itching to defraud us, con us, assault us, rip us off for every penny we got. Lovely stuff.
Does it annoy anyone else?
The media play a huge role in this as well, with newspaper articles talking about the supposedly massive problem of 'benefit cheats' when in reality they number less than 0.5% of welfare recipients.
Is it just about a need to feel 'better than them'?
It just pisses me off that so much of what is essentially supposed to pass for entertainment is really just posing 'us and them' scenarios and frankly hate-mongering when there are so many more people willing to volunteer for all sorts of causes and there are many more examples of people doing nice things for each other that never get an airing.

Mr. Rager

But why the thread title, "Haters"?

ArtSmart

Yup. we get it here thanks to that 'independent' TV station TV3.

ah, the aul fear-mongering. nothing like a cowering electorate. ye can't beat it.

Johro

Mr. Rager wrote: »

But why the thread title, "Haters"?

Because of the hate mongering nature of that type of programme.

Johro

ArtSmart wrote: »

Yup. we get it here thanks to that 'independent' TV station TV3.

ah, the aul fear-mongering. nothing like a cowering electorate. ye can't beat it.

Oh I'd expect TV3 to be full of it alright.

1ZRed

Mr. Rager wrote: »

But why the thread title, "Haters"?

As Gummy Panda might say:

Chuck Stone

The BBC has a public service remit and I guess the cowboy builders, doorstep scammer, type shows are trying to warn vulnerable people to be careful.

I was watching one last week and these vultures are fucking scum - they prey on elderly people. I was thinking of solutions and was wondering if there could be a seniors bank account where accessing sums of over a given amount per day/week would automatically alert a trustee.

Yeah, I'm a solutions guy.

Tombi!

Please, please don't take this wrong way, OP: I want to punch you for using the word "haters".

B.A._Baracus

Johro wrote: »

all giving us the impression that every living soul is just itching to defraud us, con us, assault us, rip us off for every penny we got. Lovely stuff.
Does it annoy anyone else?

I know what you mean op
In recent times TV3 has been guilty of the same. Shock documentaries (Shockumentaries? :P ) which are designed to be nothing more than "jaysus, you see whats going on" type of shows.

Johro

Chuck Stone wrote: »

The BBC has a public service remit and I guess the cowboy builders, doorstep scammer, type shows are trying to warn vulnerable people to be careful.

I was watching one last week and these vultures are fucking scum - they prey on elderly people. I was thinking of solutions and was wondering if there could be a seniors bank account where accessing sums of over a given amount per day/week would automatically alert a trustee.

Yeah, I'm a solutions guy.

Sure, I've no problem with that, I guess it's just the fact that there's so many of those shows airing, giving those people the impression they're under siege from the public. My point is just that most people are kind and perfectly willing to help out and many volunteer, especially in looking out for the elderly. The 'Saints and Scroungers' type show is just fucking awful though, in its format and its language, have a look at this review, I would agree with a lot of it. http://fightingmonsters.wordpress.com/2010/08/17/saints-and-scroungers-a-review/

Johro

Brutal Deluxe wrote: »

Please, please don't take this wrong way, OP: I want to punch you for using the word "haters".

That's alright, it got your attention, I don't give a shite.
Not the face, okay?

Rigol

Its not all bad though, people watch things like that to educate themselves to not get made a mug of.

For more positive tv you could always try Charlie Brooker or Frankie Boyle.

Mr. Rager

Johro wrote: »

Because of the hate mongering nature of that type of programme.

Well I understand the nature of these programmes but that word makes you sound like a African-American hip-hop artist addressing those who detest his music and/or image. Yo.

Where To

What have the thread title and the opening post in common?

Apart from both being in English?

Johro

Rigol wrote: »

Its not all bad though, people watch things like that to educate themselves to not get made a mug of.

For more positive tv you could always try Charlie Brooker or Frankie Boyle.

I think I'd rather drink my own piss.

Johro

Where To wrote: »

What have the thread title and the opening post in common?

Apart from both being in English?

F^#*in hell...
I'm not changing it now, you'll have to live with it.





Okay maybe I will.

B.A._Baracus

Rigol wrote: »

Its not all bad though, people watch things like that to educate themselves to not get made a mug of.

A very valid point.
I mean, we can all be thick in certain situations in our life. We're all human and prone to mistakes. Shows like Watchdog, Cowboy Builders (etc) are good. Name and shame. So things change.


But it depends on the documentary i guess. Can't help but mention TV3's shockumentaries again lol. Like the episode about the black market :pac:

Esel

Haters is great. I'm downloading series 5 as we speak. Don't tell Dominic though....

Chuck Stone

'Doom-sayer media' might be a better title Johro.

Just sayin'

MarkHitide

Johro wrote: »

I watch the english television channels as I have a free to air satellite box and no Irish channels are yet, if ever, available on it, so I've a choice of BBC, ITV, Channel 4 and such, and I'm just wondering if anyone else has noticed the depresssing negativity, and regularity, of shows like 'Saints and Scroungers' (in particular, and featuring No. 1 annoying twat Dominic Littlewood of 'Don't get done, get Dom' fame), 'Grimefighters', 'Tricks of the Tradesmen', and some the names of which I don't remember at the minute, one about fly tipping and another one which no doubt also features the words 'conned' and 'cheats', your taxes' and 'rotten tricks' etc.
Then there are the 'Cowboy Builders', 'The Cowboy Trap' and 'Neighbours from Hell' type of shows to round it all off nicely, all giving us the impression that every living soul is just itching to defraud us, con us, assault us, rip us off for every penny we got. Lovely stuff.
Does it annoy anyone else?
The media play a huge role in this as well, with newspaper articles talking about the supposedly massive problem of 'benefit cheats' when in reality they number less than 0.5% of welfare recipients.
Is it just about a need to feel 'better than them'?
It just pisses me off that so much of what is essentially supposed to pass for entertainment is really just posing 'us and them' scenarios and frankly hate-mongering when there are so many more people willing to volunteer for all sorts of causes and there are many more examples of people doing nice things for each other that never get an airing.

A Clue-

Johro

MarkHitide wrote: »

A Clue-

I'm aware of what the shows are about :rolleyes:
What I'm saying is that there are so many of them being shown, if it's not one it's the other, and that people could be forgiven for thinking everybody is out to get them in some way. I get that there are cunts out there who try to rip people off. It's just that they'll have you believe you can't step outside your door without coming across one.
There are lots of decent people out there too is all. When every time you switch on the telly you're confronted with some self righteous eejit pointing at the crap side of humanity it's easy to forget.

Johro

Chuck Stone wrote: »

'Doom-sayer media' might be a better title Johro.

Just sayin'

Fair enough. It's not really about impending doom though. It's about creating a scenario where we can feel good about ourselves and point the finger at others. Us and them.

The King of Moo

The worst, for me, is Don't Tell the Bride, though the hatred is all within the programme itself. It's predicated on causing friction between engaged couple during a period which would ordinarily be stressful for them, all for our amusement. I don't see the entertainment value in the look of profound disappointment on a woman's face when she sees that the gobshi*e she's marrying has chosen to have the ceremony in the neighbour's field in January, because she first saw a horse there as a child or something, and he spent all the money on booking Paintball for the reception.

What really bugs me, though, which I've asked many a time, is why the couple don't just agree about what they want beforehand, then pretend that the fiancé is choosing everything himself.

AEDIC

Johro wrote: »

I watch the english television channels as I have a free to air satellite box and no Irish channels are yet, if ever, available on it, so I've a choice of BBC, ITV, Channel 4 and such, and I'm just wondering if anyone else has noticed the depresssing negativity, and regularity, of shows like 'Saints and Scroungers' (in particular, and featuring No. 1 annoying twat Dominic Littlewood of 'Don't get done, get Dom' fame), 'Grimefighters', 'Tricks of the Tradesmen', and some the names of which I don't remember at the minute, one about fly tipping and another one which no doubt also features the words 'conned' and 'cheats', your taxes' and 'rotten tricks' etc.
Then there are the 'Cowboy Builders', 'The Cowboy Trap' and 'Neighbours from Hell' type of shows to round it all off nicely, all giving us the impression that every living soul is just itching to defraud us, con us, assault us, rip us off for every penny we got. Lovely stuff.
Does it annoy anyone else?
The media play a huge role in this as well, with newspaper articles talking about the supposedly massive problem of 'benefit cheats' when in reality they number less than 0.5% of welfare recipients.
Is it just about a need to feel 'better than them'?
It just pisses me off that so much of what is essentially supposed to pass for entertainment is really just posing 'us and them' scenarios and frankly hate-mongering when there are so many more people willing to volunteer for all sorts of causes and there are many more examples of people doing nice things for each other that never get an airing.

Off button...read a book...go for a walk...talk to people...problem solved.

Alter-Ego

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

I know what you mean op
In recent times TV3 has been guilty of the same. Shock documentaries (Shockumentaries? :P ) which are designed to be nothing more than "jaysus, you see whats going on" type of shows.

Ireland's worst weather. Now there was a documentary that shocked me to my core.

Johro

AEDIC wrote: »

Off button...read a book...go for a walk...talk to people...problem solved.

Not watching it myself doesn't make it go away. It's still out there telling people they should look at these people and be outraged.
Here's some of what what bothers me most in a review I happen to agree with:Saints and Scroungers – a review

I didn’t plan to watch ‘Saints and Scroungers’ on BBC1 last night. Really, I didn’t but it was nestled between The One Show and Eastenders (I never claimed to have particularly high brow TV viewing habits!) so it just happened across my TV screen.
It made me feel very angry. That was my one sentence review. In more detail, the premise of the programme is to highlight ‘benefits cheats and to track down people who deserve government help’.
Even typing that sentence made me feel faintly nauseous. It isn’t like it’s hard to find instances of people who have defrauded the benefits payments system, after all. You only need to (and I know, this is a big ask) read the Daily Mail where there highly skilled *cough* ‘investigative’ reporters are more than capable of fulfilling that self-satisfying smug need to ‘feel better’ that exists within the general populace.
The ‘scrounger’ in this sense was an ‘unremarkable grandmother’ who had CONNED THE SYSTEM (a not-so-gentle reminder every now and then that that’s you and me, you know, The Taxpayer) out of £600,000 she wasn’t entitled to.
Fair cop – it’s a heinous crime and she was caught. My problem is not that particular instance because it is a verifiable conviction from a repeat offender. My problem with the programme is the way it was couched in a self-satisfied smugness and a perception that the benefits system must be so easy to defraud that ‘we’ are all being defrauded. The cost of the reputation of people who are entirely entitled to live and receive welfare benefits is the perception that fraud is entrenched in the system.
This programme was a case type in stigmatisation and alienation of people who might access welfare benefits and as such, although it highlighted evidence of a criminal offence, the language and presentation was such that we can all go and pat ourselves on the back for not claiming benefits.
The ‘saint’ I thought initially was a young boy who had been paralysed in a motorbike accident whose mother was nursing him and who was CLEARLY entitled to all the money he received in payments. Actually, the saint was the Citizens Advice Bureau advisor who had told the family about all the benefits he had been entitled to.
This part was equally nauseating. Firstly, the CAB advisor seemed quite happy to present herself as a saint. I know they do a good job – don’t get me wrong – I’ve come across countless amazing CAB advisors but it is hardly deserving of sainthood to advise someone who is very clearly an eligible recipient of their benefits. Also, alluding to this as ‘sainthood’ is a little cloying to say the least.
It places an almost Victorian overlay of Deserving and Undeserving Disability. This young man clearly deserves our support. He looks the part and is well-spoken and able to talk to the cameras about his disability.
I did have a brief thought about what the role of social services would have been in this case and how much they might have been deserving or not of ‘sainthood’ but to be honest, I’m glad they steered well away from this condescending and nauseating programme.
I also wonder if it was a coincidence (and I’m sure it wasn’t intentionally done) that the person who defrauded the benefit system was an older black woman as opposed to a younger white man who was rightly receiving his entitlements and doing so ‘fairly’ according to the programme. I know it might be complete coincidence and I don’t doubt it wasn’t intentional but it does build on subconscious (or perhaps fully formed) prejudices and compound them which can be a dangerous thing in tough economic times.
Why did I continue to watch it? I was tempted to switch over but then decided I might write about it… look what I do for you, dear Reader!
In the end the feeling I was left with was not a satisfaction that my tax paying money was funding a poor, disabled boy and that police were working to route out the con merchant grandmother who was ruthlessly defrauding the state but an immense discomfort that I don’t need the payment of my tax money to be justified to me.
I don’t want or care to be frank, whether those who receive ESA and DLA etc are good and honest people or not – they are entitled to that money regardless and no-one receiving a benefit to which they are entitled should EVER have to justify how they spend that money to anyone – least of all, me, an average taxpayer.
Do we forget that people who don’t work are probably taxed the most harshly through indirect taxes? We are ALL taxpayers and I don’t want to feel that my taxes should be making me feel better. My taxes are also paying for the Trident Programme and I feel much more strongly about that than the odd benefit fraud to be honest – and whatever the media perception in – I remain convinced that there are far more people not claiming what they should and are entitled to than those who defraud the system.
I don’t WANT to live in an society that does not have a fair benefit system.
I can’t promise I’ll watch the next episode because this one was too much to stomach.
And I really really don’t want my TV licence to be paying for such utter, pointless, cloying and irrelevant tripe.



I will just ignore 'tl;dr' comments for this alright?

AEDIC

Johro wrote: »

I watch the english television channels as I have a free to air satellite box and no Irish channels are yet, if ever, available on it, so I've a choice of BBC, ITV, Channel 4 and such, and I'm just wondering if anyone else has noticed the depresssing negativity, and regularity, of shows like 'Saints and Scroungers' (in particular, and featuring No. 1 annoying twat Dominic Littlewood of 'Don't get done, get Dom' fame), 'Grimefighters', 'Tricks of the Tradesmen', and some the names of which I don't remember at the minute, one about fly tipping and another one which no doubt also features the words 'conned' and 'cheats', your taxes' and 'rotten tricks' etc.
Then there are the 'Cowboy Builders', 'The Cowboy Trap' and 'Neighbours from Hell' type of shows to round it all off nicely, all giving us the impression that every living soul is just itching to defraud us, con us, assault us, rip us off for every penny we got. Lovely stuff.
Does it annoy anyone else?
The media play a huge role in this as well, with newspaper articles talking about the supposedly massive problem of 'benefit cheats' when in reality they number less than 0.5% of welfare recipients.
Is it just about a need to feel 'better than them'?
It just pisses me off that so much of what is essentially supposed to pass for entertainment is really just posing 'us and them' scenarios and frankly hate-mongering when there are so many more people willing to volunteer for all sorts of causes and there are many more examples of people doing nice things for each other that never get an airing.

Dont watch it and it wont annoy you. It doesn't have to go away, if you are not aware of it then it won't bother you. or are you suggesting that you should be the arbiter of what people do want to watch?

Johro

The King of Moo wrote: »

The worst, for me, is Don't Tell the Bride, though the hatred is all within the programme itself. It's predicated on causing friction between engaged couple during a period which would ordinarily be stressful for them, all for our amusement. I don't see the entertainment value in the look of profound disappointment on a woman's face when she sees that the gobshi*e she's marrying has chosen to have the ceremony in the neighbour's field in January, because she first saw a horse there as a child or something, and he spent all the money on booking Paintball for the reception.

What really bugs me, though, which I've asked many a time, is why the couple don't just agree about what they want beforehand, then pretend that the fiancé is choosing everything himself.

For me, what they all seem to have in common is the way they work to make someone on the show, the victim of course, cry for the camera.
Even on shows like 'The Cowboy Trap, (which ultimately isn't a trap, names and shames nobody, and just tells us what nasty people are out there to get us) relentlessly asks people to tell us exactly how it made them feel while the camera moves in for the close up and waits for the tears. This is real entertainment after all, and at the end of it, we can all pat ourselves on the back for being better than them.

Johro

AEDIC wrote: »

Dont watch it and it wont annoy you. It doesn't have to go away, if you are not aware of it then it won't bother you. or are you suggesting that you should be the arbiter of what people do want to watch?

No. That's what they do.

AEDIC

Johro wrote: »

No. That's what they do.

haha...well good job that Tv's still come supplied with an off button then

Johro

AEDIC wrote: »

Dont watch it and it wont annoy you. It doesn't have to go away, if you are not aware of it then it won't bother you. or are you suggesting that you should be the arbiter of what people do want to watch?

Btw, I'm hardly telling people what to watch or not to watch, neither should you, I just said what I think off those shows and asked if they annoy anyone else. If it doesn't bother you, fine.
I'm not asking for a ban on that type of programming, I'm pointing out it makes people suspicious and fearful when these type of **** are in a minority.

Latchy

I was watching 'Saints and Scroungers' last week and it focused on somebody in a responsible position of the Benefits dept who was directing false claims to a friends bank account of which they shared the money ...to the tune of £175,000 .How many more like her out there ?

Another episode showed a woman who was claiming for 9 foster children which after investigation showed 5 didn't exist at all and the woman was actually using the money she had falsely claimed ( similar to the previous figure above ) to keep an assortment on animals in her filthy house .

On the cowboy builders show ,there are so many cowboys out there just waiting to take money of gullible and vulnerable people and what's even more ironic is that one of the presenters who rides around on the motorbike ( the Portuguese guy) was himself brought to court last month , found guilty and jailed for housing Benefit fraud .

I do agree with you OP about that Dom guy , he does come across very annoying , self righteous and some of these programs would have us believe that every other person is out to scam and rip us off but in country the size of the UK there are thousands out there who at first easy chance , will do just that .

Johro

Latchy wrote: »

I was watching 'Saints and Scroungers' last week and it focused on somebody in a responsible position of the Benefits dept who was directing false claims to a friends bank account of which they shared the money ...to the tune of £175,000 .How many more like her out there ?

Another episode showed a woman who was claiming for 9 foster children which after investigation showed 5 didn't exist at all and the woman was actually using the money she had falsely claimed ( similar to the previous figure above ) to keep an assortment on animals in her filthy house .

On the cowboy builders show ,there are so many cowboys out there just waiting to take money of gullible and vulnerable people and what's even more ironic is that one of the presenters who rides around on the motorbike ( the Portuguese guy) was himself brought to court last month , found guilty and jailed for housing Benefit fraud .

I do agree with you OP about that Dom guy , he does come across very annoying , self righteous and some of these programs would have us believe that every other person is out to scam and rip us off but in country the size of the UK there are thousands out there who at first easy chance , will do just that .

0.5% of people in receipt of benefit, apparently.
I won't argue with any of that, as I said, I know there are cunts out there just waiting for their quick pay out, in the case of cowboy builders and such, I just feel that there's so much of that type of show around I can imagine pensioners are afraid to open their door to anybody, even though most people would have good intentions and just want to help. It makes people paranoid and uneasy and suspicious to draw so much attention to what comparatively amounts to a handful of reprobates.

Irish Guitarist

The American ones are worse. There's one called Hardcore Pawn which is a really low brow series set in a pawn shop. Even the title is a rip off of Pawn Stars. People come in trying to sell absolute crap like seven year old laptops without a power supply or try to sell a fake gold pair of earrings for $200. Some people even come in and remove gold teeth from their mouth and ask if the shop will buy them. If the pawnbroker isn't interested or offers a low amount the person usually starts swearing and threatening to blow the shop up before they're dragged out of the shop by a seven foot security guard. The owner, a really creepy looking individual called Les Gold, will stand safely behind the security guard acting tough saying things like "I'm a hard ass, no one messes with me".

On the rare occasion that someone brings in a valuable item they might end up selling it for something like $40 when it could be worth $1000. Les Gold then says "we're here to help".

It's absolutely terrible and has no redeeming factors whatsoever but for some reason I find it compelling viewing, which worries me.

Johro

Irish Guitarist wrote: »

The American ones are worse.

Well that's always true, in every case. Ever. :pac:

Latchy

Johro wrote: »

I can imagine pensioners are afraid to open their door to anybody, even though most people would have good intentions and just want to help. It makes people paranoid and uneasy and suspicious to draw so much attention to what comparatively amounts to a handful of reprobates.

You see that's the problem ,like how many pensioners have been brutally assaulted in their homes and died as a result ? I can think of 3 recent cases of top of my head here in UK. We live in times were you can't really trust anybody but I take your point .




I love Storage Wars ..that's my fav American tv show at the moement :pac:

Johro

Latchy wrote: »

You see that's the problem ,like how many pensioners have been brutally assaulted in their homes and died as a result ? I can think of 3 recent cases of top of my head here in UK. We live in times were you can't really trust anybody but I take your point .




I love Storage Wars ..that's my fav American tv show at the moement :pac:

That's my point. The idea that 'we can't really trust anybody' which we keep getting rammed down our throats by tv shows and the news media. Happily, the reality is different.
I do realise though that we have to be aware of what can and does happen, but let's keep things in perspective is all.

Latchy

Johro wrote: »

That's my point. The idea that 'we can't really trust anybody' which we keep getting rammed down our throats by tv shows and the news media. Happily, the reality is different.
I do realise though that we have to be aware of what can and does happen, but let's keep things in perspective is all.

I think that condescending attitude has also spread to other tv shows and media which leaves you feeling like you've just had your intelligence insulted ,especially as you say how people in general ( famous and ordinary) are sometimes portrayed .

donegal100

Don't hate the players... hate the game