'Enough is Enough' - Lance Armstrong

Bluefoam

No

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

I don't think he's infallible and I believe he's being unfair here.

I'm not trying to be funny, or accuse Wiggins of anything... but that sounds very similar to what people said regarding Kimmage/Armstrong...

Halloween Jack

Vladimir Kurtains wrote: »

Wiggins can't even sue him for libel because, whatever the verdict, he'll lose the PR war by becoming "the guy who sued Paul Kimmage".

I like Kimmage and I think he's done a lot of courageous things. But I don't think he's infallible and I believe he's being unfair here.

It could be he's a bit miffed about being denied access for the tour or whatever, and maybe he's going a bit far, but the parallels are there and plenty of posters in this thread have commented on them.

Dermot Illogical

No

My read of the current situation:

<Public: "They're all doped up. Stupid sport anyway.">
Current pros: "That's all in the past."
Past pros: "I did it cuz everyone else did and I was left with no choice."
Paul Kimmage: "Trust no-one!"
Anti-doping bodies: "We need root and branch reformation."
Pat McQuaid: "Sure we'll look into it, but it's going to take some time."
</Public: "They're all doped up. Stupid sport anyway.">

Did I miss anything?

letape

No

bedirect wrote: »

his interview with Ophrey is on the discovery channell at 2am on Friday morning

Just checked entertainment.ie and in their TV listings The Discovery Channel doesn't start broadcasting until 6am. They are showing the interview at 8pm on Friday evening but are you sure that they are also broadcasting it live at 2am?

martingriff

No

I must wonder if he is coming clean now he must have something on someone. If he is going down he will bring everyone else with him. There must be other people and are now worried with what Armstrong will say.

I just hope this does not damage the charity whatever else and he steps well away from it. He is bad but to say he is the most evil is not true.

ThisRegard

No

RobFowl wrote: »

Personally I think Kimmage is out of order the way he's accusing Wiggins of doping.

When did he accuse him of doping ?

letape wrote: »

Just checked entertainment.ie and in their TV listings The Discovery Channel doesn't start broadcasting until 6am. They are showing the interview at 8pm on Friday evening but are you sure that they are also broadcasting it live at 2am?

Maybe on NTL but on Sky it broadcasts 24 hours.

Malari

No

letape wrote: »

Just checked entertainment.ie and in their TV listings The Discovery Channel doesn't start broadcasting until 6am. They are showing the interview at 8pm on Friday evening but are you sure that they are also broadcasting it live at 2am?

http://entertainment.ie/tv/display.asp?channelid=169&programme=&programme_day=17+January+2013&programme_time=time8&submit=Search

Discovery - using performance enhancing drugs to keep going all night.

mcgratheoin

No

RobFowl wrote: »

Dave Brailsford zero tolerance policy is a bit bizarre but does that mean every team who use anyone who's been associated with doping in the past is automatically full of dopers??

Not at all, but I think you're missing the point a bit in relation to Sky. As has been mentioned already here, if you look at Garmin and the attitudes towards them, there is definitely room in the peleton for those with a doping past. The problem with Sky is that they said one thing and then completely went and did the opposite. When they were formed Brailsford said that they'd have a zero-tolerance policy towards anyone with a dodgy past - this was why they didn't offer David Millar a role. In his defence, Kimmage questioned this decision at the time and said that he thought Millar would be a good fit for Sky.

The criticism that Sky have received is not because of their policy, it's because they said one thing and then went and ignored their own statements. At best, one of the most professionally run teams can be accused of complete naivety, and at worst it was a manipulative attempt to falsely gain the moral high ground. It appears to the public that Sky trumpeted a severe no-doping policy, but in fact implemented a don't ask, don't tell policy in relation to riders and other staff that they knew had doped. Once this was commented upon by the media, including the oft-vilified Kimmage, Sky returned to their zero-tolerance stance.

Personally, I think Sky have lots of questions to answer, amongst them -

1. Given your refusal to hire David Millar due to his doping history, can you clearly articulate what the initial criteria were for employment with Team Sky
2. Why did you hire a doctor with such strong links to such an extensive doping programme?
3. Did you fully investigate and question all your staff prior to hiring about their possible past doping offences?
4. If not, then why not?
5. If yes, then how did Sean Yates, Steven de Jongh and Bobby Julich respond?
6. Can you clearly define your current criteria for hiring riders? What constitutes for Team Sky an involvement with doping?

Cienciano

No

Dermot Illogical wrote: »

My read of the current situation:

<Public: "They're all doped up. Stupid sport anyway.">
Current pros: "That's all in the past."
Past pros: "I did it cuz everyone else did and I was left with no choice."
Paul Kimmage: "Trust no-one!"
Anti-doping bodies: "We need root and branch reformation."
Pat McQuaid: "Sure we'll look into it, but it's going to take some time."
</Public: "They're all doped up. Stupid sport anyway.">

Did I miss anything?

Yes
Lance: I beat cancer

Beasty

No

Bluefoam wrote: »

I'm not trying to be funny, or accuse Wiggins of anything... but that sounds very similar to what people said regarding Kimmage/Armstrong...

The implications behind what you are saying are quite clear. I have already issued one in-thread warning about resurrecting the Wiggins discussion in this thread. Unlike that one, this thread is unlikely to be closed anytime soon, and hence if posters continue posting things that coud be read as suggesting anyone who is not a proven doper has benefited from PEDs then we will have to start dishing out cards and bans

Now back to the topic, which is Armstrong

Any questions, PM me - do not respond in thread

velo.2010

So this is a simulcast of the programme going out on Oprah's OWN channel. Expect at least 30 odd minutes of adverts, US style! At 2 hours a show I don't think I could manage two nights in a row at that early hour. Wouldn't survive the 'Vietnam' spin on Saturday morning! (Tired smiley)

lennymc

No

velo.2010 wrote: »

So this is a simulcast of the programme going out on Oprah's OWN channel. Expect at least 30 odd minutes of adverts, US style! At 2 hours a show I don't think I could manage two nights in a row at that early hour. Wouldn't survive the 'Vietnam' spin on Saturday morning! (Tired smiley)

sky plus!

Plastik

No

velo.2010 wrote: »

So this is a simulcast of the programme going out on Oprah's OWN channel. Expect at least 30 odd minutes of adverts, US style! At 2 hours a show I don't think I could manage two nights in a row at that early hour. Wouldn't survive the 'Vietnam' spin on Saturday morning! (Tired smiley)

But sure that's why it's now on over two nights! Rumour was that advertising slots were going at near SuperBowl prices. Cha-ching.

MPFG

No

Plastik wrote: »

But sure that's why it's now on over two nights! Rumour was that advertising slots were going at near SuperBowl prices. Cha-ching.

I see Plastik you have got your ear to the ground and the inside track on the mercurial world of American media advert prices :-)

Beasty

No

2 more votes in the "No" camp since Oprah indicated earlier in the week that there would be a confession :rolleyes:

... anyway, maybe we should re-set the vote now to "who's staying up all night to watch it?"

patmac

No

Not sure if this has been posted before but something to keep you amused during the adverts. I won't be staying up myself personally so I would appreciate if someone would fill this in for me. I doubt he will say the last one however unles he really comes clean.

velo.2010

lennymc wrote: »

sky plus!

Much prefer to watch it live of course but not at that hour. Recording a 'must see' TV show and watching it later is never the same as watching go out at the advertised time along with everyone else tuning in to see what he says.

I believe they're not going to touch the interview as it was recorded, ie, not heavily edit it and keeping the 'good stuff' until the second show. Given the nature of the subject however, I get the feeling that the deeper detail will come later in the interview (second episode) after he confirms his years of doping in the first. I'll just have to keep the ears plugged on Saturday morning so!

RobbieTheRobber

No

letape wrote: »

Just checked entertainment.ie and in their TV listings The Discovery Channel doesn't start broadcasting until 6am. They are showing the interview at 8pm on Friday evening but are you sure that they are also broadcasting it live at 2am?

yeah its on alright.

Check out the upc guide http://tv-guide.upc.ie/TV/

Colonialboy

Yes, but he's still great

Plastik wrote: »

But sure that's why it's now on over two nights! Rumour was that advertising slots were going at near SuperBowl prices. Cha-ching.

yep the big picture.. but dont mention the big picture some people round gets fierce upset if you mention the big picture ... what big picture who said that ..wasnt me nothing to see here move along.

We are all playing the same game as LA falls from grace as we played during his rise to the top, the same game that created the beast in the first place.

Beasty

No

Colonialboy wrote: »

the same game that created the beast in the first place.

:eek:

petethedrummer

No

RobFowl wrote: »

With Wiggins there was a Doctor who may have been involved in doping at Rabobank prior to 2006 and thats pretty much it....
Kimmage has earned a lot of respect for his work exposing Armstrong but by God he's pushing it with his pursuit of Wiggins.

There was also Bobby Julich, Sean Yates (Motoman's buddy) and a number of riders and the phony bull**** about not knowing their past. And the pledges. :rolleyes:

Wiggins' problem is not Kimmage, it's that Brailsford thinks the public and journalists are mugs. And this Zero Tolerance policy only came in October. Under pressure form the media. They didn't have a zero tolerance policy until then.

AlmostQuick

Yes, but he's still great

The Onion gets the scoop!
http://www.theonion.com/articles/lance-armstrong-admits-to-using-performanceenhanci,30912/

SeantheMan

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tlTr2GSVUGg

wonderfullife

No

found this a powerful piece of writing and illustrates i'm sure the bitterness a lot will feel who were duped by Lance:

http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/8852974/lance-armstrong-history-lying

nipper67

Yes, but he's still great

luckly lance did not ride his bike while taking drugs or have sexual relations with a bike either come on give him credit for some thing look what tiger done and billy Clinton they lied and cheated and took something for performance

MPFG

No

Cav throwing a fit about being asked about Armstrong

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-PGsHoVYTk&feature=youtu.be

fat bloke

No

MPFG wrote: »

Cav throwing a fit about being asked about Armstrong

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R-PGsHoVYTk&feature=youtu.be

Ha ha ha. That's classic. It's actually kinda nice to see that the pro's aren't that far removed at all from your average odd-as-two-left-feet, cranky-cnut-syndrome-suffering, Dublin club cyclist!

petethedrummer

No

Kohl isn't surprised that Lance doped.

“It won’t shock anyone anymore if Armstrong admits everything,” Kohl told the Austria Press Agency.

“There won’t be a loud bang. Everyone knows that he did it. When you think of everything that’s come out in the last 10 years, then you know how this sport works … we’ll never root it (doping) out.”
http://velonews.competitor.com/2013/01/news/bradley-wiggins-armstrong-admission-would-write-off-nineties-as-lost-decade_271534

shaungil

wonderfullife wrote: »

found this a powerful piece of writing and illustrates i'm sure the bitterness a lot will feel who were duped by Lance:

http://espn.go.com/espn/story/_/id/8852974/lance-armstrong-history-lying

Oh boo hoo all the poor sucker who believed a liar and peddled the story Calls himself a journalist. Pathetic if he'd been half way decent as a jouno then he wouldn't have been suckered in.

So the circus continues tonight. I reckon we'll hear a lot of " I've made mistakes, who hasn'T?" "Remember If I did cheat it was just to level the playing field" "Once I started and the charity did so well and inpired so many I couldn't top"" It wasn't for me it was for the charity"
"It was like that wen I got here" " An older boy made me do it" " Me no speakie the language"

Maybe maybe some good will come out of it and he'll bring down the head honchos in the UCI but he only wants to redeem himself in the eyes of the American public and not face total ruin. book in a few months and then a chat show with Martha Stewart.

fat bloke

No

“There’s a lot of angry people about,” Wiggins told Sky News in an interview conducted at his Team Sky training camp in Madeira. “They need that closure in their life because they’ve been battling for so long for this."

That's a Wiggins quote from the above article. Is this what has been twisted into his attack on "bitter people like Kimmage"??? Because the above reads nothing like that to me.