'Enough is Enough' - Lance Armstrong

Beasty

No

Cienciano wrote: »

It's pretty much to promote itself. Ads on tv for livestrong, ads at football matches for it. Advertising "livestrong" is money towards "cancer awareness".
And awareness for Livestrong is awareness for Lance.
It was money well spend, me and all my friends never knew what cancer was till we saw yellow wristbands on people.

I would suggest you check the livestrong.org website, have a look at the accounts, see what they actually do, if you want an informed view of the charity, its objectives and where the money goes.

letape

No

From Eurosport.com:

"Cycling - Schleck believes Armstrong was clean after comeback

Andy Schleck, who was retroactively awarded the 2010 Tour de France win last year, believes Lance Armstrong when the American says he did not dope after his comeback".

This stuff is hard to believe...

Fr D Maugire

No

Donelson wrote: »

I don't get all this outrage, he is no worse than any other cheat. yes he was a ruthless peace of work. but I seriously doubt the rest of pro cycling are cuddle teddy bears. compare lance to someone like Michael shumacker how deliberately crashed into his opponent to win and in the process risked their lives. would the world be a better place with out this crap, absolute yes! but it is part of human nature.

If you don't understand why Armstrong is viewed as worse than other dopers, you shouldn't really be commenting then.

Donelson

No

Fr D Maugire wrote: »

If you don't understand why Armstrong is viewed as worse than other dopers, you shouldn't really be commenting then.

you have a very persuasive argument, how could I have been so wrong, I bow to your superior analysis and thank you for enlightening me.

Fr D Maugire

No

Donelson wrote: »

you have a very persuasive argument, how could I have been so wrong, I bow to your superior analysis and thank you for enlightening me.

Go and do the research and then you will know why he is viewed as much worse than others. Much of the info is within this thread.

Diarmuid

No

letape wrote: »

"Cycling - Schleck believes Armstrong was clean after comeback

Says more about the Schlecks than Lance.

Likewise Stuart O Grady

''Lance deceived everybody on the planet, us included, so obviously we wanted to believe it also - that he was winning the Tours clean,'' O'Grady said.

Dear pro peleton. Fcuk you too.

Donelson

No

Fr D Maugire wrote: »

Go and do the research and then you will know why he is viewed as much worse than others. Much of the info is within this thread.

ok, I'll leave it here. I'm sure with time opinions will mellow. will I watch the tour this year, yes, will there be cheats in the race yes. will there be a new lance in the next generation yes, will that person be good enough to win. let's wait and see.

Fr D Maugire

No

Donelson wrote: »

ok, I'll leave it here. I'm sure with time opinions will mellow. will I watch the tour this year, yes, will there be cheats in the race yes. will there be a new lance in the next generation yes, will that person be good enough to win. let's wait and see.

No there wont be another Lance in the new generation. There will surely be dopers but not another Lance, there is only one Lance.

G2ECE

No

Donelson wrote: »

ok, I'll leave it here. I'm sure with time opinions will mellow. will I watch the tour this year, yes, will there be cheats in the race yes. will there be a new lance in the next generation yes, will that person be good enough to win. let's wait and see.

If it was just doping people would get over it, Lance however went on a crusade, suing people for telling the truth, crushed peoples livelihoods etc. I am not aware of any other cyclist or sportsperson that went to such extreme lengths to cover up their cheating. He is probably the worst example of a sportsperson in history bar none.

Captain Havoc

Just finished watching and here's my summary:

I did that **** that it's been proven what I did, except the stuff that could get me sent to prison. Bull****, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, sorry, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, Bull****, I'm a jerk, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, Bull****.

Fr D Maugire

No

Captain Havoc wrote: »

Just finished watching and here's my summary:

I did that **** that it's been proven what I did, except the stuff that could get me sent to prison. Bull****, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, sorry, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, Bull****, I'm a jerk, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, Bull****.

Incredible to think a guy who has lied for so long would go on a TV show to do a confessional and then continue to lie even more.

Beasty

No

Fr D Maugire wrote: »

Incredible to think a guy who has lied for so long would go on a TV show to do a confessional and then continue to lie even more.

The Cap'n has done a TV show?:D

petethedrummer

No

Where does Lance go from here. The admission at the start means that all the defenders/believers/deluded are betrayed or pretending to be betrayed and can't defend him anymore.

Anyone who never believed is unhappy with partial admissions.

So now he has noone on his side. Poor old Lance. No friends. Even Mathew McCauaghnaheyy will probably desert him.

RobFowl

No

petethedrummer wrote: »

Where does Lance go from here. The admission at the start means that all the defenders/believers/deluded are betrayed or pretending to be betrayed and can't defend him anymore.

Anyone who never believed is unhappy with partial admissions.

So now he has noone on his side. Poor old Lance. No friends. Even Mathew McCauaghnaheyy will probably desert him.

I feel he's made a start and am giving him the benefit of the doubt for the time being. He's finished in cycling but I hope he finds a fulfilling role in life.

Ken.

No

http://www.rte.ie/ten/2013/0119/abramsj.html

JJ Abrams has reportedly bought the film rights to a future biography of Lance Armstrong.
Deadline reports that the director has teamed up with his Bad Robot partner Bryan Burk with Paramount Pictures to make the purchase.
The book, which is called Cycle Of Lies: The Fall Of Lance Armstrong, is at the proposal stage at the moment, and will be written by New York Times reporter Juliet Macur.
Macur, who has covered Armstrong's story for over a decade, has signed a deal with HarperCollins for the book.

leftism

No

Fr D Maugire wrote: »

No there wont be another Lance in the new generation. There will surely be dopers but not another Lance, there is only one Lance.

God i hope you're right... I couldn't take another 15 years of self-righteous drivel.

MPFG

No

Here's an interview with Lance's (da dah) ....BIKE .......

https://www.youtube.com/embed/P3Kvfke0sU0

I think he knew all along !

leftism

No

RobFowl wrote: »

I feel he's made a start and am giving him the benefit of the doubt for the time being. He's finished in cycling but I hope he finds a fulfilling role in life.

What part are you giving him the benefit of the doubt on exactly???

If it's the 09 and 10 tours, then i think you really need to reconsider your position...

doomed

No

ken wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/ten/2013/0119/abramsj.html

JJ Abrams has reportedly bought the film rights to a future biography of Lance Armstrong.
Deadline reports that the director has teamed up with his Bad Robot partner Bryan Burk with Paramount Pictures to make the purchase.
The book, which is called Cycle Of Lies: The Fall Of Lance Armstrong, is at the proposal stage at the moment, and will be written by New York Times reporter Juliet Macur.
Macur, who has covered Armstrong's story for over a decade, has signed a deal with HarperCollins for the book.

OK but if that doesn't work how about

Dope Pedaller
The lie of a needle
Lying bastard tries to weasel out of years of cheating (not as catchy)

Capt'n Midnight

No

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

What does cancer awareness mean?. It sounds like a silly question maybe it is but if i give 50 euro to cancer awareness what does people get back fRom it. Should I give it to research instead.

Steve Jobs died because he tried to fight cancer instead of getting medical attention.

And it's unlikely that he wasn't able to access information so it's arguable that there is a need for yet another source of information on cancer.

http://www.cdc.gov/cancer/ - real information on cancer

Far too much bad information on cancer three out of four facial "cancer" detecting apps for smartphones gave failed to recognise genuine examples :mad:


TBH you'd probably save more lives by banning any pseudoscience claims about cancer causes and treatments.

Cienciano

No

Love the finish from Kimmage at the bottom of this article:

Here's my bottom line.

In the autumn of 1993, Greg LeMond and his wife, Kathy, were sitting at home in the suburbs of Minneapolis, when they received a visit from Linda Mooneyham, the three-times Tour de France winner has recalled. Her 21-year-old son, Lance Armstrong, had just become the world champion and she had travelled from her home in Texas for advice.

"What does he do now?" she asked. "What does he do with his money?"

"Well, let him find an agent – a good one with an attorney," LeMond replied. "And one word of advice – just be his mom."

They sat on the porch for a while and then moved inside to the kitchen. Linda had something else on her mind: "How do I make him less of an asshole. He doesn't care about anyone."

"Well," LeMond replied. "I can't help you there."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2013/jan/19/lance-armstrong-cycling

leftism

No

Seeing how well Lance courted the Hollywood elite (Stiller, Williams, Mcconaughey et al.) i wouldn't be too optimistic on the quality of that particular flick...

I'd love to see a couple of European Indie film producers get together and have a crack at a movie. It doesn't even need to be all about Lance, just about the culture in cycling during the 90's and 00's. Surely someone in French cinema could pull off a decent movie that accurately depicts the state of the sport 10 years ago!

Capt'n Midnight

No

Captain Havoc wrote: »

Just finished watching and here's my summary:

I did that **** that it's been proven what I did, except the stuff that could get me sent to prison. Bull****, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, sorry, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, Bull****, I'm a jerk, Bull****, Bull****, cancer, Bull****, Bull****, Bull****.

you forgot Bully.

And no describing yourself as a Bully N+1 times doesn't excuse your behaviour.

leftism

No

Cienciano wrote: »

Love the finish from Kimmage at the bottom of this article:




http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2013/jan/19/lance-armstrong-cycling

Great article. Kimmage really is an excellent sports writer. That the Times had let him go because of the pressure from Armstrong's legal team only highlights the injustice that the prick has caused people...

Ash.J.Williams

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

agre ed totally that Lance wasn't the only one

and yes lots of people willingly doped

but you have to feel sorry for the poor bastards who were pressurised into a lifestyle where if their heart alarm's went off in the middle of the night a 10 minute spin on the rollers was essential if you ever wanted to wake up again in the morning

Could you explain this to me? Re heart alarms and rollers

Hermy

No

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Could you explain this to me? Re heart alarms and rollers

Blood doping and EPO thickens the blood to such an extent that heart failure may occur during sleep so riders set their alarm clocks to wake them every two hours so they could do some exercise to keep the blood flowing.

Capt'n Midnight

No

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Could you explain this to me? Re heart alarms and rollers

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling/blood-on-the-handlebars-20121020-27ykn.html

In Matt Rendell's celebrated 2007 book The Death of Marco Pantani, about the Italian Tour de France winner who died (of cocaine use) in 2004, there's an extraordinary account of how riders - presumed to be using EPO - would sleep with heart monitors that would have an alarm in the event their resting heart rate dropped below a dangerous number. They would get up in the middle of the night, jump on their bikes and ride hard, in order to restore their heart rate to a safe level.

''During the day we live to ride, and at night we ride to stay alive,'' was a vivid quote attributed to one rider

Also this

Broadcaster Francis Leach put it well when he compared Armstrong to the US financial institutions that were bailed out because they were ''too big to fail''.

If Lance went down, so did everyone else. Even those who are pristine will be tainted, of course, in the same way Johnson's fall in 1988 created scepticism in millions of minds about whether anyone at the top was really clean. As with most scandals in the political realm, the questions have turned from ''who did what'' to ''who knew what?''

Colonialboy

Yes, but he's still great

I thought two of the best interviews regarding where we are in this whole circus were on Newstalk yesterday afternoon.

Daniel Coyle who wrote 'The Secre Race' - Tyler Hamiltons account of doping and cover ups.... he made some great points. How it took many hours (200+) and months to get Tyler to admit to everything. That we cant expect Lance to sit there and for it all to come out at once. Its too big a story, plus the fact this happened years ago so facts figures dates all need to be checked. He spoke of how he witnessd Lance launch into a vicious tirade against Walsh when he presented drafts of an earlier book he wrote about Lance... think he spoke of how there was an vicious animal inside Lance and that that person hasnt gone away, and he saw bits of him being kept in check during the Oprah show.

David Walsh spoke with great grace and dignity , I felt really sorry for him when speaking of his sons loss. Learnt alot about humanity listening to him. Himself and kimage are on the same side but have different styles.

Didnt watch Part 2 until last night, I though Lance was credible on the emotion part , if you have kids I could empathise with the reaction I saw. I really think oprah did a great job, remember this was an interview not an investigation, if she went all out attack attack attack it would have been farce and he would have had his defenses up but she wormed inside him and we saw the character that he is. Its up to UCI,WADA etc to get him to spill the beans on the specifics.

Its a great complex story, remember America can be a pretty brutal place, Id see parts of LA as a product of that society as much as a flawed individual. I thought it interesting how he said it snowballed, I never considered that, you know you win a TDF, and start fighting against the dope allegations, all riders do that fight against the first allegations and then everything grows gets 'momentum' and he had more allegations to fight but he had bigger weaponry to fight against them.

T-K-O

Colonialboy: Excellent post

funnights74

No

Hermy wrote: »

Blood doping and EPO thickens the blood to such an extent that heart failure may occur during sleep so riders set their alarm clocks to wake them every two hours so they could do some exercise to keep the blood flowing.

A friend of mine is on dialysis, one of the side effects of the treatment, and the illness is that red blood cells are damaged or destroyed so to boost the red blood cell count they are given EPO injections so to bring it back to near normal levels. If a person is injected with EPO just for the sole purpose of boosting red blood cells, just to gain a sporting advantage then the side effects may lead to blood clotting which may prove fatal.
I remember from the mid 90's to the mid naughties that a few young cyclists on the continent died unexpectedly in their sleep.
Post mortems revealed that blood clots/ aneurysms were responsible for their fatalities. No conclusive link was ever made between these deaths and EPO/ Blood doping practices but the stricter drug testing procedures and the biological passports saw the number of fatalities drop away dramatically.