'Enough is Enough' - Lance Armstrong

FISMA

So if Lance forfeits his Tour de France wins and the organizers decide to let 2nd place become first and so on, then Ulrich, an admitted doper, becomes a 4 Tour Champion!

Justice at last!:D

Diarmuid

No

FISMA wrote: »

So if Lance forfeits his Tour de France wins and the organizers decide to let 2nd place become first and so on,

they did? When?

tfrancer

Originally Posted by mcgratheoin:
I hate this insinuation that you can beat cancer if you try hard enough.
Optimism helps people cope with cancer. It doesn't cure it.


It appears that the Lance-haters are also cancer experts?!

on_the_nickel

No

Still cheating I see.

http://app.strava.com/rides/20044757

AstraMonti

No

Pisco Sour wrote: »

Did anybody see that report on Eurosportnews of Armstrong giving a cancer conference speach in Montreal? His quote was more or less the below:

"Hi, I'd like to introduce myself. My name is Lance Armstrong. I am a cancer survivor. I'm a father of 5.....[PAUSE, ARROGANT SMIRK] and that's right, I won the Tour de France 7 times".

[MASS APPLAUSE]

:mad::mad::mad:

What did you expect? It's like you are expecting to go to church to hear about atheism

Cienciano

No

With all the lies and bullshit from Lance, I wouldn't be surprised if his medical team came out and said he actually never even had cancer

Hermy

No

Cienciano wrote: »

With all the lies and bullshit from Lance, I wouldn't be surprised if his medical team came out and said he actually never even had cancer

Although it's unlikely, I was left with this distinct impression after reading From Lance to Landis.

noddy69

No

tfrancer wrote: »

Originally Posted by mcgratheoin:
I hate this insinuation that you can beat cancer if you try hard enough.
Optimism helps people cope with cancer. It doesn't cure it.


It appears that the Lance-haters are also cancer experts?!

Hold on a second now. Knowing that optimism helps people cope and not cure makes you somehow a cancer expert !!! common sense.

The comment saying lance helps people beat cancer just by talking makes him out to be a Jesus figure, that and the blind faith with which his followers spout the spin he comes out with to hide the fact he cheated.

I hate the way he uses the charity to hide behind. You also might want to look into what he actually does. Does he do these motivational speeches for free ? Is it good work and charitable if your getting huge sums of money just to appear and give people hope.

Anyway, anyone with an ounce of common sense knows that his speaking doesnt somehow make cancer go away, you dont have to be a Lance hater to see that.

ThisRegard

No

Hamilton to tell all (again) in a new book, http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/hamilton-repeat-armstrong-doping-claims-054828333.html

The first comment, naturally supporting Armstrong, is from "Phil". It can't be him, can it ?

niceonetom

No

A fittingly patronising dismemberment of Liggett.

jinkypolly

No

Great open letter rebuttal by Michael Ashenden to Liggett's insane ramblings.

http://nyvelocity.com/content/features/2012/filthy-business-indeed

Edit: Beaten to it.

Raam

No

Quite a brilliant letter.

mcgratheoin

No

Was on my way here to post the same letter - excellent response. As Daniel Patrick Moynihan said

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts"

fat bloke

No

Man, I can't believe 20 people voted no...

Outside of Lance Armstrong, I can't think why or how anyone would vote no.... and if it was an anonymous poll, even his mouse-finger would hover over the yes icon...

furiousox

No

fat bloke wrote: »

Man, I can't believe 20 people voted no...
Outside of Lance Armstrong, I can't think why or how anyone would vote no.... and if it was an anonymous poll, even his mouse-finger would hover over the yes icon...

Of the 21 names in there I only recognise 2 as regulars of the cycling forum.
I reckon some are genuine LA disciples who might have stumbled upon the poll but I think there are a few there just to take the pi$$.

therightstuff

No

http://comocyco.blogspot.ie/2012/08/and-suddenly-nothing-happened-belief.html

Apologies if link was previously posted but I got a good laugh out of it!

Lusk Doyle

No

AstraMonti wrote: »

Pisco Sour wrote: »

Did anybody see that report on Eurosportnews of Armstrong giving a cancer conference speach in Montreal? His quote was more or less the below:

"Hi, I'd like to introduce myself. My name is Lance Armstrong. I am a cancer survivor. I'm a father of 5.....[PAUSE, ARROGANT SMIRK] and that's right, I won the Tour de France 7 times".

[MASS APPLAUSE]

:mad::mad::mad:

What did you expect? It's like you are expecting to go to church to hear about atheism

Or Greece and tax paying...oh wait...

corny

No

fat bloke wrote: »

Man, I can't believe 20 people voted no...

Outside of Lance Armstrong, I can't think why or how anyone would vote no.... and if it was an anonymous poll, even his mouse-finger would hover over the yes icon...

Simple answer: they don't want to believe its true. IMO they're emotionally compromised by years of worship.

People are capable of extraordinary mental gymnastics; i could convince myself i was a cloud if i tried hard enough.;)

niceonetom

No

corny wrote: »

Simple answer: they don't want to believe its true. IMO they're emotionally compromised by years of worship.

People are capable of extraordinary mental gymnastics; i could convince myself i was a cloud if i tried hard enough.;)

I think that goes a long way towards explaining Liggett too. He can't possibly be ignorant of the facts, or plain stupid, or even that mercenary to do what he did in that SA interview. The kind of humiliating, pathetic contortions and fabrications he comes out with there have to be the product of deep emotional investment that he simply cannot face ending. He'll do anything rather than acknowledge that he, personally and directly, has been lied to, for years, by the person who he worships. Pity is a more appropriate response to him that the inevitable distain. But his time in the sport should end.

ROK ON

No

Cognitative Dissonance anyone.

irishmotorist

No

Incidentally, Phil Liggett tweeted tonight...

@PhilLiggett
I should make it quite clear. I have no business interests with Lance Armstrong as reported on http://cyclingnews.com. Please retract

@PhilLiggett
Also, my last conversation or sighting of LA is more than 15 months ago.

Raam

No

The sighting thing has been proved to be bull****.

Fr D Maugire

No

It has to be said that the Armstrong spin and PR BS has done its job good and proper. Got into a debate with 3 colleagues at work yesterday about the subject and they were all siding with him. Some of the phases used were never tested positive!!, witchunt!!, why are they doing it now!!, everyone else was doing it!!, done too much good for cycling!!, if he tested positive why wasnt he sanctioned!! how can he be sanctioned without a positive test!! the witnesses are just jealous!! etc.

Now what these guys know about cycling is less than nothing, they would struggle to name this years Tour winner but they were still defending Armstrong. In the end I said to then that I wasnt going to continue the debate as they were so clueless it was pointless.

This is what we are dealing with though, people who know so little but still buy the BS. As I said a few pages back this was the strategy the whole time, get the largely clueless general public on your side and half the battle is won. We need to see some evidence and see it soon.

marienbad

No

Fr D Maugire wrote: »

It has to be said that the Armstrong spin and PR BS has done its job good and proper. Got into a debate with 3 colleagues at work yesterday about the subject and they were all siding with him. Some of the phases used were never tested positive!!, witchunt!!, why are they doing it now!!, everyone else was doing it!!, done too much good for cycling!!, if he tested positive why wasnt he sanctioned!! how can he be sanctioned without a positive test!! the witnesses are just jealous!! etc.

Now what these guys know about cycling is less than nothing, they would struggle to name this years Tour winner but they were still defending Armstrong. In the end I said to then that I wasnt going to continue the debate as they were so clueless it was pointless.

This is what we are dealing with though, people who know so little but still buy the BS. As I said a few pages back this was the strategy the whole time, get the largely clueless general public on your side and half the battle is won. We need to see some evidence and see it soon.

That may seem to be the case right now but in the coming months and years common sense will prevail. The LA press blitz can only continue for a limited time period and the more balanced reports will begin to dominate.

A bit like this countries attitude to Michell Smith . Of course you will always have the die-hards that will never believe but they are irrelevant.

corny

No

I'm not so sure.

Some (a huge number really) people are so hopelessly trenchant it won't matter whats reported in the media. All negative press will be rationalised as just another unjustified Lance attack. Armstrong himself might have given up on arbitration but there's no ****ing way he's gonna shy away from the media war.

GT_TDI_150

No

The fact that some pro-teams still have "LIVESTRONG" on the end of the sleaves doesnt help (the one i spotted in la vuelta just now is Johan Bruyneels team tho, proving a point i suppose)

blorg

No

Cover story in Newsweek: Lance is not contesting the charges 'for the sake of the sport,' is probably not guilty (all those tests,) is the subject of a witch hunt from the evil worthless Travis, and even if he is guilty it doesn't matter as everyone else was doing it and so he was just levelling the playing field, making it a fair competition.

The PR job is just amazing. I think the last one there is the seed Lance wants planted, in the long term everyone is going to have to concede he doped, but as everyone else did too, Lance was playing fair!

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2012/08/26/buzz-bissinger-still-believes-in-lance-armstrong.html

“I am more at ease and at peace than I have been in 10 years,” he told me in an exclusive phone interview with Newsweek. “I am focused on today and what will happen in the future.”

His thinking, he told me, was that “we’ve got to stop with this. For my own mental health. For my family. For the foundation. And for the sport of cycling. Cycling doesn’t need this.”

Oryx

No

The sport does need this. The irony is that doping is a cancer, that is killing the sport. And it is a VERY dangerous thing to suggest to casual observers that 'everyone doing it' is ok. If that alone is Lance's legacy - creating the notion that everyone doping creates a level playing field, then he has done more damage than ever. That is the beginning of the end for all sport, if doping becomes slowly and insidiously acceptable.

marienbad

No

corny wrote: »

I'm not so sure.

Some (a huge number really) people are so hopelessly trenchant it won't matter whats reported in the media. All negative press will be rationalised as just another unjustified Lance attack. Armstrong himself might have given up on arbitration but there's no ****ing way he's gonna shy away from the media war.

Yeah - but that is just in the short term- long term he will be seen for what he is. Particularly as the other USADA cases continue to arbitration and all the info starts coming out. That and the spate of boooks articles lawsuits begins to grow. I presume he can no longer use his legal team to effectively impose gagging orders on anyone that disagrees with him.

But ultimately what is required is to finally flush out that cabal at UCI and unless that is done it may all be for nothing. Last chance saloon really.

FISMA

corny wrote: »

Some (a huge number really) people are so hopelessly trenchant it won't matter whats reported in the media. All negative press will be rationalised as just another unjustified Lance attack. Armstrong himself might have given up on arbitration but there's no ****ing way he's gonna shy away from the media war.

Others still believe that you are innocent until proven guilty.

Just release the data that proves his guilt.

It always makes me wonder the strength of a prosecutor's "evidence," when they take the battle to the media or public opinion. It is one of those cases that if you cannot win in court, win outside of court.