'Enough is Enough' - Lance Armstrong

marienbad

No

FISMA wrote: »

Others still believe that you are innocent until proven guilty.

Just release the data that proves his guilt.

It always makes me wonder the strength of a prosecutor's "evidence," when they take the battle to the media or public opinion. It is one of those cases that if you cannot win in court, win outside of court.

I just don't understand this argument- this process is not a court of law and the standards required are different.

Of course if LA dos'nt like the process he can appeal to the actual law- oh wait, he did and he lost.

This is a code he knowingly signed on for and competed under and having withdrawn from that code he is out. That is all there is to it.

USADA have said the data will come out in due course , but as there are related cases pending now is not the time.

Dermot Illogical

No

FISMA wrote: »

Others still believe that you are innocent until proven guilty.

Just release the data that proves his guilt.

You can only be 'proven' guilty if you contest the case. Lance Armstrong prevented that from happening by pleading no contest, which is essentially a guilty plea. He had the means to fight, but chose not to.
I suspect he doesn't share your desire to have the evidence publicised.

furiousox

No

Link to the Newsweek interview...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056735531&page=41

This guy is the author of 'Friday Night Lights', a Pulitzer prize winning author.
I'm speechless after reading this article....:(

hardCopy

No

Is there any timeline on the other cases?

Bruyneel's response will be interesting, he can't afford to just take it on the chin, surely he'll have to give USADA their day in court.

PeadarCo

No

Given Lances history with court cases I wonder will he challenge this book. http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/tyler-hamiltons-book-reveals-in-depth-doping-network

It appears it will provide much of the evidence doubters seem to want. From the extracts mentioned its appears to be a very damming account from a person who was on the inside.

furiousox

No

Jesus, according to that article Riis was still acting the maggot even as a team owner! :mad:

corny

No

FISMA wrote: »

Others still believe that you are innocent until proven guilty.

Just release the data that proves his guilt.

It always makes me wonder the strength of a prosecutor's "evidence," when they take the battle to the media or public opinion. It is one of those cases that if you cannot win in court, win outside of court.

Oh the irony! USADA wanted to take the case to independent arbitration not to the media. Read this carefully. "Sam Sparks, of United States District Court, chastised Armstrong’s lawyers for submitting a lengthy complaint filled with allegations that “were totally irrelevant to Armstrong’s claims.”

Sparks said in his order that the court was left to presume that the allegations “were included solely to increase media coverage of this case, and to incite public opinion against” the antidoping agency and Travis Tygart, the agency’s chief executive, who is also named as a defendant. This court is not inclined to indulge Armstrong’s desire for publicity, self-aggrandizement or vilification of Defendants, by sifting through 80 mostly unnecessary pages in search of the few kernels of factual material relevant to his claims,”"

WhatNowForUs?

No

Sorry lads and lassies, I will not be intoducing my child to cycling. I am disgusted with the attatude of the personnel within the sport and those journalists bar a few who are related to it. I can understand the supporters who have an emotional attachment but there are those who should know better.

Beasty

No

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

Sorry lads and lassies, I will not be intoducing my child to cycling. I am disgusted with the attatude of the personnel within the sport and those journalists bar a few who are related to it. I can understand the supporters who have an emotional attachment but there are those who should know better.

You do realise there is a difference between cycling as a recreational activity (albeit a very healthy one) and cycling as a professional sport?

RobFowl

No

Just saw "The Bourne Legacy"....

Only saying :rolleyes:

hardCopy

No

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

Sorry lads and lassies, I will not be intoducing my child to cycling. I am disgusted with the attatude of the personnel within the sport and those journalists bar a few who are related to it. I can understand the supporters who have an emotional attachment but there are those who should know better.

You'll probably find that outside the US, cycling supporters are the ones with the least time for Armstrong and his circus.

WhatNowForUs?

No

Beasty wrote: »

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

Sorry lads and lassies, I will not be intoducing my child to cycling. I am disgusted with the attatude of the personnel within the sport and those journalists bar a few who are related to it. I can understand the supporters who have an emotional attachment but there are those who should know better.

You do realise there is a difference between cycling as a recreational activity (albeit a very healthy one) and cycling as a professional sport?

I do but if you put a kid on a soccer pitch or a gaa pitch or whatever sport it is, they are going to try and emulate their heros, those heros are usually the ones who won the most. The hero of cycling is still LA as far as I can see. I am sorry.

EoinGoal

Sheryl Crow never saw him take anything.

RobFowl

No

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

The hero of cycling is still LA .

For the majority of cyclists i know he isn't and never was. He never had the look of a GT rider and in any other era suspect Palmares would have been vastly different..
My personal cycling hero's include Hubert Oppermann (google him), rode the Tour de France, did multiple 12/24 hour TT's, fought for his country in WW2 and represented his government as a diplomat. Only stopped cycling in his 80's at the insistance of his better half.

Beasty

No

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

I do but if you put a kid on a soccer pitch or a gaa pitch or whatever sport it is, they are going to try and emulate their heros, those heros are usually the ones who won the most. The hero of cycling is still LA as far as I can see. I am sorry.

I guess you had better stop him walking while you're at it. I'm guessing running was already out of the question following Ben Johnson and Carl Lewis

Seriously, a bike is a means of getting from A to B - don't deny your kid that opportunity, particularly given the proven health benefits that cycling brings

drogdub

No

Fr D Maugire wrote: »

It has to be said that the Armstrong spin and PR BS has done its job good and proper. Got into a debate with 3 colleagues at work yesterday about the subject and they were all siding with him. Some of the phases used were never tested positive!!, witchunt!!, why are they doing it now!!, everyone else was doing it!!, done too much good for cycling!!, if he tested positive why wasnt he sanctioned!! how can he be sanctioned without a positive test!! the witnesses are just jealous!! etc.

Now what these guys know about cycling is less than nothing, they would struggle to name this years Tour winner but they were still defending Armstrong. In the end I said to then that I wasnt going to continue the debate as they were so clueless it was pointless.

This is what we are dealing with though, people who know so little but still buy the BS. As I said a few pages back this was the strategy the whole time, get the largely clueless general public on your side and half the battle is won. We need to see some evidence and see it soon.

Buy this T-shirt and wear it in work. Its funny 'cause its true!

http://handlebarmustache.blogspot.ie/2012/08/dont-ask-me-about-lance-t-shirt.html

Russman

No

furiousox wrote: »

Jesus, according to that article Riis was still acting the maggot even as a team owner! :mad:

That's probably the most worrying thing, given his continued involvement in the sport. Wonder was that pre or post his admission that he doped...?

Kinda casts doubts over the current era and makes me think the so called bad ole days haven't gone away, just gotten a little more refined. Must be disheartening for the couple of clean riders out there today.

WhatNowForUs?

No

Beasty wrote: »

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

I do but if you put a kid on a soccer pitch or a gaa pitch or whatever sport it is, they are going to try and emulate their heros, those heros are usually the ones who won the most. The hero of cycling is still LA as far as I can see. I am sorry.

I guess you had better stop him walking while you're at it. I'm guessing running was already out of the question following Ben Johnson and Carl Lewis

Seriously, a bike is a means of getting from A to B - don't deny your kid that opportunity, particularly given the proven health benefits that cycling brings

I'll qualify my comment by saying that ill not be introducing him to competitve cycling.

Captain Havoc

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

Sorry lads and lassies, I will not be intoducing my child to cycling. I am disgusted with the attatude of the personnel within the sport and those journalists bar a few who are related to it. I can understand the supporters who have an emotional attachment but there are those who should know better.

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

I do but if you put a kid on a soccer pitch or a gaa pitch or whatever sport it is, they are going to try and emulate their heros, those heros are usually the ones who won the most. The hero of cycling is still LA as far as I can see. I am sorry.

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

I'll qualify my comment by saying that ill not be introducing him to competitve cycling.

Well, thanks for dropping that bombshell on us.

el tel

No

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

I'll qualify my comment by saying that ill not be introducing him to competitve cycling.

Id say all the competitive cyclists on this thread have managed to avoid the temptation of taking peds. Sorry to hear you wouldn't have the confidence that you child would have the same convictions. Though I admire your confidence that your boy, should he take up cycling would inevitably reach the level where he'd be faced with the choice or opportunity to do a Lance style doping epic.

The tax man

No

drogdub wrote: »

Buy this T-shirt and wear it in work. Its funny 'cause its true!

http://handlebarmustache.blogspot.ie/2012/08/dont-ask-me-about-lance-t-shirt.html

and donate money to Livestrong at the same time.

Good shirt,shame about the connection though.

Lusk Doyle

No

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

Beasty wrote: »

WhatNowForUs? wrote: »

I do but if you put a kid on a soccer pitch or a gaa pitch or whatever sport it is, they are going to try and emulate their heros, those heros are usually the ones who won the most. The hero of cycling is still LA as far as I can see. I am sorry.

I guess you had better stop him walking while you're at it. I'm guessing running was already out of the question following Ben Johnson and Carl Lewis

Seriously, a bike is a means of getting from A to B - don't deny your kid that opportunity, particularly given the proven health benefits that cycling brings

I'll qualify my comment by saying that ill not be introducing him to competitve cycling.

That serves no purpose at all. Let your child chose what sports they want to participate in. It's their life, not yours.

el tel

No

The tax man wrote: »

and donate money to Livestrong at the same time.

Good shirt,shame about the connection though.

The objectives of some of the charities listed there sound comical. I'm surprised The Derek Zoolander School for Kids Who Can't Read Good and Want to Do Other Stuff Good Too isn't listed too.

hardCopy

No

el tel wrote: »

The tax man wrote: »

and donate money to Livestrong at the same time.

Good shirt,shame about the connection though.

The objectives of some of the charities listed there sound comical. I'm surprised The Derek Zoolander School for Kids Who Can't Read Good and Want to Do Other Stuff Good Too isn't listed too.

Only one of those charities avoids the words 'inspire' or 'awareness'

Ciarán_R

No

another story about the lovely Lance!

Hermy

No

From cyclingnews.com

Report: USADA in possession of positive Armstrong samples
Stade 2, the weekly television sports show by France 2, claims that the American Anti-Doping Agency (USADA) is in possession of blood samples from Lance Armstrong, which they have retested and have now come back positive for performance-enhancing drugs.

funnights74

No

Hermy wrote: »

From cyclingnews.com

I'm astonished that 21 people still believe that LA didn't dope :eek:, fully paid up members of the flat earth society no doubt!!

Hermy

No

Also from cyclingnews - McQuaid says UCI not afraid to sanction Lance Armstrong

UCI President backtracks, awaiting USADA evidence
Pat McQuaid has for the first time gone on record stating that the UCI could ban Lance Armstrong if USADA follow through and provides the relevant evidence to back their lifetime ban of the former cyclist. Armstrong was stripped of his seven Tour de France wins – as well as other titles won from August 1, 1998 – after USADA sanctioned him last month on the grounds of several doping violations.

Might have been better if he'd said fup all - this is pathetic!

IM0

No

Ill wait until the UCI and or ASO take away his titles before I decide

and if he did I wouldnt be surprised but would be shocked given his LAF fan base of fellow cancer survivors and 'letting that nothing is holier than thou' lies he would have pedaled [ha!, not intentional] to them for the last decade.

corny

No

Hermy wrote: »

From cyclingnews.com

According to the article in two weeks time USADA are going to share their evidence with the world. In the process piling the pressure on McQuaid and the UCI.

Yes he's guilty but it'll be interesting to see how this plays out.