Apple vs. Samsung - The Verdict(s) are rolling in

Media999

tolosenc wrote: »

I'm a reasonably recent CS graduate from one of the big universities in the country. In my class of 50 odd, there was 1 Apple user. We called him "Mac".

Everyone else used Linux or Windows or both. None of the lecturers used OS X.

There is almost nothing an Apple is better at (developing for iOS is quite difficult on a non Apple computer :P), and most tasks people claim that they are better at, they just aren't.

Same in mine. Class of 90.

Wibbs

ScumLord wrote: »

This may have been true in the past but the last few versions of adobes CS series have been optimized for windows and even have rendering features not available on mac, once you launch the program it's essentially the same on either type of operating system. The fact of the matter is the majority of people on the planet use windows, so while the upper echelons of media production can afford to use macs the rest of the human race is using PCs to do the exact same tasks.

Try working with Adobe Bridge in Windows and then try it in MacOS and then get back to me. Even with Adobe pushing for the Windows platform the differences are still there and there are more cons than pros(To be fair to Adobe, this is mostly down to the underlying Windows way of operating). That's before we get into colour management and fonts. Hell the simple act of adding a printer is far easier, never mind the comparative lack of hunting for drivers. Another thing you'll note if you use both environments as I do, you rarely switch off a mac based system. You just put it to sleep. The sleep/suspend function is very much better than in Windows. As is the boot time from start to actual finish when you can start work, not the speed the desktop appears. MS have made much ado about their increasingly speedy boot times and fair play but a helluva lot of that is because you have to reboot them more often so the user will notice this. The macbook I'm typing this on I haven't switched off/rebooted since Xmas 2011. I've a ten year old powerbook I sometimes use mostly for burning DVD's and troubleshooting that's been in sleep mode since January. Oh and the same ten year old mac runs a mac os from 07 and came with USB, firewire ethernet/wireless among other things built in. While there are a lot of things I like/prefer about Windows PC's there are a lot of things I like/prefer with Macs. Gun to my head if I had to choose? I'd pick the latter, for a start I could run all OS's on the same hardware legally and easily, never mind they're nicely built(in the main), tend to last longer and run up to date OS releases as they age and have much better resale value.

Steffano2002

Piliger wrote: »

That's because they make great decisions. Apple users are the most knowledgable users in the market. We buy the best and only the best.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BMsLArefSOw

ScumLord

Wibbs wrote: »

Try working with Adobe Bridge in Windows and then try it in MacOS and then get back to me.

I've never had any problems with adobe bridge in windows?

That's before we get into colour management and fonts. Hell the simple act of adding a printer is far easier, never mind the comparative lack of hunting for drivers.

I don't know what the colour management issue are either. Is it down to the fact a mac uses a mac monitor where as a PC could have any make of monitor. I calibrate my monitors to ensure they're all singing off the same hymn sheet. Never had any problems with fonts either, just drop them into the font folder.

Having said all that the only mac I ever used was the first imac. So I can't compare.

Another thing you'll note if you use both environments as I do, you rarely switch off a mac based system. You just put it to sleep. The sleep/suspend function is very much better than in Windows.

Again I don't understand what the difference is, my work PC is on 24/7 so I can access it at home, my PC at home goes to sleep and wakes up instantly (SSD hard drive) and it restarts in less than a minute.

My current PC had a motherboard fault and is back for repair so I'm using my 10+ year old PC and it's well able to run photoshop CS5, not so good with after effects due to only having 4gb of ram. Also has firewire because I wanted firewire and went for a board that had the port. The only upgrade I made to it was putting in my newer graphics card in because I wanted the use of the HDMI port which wasn't around when I bought the PC initially. I think at the time I paid something like €1500 for it but that included a 5.1 surround sound, monitor, fancy keyboard and mouse, fancy case, fancy copper heat sink, stupid lights, I went all out on it at the time. My latest 16gb monster cost €1300 and you wouldn't get a look at a similar mac for that money.

I've also never come across a situation when a windows PC didn't pick up a printer straight away without drivers just by plugging it in.

Wibbs

Wibbs wrote: »

Try working with Adobe Bridge in Windows and then try it in MacOS and then get back to me. Even with Adobe pushing for the Windows platform the differences are still there and there are more cons than pros(To be fair to Adobe, this is mostly down to the underlying Windows way of operating). That's before we get into colour management and fonts. Hell the simple act of adding a printer is far easier, never mind the comparative lack of hunting for drivers. Another thing you'll note if you use both environments as I do, you rarely switch off a mac based system. You just put it to sleep. The sleep/suspend function is very much better than in Windows. As is the boot time from start to actual finish when you can start work, not the speed the desktop appears. MS have made much ado about their increasingly speedy boot times and fair play but a helluva lot of that is because you have to reboot them more often so the user will notice this. The macbook I'm typing this on I haven't switched off/rebooted since Xmas 2011. I've a ten year old powerbook I sometimes use mostly for burning DVD's and troubleshooting that's been in sleep mode since January. Oh and the same ten year old mac runs a mac os from 07 and came with USB, firewire ethernet/wireless among other things built in. While there are a lot of things I like/prefer about Windows PC's there are a lot of things I like/prefer with Macs. Gun to my head if I had to choose? I'd pick the latter, for a start I could run all OS's on the same hardware legally and easily, never mind they're nicely built(in the main), tend to last longer and run up to date OS releases as they age and have much better resale value.

As far back as XP with a mid-range computer I could go several months at a time without reboots, think I had 4 in one particular year. My harddrive was over 90% full the entire time running several programmes including torrents which back then murdered harddrives. It's nearly a decade since regular restarts have been a regular feature of properly-running Windows desktops.
With 7 on a laptop I'll sleep and hibernate yeah, purely for power usage reasons.

Piliger

Zascar wrote: »

The fact is that Apple fanboys have always had a massive superiority complex. They hailed the iPhone as the best bit of technology ever for many years and slagged off Android as being being totally inferior.

Apple consumers are the most informed consumers there are. They want the best and insist on the best. Apple haters like you just hate Apple and Apple consumers.

If someone comes to me asking what smartphone to get - if they are just a normal person with no particular interest in technology, I will advice 95% of them to get an iPhone. They are a very good piece of kit and you won't go wrong. However if someone wants the best phone possibly available - it's not the iPhone - it's an Android - there are a few to choose from.

Hardly surprising. You are just prejudice and offer no rational evidence why you chose to advise people so wrongly. The iPhone is by far the best phone out there on the market - by a long shot. That doesn't mean it is right for everyone. But if they want the best, the iPhone is the best. Better than any of the android flotsam.

boblong

Piliger wrote: »

Hardly surprising. You are just prejudice and offer no rational evidence why you chose to advise people so wrongly. The iPhone is by far the best phone out there on the market - by a long shot. That doesn't mean it is right for everyone. But if they want the best, the iPhone is the best. Better than any of the android flotsam.

This is all so subjective, and honestly you're doing the reputation of Apple fans harm when you post things like this. There are some extremely impressive Android devices, far from the "flotsam" you suggest.

I happen to also prefer iPhones, and I've had my fair share of ribbing because of it - nothing wrong with a bit of banter. We might be crossing the line though when we call other people's character/intelligence into question over their consumer electronics preferences.

1ZRed

Piliger wrote: »

Apple consumers are the most informed consumers there are. They want the best and insist on the best. Apple haters like you just hate Apple and Apple consumers.

Hardly surprising. You are just prejudice and offer no rational evidence why you chose to advise people so wrongly. The iPhone is by far the best phone out there on the market - by a long shot. That doesn't mean it is right for everyone. But if they want the best, the iPhone is the best. Better than any of the android flotsam.

Are you for real? I've never owned an android phone, only iOS, but even I know that's not true.

Am I a hater because I see many faults with the iPhone? I also see faults with android as well so I'm on the fence ATM - the best place to be because it does away with this fanboy ****e.

It's consumers like you that make Apple say "fcuk it, people will buy it anyway. Lets do the bare minimum". And then people like me, who like the iPhone get an expensive and underpowered, slightly uncompetitive product.

Sonics2k

Piliger wrote: »

Apple consumers are the most informed consumers there are. They want the best and insist on the best. Apple haters like you just hate Apple and Apple consumers.

I'm sorry, but please tell me you're just having a laugh here.

I'd safely say the vast majority of the current Apple uses (especially iPhone owners) are not the most informed consumers, and frankly only want the phone because it's fashion statement style.

Now when the iPhone 3G was released, it certainly was a groundbreaking smartphone, and did lead to a massive revolution in the market, but the iPhone 4 (and even 5) now have major competition and are beaten (in some, not all, aspects) by the likes of HTC One X and the Samsung SIII.

I am lucky enough to have now seen, and tested, the iPhone 5 and will say it is honestly a good phone. It's just not a great phone. It's a slightly better 4S, but it's nowhere near the jump that we had from the 3 to 4.
iOS6 brings nothing truly amazing, it just replaces some good and functional apps with bad apps.
The Panorama function Apple have been touting as a great 'new' addition to the phone is already available on the 4S and always has been, it just wasn't turned on by default.

What it basically comes down to is whether or not people are willing to be the 'fashion cost' for an iPhone 5, when they can purchase an S3 or HTC One X for less and get everything they would from Apple and more.

The average consumer is going for the iPhone because it's known brand, just like Nokia back in late 90's and early 00's, even though there was great competition on the market.
People with real tech knowledge know that while the iPhone 5 is good, it's not great, and they can get just as good products from Samsung, Motorola and HTC.

I'm not saying Android devices are perfect, and I'm not saying Apple products are terrible, it's simply not true. I am saying you (and other die hard Apple fans) are deluding yourselves if you truly think the iPhone 5 and Apple can do no wrong.

Note: The only reason I haven't mentioned the Lumia 900 on W8 is simply because we/I haven't had any real hands on time with it.

Media999

Piliger wrote: »

Apple consumers are the most informed consumers there are.

Hogzy

Piliger wrote: »

Apple consumers are the most informed consumers there are.

Really? Why? Justify your argument/statement.

They want the best and insist on the best.

As do all consumers

You are just prejudice and offer no rational evidence why you chose to advise people so wrongly.

Again, you're being quite ironic here because you have not posted any evidence as to why..."The iPhone is by far the best phone out there on the market- by a long shot." - Your Quote

That doesn't mean it is right for everyone

I agree. The same applies to ALL products.

But if they want the best, the iPhone is the best. Better than any of the android flotsam.

Again, Why? Justify your statement or explain why you come to this opinion.

Overheal

Media999 wrote: »

Ladies and Gentlemen: the reason retail still exists.

Johro

Piliger wrote: »

Apple consumers are the most informed consumers there are. They want the best and insist on the best... The iPhone is by far the best phone out there on the market - by a long shot... That doesn't mean it is right for everyone. But if they want the best, the iPhone is the best.... Better than any of the android flotsam.

right..

Wompa1

1ZRed wrote: »

Are you for real? I've never owned an android phone, only iOS, but even I know that's not true.

Am I a hater because I see many faults with the iPhone? I also see faults with android as well so I'm on the fence ATM - the best place to be because it does away with this fanboy ****e.

It's consumers like you that make Apple say "fcuk it, people will buy it anyway. Lets do the bare minimum". And then people like me, who like the iPhone get an expensive and underpowered, slightly uncompetitive product.

Since you've never owned an Android phone can I ask what are the perceived faults with Android phones?

belcampprisoner

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/aug/28/apple-rot-starts-with-samsung-lawsuit-win

Overheal

Apple consumers are the most informed consumers there are. They want the best and insist on the best... The iPhone is by far the best phone out there on the market - by a long shot... That doesn't mean it is right for everyone. But if they want the best, the iPhone is the best.... Better than any of the android flotsam.

You have never worked retail a day in your life. At best, you havent worked a day of retail in the last 5 years.

boblong

Wompa1 wrote: »

Since you've never owned an Android phone can I ask what are the perceived faults with Android phones?

I'll bite if you like, as an iOS user that owns (and likes) an android. However this is increasingly not a thread conducive to good debate, so it will probably be my last post here. I like technology and talking about it, but I'm not a big fan of fanboyism.

• Development. I like to develop for the platform I own. Java is not a nice language compared to Obj-C. It's taken them so long to get something as simple as lambdas. Obj-C has concepts such as message passing and blocks that really blend the nicest features of languages like Ruby and Smalltalk with performant C. Tools such as Phonegap etc. are good, but not exactly "there" yet.
• Deployment. Google 'fragmentation android' for better articles than I can write. Not a big issue on iPhone because the majority of people will quickly upgrade to the latest version of the OS and will have similar hardware (yes I can see how this can be contorted to a criticism against Apple, but it's not relevant to this point).
• Piracy is rampant on the Android, which makes it less attractive to indie devs. Again other people can put it better.
• Typography. Apple cares about font rendering and does it best IMO, very few other manufacturers actually care at all seemingly. I'm sure it's no big deal for many users but there you go.
• UI lag. Much better in Jellybean, but my android (which has high enough technical specs) still produces more lag than iOS. I noticed similar on a GS3, but that was possibly Touchwiz being Touchpiz, and not android itself.

Once again though, I just *prefer* iOS because of the intangibles of the user experience. Also the software, like Alien Blue, Reeder, Jasmine, Clear, etc. etc. from outrageously talented devs.

I'm not attacking the android platform or OS (especially ROMS like Virtuous, Cyanogenmod), which I admire, the question was prompted and thought it would be of interest.

krudler

boblong wrote: »

I'll bite if you like, as an iOS user that owns (and likes) an android. However this is increasingly not a thread conducive to good debate, so it will probably be my last post here. I like technology and talking about it, but I'm not a big fan of fanboyism.

• Development. I like to develop for the platform I own. Java is not a nice language compared to Obj-C. It's taken them so long to get something as simple as lambdas. Obj-C has concepts such as message passing and blocks that really blend the nicest features of languages like Ruby and Smalltalk with performant C. Tools such as Phonegap etc. are good, but not exactly "there" yet.
• Deployment. Google 'fragmentation android' for better articles than I can write. Not a big issue on iPhone because the majority of people will quickly upgrade to the latest version of the OS and will have similar hardware (yes I can see how this can be contorted to a criticism against Apple, but it's not relevant to this point).
• Piracy is rampant on the Android, which makes it less attractive to indie devs. Again other people can put it better.
• Typography. Apple cares about font rendering and does it best IMO, very few other manufacturers actually care at all seemingly. I'm sure it's no big deal for many users but there you go.
• UI lag. Much better in Jellybean, but my android (which has high enough technical specs) still produces more lag than iOS. I noticed similar on a GS3, but that was possibly Touchwiz being Touchpiz, and not android itself.

Once again though, I just *prefer* iOS because of the intangibles of the user experience. Also the software, like Alien Blue, Reeder, Jasmine, Clear, etc. etc. from outrageously talented devs.

I'm not attacking the android platform or OS (especially ROMS like Virtuous, Cyanogenmod), which I admire, the question was prompted and thought it would be of interest.

well articulated responses and balanced arguments have no place here. *brandishes flaming torch*

boblong

boblong wrote: »

I'll bite if you like, as an iOS user that owns (and likes) an android. However this is increasingly not a thread conducive to good debate, so it will probably be my last post here. I like technology and talking about it, but I'm not a big fan of fanboyism.

• Development. I like to develop for the platform I own. Java is not a nice language compared to Obj-C. It's taken them so long to get something as simple as lambdas. Obj-C has concepts such as message passing and blocks that really blend the nicest features of languages like Ruby and Smalltalk with performant C. Tools such as Phonegap etc. are good, but not exactly "there" yet.
• Deployment. Google 'fragmentation android' for better articles than I can write. Not a big issue on iPhone because the majority of people will quickly upgrade to the latest version of the OS and will have similar hardware (yes I can see how this can be contorted to a criticism against Apple, but it's not relevant to this point).
• Piracy is rampant on the Android, which makes it less attractive to indie devs. Again other people can put it better.
• Typography. Apple cares about font rendering and does it best IMO, very few other manufacturers actually care at all seemingly. I'm sure it's no big deal for many users but there you go.
• UI lag. Much better in Jellybean, but my android (which has high enough technical specs) still produces more lag than iOS. I noticed similar on a GS3, but that was possibly Touchwiz being Touchpiz, and not android itself.

Once again though, I just *prefer* iOS because of the intangibles of the user experience. Also the software, like Alien Blue, Reeder, Jasmine, Clear, etc. etc. from outrageously talented devs.

I'm not attacking the android platform or OS (especially ROMS like Virtuous, Cyanogenmod), which I admire, the question was prompted and thought it would be of interest.

This sort of informed response has no place on the Internet.

Hogzy

boblong wrote: »

• Development. I like to develop for the platform I own. Java is not a nice language compared to Obj-C. It's taken them so long to get something as simple as lambdas. Obj-C has concepts such as message passing and blocks that really blend the nicest features of languages like Ruby and Smalltalk with performant C. Tools such as Phonegap etc. are good, but not exactly "there" yet.
• Deployment. Google 'fragmentation android' for better articles than I can write. Not a big issue on iPhone because the majority of people will quickly upgrade to the latest version of the OS and will have similar hardware (yes I can see how this can be contorted to a criticism against Apple, but it's not relevant to this point).
• Piracy is rampant on the Android, which makes it less attractive to indie devs. Again other people can put it better.
• Typography. Apple cares about font rendering and does it best IMO, very few other manufacturers actually care at all seemingly. I'm sure it's no big deal for many users but there you go.
• UI lag. Much better in Jellybean, but my android (which has high enough technical specs) still produces more lag than iOS. I noticed similar on a GS3, but that was possibly Touchwiz being Touchpiz, and not android itself.

Very good points. I was shocked that it took Google this long to try and sort out the UI lag. Apples UI lag has been perfected since day one yet android is still fixing the issue. Its probably down to the fact that android is put on so many devices. The Nexus devices usually handle android the best and have the least UI lag despite not having the *Best* specs on the market.

In terms of Piracy though, is Android really that worse than Apple? One quick look on piratebay suggests there are alot bigger selection of cracked apps for iOS than there are for android. Jailbreaking is rampant on the iphone/ipads aswell. Hackers seem to have no problem jailbreaking them. The iPhone 5 was jailbroken on day one.

ScumLord

Overheal wrote: »

Ladies and Gentlemen: the reason retail still exists.

I don't know, she seems like she might not be all there. She says she's never owned a phone before, maybe her guardians don't allow her to own a phone. I think they just made fun of a disabled person.

MJ23

How did anyone survive years ago with just a normal phone that you could ring people and send a few texts?
Cop on lads with your pissing match about a few phones.
Some people prefer Apple, others prefer Samsung. That's it.

Wibbs

Hogzy wrote: »

In terms of Piracy though, is Android really that worse than Apple? One quick look on piratebay suggests there are alot bigger selection of cracked apps for iOS than there are for android. Jailbreaking is rampant on the iphone/ipads aswell. Hackers seem to have no problem jailbreaking them. The iPhone 5 was jailbroken on day one.

Sure, but that's coming from a nerd/techie POV. This POV while valid in of itself doesn't equate to Most People(tm). Most people using IT devices don't hack/jailbreak/sideload apps/pirate, they just want to switch it on and go.

However Android is a lot easier for the same most people to pirate software. It's a much more open platform. Now Nerds love open platforms, they love the choice, they love to fiddle about, I do myself to a point, but again that's the nerd POV. Most people if asked will say they want more choice, but in reality choice isn't always the good thing it's made out to be, nor does it sell more to the average user and it's not that great for business especially at the small end of the market. IE nerdy guy or gal building a small phone app is more likely to not get pirated by more people and get paid if they develop for the iphone. Yet the same nerdy guy or gal if asked would likely bemoan apples closed system. In any case for the average joe or jane bloggs simple/less choice is good and they will vote with their wallets.

Good example; MP3 players. There were and are far "better" MP3 players out there when the iPod came out, yet the iPod won. Why? It shouldn't have. After all Apple at the time lest we forget were quite the niche company and not the behemoth we see today. Now sure marketing made a difference, but mostly it was because the ipod was simple and looked nice. Most people want play, fasty wasty forward and back, pause and stop, with their music in simple lists. They don't want eleventy hundred EQ bands and pitch modulation with five flashing LED's and ten buttons. Nerds usually miss this. Apple traditionally going way back didn't and Jobs was obsessive about this. EG when they were coding up new CD/DVD writing software for the macOS the programmers spent weeks building up a package with all sorts of choice and options. They had a meeting with Jobs with the framework on a whiteboard. He listened, then went up to the board wiped it clean, drew a circle representing a CD and said I want to just drop my files onto that and a button that says burn. End of. Dickhead? Yes, but that's what the majority of people actually want.

ScumLord

Wibbs wrote: »

However Android is a lot easier for the same most people to pirate software.

I don't think google are all that interested in copyright, it kind of goes against their company ethos to restrict software.

Hogzy

I just dont get why piracy is such a bigger deal on android. I mean all programmes on Mac OSX and Windows can be pirated a hell of a lot easier than on android. In fact installing cracked apps on Mac OSX is much easier than it is on windows.

I am still of the opinion that those "Nerds/techies" who have the ability to crack apps on the android platform are still just as capable as jailbreaking an iphone, installing installous and downloading cracked apps that way. Most modern jailbreaking methods involved plugging your phone into your computer and clicking on the absinthe logo (for example), the software does the rest. I really dont accept the arguement that downloading pirated software is easier on Android than on iOS.

Wibbs

ScumLord wrote: »

I don't think google are all that interested in copyright, it kind of goes against their company ethos to restrict software.

Little to do with some nice cuddly open source company ethos going on. It doesn't affect them so they don't really care about the people who it might and does.

Hogzy wrote:

I really dont accept the arguement that downloading pirated software is easier on Android than on iOS.

Well lets look at the figures. Android and iOS have about a 50/50 split in the market, yet piracy rates are significantly higher on Android. From that link(and there are countless more) "Korea based com2uS has said that some games have seen piracy rate as high as 90%. Appy Entertainment have seen piracy to the ratio of 70:1 i.e. for every 70 illegal installs, there in only one genuine purchase." Put simply iOS is a far better environment if you're a developer.

Fragmentation(coding for many different devices) is a much bigger problem on Android. Getting paid is easier and more likely on iOS. The general figure is that for every dollar you get paid on iOS, you'll get 25 cents(if you're lucky) on Android.

The way Android has been built piracy and malware are not just risks they're almost an inevitability. While no system is totally safe, non jailbroken iphones are at far less of a risk than Android phones. There's a loooong list of Android malware/dodgy apps. Again Google can more easily wipe their hands of responsibility behind the "open" mantra. Handy for them.

Dravokivich

Wibbs wrote: »

However Android is a lot easier for the same most people to pirate software. It's a much more open platform.

Hate to cut you short, but reading up on various android forums, all android phones have various procedures that need to be done for getting root access / flashing. and it's not particularly easy in most parts. Most threads I've read tend to be by people having problems with it. Each phone requires their own files and can be hard to get a track of. Even believe or not, drivers for various samsung phones.

The jailbreakers of iPhone, is a one click tool. To compare iPhone/Android in that regards, makes iPhone a lot easier. Even to stick with the iPhone/Samsung, iPhone is still easier to crack.

Wibbs

Ok then if that's the case D, how come piracy is a significantly bigger problem on Android? Google the figures for yourself. How come malware is also a significantly bigger problem on Android? From this report “Every quarter, Android malware continues to grow in number, and Q2 2012 is no exception. We received a total of 5033 malicious Android application package files, or APKs, . Now the nerdsphere was ablaze when one malware app was discovered on the iOS(mostly affecting jailbroken phones), pointing and tut tutting, yet the same nerdsphere is strangely remiss in going apeshít at the thousands of such potential threats on Android. Google have tried to address such issues of late, but security and piracy wise Apple's environment is significantly safer.

*EDIT* while I agree with you re jailbreaking iphones(though one release I recall being a right bastid), it seems most apple users don't actually bother, which leads to a more secure environment. On the other hand Android is essentially jailbroken out of the box, so is more vulnerable for the average user who doesn't want nor need that kind of access. You'd think people would have learned lessons from Windows long time issues with "security".

summerskin

Why would I want to jailbreak my iPhone? It does everything I want it to. And faster than my S3 does it.

Cienciano

Why do apple never include a radio on their phones or mp3 players? It's another very handy feature to have.

Dravokivich

Wibbs wrote: »

Ok then if that's the case D, how come piracy is a significantly bigger problem on Android? Google the figures for yourself. How come malware is also a significantly bigger problem on Android? From this report “Every quarter, Android malware continues to grow in number, and Q2 2012 is no exception. We received a total of 5033 malicious Android application package files, or APKs, . Now the nerdsphere was ablaze when one malware app was discovered on the iOS(mostly affecting jailbroken phones), pointing and tut tutting, yet the same nerdsphere is strangely remiss in going apeshít at the thousands of such potential threats on Android. Google have tried to address such issues of late, but security and piracy wise Apple's environment is significantly safer.

*EDIT* while I agree with you re jailbreaking iphones(though one release I recall being a right bastid), it seems most apple users don't actually bother, which leads to a more secure environment. On the other hand Android is essentially jailbroken out of the box, so is more vulnerable for the average user who doesn't want nor need that kind of access. You'd think people would have learned lessons from Windows long time issues with "security".

All I was saying its easier to crack an iPhone.

Piracy on Android can be explained by the APKs (Installers) being avail to load outside of the Market Place, without even root / flashing. Most users would be unaware of this however. So to some degree, yeah the android is jailbroken out of the box.

But if you are looking for the equiv of root access, it can be pretty hard and tedious for most people, where as not so much with the iPhone. I wouldn't know if its possible on an iPhone to install something that's not directly from their marketplace at all. Haven't used one.

But similarly, that is not to say all software installed outside of the marketplace on android is pirated.

Nevermind_

Dravokivich wrote: »

Hate to cut you short, but reading up on various android forums, all android phones have various procedures that need to be done for getting root access / flashing. and it's not particularly easy in most parts. Most threads I've read tend to be by people having problems with it. Each phone requires their own files and can be hard to get a track of. Even believe or not, drivers for various samsung phones.

The jailbreakers of iPhone, is a one click tool. To compare iPhone/Android in that regards, makes iPhone a lot easier. Even to stick with the iPhone/Samsung, iPhone is still easier to crack.

I rooted a GS2 the other day and it took me less than 10 mins with no problems, and i had a large choice of different firmwares.
Sure you can have problems but mostly these are people who didnt bother to read up a little bit about what they were doing.
Also you have to wait ages after every ios update to be able to jailbreak the iphone.

srsly78

Wibbs since you aren't a software developer why do you persist in making such wild assertions about these things?

There is a hell of a lot more work around for android, simply because it is in the majority. Also it's not just used for phones, but also for set-top tv boxes and fridges and microwaves. People are free to use it for whatever they want it to. Releasing apps for the platform is actually not the only way to get paid. Contrast this to iOs, the platform is very restricted.

Regarding the piracy, this is more nonsense. The figures released were small samples from small companies, and make the usual mistake of equating piracy with lost sales - just like they do with pc games etc. It's rubbish. Also Google added anti-piracy features over a year ago - it's up to developers to use them. Copying the APK onto your phone will not work for stuff using the modern protection, it will do an online check that is not trivial to crack.

In case you haven't noticed, there is an entire army of shills out there posting trash about Android. Fragmentation only exists in the mind of tech "journalists", any android developer will tell you that targeting multiple devices is really not a big deal. Devices have different screen resolutions!?!? OMG STOP EVERYTHING!!!!

Zascar

Does anyone agree with me that there is also a collossal different between the app stores from Google and iOS? I absoltuely hate the Apple App Store. It's just not easy to get what you want - you have to totally circumnavigate all the **** that they are trying to pump down your throat before you can find what you are looking for. it's like trying to book a flight with Ryanair. All the free apps are rubbish all they want you to do is buy the paid ones.

On the Google Play store, you have the main page with filed recommendations which are very good in general, then swype right for Top Paid, Top Free, Top Grossing, Top New Paid, Top New Free, and Trending. They are all on a enver ending scroll - and generally the placement is fairly accurate with the good/useful/popular apps. The Apple App Store* could almost be called the Shuffle - its just all over the place. I know some people love it and think its perfect but I hate being spoon fed like a baby of what I am allowed to or supposed to be doing - I want to be presented everything in a useful manner and chose for myself thank you!

*My experience lately is with an ipad and not an iphone

Jev/N

Cienciano wrote: »

Why do apple never include a radio on their phones or mp3 players? It's another very handy feature to have.

They do on the MP3 players - there's one on my nano anyway.

As for phones, there are plenty of apps

srsly78

Zascar that has only been the case since google revamped their market interface (about a year ago?). Yes it's a massive improvement, beforehand it was quite primitive.

Piliger

Cienciano wrote: »

Why do apple never include a radio on their phones or mp3 players? It's another very handy feature to have.

Could be something to do with the EU tax ? Also they don't need to as there are so many great radio apps. It would take up space in the iPhone that they prob feel is something that software should deal with.

Piliger

Zascar wrote: »

Does anyone agree with me that there is also a collossal different between the app stores from Google and iOS? I absoltuely hate the Apple App Store. It's just not easy to get what you want - you have to totally circumnavigate all the **** that they are trying to pump down your throat before you can find what you are looking for. it's like trying to book a flight with Ryanair. All the free apps are rubbish all they want you to do is buy the paid ones.

On the Google Play store, you have the main page with filed recommendations which are very good in general, then swype right for Top Paid, Top Free, Top Grossing, Top New Paid, Top New Free, and Trending. They are all on a enver ending scroll - and generally the placement is fairly accurate with the good/useful/popular apps. The Apple App Store* could almost be called the Shuffle - its just all over the place. I know some people love it and think its perfect but I hate being spoon fed like a baby of what I am allowed to or supposed to be doing - I want to be presented everything in a useful manner and chose for myself thank you!

*My experience lately is with an ipad and not an iphone

Jeez the Google app store is a complete and utter nightmare ! The Apple store is a beautiful, simple, streamlined place that is a joy to explore.

Tea_Bag

Nevermind_ wrote: »

I rooted a GS2 the other day and it took me less than 10 mins with no problems, and i had a large choice of different firmwares.
Sure you can have problems but mostly these are people who didnt bother to read up a little bit about what they were doing.
Also you have to wait ages after every ios update to be able to jailbreak the iphone.

I did a jailbreak on an iPhone4 a while ago. I went to jailbreakme.com and pressed a button. took 8 seconds, give or take.

and by 'wait ages after every iOS update', do you mean a day?

NinjaTruncs

Piliger wrote: »

Apple have really slapped Samsung down a notch. Samsung have no sense of innovation an just copy everything Apple do. They got their just desserts. Sales of Apple products shoot up, the company valuation goes up, phone sales go up. Brilliant.

Samsung should have a whole slew of their phones banned in the EU as well as the US. The great thing about what Apple is doing is that it will benefit us users enormously. It will force Samsung and others to start innovating instead of copying. It will push them to come up with their own ideas and not just photocopy Apple's designs.

We need more companies like Apple. More companies that invest in new great products with great design.

Wait what, Apple are suing Samsung for copying the bounce back feature and styling basically how it looks. While Samsung came up with the technology that allows you to browse the wed on your phone!

thomasj

Piliger wrote: »

Cienciano wrote: »

Why do apple never include a radio on their phones or mp3 players? It's another very handy feature to have.

Could be something to do with the EU itax ? Also they don't need to as there are so many great radio apps. It would take up space in the iPhone that they prob feel is something that software should deal with.

Major difference between the radios on the galaxy s3 and HTC one x and the great radio apps you talk about.

The difference is, the apps use data to streamline the radio stations. Hardly any use if you have got a 1gb data plan! Furthermore when you go under a tunnel or out to bad reception areas its disconnected.

With the Samsung/HTC radios they have an actual radio, the headphones are the aerial for the radio so when listening to the radio on them phones you don't use up data.

splendid101

Piliger wrote: »

Jeez the Google app store is a complete and utter nightmare ! The Apple store is a beautiful, simple, streamlined place that is a joy to explore.

ack, you're definitely trolling for reactions in this thread man.

Media999

Piliger wrote: »

Could be something to do with the EU tax ? Also they don't need to as there are so many great radio apps. It would take up space in the iPhone that they prob feel is something that software should deal with.

More dumb statements and no facts today i see.

When are you gonna actually use facts?

Hogzy

Media999 wrote: »

More dumb statements and no facts today i see.

When are you gonna actually use facts?

He has none, Just more marketing BS.

tolosenc

boblong wrote: »

I'll bite if you like, as an iOS user that owns (and likes) an android. However this is increasingly not a thread conducive to good debate, so it will probably be my last post here. I like technology and talking about it, but I'm not a big fan of fanboyism.

• Development. I like to develop for the platform I own. Java is not a nice language compared to Obj-C. It's taken them so long to get something as simple as lambdas. Obj-C has concepts such as message passing and blocks that really blend the nicest features of languages like Ruby and Smalltalk with performant C. Tools such as Phonegap etc. are good, but not exactly "there" yet.
• Deployment. Google 'fragmentation android' for better articles than I can write. Not a big issue on iPhone because the majority of people will quickly upgrade to the latest version of the OS and will have similar hardware (yes I can see how this can be contorted to a criticism against Apple, but it's not relevant to this point).
• Piracy is rampant on the Android, which makes it less attractive to indie devs. Again other people can put it better.
• Typography. Apple cares about font rendering and does it best IMO, very few other manufacturers actually care at all seemingly. I'm sure it's no big deal for many users but there you go.
• UI lag. Much better in Jellybean, but my android (which has high enough technical specs) still produces more lag than iOS. I noticed similar on a GS3, but that was possibly Touchwiz being Touchpiz, and not android itself.

Once again though, I just *prefer* iOS because of the intangibles of the user experience. Also the software, like Alien Blue, Reeder, Jasmine, Clear, etc. etc. from outrageously talented devs.

I'm not attacking the android platform or OS (especially ROMS like Virtuous, Cyanogenmod), which I admire, the question was prompted and thought it would be of interest.

Coherent answer, wow.

But Obj-C is a horrible language to code in, it's extremely hacked together. It was invented at the same time as C++, and we all know who one that one. It was essentially dead until Steve Jobs had an ego trip. Java is probably the best programming language going today, since its speed issues have been sorted out. I wager that with anyone other than Jobs at the helm, the iPhone would run a Java based OS.

thomasj

http://www.theverge.com/2012/9/21/3368502/docomo-sales-rep-tricks-iphone-customer-into-buying-the-galaxy-siii

"This is not the iPhone 5" Son who beat up dad, arrested.

On the 21st in Setagaya city, a 22 y.o man was arrested on allegations that he struck his father down with a blunt intrument. The father, whose bleeding head needed 6 stitches, is expected to recover completely from the relatively minor injury in a week. Further investigation revealed that on the night of the 20th, suspect had requested his father (49 y.o) to get him Apple's latest smartphone "iPhone 5" that was launching on 21st, the next day.

Securing a leave of absence from work for the day of the launch, the father begins his wait at the local store at 1 p.m that night, with the official opening scheduled for 8 a.m the following morning. However, the next morning the father returns home with a smartphone that was not the iPhone, sending the man into fits of rage. After grabbing gari-gari kun (corn potage flavor ice cream) from the breakfast table and beating his father with it till it broke, he continued his relentess assault with an azuki bar. His mother who ran in after hearing the father's screams couldn't stop the assault. Two Setagaya members present on the scene were also apprehended. The father sustained minor head injury from the azuki bar attack which required 6 stitches. He is expected to recover in a week's time.

The testimony filed by the Setagaya officials read, "The son, after asking dad for an iPhone 5, got uneasy when he heard that dad came back from making a purchase at the Docomo shop and flew into blinding rage when he discovered it was indeed a Samsung Galaxy SIII as he had feared, and ended up beating his dad. The dad was later found in a pool of his own blood holding the blood-stained azuki bar in his hands, without recollection of what happened during the assault."

The injured father said, "After leaving home at 1 p.m and finding that the SoftBank store already had a huge line in front of it, I headed for the Docomo store. When I asked the sales-rep for an iPhone, I was handed this device."

Setagaya city have cautioned customers against falling prey to the baseless rumors that Docomo is selling the iPhone and further requested that they not become easy stories for the newspapers.

its a fake japanese news site. still had me in stitches reading it! a popsicle stick wouldnt do much.

Piliger

splendid101 wrote: »

ack, you're definitely trolling for reactions in this thread man.

Yeah right .. you actually have the gall to say Google's app store is better than the Apple app store ... and call me a troll ? hilarious :rolleyes:

Media999

Piliger wrote: »

Yeah right .. you actually have the gall to say Google's app store is better than the Apple app store ... and call me a troll ? hilarious :rolleyes:

For a person who wouldnt use an Android you seem to be fairly knowledgeable about them. I use both and have to say there about on par.

Why not give us an actual fact about why one is better than the other or are you too retarded to understand what a fact is?

splendid101

Piliger wrote: »

Yeah right .. you actually have the gall to say Google's app store is better than the Apple app store ... and call me a troll ? hilarious :rolleyes:

I never said that.

I'm calling you out on trolling because you have intimate knowledge of Google's Play Store but you only use Apple products cos they're the best.

You're having a laugh and enjoying winding people up with your baseless comments.

Snowie

jesus if yas out this amount of effort into arguing what are you all like when ya do some work :pac: