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Abortion/ *Note* Thread Closing Shortly! ! !
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No its not, its simply not playing chess. A view on the merits of playing chess is not simply not playing chess. I'm just dropping a seagull point here though
No, you're trying to drop the cat amongst the pigeons, whip everyone up into a frenzy, and then look for an excuse to drop out of any imminent debate.
Atheists are waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more entitled to be part of this focus group than a bunch of celibate old men taking instruction from their invisible men.0 -
Its a shame there seems to be only 2 people from the pro choice groups and 7 from the anti abortion groups.
An even bigger shame is the lack of representation from women and their partner s who have actually had abortions overseas to talk about the impact having to travel has had. I actually emailed Enda Kenny when I found out he was meeting the Church offering him my story for balance but didn't even get a reply
It just seems every single debate leaves out the voices of the women who have been directly affected by the lack of abortion services here.0 -
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Coincidentally, I'm happy for you to represent me in such a forum however I would like if you would bear in mind that Atheist Ireland doesn't represent atheists in the same way that the hierarchy of Catholics represent Catholics.
Although it's important for a secular viewpoint to be heard I don't want people to get the impression that Atheist Ireland is the de facto leadership of all atheists in Ireland.
Fair enough, but they're the best we've got at policy level. If they don't represent you, get in there and vote on their policy? I intend to (haven't done it yet). I'm happy they're going to be there too.
I also don't think for a minute that the hierarchy of Catholics represent Catholics. That's their problem (and ours, in terms of how they have manipulated this country). At least we get to vote on the Board of AI/policies if we join.
It irritates me slightly that lots of people keep saying AI doesn't represent ALL atheists (of course it doesn't, how would it?), yet they're happy to see them speak up when it counts. Nothing personal to you Gbear, just that I've seen this so often, and yet we DO need a voice. In fact, we moan about not having a voice all the time.0 -
CoughIt irritates me slightly that lots of people keep saying AI doesn't represent ALL atheists [...]
In all fairness, that's always going to be the problem with something like atheism that tends to be defined more by what it's not, than what it is.
But are there any atheism-related issues that AI is speaking up on that people actually disagree with?
For myself, the only two I can think of are (a) whatever that recent spat was with the ICCL (too many irons in too many fires it seemed to me); and (b) the respectful, trusting position that I understand AI has taken wrt to the activities, policies and views of Miss Watson and her friends (much anon elsewhere).0 -
Cough
In all fairness, that's always going to be the problem with something like atheism that tends to be defined more by what it's not, than what it is.
Well, that's exactly what I mean - I get irritated because it's obvious AI isn't going to be representing anyone except their actual membership, but people going on about the ways it doesn't represent them seems to be the only actual problem. If you're not in, ye can't win...and all that.But are there any atheism-related issues that AI is speaking up on that people actually disagree with?
For myself, the only two I can think of are (a) whatever that recent spat was with the ICCL (too many irons in too many fires it seemed to me); and (b) the respectful, trusting position that I understand AI has taken wrt to the activities, policies and views of Miss Watson and her friends (much anon elsewhere).
Same as. I'm on the fence about the "respectful, trusting" position AI has taken to the Ms.Watsons of this world - haven't spotted any particular leanings in AI policy - just a lot of clearly thought out policies respecting everyone in an inclusive way. I have noticed some AI members being particularly caring about people who (IMO) cry wolf a lot, but I don't see that translated into policy.0 -
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