How do you form your opinions?

Xavi6

Touched on in the summer transfers thread but I think it has value as a thread on it's own. So how do you form your opinions on players?

Do you -

- Prefer to see the player in the flesh a few times first before wading in to a discussion?

- Go on the word of articles / news stories / opinion pieces online or in the papers etc?

- Watch countless four minute YouTube videos?

- Take the word of random posters on an internet forum, i.e. "Well if x and y say he's good then he must be"?

- Play a shitload of Football Manager?

I'm sure there's other influences as well but the above are the most common I've come across. Maybe it's none of them, maybe a combination of some or all.

Personally I read a lot of opinions in articles, on forums, on twitter etc but I won't offer an opinion of my own until I've actually seen the player myself a few times.

TerryTibbs!

Watch the player myself or take the opposite of what amiable says and go with that :P

Just kidding.

J. Marston

Fifa stats.

The_Kew_Tour

Watch the player in flesh, although little more limited on TV.

Everything else is Fail.

Amirani

I'd be lying if I said I didn't form some sort of an opinion on players based on news articles I read and player attributes in FM. I wouldn't give any sort of qualified opinion though without having seen the player play a good few times.

I don't think Youtube or Fifa give accurate representations of players.

PhlegmyMoses

I usually try to look at players on Youtube when my scout recommends them on Football Manager.

Giggsy11

Fifa stats, then check his FM stats after that download genie scout and check his potential growth and also hidden attributes like his consistency, big matches, injury proness, professionalism. Can't get better judgement than this..


I watch matches on TV and come to conclusion. I watch around 4 league (not all games, whichever game is interesting or teams I like or if any player is linked with ManUtd).

Jason Todd

If I read/hear about a player that's described as great, I'll Wiki him, YouTube him, ask my mates about him and see if any of the more knowledgable posters here have discussed him. If all that is positive I'll make it my business to watch him next time he's playin on TV!

If I hear Waterford Utd have a good player I'll just head down the RSC like I would be anyway! Although good players don't happen too often :P Only joking!

_blank_

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Fifa stats, then check his FM stats after that download genie scout and check his potential growth and also hidden attributes like his consistency, big matches, injury proness, professionalism. Can't get better judgement than this..

lolwut?

You use a game to form your opinion of players, and you say there are no better judges?

You serious bro?

_blank_

Jason Todd wrote: »

more knowledgable posters

Like who?

Jason Todd

Des wrote: »

Jason Todd wrote: »

more knowledgable posters

Like who?

Kess, Ade, Knex, opr, I don't tend to stray too far from the Liverpool thread! Ha ha!

tony1kenobi

I have a fairly simple system.

The ones not wearing an Arsenal shirt are c*nts.

I am not involved in professional football in any capacity though.

Giggsy11

Des wrote: »

lolwut?

You use a game to form your opinion of players, and you say there are no better judges?

You serious bro?

You thought I was?

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Articles and and the word of more respected posters on here, but I'd never try and pass it off as my own opinion if I hadn't seen the player play.

Leiva

Prefer to see the player in the flesh a few times first before wading in to a discussion?

If someone mentions a player as being a talent I try my best to see their next games on (tv-internet-re runs) no matter what the league

- Go on the word of articles / news stories / opinion pieces online or in the papers etc?

Would again use the above to get a feel for the player with regards to best position, strengths, weaknesses, attitude etc etc but only from reliable sources and avoid the known rags

- Watch countless four minute YouTube videos?

Would never use it as a final decission maker, but good to see a condensed version of all things good be it goals, tackles, assists etc.

- Take the word of random posters on an internet forum, i.e. "Well if x and y say he's good then he must be"?

Never ! But forums are a good place to get a name of a potential star. Example being Kess who over two years ago got me watching Hazard before he really hit the lime light, and Ade has a great eye for a player that I would listen to also due to both posters watching a lot of European league games , more than I have time to do

- Play a shitload of Football Manager?

Never played a game of it in my life so can't comment

Personally I read a lot of opinions in articles, on forums, on twitter etc but I won't offer an opinion of my own until I've actually seen the player myself a few times.

Pretty much my position as well .

Dave!

I wait until a good few people have posted on the subject, and then I use a complicated algorithm to determine a reasonable middle ground between them all, and that's the one I adopt.

pandaboy

Robbie Savage helps me to determine a good player, and manager!

A lot of it stemmed from playing hundreds of hours of Master League and just finding random youth players. Mainly base my research on the player, their team, and league. Watching countless matches from most leagues also helps! Follow up with some stats on the player and basically just follow the rumour mongrel for spots on new players and then start the cycle again.

I've had numerous arguments about players with friends and so far I've been pretty right. All I can say is, stats don't lie! That's probably the best way of determining a player.

Roger Sterling

I wait until they have a brilliant game against United then jump straight on the bandwagon, punching my penis in blind rage when they sign for Spurs instead.

_blank_

tony1kenobi wrote: »

I have a fairly simple system.

The ones not wearing an Arsenal shirt are c*nts.

I am not involved in professional football in any capacity though.

Best answer.

Some people give off the impression that they are failed wannabe scouts.

It's a bit cringey

dahat

What is Football manager?i know it is a game of sorts,XBOX,PS3???

Dub13

I have a simple system,whatever Barry Glendenning says I think the opposite.

Quazzie

Des wrote: »

lolwut?

You use a game to form your opinion of players, and you say there are no better judges?

You serious bro?

Its a laughable way to form an opinion on a player, but the stats in the game are eerily accurate. I used to buy Kompany as a 15 year old in football manager and he used to turn out world class. Real life also followed suit. So whilst its ridiculous to form an opinion of a player based on games it can certainly be used to open your eyes to players you might never have heard about.

As for how I form my own opinions, I try to watch as many games as possible of a player, but I tend to evaluate a player based more on how they interact within a team unit rather than as an individual which tends to contradict how others do it.

Giggsy11

Quazzie wrote: »

Its a laughable way to form an opinion on a player, but the stats in the game are eerily accurate. I used to buy Kompany as a 15 year old in football manager and he used to turn out world class. Real life also followed suit. So whilst its ridiculous to form an opinion of a player based on games it can certainly be used to open your eyes to players you might never have heard about.

As for how I form my own opinions, I try to watch as many games as possible of a player, but I tend to evaluate a player based more on how they interact within a team unit rather than as an individual which tends to contradict how others do it.

There are also FM wonderkids who are playing their trade in league 2s or lower. I think in FM09 or 10 there was a winger Marquinhos who was a must buy, never heard of him linked with any teams at all, likewise there was Kerlon, Camacho (in FM09 he became world class player) and many more players.

Dub13

Giggsy11 wrote: »

There are also FM wonderkids who are playing their trade in league 2s or lower.

Freddy Adu....?

PhlegmyMoses

I still think that Cherno Samba will come good.

Quazzie

Dub13 wrote: »

Freddy Adu....?

I'm surprised it took so long to see his name after FM was mentioned. He seems to the poster boy of failed potential from FM.

Giggsy11

Dub13 wrote: »

Freddy Adu....?

Is he even playing? :pac:

RayCon

I have a few beers and then suddenly have the ability to talk with great authority about most players.

Dub13

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Is he even playing? :pac:

The last I heard he was playing for Philadelphia,I don't think he even made the US squad for the last world cup.

Xavi6

Dub13 wrote: »

The last I heard he was playing for Philadelphia,I don't think he even made the US squad for the last world cup.

Still only 23 and part of the US recently enough with the Olympic team (that failed to qualify). He hasn't been a disaster but the weight of expectation from Champ Manager and that ridiculous Nike contract he got had people going way OTT.

gimmick

I rate a player by whether he has signed for ManU or not. if he has, he is obviously the bestest in the world who can do no wrong and drink loads of kool aid. If he doesn't sign for ManU I will assume ManU didn't want him, therefore he is not really that good.

PiE

I don't need to form my own opinions; certain posters on boards are clearly full-time scouts and tell me everything I need to know. I accept this in blind faith.

There is no way they would lie about their knowledge to gain internet kudos. That's crazy talk.

dahat

I read The Sun,i know more than anyone..

LuckyLloyd

Des wrote: »

Best answer.

Some people give off the impression that they are failed wannabe scouts.

It's a bit cringey

There are football forums that are worse for it though, as hard as that is to believe. One of the sports forums I post on has a guy who puts up a "top 300 players in the world" every year. He ranks them exactly 300 - 1, indicates whether they've moved up or down and reasoning for same. It's utterly ridiculous.

People will claim that their obscure knowledge of an up and coming star from the Argentinian league is based on something more than FM but I'm not buying it.

I mean, if you play a lot of FM you will know a lot about the layout of world leagues, players names / teams / etc. When I was younger and had more time I used to play hours and hours of it myself and there is no doubting that it gave you a greater surface knowledge of the game. But all it provides is waves of basic information. The scouting aspect has as many misses as hits over the years, and the stats it populates for player attributes are questionable - even for well known players.

I live with a football coach, and talking to him really puts into context how laughable the detail some guys lay claim to on football forums is. Stats do have their place in the game, and will have a bigger part to play in team's decision making process in the future. But there will always be networks of guys who are paid to go and watch football, talk to other football people and repeat same over and over and over 60+ hours a week.

People need to understand that if you're not doing that; and you don't have access to the advanced statistical industry databases that professional football "stat" people have - you don't really have a ****ing clue what you're talking about and should stick to what you've seen a lot of yourself.

Rekop dog

Leiva wrote: »

Never ! But forums are a good place to get a name of a potential star. Example being Kess who over two years ago got me watching Hazard before he really hit the lime light,

Even a stopped clock is right twice a day!

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I live with a football coach, and talking to him really puts into context how laughable the detail some guys lay claim to on football forums is. Stats do have their place in the game, and will have a bigger part to play in team's decision making process in the future. But there will always be networks of guys who are paid to go and watch football, talk to other football people and repeat same over and over and over 60+ hours a week.

People need to understand that if you're not doing that; and you don't have access to the advanced statistical industry databases that professional football "stat" people have - you don't really have a ****ing clue what you're talking about and should stick to what you've seen a lot of yourself.

Yeah and even the 60 hours a week some of these scouts put in would be focussed in very specific areas unlike the super scouts here who give what they believe are definitive judgements on players from a vast pool of leagues when it's basically impossible to have any sort of worthwhile opinion if your casting your net that wide.

brianregan09

Simple answer from watching them in games , for example i watch a lot of the bundesliga and my mouth was watering at the thoughts of Sahin coming to Arsenal as i had seen how good he was for Dortmund, Sad he didn't get a look in at Madrid , Even sadder he went to liverpool should be immense for them

Roger Sterling

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Des wrote: »

Best answer.

Some people give off the impression that they are failed wannabe scouts.

It's a bit cringey

There are football forums that are worse for it though, as hard as that is to believe. One of the sports forums I post on has a guy who puts up a "top 300 players in the world" every year. He ranks them exactly 300 - 1, indicates whether they've moved up or down and reasoning for same. It's utterly ridiculous.

People will claim that their obscure knowledge of an up and coming star from the Argentinian league is based on something more than FM but I'm not buying it.

I mean, if you play a lot of FM you will know a lot about the layout of world leagues, players names / teams / etc. When I was younger and had more time I used to play hours and hours of it myself and there is no doubting that it gave you a greater surface knowledge of the game. But all it provides is waves of basic information. The scouting aspect has as many misses as hits over the years, and the stats it populates for player attributes are questionable - even for well known players.

I live with a football coach, and talking to him really puts into context how laughable the detail some guys lay claim to on football forums is. Stats do have their place in the game, and will have a bigger part to play in team's decision making process in the future. But there will always be networks of guys who are paid to go and watch football, talk to other football people and repeat same over and over and over 60+ hours a week.

People need to understand that if you're not doing that; and you don't have access to the advanced statistical industry databases that professional football "stat" people have - you don't really have a ****ing clue what you're talking about and should stick to what you've seen a lot of yourself.

Superb post.

Legwinski

I find out their nationality. If they're Belgian they're bound to be class :cool:

Quazzie

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

There are football forums that are worse for it though, as hard as that is to believe. One of the sports forums I post on has a guy who puts up a "top 300 players in the world" every year. He ranks them exactly 300 - 1, indicates whether they've moved up or down and reasoning for same. It's utterly ridiculous.

People will claim that their obscure knowledge of an up and coming star from the Argentinian league is based on something more than FM but I'm not buying it.

I mean, if you play a lot of FM you will know a lot about the layout of world leagues, players names / teams / etc. When I was younger and had more time I used to play hours and hours of it myself and there is no doubting that it gave you a greater surface knowledge of the game. But all it provides is waves of basic information. The scouting aspect has as many misses as hits over the years, and the stats it populates for player attributes are questionable - even for well known players.

I live with a football coach, and talking to him really puts into context how laughable the detail some guys lay claim to on football forums is. Stats do have their place in the game, and will have a bigger part to play in team's decision making process in the future. But there will always be networks of guys who are paid to go and watch football, talk to other football people and repeat same over and over and over 60+ hours a week.

People need to understand that if you're not doing that; and you don't have access to the advanced statistical industry databases that professional football "stat" people have - you don't really have a ****ing clue what you're talking about and should stick to what you've seen a lot of yourself.

An opinion doesn't have to be factual. An opinion is still an opinion even if its wrong. If football was so analytically based on facts and figures there wouldn't be any need for discussion forums.

LuckyLloyd

Quazzie wrote: »

An opinion doesn't have to be factual. An opinion is still an opinion even if its wrong. If football was so analytically based on facts and figures there wouldn't be any need for discussion forums.

There is a significant difference between an informed and an uninformed opinion.

People who get paid to form and offer opinions on football players base it on hours and hours of watching games and talking to other people who watch hours and hours of games; or they work with specially created in house stats or database resources that are not available to you and me.

If your point is that anyone is allowed to speak any old rubbish they like then fair enough. They are, the wonders of living in a free and democratic society. All I'm noting is that the vast majority of what gets stated as fact or is rated as valuable info on this or any other football forum is half baked rubbish that would get laughed out of any room filled with real football people. Sorry.

Quazzie

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

There is a significant difference between an informed and an uninformed opinion.

People who get paid to form and offer opinions on football players base it on hours and hours of watching games and talking to other people who watch hours and hours of games; or they work with specially created in house stats or database resources that are not available to you and me.

If your point is that anyone is allowed to speak any old rubbish they like then fair enough. They are, the wonders of living in a free and democratic society. All I'm noting is that the vast majority of what gets stated as fact or is rated as valuable info on this or any other football forum is half baked rubbish that would get laughed out of any room filled with real football people. Sorry.

I agree 100%. My point was that the people who actually would be in that room, probably aren't roaming around internet forums. Plus its the conflict of opinions which makes discussion interesting and frustrating in equal measures.

Madworld

Aha Shake wrote: »

I find out their nationality. If they're Belgian they're bound to be class :cool:

FM & Vanden Barre.

DM_7

I form opinions in different ways but wouldn't normally comment to someone else without seeing the player.

I see a player and he does something I like (dislike), I keep a closer eye on him and form an opinion.

If I read or hear good things I might take a particular interest in watching that player to see how good/bad he is.

Sometimes I can form an opinion quickly. Like when United looked to be signing Kagawa, I had never watched him before. Then saw him in German Cup Final and decided I liked him at that stage and then went out of my way to see more, read more about him to see if I was on the right track.

Or recently I watched Cleverley in the Olympics and noticed how as a game wore on and his role changed he struggled in defending as players were bursting past him, but when he was part of a three man midfield he was grand. Got into a discussion with a poster on here who thought he would be fine as he had enough to speed to make sure he was not over run. Decided to check out some footage and that backed other posters opinion so decided to keep a close eye on him again. Still think in possession he is class but have a question mark over him without the ball.

Paully D

By listening to Alan Shearer and Mark Lawrenson on Match of the Day.