4,000 new citizens, a day to celebrate.

therewillbe

Pherekydes wrote: »

Looking at your posts and teasing out your opinions, I can safely say I have nothing in common with you. I don't like any aspect of your life. Ergo, you are not Irish.

100%Pure.

Pherekydes

CuriousG wrote: »

I don't see how coming here, staying for years (either taking a job an Irish person could have had, or living off tax payers money) and not integrating counts as earning citizenship.

The very fact that they are taking out citizenship shows that they are integrating.

And living here, and working here and paying taxes is exactly what qualifies them to take out citizenship.

karma_

therewillbe wrote: »

Not in My eyes.A little piece of paper dont make you anything.

The Irish State makes that decision, it does not require your express authority. That little bit of paper means everything.

AnonoBoy

therewillbe wrote: »

Not in My eyes.A little piece of paper dont make you anything.

They're citizens now and are treated as such by law.

Don't worry. Nobody is ever going to ask for your opinion or permission on these matters in any sort of official way.

But be sure to continue your ranting about it online and down the pub. I'm sure everyone is very interested in your well-thought out arguments.

therewillbe wrote: »

100%Pure.

Except for those Saxons, Normans and Vikings that came and polluted your bloodline years back.

:rolleyes:

MadsL

Unreal amount of utter dumb ignorance in this thread.

2 years ago my wife became an Irish citizen, after years and years of paying Irish taxes and all the time paying for her own Health Insurance. Even though she was paying PRSI, she had to have her own private health insurance as part of her permission to remain. Given the tax level she was on through the years she more than paid her dues. Yet we still had to hand over almost €1000 to go through the process and wait a further 18 months for this to be processed.

We have since moved to the US, and in just over two years I can apply to become an US citizen. It strikes me that Americans a. Welcome you to America and are grateful for your arrival and b. Are congratulatory when you do become a citizen.

Reading some of the comments has confirmed it was the correct decision to leave Ireland.

CuriousG

Pherekydes wrote: »

The very fact that they are taking out citizenship shows that they are integrating.

And living here, and working here and paying taxes is exactly what qualifies them to take out citizenship.

There are many foreign citizens here that definitely do not integrate, you can argue against that all you want to, but it is true at the end of the day.


If that is so, fine, but the fact you support non citizens here working when there are thousands of Irish people unemployed speaks volumes. Paying taxes or not, they should not be here when there are Irish people being kicked out on the street.


Why are people living in denial about this in fear of being called something??? It will be regretted by many in years to come.

Annasopra

MadsL wrote: »

Unreal amount of utter dumb ignorance in this thread.

2 years ago my wife became an Irish citizen, after years and years of paying Irish taxes and all the time paying for her own Health Insurance. Even though she was paying PRSI, she had to have her own private health insurance as part of her permission to remain. Given the tax level she was on through the years she more than paid her dues. Yet we still had to hand over almost €1000 to go through the process and wait a further 18 months for this to be processed.

We have since moved to the US, and in just over two years I can apply to become an US citizen. It strikes me that Americans a. Welcome you to America and are grateful for your arrival and b. Are congratulatory when you do become a citizen.

Reading some of the comments has confirmed it was the correct decision to leave Ireland.

Unfortunately we do have a lot of problems with racism and xenophobia here. Thankfully it is only amongst a minority though.

CuriousG

MadsL wrote: »

Unreal amount of utter dumb ignorance in this thread.

2 years ago my wife became an Irish citizen, after years and years of paying Irish taxes and all the time paying for her own Health Insurance. Even though she was paying PRSI, she had to have her own private health insurance as part of her permission to remain. Given the tax level she was on through the years she more than paid her dues. Yet we still had to hand over almost €1000 to go through the process and wait a further 18 months for this to be processed.

We have since moved to the US, and in just over two years I can apply to become an US citizen. It strikes me that Americans a. Welcome you to America and are grateful for your arrival and b. Are congratulatory when you do become a citizen.

Reading some of the comments has confirmed it was the correct decision to leave Ireland.

There is a huge difference between America and Ireland.
1) It is about fifty times the size.
2) Their economy may be bad, but it is nowhere near as bas as ours, and they have more ways to deal with it.
3) There is the argument that America doesn't really belong to anyone in the first place, but that's for another thread.

GOODME

therewillbe wrote: »

Bull! It takes more than a few words and Flag Kissing to become Irish. They have nothing in common with me,I dont like any aspect of their lives etc(very small minded) Who cares,I dont like the situation with all this mult iculture BS,Irish and Proud,No qualms about it .

You will be surprised how many of them with a better, rich background you would wish to be them. In this world esp Africa does not mean al are poor.

was on holidays in East Africa once ooh my God name cars in the world are there, houses worth thousands some to millions of dollars. I was surprised had to bring back magazines and newspapers to show the adverts to others who also could not believe.

we should respect each other, as i heard those who are high just laugh at Irish who complain about them.

But you know many Irish are not educated esp up to those in their 50 or 40 here. time when many in their countries where studying and reached degree level.

cristoir

jimmi10 wrote: »

I think the government should be looking after it's current citizens many whom are unemployed (myself included) before granting foreigners citizenship.

Once unemployment has being greatly reduced among Irish people, then the matter of granting citizenship to non-Irish nationals can be addressed.

Granting citizenships to foreigners is a luxury this country cannot afford at present.

Healthy amounts of immigration will improve the economy through additional productivity, capital formation and demand for goods and services. This will increase your chances of getting employment. There is no dynamic and successful economy that doesn't have a considerable immigrant community. There is a reason for that.

bodice ripper

mango salsa wrote: »

These people are our own now.

therewillbe wrote: »

Never!

that is ridiculous.

I'm an ex-pat since I was three. i have lived in 4 countries, worked in two. whose "own" am I?

How long does someone have to be here to be one of "our own"? years? generations? How many years would some one Ireland born have to be away before they ceased to be "our own"? I bet it's a lot less. Because this crap you spout is about ethnicity, not being irish. It is digusting.

AnonoBoy

CuriousG wrote: »

There are many foreign citizens here that definitely do not integrate, you can argue against that all you want to, but it is true at the end of the day.


If that is so, fine, but the fact you support non citizens here working when there are thousands of Irish people unemployed speaks volumes. Paying taxes or not, they should not be here when there are Irish people being kicked out on the street.


Why are people living in denial about this in fear of being called something??? It will be regretted by many in years to come.

So you're saying every foreign person should be sent home?

Every single foreign person should be deported from Ireland until we get our economy back up and running?

Do you understand not only how insane that sounds but also how completely unfeasible that is?

cristoir

CuriousG wrote: »

I don't see how coming here, staying for years (either taking a job an Irish person could have had, or living off tax payers money) and not integrating counts as earning citizenship.

Yes because that is the root all residents take to citizenship. :rolleyes:

AnonoBoy

mango salsa wrote: »

Unfortunately we do have a lot of problems with racism and xenophobia here. Thankfully it is only amongst a minority though.

Yeah but they're so f*cking loud and irritating about it it's just so much fun to prick holes in their little bigot balloons.

jam_mac_jam

MadsL wrote: »

Unreal amount of utter dumb ignorance in this thread.

2 years ago my wife became an Irish citizen, after years and years of paying Irish taxes and all the time paying for her own Health Insurance. Even though she was paying PRSI, she had to have her own private health insurance as part of her permission to remain. Given the tax level she was on through the years she more than paid her dues. Yet we still had to hand over almost €1000 to go through the process and wait a further 18 months for this to be processed.

We have since moved to the US, and in just over two years I can apply to become an US citizen. It strikes me that Americans a. Welcome you to America and are grateful for your arrival and b. Are congratulatory when you do become a citizen.

Reading some of the comments has confirmed it was the correct decision to leave Ireland.

Pity they wouldnt do the same for all the mexicans picking their fruit, no problems in the US with immigration at all.

Although I do agree that they are congratulatory when you become a citizen when it doesnt really seem to matter to some people you will always not be Irish.

CuriousG

AnonoBoy wrote: »

So you're saying every foreign person should be sent home?

Every single foreign person should be deported from Ireland until we get our economy back up and running?

Do you understand not only how insane that sounds but also how completely unfeasible that is?

No. I just think if they ARE going to come here at all, they should not get preference before Irish people, and also I think that people like me and others here should be allowed to voice an opinion on it without being called racist. Why is it not allowed to have an opinion on this subject? WHY is everyone forced to agree???


Also, I never said I supported excessive immigration here during the boom, I don't know if you remember the millions of Eastern Europeans that came here, worked, and went back to Poland only to erect the 'No Irish' signs. I can say I have a great number of Easterns that I really do like, but the majority of them have not integrated to this day.

GOODME

Spook_ie wrote: »

You were doing so well until then.....

At least they are screening them, got them to work and stay out of committing crime.

The question is will they stay to help build Ireland? that is what we have to wait and see. I guess there will be those who will move to other countries and live as Irish.

CuriousG

AnonoBoy wrote: »

Yeah but they're so f*cking loud and irritating about it it's just so much fun to prick holes in their little bigot balloons.

I actually think it is pretty hypocritical to call someone a bigot. Why don't you accept the views of everyone?

CuriousG

cristoir wrote: »

Yes because that is the root all residents take to citizenship. :rolleyes:

As opposed to what? Marrying an Irish citizen?

Annasopra

CuriousG wrote: »

I don't know if you remember the millions of Eastern Europeans that came here, worked, and went back to Poland only to erect the 'No Irish' signs.

No. Because millions of Eastern Europeans did not erect "No Irish" signs. There were a few signs but don't exaggerate

al28283

CuriousG wrote: »

No. I just think if they ARE going to come here at all, they should not get preference before Irish people

Can you give some examples of these people being given preference before Irish people?

karma_

CuriousG wrote: »

I actually think it is pretty hypocritical to call someone a bigot. Why don't you accept the views of everyone?

Why does everyone not accept the authority and the privilege that is bestowed by Irish citizenship?

SocSocPol

CuriousG wrote: »

No. I just think if they ARE going to come here at all, they should not get preference before Irish people, and also I think that people like me and others here should be allowed to voice an opinion on it without being called racist. Why is it not allowed to have an opinion on this subject? WHY is everyone forced to agree???


Also, I never said I supported excessive immigration here during the boom, I don't know if you remember the millions of Eastern Europeans that came here, worked, and went back to Poland only to erect the 'No Irish' signs. I can say I have a great number of Easterns that I really do like, but the majority of them have not integrated to this day.

Any link to evidence of "millions" of immigrants , or is this just another racist right wing rant?

CuriousG

karma_ wrote: »

Why does everyone not accept the authority and the privilege that is bestowed by Irish citizenship?

Simply, because there is freedom of speech and opinion in this country. Or do you not agree with that?

cristoir

CuriousG wrote: »

No. I just think if they ARE going to come here at all, they should not get preference before Irish people, and also I think that people like me and others here should be allowed to voice an opinion on it without being called racist. Why is it not allowed to have an opinion on this subject? WHY is everyone forced to agree???

Anything, anything at all to imply that is actually happening?

Also, I never said I supported excessive immigration here during the boom, I don't know if you remember the millions of Eastern Europeans that came here, worked, and went back to Poland only to erect the 'No Irish' signs. I can say I have a great number of Easterns that I really do like, but the majority of them have not integrated to this day.

An urban myth and a bad one at that.

Not to be rude but are you going to offer any analysis or evidence? Even a little. I'm finding in difficult to debate cliches and stereotypes.

CuriousG

SocSocPol wrote: »

Any link to evidence of "millions" of immigrants , or is this just another racist right wing rant?

Granted, I'll change that to thousands, literally because we can't fit millions here... Also, if you're going to be using childish assumptions like that, just because someone doesn't agree with you, maybe you should look at who is actually the bigot here, me or you?

therewillbe

AnonoBoy wrote: »

They're citizens now and are treated as such by law.

Don't worry. Nobody is ever going to ask for your opinion or permission on these matters in any sort of official way.

But be sure to continue your ranting about it online and down the pub. I'm sure everyone is very interested in your well-thought out arguments.



Except for those Saxons, Normans and Vikings that came and polluted your bloodline years back.

:rolleyes:

I dont drink in Pubs,I am expressing my personal view which is my democratic right.I have not called for the mass round up of any if not all Illegal`s in this country as what has and is happening in various countries .Because I see myself as a Proud Irishman with views that dont fit with the norm I must be a lower class who gives it loads down the pub!LOL .

mikemac1

Back in the eighties wasn't there some scandal about the government selling passports to millionaires?

We are short of money at the moment, maybe we need to start this scheme again :pac:

Pherekydes

CuriousG wrote: »

No. I just think if they ARE going to come here at all, they should not get preference before Irish people, and also I think that people like me and others here should be allowed to voice an opinion on it without being called racist. Why is it not allowed to have an opinion on this subject? WHY is everyone forced to agree???


Also, I never said I supported excessive immigration here during the boom, I don't know if you remember the millions of Eastern Europeans that came here, worked, and went back to Poland only to erect the 'No Irish' signs. I can say I have a great number of Easterns that I really do like, but the majority of them have not integrated to this day.

We should extend that reasoning to our own population, no? Unemployement is higher in our cities because country folk migrate to the cities and take the jobs.

Everyone should stay in their own little hamlets and villages and never stir for any reason whatsoever.

Eve_Dublin

There are many foreign citizens here that definitely do not integrate, you can argue against that all you want to, but it is true at the end of the day.

When you say, "don't integrate"...what do you mean exactly?

If that is so, fine, but the fact you support non citizens here working when there are thousands of Irish people unemployed speaks volumes. Paying taxes or not, they should not be here when there are Irish people being kicked out on the street.

And thousands and thousands of Irish people like me who've emigrated and made their life elsewhere. Thank fook I haven't encountered people so hostile to outsiders like you seem to be.

Why are people living in denial about this in fear of being called something??? It will be regretted by many in years to come.

You think people are all pretending to be tolerant?

karma_

CuriousG wrote: »

Simply, because there is freedom of speech and opinion in this country. Or do you not agree with that?

This has nothing to do with freedom of speech. It's flat out racism. These 4000 people have been granted citizenship, they are now Irish.

cristoir

CuriousG wrote: »

As opposed to what? Marrying an Irish citizen?

No. As opposed to moving here, getting a job or starting a business, paying tax, being resident here for at least 5 years, filling out a mounds of paperwork, being interviewed at least twice and then pledging intelligence to their adapted homeland. That's not to mention the other ties they'd develop like their kids going to school here or becoming embedded in a local community.

CuriousG

cristoir wrote: »

Anything, anything at all to imply that is actually happening?
An urban myth and a bad one at that.

Not to be rude but are you going to offer any analysis or evidence? Even a little. I'm finding in difficult to debate cliches and stereotypes.

There was numerous pictures of those signs, just because you didn't see them doesn't mean they didn't exist. Also, whether there was one, or two thousand, it doesn't take away from what I am saying.

I don't feel any need to justify myself, my opinions or my personal experiences to people I do not know, that can't accept not everyone is going to agree with them. This is something I came across in playschool - it's about time people accepted that just because YOU think something, doesn't mean everyone HAS to agree with you.

The fact that anyone who doesn't adhere strictly to every single opinion and thought you have on any certain topic is called a bigot, says a lot about who the true bigots are in Ireland today.

SocSocPol

CuriousG wrote: »

Granted, I'll change that to thousands, literally because we can't fit millions here... Also, if you're going to be using childish assumptions like that, just because someone doesn't agree with you, maybe you should look at who is actually the bigot here, me or you?

You

MadsL

I'd love to have a magic wand to show people what Ireland would look like if it closed borders to migration.

Over 1,000 Foreign companies in Ireland employ over 146,000 people.

Cop on.

It also amuses me to see that someone who posts "I dont like the situation with all this mult iculture BS" is also discussing their local Chinese restaurant in another thread and this;

therewillbe wrote: »

Hi,Is the sale of a Gurka Knife allowed or Not? I know the sale of blades is a No No but have seen some Samurai Swords for sale recently and they were modern and my piece is an old one.

Thanks.

Minds so small the irony just leaks out of their ears.

No. I just think if they ARE going to come here at all, they should not get preference before Irish people,

Do you think employers should be able to post signs that say "No Irish" then in the UK and Australia?

no problems in the US with immigration at all.

Where did I say that?

bodice ripper

therewillbe wrote: »

100%Pure.

Sorry, but we've ****ed that up for you already. I have an Irish and an American parent. My sister is over in Ireland right now, blatanly of breeding age, with an Irish boyfriend. You genes are ****ed.

you are a mongrel, just like everyone else.

CuriousG

karma_ wrote: »

This has nothing to do with freedom of speech. It's flat out racism. These 4000 people have been granted citizenship, they are now Irish.

No, if I was racist, I would be specifying why I hate any particular race/ using racial slurs. Maybe you should look that definition up, just so you refrain from using it when someone doesn't agree with you.

Annasopra

CuriousG wrote: »

Simply, because there is freedom of speech and opinion in this country.

No not really

We have the prohibition of incitement to hatred act though

Annasopra

therewillbe wrote: »

I have not called for the mass round up of any if not all Illegal`s in this country

Just Nigerians then?

CuriousG

SocSocPol wrote: »

You

Why? Because I don't agree with your opinion??

big·ot (b g t). n. One who is strongly partial to one's own group, religion, race, or politics and is intolerant of those who differ.

I don't recall saying I was intolerant of anything, did I?

MadsL wrote: »

Do you think employers should be able to post signs that say "No Irish" then in the UK and Australia?

Ah. You see, Ireland did not colonise half the world, nor were people forcibly sent here/colonising the Natives. So, while it would be pretty silly of them to do that, it's their prerogative - they built the country, and they are governing it.

CuriousG

mango salsa wrote: »

No not really

We have the prohibition of incitement to hatred act though

We certainly do. I'd love to know if you could point out my 'hatred' here. Thanks a million.


Also, due to the fact that the majority of migrants to Ireland come from struggling countries, why don't you all support them using their personal resources to build up the country they have came from?

MadsL

CuriousG wrote: »

There was numerous pictures of those signs

So you object when someone puts up a No Irish sign, but you want Ireland to put up No Foreigners signs.

I'm confused, are you in favour of migration or not? Or is it that you want the freedom to live and work in Ireland and anywhere else you choose, but don't want the same privilege for those people who come to Ireland.

Just check your ears for leaking irony, there's a good chap.

cristoir

CuriousG wrote: »

There was numerous pictures of those signs, just because you didn't see them doesn't mean they didn't exist. Also, whether there was one, or two thousand, it doesn't take away from what I am saying.

I don't feel any need to justify myself, my opinions or my personal experiences to people I do not know, that can't accept not everyone is going to agree with them. This is something I came across in playschool - it's about time people accepted that just because YOU think something, doesn't mean everyone HAS to agree with you.

The fact that anyone who doesn't adhere strictly to every single opinion and thought you have on any certain topic is called a bigot, says a lot about who the true bigots are in Ireland today.

You are more then entitled to an opinion but I am more the entitled to challenge it. Especially when you come on internet discussion forum. What did you expect? You would get to say you your piece and we'd all nod our heads?

Your schoolyard reference is a bit crass. We are or where having a debate. It's a perfectly civilized thing. You say something, I rebut and then you should counter-rebut. I don't expect you to agree with me but I do expect if you have an opinion and you declare in publicly you at least explain to us why you think your right. I mean is analytical and reasoned discussion not a good thing?

And I don't recall calling you a bigot.

CuriousG

MadsL wrote: »

So you object when someone puts up a No Irish sign, but you want Ireland to put up No Foreigners signs.


Just check your ears for leaking irony, there's a good chap.

Well, if that's not twisting words I don't know what is. Love to know where I said those exact words - No, you're just making that up actually, that's it.

I don't object one bit if another country puts up a sign, they're fully within their rights to do it. What I am objecting to, is they should practice what they preach, and since Irish people are stupid enough to flood our country, they should have appreciated it at least.

I'm no chap, thanks.

sandmanporto

Jeez I'll spin the globe and whatever country my finger lands on I'll become a citizen of theirs

MadsL

CuriousG wrote: »

Well, if that's not twisting words I don't know what is. Love to know where I said those exact words - No, you're just making that up actually, that's it.

I don't object one bit if another country puts up a sign, they're fully within their rights to do it. What I am objecting to, is they should practice what they preach, and since Irish people are stupid enough to flood our country, they should have appreciated it at least.

I'm no chap, thanks.

So no Irish should emigrate then, is that your view?

CuriousG

cristoir wrote: »

You are more then entitled to an opinion but I am more the entitled to challenge it. Especially when you come on internet discussion forum. What did you expect? You would get to say you your piece and we'd all nod our heads?

Your schoolyard reference is a bit crass. We are or where having a debate. It's a perfectly civilized thing. You say something, I rebut and then you should counter-rebut. I don't expect you to agree with me but I do expect if you have an opinion and you declare in publicly you at least explain to us why you think your right. I mean is analytical and reasoned discussion not a good thing?

And I don't recall calling you a bigot.

The thing about opinion is, you're entitled to have an opinion based on life experience and seeing it happen to others. Some of those things are pretty personal, so I don't see the need to tell you all about them. That doesn't make my opinion less valid. If you didn't expect me to agree with you there would be no comments such as 'racist right wing' and 'bigot' thrown at me.

Obviously, none of you know how to have a civilized discussion, because if you did, you would be able to accept this, without name calling.

Cienciano

conorhal wrote: »

I've really tired of this 'culturally enriched' meme that the left perpetrate, many of whom are the very same people that that rather ironically sneer at any and every assertion of indigenous Irish culture.

I've also yet to experience this 'cultural enrichment', or have anybody explain exactly how my life has been 'enhanced’ by it.
Perhaps I have failed to fully appreciate the cultural value of my Eastern European neighbors all night vodka parties and casual knife crime (neighbor stabbed to death a few years ago at a party). Nor does my trip into work feel 'enhanced' by the burka brigade on the bus with their kids and male 'chaperone', in fact I find it somewhat disquieting to have to sit in proximity to somebody wearing a mask and seated next to her bouncer. Nor does half of Nigeria swaggering around the Square where I shop dressed as identikit gangstas in their trackies and chains seem very 'culturally enhancing' either, and I've yet to figure out how the default cultural expression of most Africans in the area appears to be the culture of South Central Los Angeles to which (as far as I can gather anyway) they have no connection.

I get the distinct feeling that those who bang on about 'cultural vibrancy' tend to be the kind of people that turn up at the annual DunLaoghaire 'Festival of Cultures' to eat a samosa, watch some Thai's dance and buy a colorful hat before fecking off back home to Dublin 4, because they sure as hell don't live in the pretty alienating world of vibrant multicultural Dublin that I do.

Yeah, Tallaght was beautiful before the Nigerians moved in and ruined it.

mikemac1

More Dublin 15 then Tallaght

CuriousG

MadsL wrote: »

So no Irish should emigrate then, is that your view?

In an ideal world, they wouldn't have a need to. But thanks to people like you and others, we will never have an ideal world, because your opinions have to reign supreme on everybody. You would rather pander to the idea you HAVE to love the fact our country is being ruined, instead of actually looking at it in a logical sense. I'm not going to comment here anymore, because it's going to end up with me being called a number of things for not agreeing.



I think the majority of people here are bigots, you cannot force people to agree with you.