Traveller woman beaten to death in Louth.**Mod warning in post 1**

dvpower

smash wrote: »

Lads, he admitted it didn't he? So who cares if he's been charged considering he owned up.

Convicted you mean?

Jaffusmaximus

I live in close proximity to what happened and to be honsest they kept pretty much to themselves, we all knew who he was but we all kept our council and gave the benefit of the doubt. But in hind sight it is hard to see how such a man could raise a family and lead the life he has without some adverse mental effect. At the end of it we will no longer see her kids playing in the streets which will make the area a lot quiter. Very tragic!

MusicalMelody

Absolute Bastard RIP!

OnTheCounter

Nulty wrote: »

Look, some people have an aversion to travelers and seem to be happy to perpetuate a line of "don't bother us and we won't bother you". Those people are happy to accept anything that travelers might do to each other as long as they don't infringe on their own, settled lives. That woman (Jacqueline) did not enter her self in a bare knuckle fight nor did any of the other assaulted traveler women who find them selves physically abused by their spouses. Just because they are travelers doesn't make it acceptable for it to happen. If two men want to go and punch the heads off each other because it makes them look tough then so be it but these women are non-combatants and should be afforded the same attention and protection as settled victims of domestic abuse. I know it is culture/tradition to beat on your wife "when she deserves it" but that admission does not justify the act. I acknowledge that it is done but that doesn't mean I condone it. It is a disgraceful scenario where a culture has developed where victims of abuse are not even aware of their rights in a so called civilized country like ours.

they have options.

not great, and they will be shunned seemingly, but if they want out they report the abuse and soon they and their kids will be housed by the government.

They choose to put up with it in the majority of cases.

they have to make the first move to change things for themselves.

the fact is the majority of female travellers are lovelx people, the majority of male travellers are not.

tayto lover

As this man has now been charged I think we should let the law take it's course and end the thread.

Tipsy McSwagger

tayto lover wrote: »

As this man has now been charged I think we should let the law take it's course and end the thread.

I never knew the guards closed the threads on Boards.

JP Liz V1

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Uh, he has been charged. That's not the same thing.

He admitted to the killing his wife yes?

Monty Burnz

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

He admitted to the killing his wife yes?

I don't know what he has admitted.

JP Liz V1

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

He admitted to the killing his wife yes?

according to a news report earlier, he said he was sorry, and didnt mean to kill her, its somewhere on this thread i think.

yep, here it is

http://www.98fm.com/2012/category-news-sport/i-didnt-mean-to-kill-her-im-sorry-the-words-of-jacqueline-mcdonaghs-husband/

marzic

Rochelle wrote: »

Like a lot of people my age, I'm 34.

and me, me too... makes you think.

OnTheCounter

Going by some of the more recent high profile sentences I have seen handed down I have no idea what the sentence could be for beating his wife to death. He said in court he didnt mean to kill her but it would take a fairly savage beating to kill someone with your bare hands.

anywhere between 3 and 15 years of actual incarasation (jail sentence - suspended period - time off for good behaviour, ect)?

justice system is a joke when there is no consistancy and the same crime gets a vastly different sentence depending on which judge you get.

Wanderer2010

Has nobody mentioned that he is only 33???? He looks at least 10 years older, seriously, WTF. Must be all that boxing, not good for the complexion..

charlemont

OnTheCounter wrote: »

Going by some of the more recent high profile sentences I have seen handed down I have no idea what the sentence could be for beating his wife to death. He said in court he didnt mean to kill her but it would take a fairly savage beating to kill someone with your bare hands.

anywhere between 3 and 15 years of actual incarasation (jail sentence - suspended period - time off for good behaviour, ect)?

justice system is a joke when there is no consistancy and the same crime gets a vastly different sentence depending on which judge you get.

What makes you think that ?
Judging by the severity of the beating she got it shows intent, It says somewhere in the media that a weapon was used..Intent-Murder-Life sentence so he might be out in time for his old age pension.

Lapin

OnTheCounter wrote: »

Going by some of the more recent high profile sentences I have seen handed down I have no idea what the sentence could be for beating his wife to death. He said in court he didnt mean to kill her but it would take a fairly savage beating to kill someone with your bare hands.

anywhere between 3 and 15 years of actual incarasation (jail sentence - suspended period - time off for good behaviour, ect)?

justice system is a joke when there is no consistancy and the same crime gets a vastly different sentence depending on which judge you get.

There is no 'Justice system' in this country.

We have one of the best legal systems in the world. The legal profession see to that, and tweak the system to suit themselves.

But 'Justice' is an unfunny joke in Ireland.

Bad Panda

MagicSean wrote: »

Domestic abuse may be common but it is almost unheard of for a man to assault another mans wife within the traveller community.

Look! Can we please stop pretending that these people have any kind of moral code they live by.

We all know what travellers are like, but to appease the PC-ness of boards we're not allowed to say it like it is.

RGDATA!

Bad Panda wrote: »

Look! Can we please stop pretending that these people have any kind of moral code they live by.

We all know what travellers are like, but to appease the PC-ness of boards we're not allowed to say it like it is.

Don't speak for me mate, thanks. ("We all know what travellers are like").

Chuck Stone

Bad Panda wrote: »

We all know what travellers are like, but to appease the PC-ness of boards we're not allowed to say it like it is.

It's undeniable that there is a problem with domestic violence in the TC but to try to suggest that Travellers are some sort of amoral sub-species is disgusting. People who will use this terrible violent act to make prejudicial, broad brush comments about the Traveller community should be ashamed of themselves.

As for boards being PC? Boards has to operate within the law - the same laws that protect you and I from being defamed. Maybe you'd rather be posting here.

Bad Panda

RGDATA! wrote: »

Don't speak for me mate, thanks. ("We all know what travellers are like").

Well, I'm not your mate, thanks.

And when I said 'we all' I was clearly referring to people not hamstrung by some need to feel and say the right thing when it comes to such topics. A topic where anything but political correctness is frowned upon.

I have experienced many times what these people are really like and I for one cannot stand (most) of that community and they're bullsh1t, contrived 'rules of being a traveller'.

They contribute nothing to society and want everything in return.

tayto lover

Bad Panda wrote: »

Look! Can we please stop pretending that these people have any kind of moral code they live by.

We all know what travellers are like, but to appease the PC-ness of boards we're not allowed to say it like it is.

There vast majority of the Travelling Community are sound and are not involved in any type of crime.

MagicSean

Bad Panda wrote: »

Look! Can we please stop pretending that these people have any kind of moral code they live by.

We all know what travellers are like, but to appease the PC-ness of boards we're not allowed to say it like it is.

Bad Panda wrote: »

Well, I'm not your mate, thanks.

And when I said 'we all' I was clearly referring to people not hamstrung by some need to feel and say the right thing when it comes to such topics. A topic where anything but political correctness is frowned upon.

I have experienced many times what these people are really like and I for one cannot stand (most) of that community and they're bullsh1t, contrived 'rules of being a traveller'.

They contribute nothing to society and want everything in return.

I deal with the worst of travellers every day I go to work. I have no illusions about what goes on within their community because I have seen it all quite often. But I also know a lot about their culture and their community. And the fact is that they do have certain codes that they take very seriously. A man attacking another mans woman is just not done. It's considered extremely cowardly.

UCDVet

MagicSean wrote: »

I deal with the worst of travellers every day I go to work. I have no illusions about what goes on within their community because I have seen it all quite often. But I also know a lot about their culture and their community. And the fact is that they do have certain codes that they take very seriously. A man attacking another mans woman is just not done. It's considered extremely cowardly.

If it's not done - shouldn't you say '...It would be considered extremely cowardly?'

"It's considered extremely cowardly" implies it has happened.

tayto lover

tayto lover wrote: »

There vast majority of the Travelling Community are sound and are not involved in any type of crime.

With only about 15% in any sort of employment, I would doubt that.

Boombastic

tayto lover wrote: »

There vast majority of the Travelling Community are sound and are not involved in any type of crime.

I thought sweeping generalisations weren't allowed;)

MagicSean

UCDVet wrote: »

If it's not done - shouldn't you say '...It would be considered extremely cowardly?'

"It's considered extremely cowardly" implies it has happened.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4vf8N6GpdM

Chuck Stone

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

With only about 15% in any sort of employment, I would doubt that.

There are many reasons for this. A lot of employers wouldn't even entertain a Traveller's CV. There are also huge literacy problems in the TC especially the men.

I don't think they should even bother trying to engage the men in literacy programs - they should focus on the women. If you teach a woman you're teaching a family (the women are a lot more receptive to change too).

Aidric

tayto lover wrote: »

There vast majority of the Travelling Community are sound and are not involved in any type of crime.

Ah here.

Boombastic

Interesting read here

UCD - Domestic Violence within the Travelling Community:
A Challenge for Social Work

From research on the men:

The findings of this research suggested that it ‘happens regularly’ and
involves a range of abusive behaviours including even murder (McCann, 2007:14/15). The range of causes attributed to causing the abuse and violence included alcohol and drug use, arranged marriages, control, jealousy, learned behaviour and power- needing to show ‘who
the boss is’ (p.16)

OnTheCounter

Chuck Stone wrote: »

There are many reasons for this. A lot of employers wouldn't even entertain a Traveller's CV. There are also huge literacy problems in the TC especially the men.

I don't think they should even bother trying to engage the men in literacy programs - they should focus on the women. If you teach a woman you're teaching a family (the women are a lot more receptive to change too).

would agree with this. The women raise the children and influence them.

i was in an internet cafe a month ago in dublin and a traveller male called over the guy working there and in front of about 20 people he loudly asked the guy how to spell gmail. Seriously.

not a bit of interest in learning or ashamed that at about 20 he cant spell something an 8 year old could do.

what job is he going to get that is better than dole + rent supplement + medical card + all the other allowances?

tayto lover

Boombastic wrote: »

I thought sweeping generalisations weren't allowed;)

www.cheshirewestandchester.gov.uk/your_council/policies_and_performance/equality_and_diversity/gypsy_and_traveller_myth_bust.aspx

Here's a paragraph --

Will having Gypsy sites nearby increase crime levels?
There is no evidence anywhere to suggest that this is the case. Crimes are committed by individuals not communities. There is no evidence at all that there is a disproportionate number of offenders within Gypsy and Traveller communities as opposed to any other communities. The police service has learned from past experience that it is wrong to create stereotypes that link particular crimes with ethnic or social groups.
In Cheshire, neighbourhood policing and the establishment of Gypsy and Traveller Liaison Officers has helped build greater trust. Many Travellers return to the same sites year after year and do get to know local officers and local people. There are far fewer unauthorised encampment issues across the county than five or ten years ago. (Cheshire Constabulary 2011)


I remember a Garda telling us the same at a community meeting a few years ago. If I can find an Irish link i'll post it. At the time I found it hard to believe myself but he assured us that it was the case.

OnTheCounter

Bad Panda wrote: »

Look! Can we please stop pretending that these people have any kind of moral code they live by.

We all know what travellers are like, but to appease the PC-ness of boards we're not allowed to say it like it is.

it has nothing to do with morals

Micky Dolenz

As a court case is now pending, we'll have to wrap this up as per current Irish law with regard to contempt of court.