Are kids really worth all the hassle

2218219

TeddyTedson wrote: »

I actually fear this. Well not so much having kids, just that same life everyone seems to end up having. Working long hours to support family. Living in the same house doing the same ****ty 9-5 job with the same girlfriend for the rest of your life.
I'm probably being very insulting but it's just the way I personally feel about it.
Being stuck in on weekends looking after the kids. Jesus, I just could never imagine it.

I should be saying hopefully one day I'll want all that **** but I don't want it. Ever.

Perhaps it will all result in me dying alone as a miserable old bollocks with a whole lot of crazy.

your not insulting at all, your just showing how you miserable you and your parents were.


if that's how you think parenting is then wow mate, you must of not been happy growing up, hey?

keith16

Madam_X wrote: »

I don't have time for people giving others crap for not having children either. I think it's appalling. Fail to see where I suggested otherwise...

I agree madam_x. Before I had kids, I would encounter people from time to time who were all "you should have kids, blah blah blah", which largely just irritated me.


But that's more to do with people just being d1cks, and has nothing to do with the relative merits of having / not having kids.

I am a parent but I don't foist that on anyone else. Equally, I won't tolerate anyone telling me that I have no ambition or I'm wasting my life because I am a parent. Which to be fair I have only encountered on this thread. Which says a lot really.

2218219

and you don't stay in at weekends lol, you bring your kids out to go surfing, nature walks , spins around the country side, holidays , hobbies , go out in the garden with the sun out and a blue sky and paint/play ball/etc, go to the market and chill out,explore,playing at home , playing in the garden with your kids out having fun with you and your misses with the Barbecue on and invite a true social friend or friends over.. and so so so much more, millions of fun more things and everything.

weekends are overload with the amount of funs things to do.
it shows you how most of you that posted here never got to do anything on the weekends and really, nothing at all which is quite sad.

Bipolar Joe

I want a kid. I pretty much just sit around and play any ways, so it would be nice to have someone on my emotional and psychological level.

Varied

2218219 wrote: »

wow, reading back on some of the posts.

you guys must be really sad in life if that's what you think, seriously.
I am 14 and like wow, are you guys over 20 or what?

WOW some of people must just be so sad.

Loike tewtally.

tan11ie

Wow some of the replies are depressing...but each to their own :cool:

1ZRed

Don't want kids and hardly even see myself getting married because I don't really see the absolute need to do either one. Like a lot of people have said, I really don't want to be bogged down with kids, working my arse off for them, and sacrificing everything just to live out the dull routine that is to be expected.

Why do the majority of people see it as "the done thing" to have a family and settle down into a monotonous life, and then take pity on other people who don't have children or necessarily want the same thing?

If anything, my life will be much more rewarding without them and I'll have absolute freedom and more financial stability to do what I want with my partner, without any pressing and ever present responsibilities and limitations.

I think the whole "settling down and having a family" concept needs to be updated for the 21st century because it's not the be all and end all for everybody's life in modern society.

Scanlas The 2nd

1ZRed wrote: »

Don't want kids and hardly even see myself getting married because I don't really see the absolute need to do either one. Like a lot of people have said, I really don't want to be bogged down with kids, working my arse off for them, and sacrificing everything just to live out the dull routine that is to be expected.

Why do the majority of people see it as "the done thing" to have a family and settle down into a monotonous life, and then take pity on other people who don't have children or necessarily want the same thing?

If anything, my life will be much more rewarding without them and I'll have absolute freedom and more financial stability to do what I want with my partner, without any pressing and ever present responsibilities and limitations.

I think the whole "settling down and having a family" concept needs to be updated for the 21st century because it's not the be all and end all for everybody's life in modern society.

Well that would further destroy our economy.

Glowing

Does anyone here who already HAS kids think they're not worth the hassle?

ermahgerd

Daisy M wrote: »

Once again you are choosing to spout facts that you have no idea of, you do not know whether or not I am an exception and if nobody else would take lots to mean 75%.

It's common sense. Taking "lots" to mean 75% is ridiculous in itself. I'm not going to address you on it any further, it's ridiculous.

If you consider me to be condesending because I am correcting your incorrect statements then so be it, if I see an inconsistency I will point it out.

Um, no, I was saying you can leave the attempts at condescension with statements like "go look up the term ambiguous". You weren't correcting anything.

Here is the link.
http://www.thejournal.ie/census-shows-family-size-still-declining-but-at-a-slower-pace-400539-Mar2012/

Ugh, jesus, don't quote statistics if you don't understand them. It says that 62.4% of all families have more than 4 children which as I said to you originally is irrelevant as it takes into account an enormous amount of families who did not have the option to use contraception.

This figure is also dropping, meaning that there are more families being made with significantly less children thus dropping the average.

Are you able to give any sources for the facts you have spouted?

Yes, the CSO who get their data from the census.
The difference is, I know how to use that data.

Listen, I'm not going to continue with this any further with you for a number of reasons the number one being I just don't think you're smart enough to hold a discussion on the matter. Quoting a source such as TheJournal, which is absolute trash, would support this. You're wrong in basically everything you've said and you've a terrible, terrible attitude so I'm just not going to bother replying to you again on the matter. Good luck.

ermahgerd

2218219 wrote: »

your not insulting at all, your just showing how you miserable you and your parents were.

if that's how you think parenting is then wow mate, you must of not been happy growing up, hey?

Got to love it, a child who likely couldn't even produce a child itself, let alone support a child, is here telling adults about parenting.

Love it.

keith16

ermahgerd wrote: »

2218219 wrote: »

your not insulting at all, your just showing how you miserable you and your parents were.

if that's how you think parenting is then wow mate, you must of not been happy growing up, hey?

Got to love it, a child who likely couldn't even produce a child itself, let alone support a child, is here telling adults about parenting.

Love it.

Are you talking about yourself? And can you please tell me how parenting = no ambitions? Or are you selectively point scoring here?

ermahgerd

keith16 wrote: »

Are you talking about yourself? And can you please tell me how parenting = no ambitions? Or are you selectively point scoring here?

1: No, I'm clearly not talking about myself. Read properly before posting.
2: If you could read properly you would see I did not say that parenting = no ambitions. Go back and reread the statement you're referring to, properly this time.

keith16

ermahgerd wrote: »

keith16 wrote: »

Are you talking about yourself? And can you please tell me how parenting = no ambitions? Or are you selectively point scoring here?

1: No, I'm clearly not talking about myself. Read properly before posting.
2: If you could read properly you would see I did not say that parenting = no ambitions. Go back and reread the statement you're referring to, properly this time.

Wow. I'm very much capable of reading. But perhaps you could perhaps expand on your point because it makes no sense whatsoever. I don't see how ambition and kids are linked. Unless it is your ambition to raise children? You seem to think this isn't a worthy ambition?

And how do kids stand in the way of ambition? Because anyone who thinks they do is a fool.

ermahgerd

keith16 wrote: »

Wow. I'm very much capable of reading.

Deducing parenting = no ambition from the statement you referred to would indicate you're not.

I don't see how ambition and kids are linked.

Well then that's your problem because your life's ambitions, excluding those related to children, are affected by whether you have children or not.

Unless it is your ambition to raise children? You seem to think this isn't a worthy ambition?

It's as ambitious as making having breakfast an ambition.

And how do kids stand in the way of ambition?

I'm not explaining this to you.

Because anyone who thinks they do is a fool.

So given that you know this is my belief, as I asserted it, you're calling me a fool? Going personal are you? What a big man you are. Good on you.

I'm not engaging with you any further on this as you're clearly unable to have an objective discussion on the matter, let alone be rational about it. I should have guessed by your "talking about yourself hurrr hurrr hurr" bullsh1te from the start but you've only reduced you intellectual input with every extra word since. You have left me feeling terrible for your kids, admittedly.

Best of luck with it, and all that.

blingrhino

Glowing wrote: »

Does anyone here who already HAS kids think they're not worth the hassle?

I do , now I love them and all that but would I prefer the life I had before ? honestly , yes .
Having kids I feel ,is for the fear of been on your own in later life - totally selfish ..

ermahgerd

blingrhino wrote: »

I do , now I love them and all that but would I prefer the life I had before ? honestly , yes .
Having kids I feel ,is for the fear of been on your own in later life - totally selfish ..

That's very honest of you, thanks for stepping forward where others haven't managed to bring themselves to.

af_thefragile

What is this freedom you all talk about that having kids will take away from you??

I don't see how having kids can restrict whatever you want to do in life. You can always take them along with you wherever you want to go or you could go without them. Neing away from your kids for a couple of months is not the end of the world...

Richard Hillman

Literally, i would rather die than have a child. I dont fancy signing my life away to slavery.

shopaholic01

Abi wrote: »

I'm not being smart here, but you should go with your own advice. You've a heavy stance on the no children front to the point, that I don't think you're ever willing to even attempt to understand the pain that people that can't have children have to go through. That is no more wrong however, than the people who judge you.

Abi, I never belittled the suffering of those who can't conceive. I know couples who are desperate for a child and can't have them. I know the torture they go through with IVF and exploring all the other options. That was never the purpose of my posts, and I apologise if that was implied.

I responded to the attitude that an empty life is the inevitable consequence of choosing not to have children. Reference was made to weekends lurking in nightclubs etc., because what else would we have to do?

Having or not having children is a choice for some people, for others it isn't - either through infertility or unplanned pregnancy.

However, there are enough examples of poor parenting for people to realise that having children is a serious responsibility. Like I said previously, I admire good parents and yes, I sympathise with those who would love to have children but, there is no point having children when you know you will not give that child everything he/she deserves.

shopaholic01

af_thefragile wrote: »

What is this freedom you all talk about that having kids will take away from you??

I don't see how having kids can restrict whatever you want to do in life. You can always take them along with you wherever you want to go or you could go without them. Neing away from your kids for a couple of months is not the end of the world...

One very common example is couples who would now emigrate if they didn't have children, or if their children were at a different age. For example, it's very difficult to take a teenager from secondary school to a country with a completely different cirriculum. They want their child to have the best possible education and worry about the child settling in a new country, new school, coping with the changes etc.

It's harder for parents to retrain if they have a family to support, to work away for a couple of years to make money etc. A lot of families are now living apart - one parent working abroad and the other at home with the family. That is not to say that they regret having their children, but it does make life harder.

keith16

ermahgerd wrote: »

keith16 wrote: »

Wow. I'm very much capable of reading.

Deducing parenting = no ambition from the statement you referred to would indicate you're not.

I don't see how ambition and kids are linked.

Well then that's your problem because your life's ambitions, excluding those related to children, are affected by whether you have children or not.

Unless it is your ambition to raise children? You seem to think this isn't a worthy ambition?

It's as ambitious as making having breakfast an ambition.

And how do kids stand in the way of ambition?

I'm not explaining this to you.

Because anyone who thinks they do is a fool.

So given that you know this is my belief, as I asserted it, you're calling me a fool? Going personal are you? What a big man you are. Good on you.

I'm not engaging with you any further on this as you're clearly unable to have an objective discussion on the matter, let alone be rational about it. I should have guessed by your "talking about yourself hurrr hurrr hurr" bullsh1te from the start but you've only reduced you intellectual input with every extra word since. You have left me feeling terrible for your kids, admittedly.

Best of luck with it, and all that.

I am trying to have an objective discussion. You seem to think that because I am a parent that any other ambition in life should be relinquishined which is foolish.

I never called you a fool pal. I admit that I misquoted you somewhat, but my point still stands.

Daisy M

ermahgerd wrote: »

Ugh, jesus, don't quote statistics if you don't understand them. It says that 62.4% of all families have more than 4 children which as I said to you originally is irrelevant as it takes into account an enormous amount of families who did not have the option to use contraception.

This figure is also dropping, meaning that there are more families being made with significantly less children thus dropping the average.


Listen, I'm not going to continue with this any further with you for a number of reasons the number one being I just don't think you're smart enough to hold a discussion on the matter. Quoting a source such as TheJournal, which is absolute trash, would support this. You're wrong in basically everything you've said and you've a terrible, terrible attitude so I'm just not going to bother replying to you again on the matter. Good luck.

ermahgerd wrote: »

I'm not engaging with you any further on this as you're clearly unable to have an objective discussion on the matter, let alone be rational about it. I should have guessed by your "talking about yourself hurrr hurrr hurr" bullsh1te from the start but you've only reduced you intellectual input with every extra word since. You have left me feeling terrible for your kids, admittedly.

Best of luck with it, and all that.

Theres a bit of a pattern starting to emerge here, careful or you will have no one left to debate with.

Take heart you are doing the world a big favour by choosing not to have children.

af_thefragile

shopaholic01 wrote: »

One very common example is couples who would now emigrate if they didn't have children, or if their children were at a different age. For example, it's very difficult to take a teenager from secondary school to a country with a completely different cirriculum. They want their child to have the best possible education and worry about the child settling in a new country, new school, coping with the changes etc.

It's harder for parents to retrain if they have a family to support, to work away for a couple of years to make money etc. A lot of families are now living apart - one parent working abroad and the other at home with the family. That is not to say that they regret having their children, but it does make life harder.

That is not enough a reason for not having children. My uncle and aunt emigrated to another country with their kids and it didn't take very long for the kids to adjust to their new surrounding and school.

I know many people in college on graduate entry programs (or even the normal course) who have kids. Doesn't stop them from pursuing the education they want.


I used to be like you when i was a teenager thinking i'll bever have kids because its too much responsibility and i'ld like to be "free" move around the world, do whatever i want to. But that was just really the teenage "screw the world" angst in me. Now i realised i can still do everything i want while having kids and once they grow up a bit, you can always take them with you and do all you want to do with them. Its not gonna restrict ur freedom, you'll have company and your kids will love you for involving them in whatever pursuits u take.

The only thing that might worry people about having kids is not having enough money. But then i sorta never worried about money n lived on shoe string budgets all my life so i feel pretty confident i can manage paying for kids too.

Motorist

Daisy M wrote: »

Frankly I think this is an exaggerated statement. If you look at this anonymous thread there are no parents saying they regret having children and if they could turn back time they would never have them. Surely an internet forum is the place you could be most honest as no one will ever know who you are.

I know many parents and I can only think of one lady who while she didnt regret having her kids did begrudge the amount of effort (not commitment) involved.
I often read threads on here mentioning haggared parents who complain about how hard been a parent is on a non stop basis but I have never met aside from the lady I mentioned any other parents who are like that. Everyone has a moan from time to time be it about you job, partner, family home ect but it does not mean you wish you never had these things just that you are letting off steam.

If you choose not to have children great, enjoy life and be comfortable with your choice, don't try and make out that been a parent means you are living a substandard life because that isn't true.

If you choose to have children accept that while you are more happy and content than you have ever been that it is not for everyone and that people who choose not to have children do not live a less fufilled life than you do.

Don't be so incredulous as to what parents have said to me. Don't lambast people for their honesty. I have been truthfully told that they think it's really ****. Do they regret it? No. Much like a cancer patient doesn't regret getting chemotherapy even though it's awful. At least these parents have a more balanced perspective and don't come out with nauseating trite such as "it's made me into a better human being", or foolishly think they've accomplished something godly by having sex without contraception. Im sure they also relish the experience, but recognise it's many downfalls especially on their social lives, etc.

shopaholic01

af_thefragile wrote: »

That is not enough a reason for not having children. My uncle and aunt emigrated to another country with their kids and it didn't take very long for the kids to adjust to their new surrounding and school.

I know many people in college on graduate entry programs (or even the normal course) who have kids. Doesn't stop them from pursuing the education they want.


I used to be like you when i was a teenager thinking i'll bever have kids because its too much responsibility and i'ld like to be "free" move around the world, do whatever i want to. But that was just really the teenage "screw the world" angst in me. Now i realised i can still do everything i want while having kids and once they grow up a bit, you can always take them with you and do all you want to do with them. Its not gonna restrict ur freedom, you'll have company and your kids will love you for involving them in whatever pursuits u take.

The only thing that might worry people about having kids is not having enough money. But then i sorta never worried about money n lived on shoe string budgets all my life so i feel pretty confident i can manage paying for kids too.

I was giving examples of parents I know, so it is an issue for some. Not everyone has the financies, even with assistance, to go back to third level education and plenty of parents are afraid to uproot their children. Plenty of families are forced to separate and one works abroad to pay the mortgage and support a family. It does limit some people, I am not saying however that this is a reason not to have children, merely answering your question.

I'm not coming from a teenage angst perspective either, I'm in my late 30's.

Motorist

Mr_Spaceman wrote: »

FFS. What a life, eh?

Which begs the obvious: WTF did they have kids for then?

It's a bit like having a gulp of sour milk. You expect something different, and it's too late once you've drank it.

Daisy M

Motorist wrote: »

Don't be so incredulous as to what parents have said to me. Don't lambast people for their honesty. I have been truthfully told that they think it's really ****. Do they regret it? No. Much like a cancer patient doesn't regret getting chemotherapy even though it's awful. At least these parents have a more balanced perspective and don't come out with nauseating trite such as "it's made me into a better human being", or foolishly think they've accomplished something godly by having sex without contraception. Im sure they also relish the experience, but recognise it's many downfalls especially on their social lives, etc.

Its interesting how people vary, I have never had anything like this said to me even before I had children when perhaps it would be more easily brought up!!

From my experience most parents are some where in the middle of what you describe. They enjoy having their children, have few regrets but are not under the illusion that because they have chosen to be a parent that they are some sort of super human.

I really believe in live and let live, if someone chooses to have 12 children, something I would never choose to do, then good luck to them, (as long as they don't expect me to baby sit!) If some one doesn't want children then good luck to them too. It makes no difference to me.

What I find puzzling is why, the need to force your (not you, but people in general) opinion on others. If I and other parents say we are happy been a parent and have no regrets, then others should respect that point of view rather than dismissing it and informing us that we are missing out.
The one thing parents/gaurdians do have is an informed opinion, we have been adults without children and are adults with children so we are able to compare to what life was like both with and without children, anyone else is only making an educated guess.

Daisy M

Motorist wrote: »

It's a bit like having a gulp of sour milk. You expect something different, and it's too late once you've drank it.

But yet there are very few families that I know and I know hundreds, who have just the one child. Some people are whingers and you do need to take some of what they say with a pinch of salt, if they weren't moaning about children they would be moaning about something else.

Motorist

Daisy M wrote: »

But yet there are very few families that I know and I know hundreds, who have just the one child. Some people are whingers and you do need to take some of what they say with a pinch of salt, if they weren't moaning about children they would be moaning about something else.

And likewise to those who give you the superficial respose that it's brilliant. Like everything else, some parents have it easy or take more naturally to it. Others probably find it difficult. It's hard to judge until you go and have your own.

ermahgerd

Daisy M wrote: »

Theres a bit of a pattern starting to emerge here, careful or you will have no one left to debate with.

Oh, I will, such as intelligent people who can actually understand the statistics they're quoting

Take heart you are doing the world a big favour by choosing not to have children.

Ah more pettiness by someone who couldn't hold their argument and whose points fell apart completely with the most gentle of prodding.

The gene pool benefits every time someone such as myself breeds, it is polluted and is damaged every time someone like you does. I don't know if you'll understand that concept though...Anyway, we do need a steady supply of people who'll carry out menial, mindless work for us, so you guys do provide us with something.

We can both throw insults, dear. Now go tend to your contribution to the next generation of floor sweepers and petty criminals like a good parent.

Tarkus

To each his own...

Mine was the reason for living, the highs of every day, the unfettered joys that reminded you of youth's magic, memories that filled spaces that then couldn't be filled with bad ones, parenting that made you a better person who had vision, etc., etc., etc.

The only down side was her leaving for college, leaving ma & pa with a selfish feeling of heartbreak but a flood of pride on who she's become.

So individually? I couldn't have made a better choice in having a child & as far as I ever saw, didn't miss out on a thing by having her.

Sorry to the ones who may have not been so lucky.

say_who_now?

ermahgerd wrote: »

Daisy M wrote: »

Theres a bit of a pattern starting to emerge here, careful or you will have no one left to debate with.

Oh, I will, such as intelligent people who can actually understand the statistics they're quoting

Take heart you are doing the world a big favour by choosing not to have children.

Ah more pettiness by someone who couldn't hold their argument and whose points fell apart completely with the most gentle of prodding.

The gene pool benefits every time someone such as myself breeds, it is polluted and is damaged every time someone like you does. I don't know if you'll understand that concept though...Anyway, we do need a steady supply of people who'll carry out menial, mindless work for us, so you guys do provide us with something.

We can both throw insults, dear. Now go tend to your contribution to the next generation of floor sweepers and petty criminals like a good parent.

Your opinion of yourself is so obnoxious it'd be comical if I didn't think you were actually serious. I hope when they're colonizing Mars you're first in line, because this planet clearly isn't for you. NASA will welcome your space cadet credentials!

Mine, were, worth the hassle. Had hard times with them, but all those times where overshadowed by the enourmous joy they gave me.

Ive loved watching them grow up. I love them dearly, and luckily enough they feel the same way about me. I never laugh as hard as when I am with them.

Hopefully when Im old they'll mind me ))

Cant wait for the grandbabies

ermahgerd

say_who_now? wrote: »

Your opinion of yourself is so obnoxious it'd be comical if I didn't think you were actually serious. I hope when they're colonizing Mars you're first in line, because this planet clearly isn't for you. NASA will welcome your space cadet credentials!

What a pleasant little person you are

Well done on using big words too, by the way, I'm sure your nurses would be very, very proud. Print off your post and they might even put it on the fridge for the rest of the centre to see

say_who_now?

ermahgerd wrote: »

What a pleasant little person you are

Well done on using big words too, by the way, I'm sure your nurses would be very, very proud. Print off your post and they might even put it on the fridge for the rest of the centre to see

Well they certainly won't be putting your post on the fridge, I printed that off and the nurses helped me wipe my àrse with it.

ermahgerd

say_who_now? wrote: »

Well they certainly won't be putting your post on the fridge, I printed that off and the nurses helped me wipe my àrse with it.

Good man.

Now go take your meds, cross the fingers that you've no more violent spastic fits and go play with your lego.

1ZRed

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Well that would further destroy our economy.

How so? I think it's natural for most people to want children and have it in them. I just think that if that part of life wasn't so emphasised as the "the sole purpose of your life is to raise children" then, people who don't want them wouldn't be thrown down on or maybe pushed into having them. There's already too many people on the planet to begin with. Cutting down on the amount of people who do have children unnecessarily, will only help that problem.

Screw the economy, it doesn't even come into play with what I'm talking about because many larger factors effect it more substantially.

say_who_now?

ermahgerd wrote: »

say_who_now? wrote: »

Well they certainly won't be putting your post on the fridge, I printed that off and the nurses helped me wipe my àrse with it.

Good man.

Now go take your meds, cross the fingers that you've no more violent spastic fits and go play with your lego.

Yes daddy.

keith16

ermahgerd wrote: »

Oh, I will, such as intelligent people who can actually understand the statistics they're quoting



Ah more pettiness by someone who couldn't hold their argument and whose points fell apart completely with the most gentle of prodding.

The gene pool benefits every time someone such as myself breeds, it is polluted and is damaged every time someone like you does. I don't know if you'll understand that concept though...Anyway, we do need a steady supply of people who'll carry out menial, mindless work for us, so you guys do provide us with something.

We can both throw insults, dear. Now go tend to your contribution to the next generation of floor sweepers and petty criminals like a good parent.

This from the the person who gets up on their high horse and takes things all "personal" when their view is criticised for being utterly foolish.

Are you even going to bother defending this view? Think about all those obnoxious parents who look down on others for not having kids and bang on about it being the best thing in the world.

You are just like them. It's completely obnoxious and wrong to say that children get in the way of other ambitions and parents have no lives outside their kids, just as it is to say that having kids is the be-all and end all.

Your tactics in this discussion are childish to say the least. I asked you a question (admittedly with a slight mis-quotation). You subsequently attacked my reading ability, intellectual capacity and got in a huff when I mentioned the word fool. All of this of course distracting from your inability to defend your viewpoint.

Scanlas The 2nd

1ZRed wrote: »

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Well that would further destroy our economy.

How so? I think it's natural for most people to want children and have it in them. I just think that if that part of life wasn't so emphasised as the "the sole purpose of your life is to raise children" then, people who don't want them wouldn't be thrown down on or maybe pushed into having them. There's already too many people on the planet to begin with. Cutting down on the amount of people who do have children unnecessarily, will only help that problem.

Screw the economy, it doesn't even come into play with what I'm talking about because many larger factors effect it more substantially.

Screw the economy you say? Screw the economy and people die and suffer. Fewer doctors and less medical equipment causes deaths. The economy is hugely important to our well being and happiness. The western world is running out of young people, unless you want to work yourself to death in your nineties you might want to reconsider your position how many new babies we need.

JupiterKid

I think a lot of people have children just because of the enormous social pressure placed on them by parents, siblings, relatives and friends and that's very sad. It's expected of them as their "duty."

People should have children because they want to, not because they feel they have to. I was at a wedding of a good mate just a couple of weeks ago and there were a few other married couples who were married in the past couple of years there and at the reception the usual question they were asked, especially by aul ones, was "when are you going to have children?" - it's very nosey and rude IMO.

Look the world is already overpopulated by humans and Ireland is going through an unprecedented baby boom so I applaud anyone who makes the decision NOT to have children.

I really love my nephew and niece - and I like children - but there are times that I'm glad I'm a gay man and not under the obligation to become a parent. They are a massive drain on your resources and often turn you into a right wing reactionary.

1ZRed

Scanlas The 2nd wrote: »

Screw the economy you say? Screw the economy and people die and suffer. Fewer doctors and less medical equipment causes deaths. The economy is hugely important to our well being and happiness. The western world is running out of young people, unless you want to work yourself to death in your nineties you might want to reconsider your position how many new babies we need.

Population had nothing to do with our economical fuck up. And who's to say there will be few doctors? The future of high payed careers are in science, technology and medicine. You could argue that people would shift more to these positions instead of commerce, trade and others in a bad economic time.

The world is not running out of young people. The boom that caused such a massive and rapid increase in population is just aging. We are slowly levelling off nicely and most importantly, sustainably. It just happens to be a tricky situation that there will be more older people than younger people replacing them but the level of young people is still staggeringly high and more than sufficient.

There are nearly 7 billion people on the planet, speaking for the western world only, the vast majority of them will want to reproduce, albeit having fewer children, so you still have nothing to worry about in terms of a young population. What was happening to the population last century in the western world was completely unsustainable long term. It's only now that things are becoming more realistic.

The world will just have to wade through a period of having a very large aging population for a century and then things will be far more levelled between the young population and the aging one. Which speaking long term, will be much better for our happiness and well being without the population reaching a point where they demand resources that aren't there, and being completely congested and overpopulated.

branbee

Just on the whole ambition issue, I honestly don't understand how anybody could look down on someone whos ambition is to raise children, or insinuate that it is to do with a lack of ambition.

People train for years to be teachers/nurses/care providers/youth workers and their ambition to do this is praised and respected because they have a goal to help and care for people in society. Yet when someones ambition is to actually bring a child into the world and care for them and dedicate their time and effort to them its ridiculed because they are doing it for their own child rather than someone elses.

Im not really making my point very clear il admit but I just don't get how someone wanting to raise a person, shape their personality, be responsible for their well being etc, indicates a lack of ambition. When it comes to parents who drag their kids up rather than raise them and then go on to have more children with no interest in actual parenting then yeah I guess its a valid point but I hope that's a small minority.

Also since having my daughter I have a lot more ambition in life. I work so hard for her sake more than I ever would if she wasn't in my life. Not because I need to but because I want to. I could quite happily work a boring job that'll lead nowhere in order to pay for her upbringing but instead I want to further my career and training so she is proud of me. And the extra money would be nice too I guess!
And my education/training/career path hasnt been hindered in the slightest.

keith16

branbee wrote: »

Just on the whole ambition issue, I honestly don't understand how anybody could look down on someone whos ambition is to raise children, or insinuate that it is to do with a lack of ambition.

People train for years to be teachers/nurses/care providers/youth workers and their ambition to do this is praised and respected because they have a goal to help and care for people in society. Yet when someones ambition is to actually bring a child into the world and care for them and dedicate their time and effort to them its ridiculed because they are doing it for their own child rather than someone elses.

Im not really making my point very clear il admit but I just don't get how someone wanting to raise a person, shape their personality, be responsible for their well being etc, indicates a lack of ambition. When it comes to parents who drag their kids up rather than raise them and then go on to have more children with no interest in actual parenting then yeah I guess its a valid point but I hope that's a small minority.

Also since having my daughter I have a lot more ambition in life. I work so hard for her sake more than I ever would if she wasn't in my life. Not because I need to but because I want to. I could quite happily work a boring job that'll lead nowhere in order to pay for her upbringing but instead I want to further my career and training so she is proud of me. And the extra money would be nice too I guess!
And my education/training/career path hasnt been hindered in the slightest.

You could have just had a bowl of cereal. Just as ambitious :rolleyes:

Daisy M

ermahgerd wrote: »

Oh, I will, such as intelligent people who can actually understand the statistics they're quoting



Ah more pettiness by someone who couldn't hold their argument and whose points fell apart completely with the most gentle of prodding.

The gene pool benefits every time someone such as myself breeds, it is polluted and is damaged every time someone like you does. I don't know if you'll understand that concept though...Anyway, we do need a steady supply of people who'll carry out menial, mindless work for us, so you guys do provide us with something.

We can both throw insults, dear. Now go tend to your contribution to the next generation of floor sweepers and petty criminals like a good parent.

I thought you said we were done?
Seriously and I mean seriously, you have major issues, what rational person gets this riled up because someone on an internet forum has an opposing view to them.

mikom

gsxr1 wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=to7uIG8KYhg

http://youtu.be/to7uIG8KYhg

You would have to have a heart of stone not to smile at this.

Pity it's a viral ad for the Fisher Price Space Saver Highchair..........

Mr_Spaceman

There are one or two posters/professional arguers in this debate who should be feeling the force of the ban hammer.

NegativeCreep

mikom wrote: »

Pity it's a viral ad for the Fisher Price Space Saver Highchair..........

You just had to ruin it

Micky Dolenz

ermahgerd wrote: »

Oh, I will, such as intelligent people who can actually understand the statistics they're quoting



Ah more pettiness by someone who couldn't hold their argument and whose points fell apart completely with the most gentle of prodding.

The gene pool benefits every time someone such as myself breeds, it is polluted and is damaged every time someone like you does. I don't know if you'll understand that concept though...Anyway, we do need a steady supply of people who'll carry out menial, mindless work for us, so you guys do provide us with something.

We can both throw insults, dear. Now go tend to your contribution to the next generation of floor sweepers and petty criminals like a good parent.

ermahgerd wrote: »

Good man.

Now go take your meds, cross the fingers that you've no more violent spastic fits and go play with your lego.

ermahgerd wrote: »

What a pleasant little person you are

Well done on using big words too, by the way, I'm sure your nurses would be very, very proud. Print off your post and they might even put it on the fridge for the rest of the centre to see

Mod

How Rude!

If you do have children I hope they have better manners then you.

Original banned increased for major dickish behaviour.