neighbour's landlord won't cut back their trees

endofrainbow

don't really want to go down the legal route but looking for advice from someone who may have been in the same situation. long story short - house next door has been rented out for a couple of years, no issue with current tenants. However, front and back gardens have become quite overgrown with no attempt made to maintain them. Ivy from their garden is now creeping up over my house.

A few months ago, I was pricing a job to have my side of the bushes/shrubs/trees (in my garden) trimmed back. Called the landlord to say I was having this done and that the gardener might need access to their garden - was told no problem, that they would maintain their side and cut back the offending branches. They came over a week later and and cut back a few twigs....

I had no issue paying for my garden to be done but was hoping that the landlord might contribute or at least maintain their side. That was late April and still nothing has been done. Branches from their trees are overshadowing my house and the landlord is not really approachable - constantly saying *yeah sure, get me a price and I will pay half*. the offending trees are planted on their side and it would take a cherry-picker to cut back the branches and/or cut the trees. I have already forked out for my side and don't think I should have to pay for their trees to be cut back.

Opinions?

Procrastastudy

endofrainbow wrote: »

don't really want to go down the legal route but looking for advice from someone who may have been in the same situation. long story short - house next door has been rented out for a couple of years, no issue with current tenants. However, front and back gardens have become quite overgrown with no attempt made to maintain them. Ivy from their garden is now creeping up over my house.

A few months ago, I was pricing a job to have my side of the bushes/shrubs/trees (in my garden) trimmed back. Called the landlord to say I was having this done and that the gardener might need access to their garden - was told no problem, that they would maintain their side and cut back the offending branches. They came over a week later and and cut back a few twigs....

I had no issue paying for my garden to be done but was hoping that the landlord might contribute or at least maintain their side. That was late April and still nothing has been done. Branches from their trees are overshadowing my house and the landlord is not really approachable - constantly saying *yeah sure, get me a price and I will pay half*. the offending trees are planted on their side and it would take a cherry-picker to cut back the branches and/or cut the trees. I have already forked out for my side and don't think I should have to pay for their trees to be cut back.

Opinions?

Charter - Can't provide legal advice (for that reason and the other reason bing I'm not qualified to do so). I would look at the PRTB and see if you can get any joy with that - I'm no suggesting you can. I would also suggest that you start corresponding with the Landlord in writing and being specific as it seems at the moment might be being just a wooly as he is.

BornToKill

Procrastastudy wrote: »

I would look at the PRTB and see if you can get any joy with that

What would you consider to be the relevance of the PRTB in this situation? The relationhip between the parties is that they own neighbouring properties. They are not in a landlord-tenant relationship.

Procrastastudy

BornToKill wrote: »

What would you consider to be the relevance of the PRTB in this situation? The relationhip between the parties is that they own neighbouring properties. They are not in a landlord-tenant relationship.

I was under the (possibly probably mistaken) impression that the PRTB have powers when there are issues being caused to third parties. By virtue of Section 15 of the 2004 Act.

BornToKill

From the PRTB's Information Note on Third Party Applications for PRTB Dispute Resolution:

"Please note that third party issues in relation to the standard and maintenance of a rental dwelling are a matter for local authority enforcement and the PRTB does not have jurisdiction to deal with such complaints".

January

Cut the trees and throw the clippings back into their garden as technically it's their property.

Procrastastudy

January wrote: »

Cut the trees and throw the clippings back into their garden as technically it's their property.

I'd love to find the authority on this being okay. I'm not saying it isn't I#m just worried about it being one of those things that has passed into the realm of 'people say'.

I think the OP is more concerned about the cost of the cherry picker etc.

Ken.

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/property/2012/0614/1224317867177.html
THE MINISTER for Justice is reported to be considering legislation that will entitle homeowners to adequate light. So, what are the current rights of people living in the shadow of high trees and shrubs?

Q Where branches overhang a neighbour’s property, is it the responsibility of the neighbour to cut back the branches and maintain the trees?
A Where branches from a neighbours tree overhang into another property, the overhang can be cut back to the boundary wall and all branches must be returned to the tree owner. Again, it is best to consult with the tree owner before taking action.

Procrastastudy

ken wrote: »

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/property/2012/0614/1224317867177.html
THE MINISTER for Justice is reported to be considering legislation that will entitle homeowners to adequate light. So, what are the current rights of people living in the shadow of high trees and shrubs?

Q Where branches overhang a neighbour’s property, is it the responsibility of the neighbour to cut back the branches and maintain the trees?
A Where branches from a neighbours tree overhang into another property, the overhang can be cut back to the boundary wall and all branches must be returned to the tree owner. Again, it is best to consult with the tree owner before taking action.

Thanks Ken - I'd still like to find a primary source though although to be fair it's pretty reliable if reported in the times.

iverjohnston

If you were to drive a copper nail or two into each tree trunk, the problem would be resolved over the course of six months or so.:)

M in Cavan

NUTLEY BOY

This is what is known as criminal damage!

GarIT

NUTLEY BOY wrote: »

This is what is known as criminal damage!

If thats criminal damage then the trees are tresspassing and cutting them back would be acting in self defence.

jblack

GarIT wrote: »

If thats criminal damage then the trees are tresspassing and cutting them back would be acting in self defence.

I assume that is a joke?

You are abating a trespass when cutting back the branches, but the property that is trespassing (the branches/leaves etc) does not belong to you so you should either give it back or have permission to dispose or keep them.

Be careful, if you just f**k them back over the wall and they damage something you may be liable yourself.

GarIT

jblack wrote: »

I assume that is a joke?

You are abating a trespass when cutting back the branches, but the property that is trespassing (the branches/leaves etc) does not belong to you so you should either give it back or have permission to dispose or keep them.

Be careful, if you just f**k them back over the wall and they damage something you may be liable yourself.

It mostly was, but I do think you would have a hard time trying to say clearing away organic material overhanging someones property is criminal damage.

jblack

GarIT wrote: »

It mostly was, but I do think you would have a hard time trying to say clearing away organic material overhanging someones property is criminal damage.

I doubt it would be criminal damage either unless you could show the requisite intent, but liability in negligence would have a much lower threshold.

Procrastastudy

jblack wrote: »

I doubt it would be criminal damage either unless you could show the requisite intent, but liability in negligence would have a much lower threshold.

I think the criminal damage comment stemmed (see what I did there!) from the copper nail comment - I think that's pretty clear cut (I'm on a roll!) criminal damage.

valleyoftheunos

Its a clause in nearly all residential leases that the person responsible for the upkeep of the garden and trimming of any trees or bushes is the tenant and not the Landlord.

With that in mind by talking to the landlord about this you may be dealing with the wrong person as it might not be his responsibility.

January

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

Its a clause in nearly all residential leases that the person responsible for the upkeep of the garden and trimming of any trees or bushes is the tenant and not the Landlord.

With that in mind by talking to the landlord about this you may be dealing with the wrong person as it might not be his responsibility.

Only if the landlord provides the tools to do so. If the landlord doesn't provide it then it's the landlords responsibility to hire someone to keep the garden in good condition, that or the landlord can leave a lawnmower etc and the tenant is then responsible.

valleyoftheunos

January wrote: »

Only if the landlord provides the tools to do so. If the landlord doesn't provide it then it's the landlords responsibility to hire someone to keep the garden in good condition, that or the landlord can leave a lawnmower etc and the tenant is then responsible.

where on earth did you get that from? as I said most residential leases (certainly anything done by a letting agent) will have a very explicit clause stating that the tenant is responsible for upkeep and maintenance of the garden. I've often found that both Tenant and Landlord are ignorant of it because they have made incorrect assumptions that it is the landlords responsibility.

NUTLEY BOY

Operation "copper nail" would be criminal damage. Cutting back trespassing branches is fine.

January

valleyoftheunos wrote: »

where on earth did you get that from? as I said most residential leases (certainly anything done by a letting agent) will have a very explicit clause stating that the tenant is responsible for upkeep and maintenance of the garden. I've often found that both Tenant and Landlord are ignorant of it because they have made incorrect assumptions that it is the landlords responsibility.

This post here would suggest that it's the landlords responsibility.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=64604545&postcount=4

Also here, http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/repairs_maintenance_and_minimum_physical_standards.html

So it doesn't really matter what is in the lease as the law overrides anything that is in a lease.

byhookorbycrook

What is the position at present re very high trees on the neighbouring property blocking light in one's own?

Procrastastudy

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

What is the position at present re very high trees on the neighbouring property blocking light in one's own?

I'm more than open to correction on this but - if anything - I believe its a case by case nuisance basis.

Isn't there legislation in the works in relation to this though?

Boardwalker100

Procrastastudy wrote: »

endofrainbow wrote: »

don't really want to go down the legal route but looking for advice from someone who may have been in the same situation. long story short - house next door has been rented out for a couple of years, no issue with current tenants. However, front and back gardens have become quite overgrown with no attempt made to maintain them. Ivy from their garden is now creeping up over my house.

A few months ago, I was pricing a job to have my side of the bushes/shrubs/trees (in my garden) trimmed back. Called the landlord to say I was having this done and that the gardener might need access to their garden - was told no problem, that they would maintain their side and cut back the offending branches. They came over a week later and and cut back a few twigs....

I had no issue paying for my garden to be done but was hoping that the landlord might contribute or at least maintain their side. That was late April and still nothing has been done. Branches from their trees are overshadowing my house and the landlord is not really approachable - constantly saying *yeah sure, get me a price and I will pay half*. the offending trees are planted on their side and it would take a cherry-picker to cut back the branches and/or cut the trees. I have already forked out for my side and don't think I should have to pay for their trees to be cut back.

Opinions?

Charter - Can't provide legal advice (for that reason and the other reason bing I'm not qualified to do so). I would look at the PRTB and see if you can get any joy with that - I'm no suggesting you can. I would also suggest that you start corresponding with the Landlord in writing and being specific as it seems at the moment might be being just a wooly as he is.

I've come across this before and really the rule is "if it's in your property look after it"
Your completely within your rights to cut back as far as the boundary line, and as old law says pass it back over the wall. Dont pass the boundary line though. I understand that it's easier said then done and may require a professional, who in turn will have to be paid. Maybe let your neighbour know, that its being done and that everything is going back over regardless. Then he will be left to foot a removal bill. Which can at times be half the cost. Might get him to move a bit quicker. Worth a shot!!

Boardwalker100

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

What is the position at present re very high trees on the neighbouring property blocking light in one's own?

As it stands your land/you do not have a right to light. As to say your case wouldn't be won by saying your kitchen etc is in darkness and therefore your neighbour must take down or reduce the height of his trees. Probably could have phrased that a bit better but how and ever!

valleyoftheunos

January wrote: »

This post here would suggest that it's the landlords responsibility.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=64604545&postcount=4

Also here, http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/renting_a_home/repairs_maintenance_and_minimum_physical_standards.html

So it doesn't really matter what is in the lease as the law overrides anything that is in a lease.

I don't see that anywhere in the links above. It is always possible to contract out of statutory rights or obligations unless the legislation provides otherwise. As I'm sure you are aware a Lease is just a contract and if a tenant has agreed to maintain the garden there will be no obligation on the Landlord.