RIRA Man shot dead in broad daylight

Fenian Army

Monty Burnz wrote: »

They do what they can, but they have to operate within the law. Admittedly, it's f*cking frustrating at times.

If you are in trouble with drug dealers, ie owe them money or something, (which in a working class community is easy enough to happen when young kids get taken advantage of) its worse than useless to go to the Garda.

Unfortunatly I'm speaking from experience but the best thing to do is:

1.Pay them off

2.Go to someone like alan ryan if you can't.

The garda won't do anything, they'll take your statement which will be about it and be nowhere to be seen when you have your legs broken.

And thats not me supporting AR, but pointing out facts.

Monty Burnz

Crooked Jack wrote: »

Hence my use of the word 'morally' and lack of the word 'legally'

And laws are not based on morality?

I have to say, I was happy enough when I heard that the Yorkshire Ripper was dead. I am now saddened to learn that that makes me his moral equivalent.

Lelantos

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

alan ryan has gone from being Batman to the A-Team now..

If your kid has a problem with drugs, and nobody else can help .....

The truth is he had no training in drug rehab and he received his gun health and safety in a field from older men trying to impress kids with their ****e talk...

Bad Alan Barracus
"I ain't gettin in no coffin fool"

Monty Burnz

Fenian Army wrote: »

If you are in trouble with drug dealers, ie owe them money or something, (which in a working class community is easy enough to happen when young kids get taken advantage of) its worse than useless to go to the Garda.

Unfortunatly I'm speaking from experience but the best thing to do is:

1.Pay them off

2.Go to someone like alan ryan if you can't.

The garda won't do anything, they'll take your statement which will be about it and be nowhere to be seen when you have your legs broken.

And thats not me supporting AR, but pointing out facts.

Right, but that isn't really something in his favour, is it? If criminal A* has a problem with criminal B, talk to criminal C?

*or non-criminal

Sleepy

Fenian Army wrote: »

lol.

We are talking about working class communities being utterly destroyed by these scum dealing drugs like heroin, not people selling weed or yolks to rich kids

No, we're talking about kids who've been dragged up injecting ****e into their arms or joining criminal gangs to make money off of the junkies (and don't kid yourself that Ryan wasn't making money off those poor saps).

If more people in working class communities actually (a) worked and (b) were bothered to raise their children to understand they could have a better life by making the most of the educational opportunities provided to them and working hard, there'd be **** all market for the dealer's wares.

We all know plenty of guys who grew up in absolute ****holes that were raised well and have done very well for themselves. Growing up without a silver spoon in your mouth is no excuse to turn to crime. It's no excuse for fathering / giving birth to a child you can't be arsed to rear. We have one of the most generous social welfare systems in Europe. The vast, vast majority of the welfare classes who've never worked a day in their lives live in absolute luxury when compared to the lives lived by our grandparents.

There are good, honest people living in these areas. Who can they blame for the fact their communities are ****holes when they start turning to the likes of Ryan instead of the police? When they refuse to "rat" on their law-breaking neighbours? When they hand over money for protection from the local bully boy who's draped himself with a tricolour instead of working with the police to put him behind bars?

Ash.J.Williams

Has anybody here had a problem and went to the gardai, who did nothing, and you had to visit a vigilante instead?

canttalk1

Sleepy wrote: »

No, we're talking about kids who've been dragged up injecting ****e into their arms or joining criminal gangs to make money off of the junkies (and don't kid yourself that Ryan wasn't making money off those poor saps).

If more people in working class communities actually (a) worked and (b) were bothered to raise their children to understand they could have a better life by making the most of the educational opportunities provided to them and working hard, there'd be **** all market for the dealer's wares.

We all know plenty of guys who grew up in absolute ****holes that were raised well and have done very well for themselves. Growing up without a silver spoon in your mouth is no excuse to turn to crime. It's no excuse for fathering / giving birth to a child you can't be arsed to rear. We have one of the most generous social welfare systems in Europe. The vast, vast majority of the welfare classes who've never worked a day in their lives live in absolute luxury when compared to the lives lived by our grandparents.

There are good, honest people living in these areas. Who can they blame for the fact their communities are ****holes when they start turning to the likes of Ryan instead of the police? When they refuse to "rat" on their law-breaking neighbours? When they hand over money for protection from the local bully boy who's draped himself with a tricolour instead of working with the police to put him behind bars?

very, very apt location for such a silly comment.

Sleepy

Calling my post silly doesn't deal with the points I make, it just makes it look as if you have no rebuttal for them.

fasttalkerchat

StaunchyDJ wrote: »

Still it can't be seen as okay to shoot guns! What do you think would happen if at a gang leaders funeral they decided to let off a volley or 2...? The cops would be straight in!

Sending in the guards certainly isn't a solution. That was all I had to say on the matter.

Fenian Army

canttalk1 wrote: »

very, very apt location for such a silly comment.

Pretty much

Happyman42

Monty Burnz wrote: »

And the alternative is...Brits out? Or what?

It may have to be that. Depends what price you put on a peaceful society. The level of violence at the moment is something the powers that be can plainly live with, the con they are selling 'again', is that it will eventually go away or that they (with our help and blessing) can violently suppress it.

Carlos Orange

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I wonder why it never occurred to Batman to just tax the criminals rather than actually stopping them? He'd have made a fortune and would have avoided lots of nasty scraps.

I don't think Batman was in it for the money. He was already fairly well off. It was more of a hobby.

Crooked Jack

Monty Burnz wrote: »

And laws are not based on morality?

I have to say, I was happy enough when I heard that the Yorkshire Ripper was dead. I am now saddened to learn that that makes me his moral equivalent.

Ooo, why stop there, why dont you just go all out and say Hitler.
People are on here condemning him as a murdering scumbag and then saying they're glad he was murdered in the same breath.
These people are condemning this fella as a murderer and then celebrating his murder. Ergo they think murder is acceptable in certain situations, much like he did. how are those attitudes not morally equivalent.

If i bang your wife it'd fairly safe to say that's morally wrong. It's not illegal though.

AEDIC

Happyman42 wrote: »

It may have to be that. Depends what price you put on a peaceful society. The level of violence at the moment is something the powers that be can plainly live with, the con they are selling 'again', is that it will eventually go away or that they (with our help and blessing) can violently suppress it.

Won't solve anything.... sorry to remind everyone of the main thrust of the thread here....but this is about a guy using thinly veiled 'republicanism' to 'tax' drug dealers.

Unless I am missing something and those drug dealers were Brits then you are a bit off the mark....in this case.

Carlos Orange

Fenian Army wrote: »

The fact is that the garda do fcuk all to stop these drug dealers which is wh people turn to people like Alan Ryan for help.

If someone has a kid in trouble with drug dealers it's better to go to someone like Alan Ryan than the garda, thats the simple fact of the matter.

If shatter and the government combated drugs better and didn't leave working class communities to fend for themselves people like Ryan wouldn't be able to establish themselves in the community.

Thats the root of the issue.

If people in 'working class communities' (which seems to mean the exact opposite these days) bought less drugs there wouldn't even be drug dealers. Not sure economists know much about how economies work but I think they are onto something with this whole supply/demand idea.

fasttalkerchat

Ash.J.Williams wrote: »

Has anybody here had a problem and went to the gardai, who did nothing, and you had to visit a vigilante instead?

Not me personally but I know of someone who was raped and couldn't face going to court. They sat in with a local republican and their mother and told the story. They confronted the scumbag who admitted to it in exchange for keeping his life. He's now in a wheelchair in England.

Monty Burnz

Happyman42 wrote: »

It may have to be that. Depends what price you put on a peaceful society. The level of violence at the moment is something the powers that be can plainly live with, the con they are selling 'again', is that it will eventually go away or that they (with our help and blessing) can violently suppress it.

I think the idea that you can 'peacefully' drive out the million plus people who are British but regard the six counties as their home is rather unrealistic.

Sleepy

And isn't that a wonderful story :rolleyes:

We live in a representative democracy in the 21st century and you think tribal war-lords offer a better option?

Goro

Yeah it's all the Brits fault. Those Brits have a terrible hold on Donaghmede, The young lads in tracksuits there really must get the Brits out of that area for the good of the country. And sure if they sell a bit of gear, rob a few cars and bully a few publicans out of a grand or 10 along the way...well hey, it's all in the name of patriotism.

The stupidity of the Ra heads here is stunning.

Monty Burnz

Crooked Jack wrote: »

Ooo, why stop there, why dont you just go all out and say Hitler.

Oh no, I was very sad when he died.

Crooked Jack wrote: »

People are on here condemning him as a murdering scumbag and then saying they're glad he was murdered in the same breath.
These people are condemning this fella as a murderer and then celebrating his murder. Ergo they think murder is acceptable in certain situations, much like he did. how are those attitudes not morally equivalent.

There's a difference between "I'm glad he's dead" and actually killing him. No?

Crooked Jack wrote: »

If i bang your wife it'd fairly safe to say that's morally wrong. It's not illegal though.

You are dead wrong there mate, my wife is only 12.

Monty Burnz

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

Not me personally but I know of someone who was raped and couldn't face going to court. They sat in with a local republican and their mother and told the story. They confronted the scumbag who admitted to it in exchange for keeping his life. He's now in a wheelchair in England.

Of course, there's no risk that somebody would make up a story like that, or someone might get clipped in a case of mistaken identity...

canttalk1

psinno wrote: »

If people in 'working class communities' (which seems to mean the exact opposite these days) bought less drugs there wouldn't even be drug dealers. Not sure economists know much about how economies work but I think they are onto something with this whole supply/demand idea.

You´re either trying to provoke a response, or like the previous poster from one of the most prestiguos areas in Dublin, you are extremely ignorant. Drug use / abuse is not confined to the lower classes and in the case of cocaine, arguably the most popular drug on the "market", there´s a reason why it´s called a yuppy-drug.

In fact, there was a high profile model that died using the drug only a couple of years ago that briefly highlighted the problem of that particular drug amongst our "elite" society. I won´t do that girl the dishonour of mentioning her name in this thread, but it´s nice to see the full circle as to how each of the sociological problems interconnect between the economic classes.

Ash.J.Williams

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

Not me personally but I know of someone who was raped and couldn't face going to court. They sat in with a local republican and their mother and told the story. They confronted the scumbag who admitted to it in exchange for keeping his life. He's now in a wheelchair in England.

so she didn't report it?

Crooked Jack

Monty Burnz wrote: »

Oh no, I was very sad when he died.

There's a difference between "I'm glad he's dead" and actually killing him. No?

You didnt answer my question so I see no reason to answer yours.

You are dead wrong there mate, my wife is only 12.

Touche

seamus

fasttalkerchat wrote: »

They confronted the scumbag who admitted to it in exchange for keeping his life.

Admit to committing a crime or be killed.

Yeah, I can't see how that system would ever get it wrong...

Sleepy

And I'm sure we've never had a false rape allegation in this country...

Happyman42

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I think the idea that you can 'peacefully' drive out the million plus people who are British but regard the six counties as their home is rather unrealistic.

I never said that.
30 years ago to talk about the 'unrealistic' idea that the IRA would disarm, that the Unionists would sit down and thrash out a mutally respectful deal to enable power to be equally shared would have had you thrown in a loony bin.
Yet it happened, but there where those who were left behind and that movement is growing. Is it time to admit that this movement exists and have legitimate claims (even if you don't agree with them), is it time to engineer a situation where these people are brought to a negotiating table and their issues addressed? Or will we wait until the body count is once again high enough?

Cheeky_gal

WERE HIS BROTHERS INVOLVED IN CRIME?

Someone said they were, but I did not read about any truth of that in any of the papers.

jmayo

Fenian Army wrote: »

If you are in trouble with drug dealers, ie owe them money or something, (which in a working class community is easy enough to happen when young kids get taken advantage of) its worse than useless to go to the Garda.

Unfortunatly I'm speaking from experience but the best thing to do is:

1.Pay them off

2.Go to someone like alan ryan if you can't.
...

Problem with going down that avenue is you then owe alan ryan.

I just find it rather unbelievable that people are still talking up his republican credentials.
I suppose he was like a fair few more protectors or freedom fighters who while supposedly protecting their local community are actually sucking it dry at the same time.
Reminds me a bit of the mafia.

Funny how these guys manage to get rich whilst they are protecting their communities and isn't it funny how some drug dealers and theives can continue to function within their area of control ?

What makes his so called republican credentials all the more laughable is that he lived and operated in Dublin, not in some area that is still controlled by those awful Brits.

Fenian Army

jmayo wrote: »

Problem with going down that avenue is you then owe alan ryan.

I just find it rather unbelievable that people are still talking up his republican credentials.
I suppose he was like a fair few more protectors or freedom fighters who while supposedly protecting their local community are actually sucking it dry at the same time.
Reminds me a bit of the mafia.

Funny how these guys manage to get rich whilst they are protecting their communities and isn't it funny how some drug dealers and theives can continue to function within their area of control ?

What makes his so called republican credentials all the more laughable is that he lived and operated in Dublin, not in some area that is still controlled by those awful Brits.

The thing is, you wouldn't.

Lelantos

Fenian Army wrote: »

jmayo wrote: »

Problem with going down that avenue is you then owe alan ryan.

I just find it rather unbelievable that people are still talking up his republican credentials.
I suppose he was like a fair few more protectors or freedom fighters who while supposedly protecting their local community are actually sucking it dry at the same time.
Reminds me a bit of the mafia.

Funny how these guys manage to get rich whilst they are protecting their communities and isn't it funny how some drug dealers and theives can continue to function within their area of control ?

What makes his so called republican credentials all the more laughable is that he lived and operated in Dublin, not in some area that is still controlled by those awful Brits.

The thing is, you wouldn't.

Well, not anymore anyways.

Cienciano

seamus wrote: »

Admit to committing a crime or be killed.

Yeah, I can't see how that system would ever get it wrong...

It really sums up the "republican" justice system! Imagine some girl decided she didn't like you cos you dumped her. 24 hours later you're in a wheelchair having to leave the country!

Omackeral

flanzer wrote: »

Could they not have drafted in the army and the rangers also?

That would make it worse I think...

humanji

Cheeky_gal wrote: »

WERE HIS BROTHERS INVOLVED IN CRIME?

Someone said they were, but I did not read about any truth of that in any of the papers.

From what I hear, one wasn't (the one who went back to his house on the night of the murder), and the others are.

Happyman42

jmayo wrote: »

Problem with going down that avenue is you then owe alan ryan.

I just find it rather unbelievable that people are still talking up his republican credentials.
I suppose he was like a fair few more protectors or freedom fighters who while supposedly protecting their local community are actually sucking it dry at the same time.
Reminds me a bit of the mafia.

Funny how these guys manage to get rich whilst they are protecting their communities and isn't it funny how some drug dealers and theives can continue to function within their area of control ?

What makes his so called republican credentials all the more laughable is that he lived and operated in Dublin, not in some area that is still controlled by those awful Brits.

I love all this moral indignation that flies in the face of reality. Revolutionaries, subversives, anti establishment, terrorists (call them whatever you want) around the world have always funded their operations this way. Bank robbing, involement in what we call crimminal activity.
When you have an EU fund for revolution that they can apply to or a Bank that likes to say Yes to revolutionaries then their methods of fund raising might change.
It a reality of life that this is how they fund themselves, get over it and deal with the core issues. Because otherwise it's just shrill indignation and useless condemnation which always has and always will, fall on deaf ears.

Goro

Dutch Gold Republicans.

As soon as the Brits leave they promise they will all get jobs and stop selling gear.

Carlos Orange

canttalk1 wrote: »

You´re either trying to provoke a response, or like the previous poster from one of the most prestiguos areas in Dublin, you are extremely ignorant. Drug use / abuse is not confined to the lower classes and in the case of cocaine, arguably the most popular drug on the "market", there´s a reason why it´s called a yuppy-drug.

In fact, there was a high profile model that died using the drug only a couple of years ago that briefly highlighted the problem of that particular drug amongst our "elite" society. I won´t do that girl the dishonour of mentioning her name in this thread, but it´s nice to see the full circle as to how each of the sociological problems interconnect between the economic classes.

Drug use isn't confined to the lower class and neither is working confined to 'working class' areas. It is a fairly meaningless term.

Sleepy

Happyman42 wrote: »

I never said that.
30 years ago to talk about the 'unrealistic' idea that the IRA would disarm, that the Unionists would sit down and thrash out a mutally respectful deal to enable power to be equally shared would have had you thrown in a loony bin.
Yet it happened, but there where those who were left behind and that movement is growing. Is it time to admit that this movement exists and have legitimate claims (even if you don't agree with them), is it time to engineer a situation where these people are brought to a negotiating table and their issues addressed? Or will we wait until the body count is once again high enough?

What legitimate claims have they?

That they should be allowed to run protection rackets? That drug dealers should pay them tax? That they should be allowed to ignore the democratic wishes of the people they claim to represent?

Neither population supports their dream of unification of the two countries on this Island. Both sides voted in the Good Friday agreement.

Monty Burnz

Happyman42 wrote: »

I never said that.
30 years ago to talk about the 'unrealistic' idea that the IRA would disarm, that the Unionists would sit down and thrash out a mutally respectful deal to enable power to be equally shared would have had you thrown in a loony bin.
Yet it happened, but there where those who were left behind and that movement is growing. Is it time to admit that this movement exists and have legitimate claims (even if you don't agree with them), is it time to engineer a situation where these people are brought to a negotiating table and their issues addressed? Or will we wait until the body count is once again high enough?

I admit they have legitimate claims, and I also admit that the unionists have legitimate claims. How do you square that circle?

Dyr

humanji wrote: »

From what I hear, one wasn't (the one who went back to his house on the night of the murder), and the others are.

Where did you hear it?

Monty Burnz

Happyman42 wrote: »

I love all this moral indignation that flies in the face of reality. Revolutionaries, subversives, anti establishment, terrorists (call them whatever you want) around the world have always funded their operations this way. Bank robbing, involement in what we call crimminal activity.

Perhaps then you will spare us the moral indignation about collusion, oppression and counter-terrorist operations?

After all, it flies in the face of reality and it's always been that way.

Cheeky_gal

Type in Aaron Nealis into Facebook.

He's Alan's mate (the guy who got shot in the leg).

The amount of crap he's posted up about Alan been a hero, look at the amount of likes and comments. It's sickening

Happyman42

Sleepy wrote: »

What legitimate claims have they?

That they should be allowed to run protection rackets? That drug dealers should pay them tax? That they should be allowed to ignore the democratic wishes of the people they claim to represent?

Neither population supports their dream of unification of the two countries on this Island. Both sides voted in the Good Friday agreement.

I think you might need to increase the intensity of your 'research'.
We'll just get them all 'jobs', that'll cure everything. :rolleyes:

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I admit they have legitimate claims, and I also admit that the unionists have legitimate claims. How do you square that circle?

Recognition and negotiation, it's the only way. History teaches us the dangers of supression on this island.
Putting your head in the sand and hoping it will go away is not the answer either.

Monty Burnz

Happyman42 wrote: »

Recognition and negotiation, it's the only way. History teaches us the dangers of supression on this island.
Putting your head in the sand and hoping it will go away is not the answer either.

But that has been done, and a huge majority have supported the conclusion. What is left to negotiate? What further concessions can now be made to the majority, and what more to the minority?

Fenian Army

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Uh5V7G8Geo

If one can ignore the sentiment of the video there's some decent pics in there so people can get an idea of what the aggro is about

jmayo

Happyman42 wrote: »

I love all this moral indignation that flies in the face of reality. Revolutionaries, subversives, anti establishment, terrorists (call them whatever you want) around the world have always funded their operations this way. Bank robbing, involement in what we call crimminal activity.

Ehh how about calling a spade a spade and just call them criminals ?
Yes there are revolunaries, but how anyone can call alan ryan one is beyond me.
What was he revolting against in north Dublin city ?

Happyman42 wrote: »

When you have an EU fund for revolution that they can apply to or a Bank that likes to say Yes to revolutionaries then their methods of fund raising might change.
It a reality of life that this is how they fund themselves, get over it and deal with the core issues. Because otherwise it's just shrill indignation and useless condemnation which always has and always will, fall on deaf ears.

Again what was he supposedly revolting against ?

And what are the core issues for North Dublin ?
What core issue was being satisfied by demanding a publican shut his business or else ?

BTW why don't you get over it and deal with the modern world.
The vast vast majority of people don't want your so called revolutionaries like alan ryan, because they see them for what they are, criminals who prey on their own.

Happyman42

Monty Burnz wrote: »

What is left to negotiate? What further concessions can now be made to the majority, and what more to the minority?

Do you really think you are going to find that out by suppression? Good luck with that point of view, it is clear that not everyone was accommadated in the GFA. You can jump up and down and point at the voting statistics all you wish, does not deal with the realities though. People have died and will continue to die.....needlessly. We have been here before, are we going to go the same road again?........looks like it to me.

Monty Burnz

Happyman42 wrote: »

Do you really think you are going to find that out by suppression?

I'm not suppressing anyone - I'm just asking a simple question.

Happyman42 wrote: »

Good luck with that point of view, it is clear that not everyone was accommadated in the GFA. You can jump up and down and point at the voting statistics all you wish, does not deal with the realities though. People have died and will continue to die.....needlessly. We have been here before, are we going to go the same road again?........looks like it to me.

No disrespect, but there's a lot of rhetoric there that does not address the question - how do you satisfy the hardline republicans and the hardline loyalists at the same time?

Happyman42

jmayo wrote: »

Ehh how about calling a spade a spade and just call them criminals ?
Yes there are revolunaries, but how anyone can call alan ryan one is beyond me.
What was he revolting against in north Dublin city ?



Again what was he supposedly revolting against ?

And what are the core issues for North Dublin ?
What core issue was being satisfied by demanding a publican shut his business or else ?

BTW why don't you get over it and deal with the modern world.
The vast vast majority of people don't want your so called revolutionaries like alan ryan, because they see them for what they are, criminals who prey on their own.

Just in: 'Will all Republicans, Revolutionaries and those who wish to see a United Ireland please live within 10 miles of the Border'.:rolleyes:

Happyman42

Monty Burnz wrote: »

I'm not suppressing anyone - I'm just asking a simple question.

No disrespect, but there's a lot of rhetoric there that does not address the question - how do you satisfy the hardline republicans and the hardline loyalists at the same time?

I didn't believe that the two sides could thrash out the GFA, but they did and it is holding for those who signed up to it.
I don't know what the answers are or what terms will satisfy but I do know, what will 'not' work and is not working. Young men are being attracted to this movement again, those who where prepared to allow the GFA address their issues with partition are being swayed back to supporting the disidents. That is what is happening amid all the useless condemnation of this one man's fundraising.