Limerick improvement projects

source

keane2097 wrote: »

What size of a building would be suitable out of interest?

I would be happy with a 4 storey building on most of the site, possibly up to 5 at the front.

Edit: but also one that isn't shoehorned into the site taking up the majority of the site with buildings.

Vanquished

source wrote: »

I would be happy with a 4 storey building on most of the site, possibly up to 5 at the front.

Edit: but also one that isn't shoehorned into the site taking up the majority of the site with buildings.

I think you'll find that there was a significant amount of open space in the centre between the two blocks.

Limerick needs to densify. A hollow centre with sprawling, low coverage suburbs is never going to thrive or prosper.

CosmicFool

source wrote: »

I would be happy with a 4 storey building on most of the site, possibly up to 5 at the front.

Edit: but also one that isn't shoehorned into the site taking up the majority of the site with buildings.

http://punchescrossstudentvillage.com/

Don't think this is out of place at all. Looks nice. It would give the area a much needed boost.

sioda

It was bland boring architecture adding nothing to the area. Yes we need the development but could we not get a more imaginative design.

Cookiemunster

I'm more interested in the part of the decision where they said that the site couldn't be couldn't be excavated because the old petrol tanks and contaminated soil could affect the Shannon. Sounds a bit strange to me. The Shannon is a kilometer away, as are the other river/streams in the area. The old gasworks site on the Dock Road has recently been excavated and cleared of contaminants. Why would this not have been possible here?

martyc5674

Cookiemunster wrote: »

I'm more interested in the part of the decision where they said that the site couldn't be couldn't be excavated because the old petrol tanks and contaminated soil could affect the Shannon. Sounds a bit strange to me. The Shannon is a kilometer away, as are the other river/streams in the area. The old gasworks site on the Dock Road has recently been excavated and cleared of contaminants. Why would this not have been possible here?

Found that strange myself. There’s ways and means of getting those tanks out and decontaminated , and quite frankly the current owners should be responsible for doing that sooner rather than later if there actually is a concern about their contents.
I’m on the fence about whether it should have been granted or not. When I see student accom on the planning it sets alarm bells, lower regs enforced = cheaper build cost, and very often don’t actually end up as student accom for long. On the other hand hard to ignore the housing crisis of course.
Marty

mdmix

Cookiemunster wrote: »

I'm more interested in the part of the decision where they said that the site couldn't be couldn't be excavated because the old petrol tanks and contaminated soil could affect the Shannon. Sounds a bit strange to me. The Shannon is a kilometer away, as are the other river/streams in the area. The old gasworks site on the Dock Road has recently been excavated and cleared of contaminants. Why would this not have been possible here?

Ya I was a bit confused by that myself, I took it to mean there was information lacking in the application..

Vanquished

Yes. The necessary environmental screening assessment wasn't included in the planning application. If a site is located within the water catchment area of a Special Area of Conversation, in this case the Lower River Shannon then a 'Natura Impact Statement' is required.

It was a pretty poor oversight by the developers and their planning consultants that they neglected to adhere to this requirement. Hopefully they will re-submit an application for the site as it urgently needs to be redeveloped.

damowill

Thread here about whether Annacotty Train Station should be reopened. If so, would people use it? Annacotty is expanding and growing all the time, however it probably needs some higher density.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058021576

Cookiemunster

No point reopening the station when there are no trains to stop there (as is mention in that thread).

lisasimpson

If anything a new station near the back of Thomand park would be better so students in LIT could commute from Castleconnell Nenagh etc down along the track. However there is no interest to invest in the that line. If they trains could travel at a proper speed and at decent times people would use it . Sadly no money or interest with the powers that be to make that happen

Eire-Dearg

The fact that the train to Castleconnell leaves at 5pm (or even earlier?) and not a bit later when city workers might have a chance to get as far as the station, says it all.

source

Eire-Dearg wrote: »

The fact that the train to Castleconnell leaves at 5pm (or even earlier?) and not a bit later when city workers might have a chance to get as far as the station, says it all.

The last train leaves Limerick at 16:45 which means you can't go home on it, and the first train gets into Limerick at 08:45.

knipex

source wrote: »

The last train leaves Limerick at 16:45 which means you can go home on it, the issue is that the first train gets into Limerick at 08:45.

How many people finish work in time to get a 16:45 train ??

source

knipex wrote: »

How many people finish work in time to get a 16:45 train ??

Exactly why it's not used and in danger of being shut down due to low passenger numbers! IE apear to be useless at arranging lines and calculating timetables based on passenger numbers.

The reason there isn't a line to Shannon, is IE didn't think the passenger numbers coming through the airport were sufficient to warrant it, completely ignoring the population of Shannon, a lot of whom work in either Limerick or Ennis, and the massive numbers from Limerick and Ennis who commute to Shannon for work.

knipex

source wrote: »

The reason there isn't a line to Shannon, is IE didn't think the passenger numbers coming through the airport were sufficient to warrant it, completely ignoring the population of Shannon, a lot of whom work in either Limerick or Ennis, and the massive numbers from Limerick and Ennis who commute to Shannon for work.

If they built a line to Shannon it would probably terminate at the airport and pass by the industrial estate..

A commuter train from Limerick with stops in Caherdavin, Cratloe Smithstown, West-park end of Ind Est., runway side of the Ind Est and then the airport would do well.

Start running to get first train into Shannon for around 7am and then every 30 minutes up to around 10. after than drop to 1 and hour or even 1 every 2 hours.. and then pick up starting at 4 leaving Shannon and finishing around 7 before slowing down again. People work flexible hours and shift now, Its not 8 to 4 or 9 to 5 anymore. those days are gone..

Niallof9

source wrote: »

On traffic, if you believe that students don't have cars then you should have a look some day at the sheer volume of cars parked around Courtbrack/Ashbourne Ave, and the increase in traffic when the students are around vs when they are not.

On building high, if you look back over my posts in this very thread, you'll see that I am completely in favour of doing so in the city centre, but not in a residential area.

I would also say that while I agree that 7 storeys is not very high in theory, when all the other buildings around it are at most 2 storeys then it is completely out of place and unsuitable.

As a someone who lives in the area, I want that site built on. It's an eyesore as it is, but building a bigger eyesore on it to satisfy student housing requirements isn't the answer. A better design, that doesn't take over the area, would have been successful.

.Out of place...2 km from the city centre ffs:rolleyes:

How do you expect Limerick to grow?

source

Niallof9 wrote: »

.Out of place...2 km from the city centre ffs:rolleyes:

How do you expect Limerick to grow?

It's a residential area, made up exclusively of max 2 storey buildings, 7 storeys IS far too large and out of place in the context of the surrounding area.

CosmicFool

source wrote: »

It's a residential area, made up exclusively of max 2 storey buildings, 7 storeys IS far too large and out of place in the context of the surrounding area.

The only houses it will have a direct impact on is the few houses on Rosbrien Road. It's surrounded by peony court punches bar/hotel, HSE building & lidl, flavins butchers and the few shops that are there and Aldi. There is also a substantial incline towards the city centre from that crossroads and it won't look as tall from the houses on o connell Avenue.

Cookiemunster

CosmicFool wrote: »

The only houses it will have a direct impact on is the few houses on Rosbrien Road. It's surrounded by peony court punches bar/hotel, HSE building & lidl, flavins butchers and the few shops that are there and Aldi. There is also a substantial incline towards the city centre from that crossroads and it won't look as tall from the houses on o connell Avenue.

I'm not sure why the height is even being discussed. It got refused because the developer didn't submit a Natura Impact Statement in the application. ABP didn't give any other reasons for refusal. Therefore if they reapply with that report done, there's no reason why permission shouldn't be granted.

source

CosmicFool wrote: »

The only houses it will have a direct impact on is the few houses on Rosbrien Road. It's surrounded by peony court punches bar/hotel, HSE building & lidl, flavins butchers and the few shops that are there and Aldi. There is also a substantial incline towards the city centre from that crossroads and it won't look as tall from the houses on o connell Avenue.

I live up here, I use Punch's Cross multiple times daily. I will say it again for all those who seem to have missed it the first time around.

I want something built on the site, I have been looking at it daily for 10 years, and less regularly before that. It is an eyesore and something needs to be built there. I do not, however, believe that the building presented for planning was the correct building for the site. Building the wrong thing there only goes further to damage the fabric of our city, rather than what getting it right would provide, building for the sake of building is the wrong way to go here.

Yes there are some commercial buildings in the immediate surrounds of the site. It doesn't change the fact that the area as a whole is a residential area. Again I will note that Peony Court is a 1 storey building, Punches Hotel is a 2 storey building, HSE/ETB building is a 2 storey building, Lidl is a 2 Storey building, the Greenpark Centre is also a single storey complex.

The building planned for the site was to be 7 storeys at the Punches Cross elevation, 5 storeys above the tallest building in the area. It would be visible all along New Street, It would be visible from Ballinacurra Road, Rosbrien Road, and yes once you crest the hill on O'Connell Ave it would be less visible but that is the only direction that there would be little visual impact.

I have discussed the building with my neighbours and the design was universally disliked by pretty much everyone in the community. If you drive past the site, there are renders of the building on the hoarding, someone has written the word "UGLY" in permanent marker on those renders. The design was not liked by existing residents, it was far too imposing and out of scale for the area. And yes it is a pretty ugly design.

We all want action to be taken on the site, but we don't want 7 storeys of concrete facing us in an area with a maximum current building height of 2 storeys. We understand there is a housing crises, we understand the site has been empty for about 15 years or more at this stage, we understand that something needs to be built there and we want something built there. Just not that monstrosity!

source

Cookiemunster wrote: »

I'm not sure why the height is even being discussed. It got refused because the developer didn't submit a Natura Impact Statement in the application. ABP didn't give any other reasons for refusal. Therefore if they reapply with that report done, there's no reason why permission shouldn't be granted.

Locals believe it is too high and the majority I've talked with in the area have made submissions to that effect, and will again if permission is sought again.

Cookiemunster

source wrote: »

Locals believe it is too high and the majority I've talked with in the area have made submissions to that effect, and will again if permission is sought again.

That may be the case, but ABP obviously decided to ignore those submissions as height wasn't mentioned in the decision. As I said the only issue was the Natura Impact Statement.

tototoe

Personally think that site needs a big lump of a building, and thought they got it close enough from what I saw. The height didn't even enter my head as too much. Not that bloody high.

CosmicFool

source wrote: »

I live up here, I use Punch's Cross multiple times daily. I will say it again for all those who seem to have missed it the first time around.

I want something built on the site, I have been looking at it daily for 10 years, and less regularly before that. It is an eyesore and something needs to be built there. I do not, however, believe that the building presented for planning was the correct building for the site. Building the wrong thing there only goes further to damage the fabric of our city, rather than what getting it right would provide, building for the sake of building is the wrong way to go here.

Yes there are some commercial buildings in the immediate surrounds of the site. It doesn't change the fact that the area as a whole is a residential area. Again I will note that Peony Court is a 1 storey building, Punches Hotel is a 2 storey building, HSE/ETB building is a 2 storey building, Lidl is a 2 Storey building, the Greenpark Centre is also a single storey complex.

The building planned for the site was to be 7 storeys at the Punches Cross elevation, 5 storeys above the tallest building in the area. It would be visible all along New Street, It would be visible from Ballinacurra Road, Rosbrien Road, and yes once you crest the hill on O'Connell Ave it would be less visible but that is the only direction that there would be little visual impact.

I have discussed the building with my neighbours and the design was universally disliked by pretty much everyone in the community. If you drive past the site, there are renders of the building on the hoarding, someone has written the word "UGLY" in permanent marker on those renders. The design was not liked by existing residents, it was far too imposing and out of scale for the area. And yes it is a pretty ugly design.

We all want action to be taken on the site, but we don't want 7 storeys of concrete facing us in an area with a maximum current building height of 2 storeys. We understand there is a housing crises, we understand the site has been empty for about 15 years or more at this stage, we understand that something needs to be built there and we want something built there. Just not that monstrosity!

So because it's a residential area there can't be any tall buildings? Total Nimbyism. The only reason the design is disliked by locals is because locals don't want a tall building in the area so by nature they're going to dislike it. Anyways. I think once ABP get the proper submissions in it will be back on track and I do hope it goes ahead. Limerick needs projects like this.

source

CosmicFool wrote: »

So because it's a residential area there can't be any tall buildings? Total Nimbyism. The only reason the design is disliked by locals is because locals don't want a tall building in the area so by nature they're going to dislike it. Anyways. I think once ABP get the proper submissions in it will be back on track and I do hope it goes ahead. Limerick needs projects like this.

Read the thread, I've already covered this, what I think would be acceptable in the space and why it's not nimbyism. I'm not going to repeat myself anymore.

sioda

CosmicFool wrote: »

So because it's a residential area there can't be any tall buildings? Total Nimbyism. The only reason the design is disliked by locals is because locals don't want a tall building in the area so by nature they're going to dislike it. Anyways. I think once ABP get the proper submissions in it will be back on track and I do hope it goes ahead. Limerick needs projects like this.

The design is crap its bland and boring. That site doesn't need 7 stories source is dead right it's out of scale for the area and its an elevated site. They never presented a drawing from the Ballinacurra side which might change people's perceptions

CosmicFool

sioda wrote: »

The design is crap its bland and boring. That site doesn't need 7 stories source is dead right it's out of scale for the area and its an elevated site. They never presented a drawing from the Ballinacurra side which might change people's perceptions

It really isn't. It's perfectly fine for the area. And they have drawings from all sides if you looked.

Cookiemunster

source wrote: »

Read the thread, I've already covered this, what I think would be acceptable in the space and why it's not nimbyism. I'm not going to repeat myself anymore.

Not wanting something built near where you live because you don't like it is the definition of NIMBYism. Just because you'd accept something different on the site doesn't change that.

sioda

It also ignores the new apartment guidelines that all new apartments need terrace or balcony space.