Refusing to work notice.

Esoteric_

Query for my sister.

She has been working in a creche for 11 months. During the 11 months, she has had deductions taken from her wages, supposedly for tax purposes, which it transpired did not go on taxes, but into the owner's pocket. She is owed overtime, which they have not paid her for. Her legal ratio of how many children should be in her room has been completely overlooked (on several occasions, she was left alone with more than 20 children), the owner regularly screams abuse at her, etc etc. It is basically a terrible environment to work in.

Yesterday, the HSE were called in after a report was made, and they gave the owner one week to sort out the outlined issues with health and safety. This left the owner stressed out and she was more verbally abusive than usual.

This morning, my sister came into work and was working away as usual. The owner, for no particular reason (as is usual), started screaming at her, and my sister walked away as she felt intimidated. The owner then made a threat to her. This is not the first time the owner has threatened her. She regularly calls my sister an idiot, cúnt, stupid bítch and regularly says 'I'll fcuking kill you, I'll dance on your head, etc etc.'

My sister, after this threat, broke down and walked out of the place, and told them she will under no circumstances work her notice, as she is in genuine fear for her safety (as she has seen the owner hit the children in the creche and as such feels that there is a chance the owner will make good on her threats to hurt her).

What I want to know is, under these circumstances, does my sister have any entitlement to receive wages for hours worked? She is willing to forfeit her holiday pay, illegal deductions and overtime, as long as she gets her wages for the week and a half that she is owed. Is she entitled to this? The owner has called her and texted her around 10 times since my sister left the creche this morning, and is now saying that she will not pay her anything for her hours worked (she is owed over 400 euro just for the hours she's worked, excluding overtime).

Can the owner do this? I know legally she has to work her notice, but she's terrified and just wants her wages and nothing else.

Procrastastudy

Make a report to the Guards the fact that she hasn't done so already is quite reprehensible in all honesty.

dlofnep

That's horrible. Yes, make a report to the Gardaí. Don't leave someone else suffer like this.

Procrastastudy

dlofnep wrote: »

That's horrible. Yes, make a report to the Gardaí. Don't leave someone else suffer like this.

Or someone's Kids.

Engage with a half decent employment solicitor for the moneys owed and anything else. PM me if you want a recommendation but it's in the Dublin 7 area.

Liamario

The owner has been hitting small children and your sister is worried about her wages?? :mad:

él statutorio

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Query for my sister.

She has been working in a creche for 11 months. During the 11 months, she has had deductions taken from her wages, supposedly for tax purposes, which it transpired did not go on taxes, but into the owner's pocket. She is owed overtime, which they have not paid her for. Her legal ratio of how many children should be in her room has been completely overlooked (on several occasions, she was left alone with more than 20 children), the owner regularly screams abuse at her, etc etc. It is basically a terrible environment to work in.

Yesterday, the HSE were called in after a report was made, and they gave the owner one week to sort out the outlined issues with health and safety. This left the owner stressed out and she was more verbally abusive than usual.

This morning, my sister came into work and was working away as usual. The owner, for no particular reason (as is usual), started screaming at her, and my sister walked away as she felt intimidated. The owner then made a threat to her. This is not the first time the owner has threatened her. She regularly calls my sister an idiot, cúnt, stupid bítch and regularly says 'I'll fcuking kill you, I'll dance on your head, etc etc.'

My sister, after this threat, broke down and walked out of the place, and told them she will under no circumstances work her notice, as she is in genuine fear for her safety (as she has seen the owner hit the children in the creche and as such feels that there is a chance the owner will make good on her threats to hurt her).

What I want to know is, under these circumstances, does my sister have any entitlement to receive wages for hours worked? She is willing to forfeit her holiday pay, illegal deductions and overtime, as long as she gets her wages for the week and a half that she is owed. Is she entitled to this? The owner has called her and texted her around 10 times since my sister left the creche this morning, and is now saying that she will not pay her anything for her hours worked (she is owed over 400 euro just for the hours she's worked, excluding overtime).

Can the owner do this? I know legally she has to work her notice, but she's terrified and just wants her wages and nothing else.

Report the owner to the Gardaí immediately for the above along with threats made to your sister.

Esoteric_

Liamario wrote: »

The owner has been hitting small children and your sister is worried about her wages?? :mad:

No, she is not just worried about her wages. There's been a HSE inspection for a reason. :rolleyes:

At the end of the day, I'm not here to ask about the children. If that was the case, I'd have put this in the legal discussion forum. The situation with the children and such is being dealt with already, which is why I asked solely for advice on her wage entitlements.

Procrastastudy

Actually sorry to post again - but given the nature of this I felt I should say this. Engage with a solicitor first. You sister could be in all kinds of trouble for not having reported this. Do it sooner rather than later any further delay could open up an even bigger can of worms.

I'd also think very carefully about what you are posting on an open forum.

IITYWYBMAD

Liamario wrote: »

The owner has been hitting small children and your sister is worried about her wages?? :mad:

I see this as an addition to the problem, and any moral high ground you are trying to gain is sad imo.

OP, I would suggest a number of things need to be done. I would advise your sister to write to her (previous) employer outlining the reason she walked out today, and demanding that she be paid all monies due to her.

I would contact the HSE and social services, and put in writing the abuse she has witnessed, and also outlining the metal abuse she has personally suffered over the past with regards to her working conditions.

I would immediately get her to contact the Guards, and make a statement to them (I would inform her emplyer that she is doing this, recording the time, place and outline the complaint).

I would advise your sister to have no further contact with this person, and seek redress through the multitude of channels available to her.

él statutorio

Procrastastudy wrote: »

Actually sorry to post again - but given the nature of this I felt I should say this. Engage with a solicitor first. You sister could be in all kinds of trouble for not having reported this. Do it sooner rather than later any further delay could open up an even bigger can of worms.

+1 to this. While your sister was probably doing her best in the conditions she really should get proper legal advice if for no other reason than to cover herself if the HSE decide to prosecute.

Esoteric_

Thanks very much for the helpful advice, guys.

Procrastastudy - Don't worry. I have changed the details in the OP from the full details of the situation enough to make it difficult to determine where the place is, also my username on here is not any indication of my real name either, so it shouldn't even be linked back to me.

But yeah, thanks so much guys. I appreciate the helpful input.

kopfan77

LyndaMcL wrote: »

No, she is not just worried about her wages. There's been a HSE inspection for a reason. :rolleyes:

At the end of the day, I'm not here to ask about the children. If that was the case, I'd have put this in the legal discussion forum. The situation with the children and such is being dealt with already, which is why I asked solely for advice on her wage entitlements.

To those criticising this person for not reporting.....please take a look at this post...I think its pretty obvious that it was her who made the report to the HSE!

Procrastastudy

It probably doesn't have legs - but also see what a solicitor advises ref a civil assault claim.

Procrastastudy

kopfan77 wrote: »

To those criticising this person for not reporting.....please take a look at this post...I think its pretty obvious that it was her who made the report to the HSE!

The HSE aren't the body you report criminal activity to.

Esoteric_

Procrastastudy wrote: »

The HSE aren't the body you report criminal activity to.

Indeed, they're not. But without proof (no CCTV in the place), there is little else she can do.

They are denying threatening her too (somebody acting on my sister's behalf answered the phone to them), and the two people who witnessed the threats are also denying it happening.

All the advice has been taken on board and she will be doing her utmost to get this sorted.

kopfan77

Procrastastudy wrote: »

The HSE aren't the body you report criminal activity to.

But she has reported it to a relevant body who have a duty of care to investigate and thereby notify the Gardai if needs be....which is reporting the matter and not "not reporting" it as some people are stipulating

Procrastastudy

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Indeed, they're not. But without proof (no CCTV in the place), there is little else she can do.

They are denying threatening her too (somebody acting on my sister's behalf answered the phone to them), and the two people who witnessed the threats are also denying it happening.

All the advice has been taken on board and she will be doing her utmost to get this sorted.

While I understand why she is hesitant to do so the lack of CCTV is no excuse. If my job was working with children and I witnessed a member of staff assaulting a child I would have immediately called the guards - there, then, in front of the person.

I can also tell you that if I was a parent that found out my child had been assaulted, by someone know to be violent, and the staff did not report it to the guards I can assure you I would be doing my damnest to make sure they were joined in any suit I took against the company. Probably without success in all honesty.

In fact having been a retail manager for a number of years I would have done the same if a member of my staff had done that in a shop.

EDIT - Legally she may very well be covered - I'm not qualified to say. Morally - she really needs to reflect on whether she should continue working in this area if she can't protect the children under her care.

I'll refrain from making any more comment on the subject - your post is asking a specific question - I personally would have provided a bit less information to avoid the understandable outrage - but thats just me.

twowheelsonly

As others have said, engage a Solicitor.
Inform Gardai and HSE re any H & S or legal issues and contact NERA about her wages and conditions.
She may need witnesses (parents) to establish how long she was working there as if no tax was being paid it's unlikely that the owner has records or will be willing to truthfully disclose these. This will have repercussions on any benefits that she may need to claim.

3DataModem

LyndaMcL wrote: »

Thanks very much for the helpful advice, guys.

Procrastastudy - Don't worry. I have changed the details in the OP from the full details of the situation enough to make it difficult to determine where the place is, also my username on here is not any indication of my real name either, so it shouldn't even be linked back to me.

But yeah, thanks so much guys. I appreciate the helpful input.

Easy to link it back to you... you should really be more careful.

<SNIP>

I suggest you ask mods to delete this thread.

Procrastastudy

3DataModem wrote: »

Easy to link it back to you... you should really be more careful.

<SNIP>

I suggest you ask mods to delete this thread.

Jesus - I hope your having a laugh 3Data.

That said I was wondering how many creche owners there were out there that call staff c**ts, hit kids, have recently had a HSE inspection and have had a member of staff walk out recently. I was hoping it was all an elaborate web of deception to hide the identity of the innocent

Honestly - really no more comment...

Esoteric_

3DataModem wrote: »

Easy to link it back to you... you should really be more careful.

<SNIP?>

I suggest you ask mods to delete this thread.

no, her name is not anything beginning with <SNIP>

3DataModem

LyndaMcL wrote: »

3DataModem wrote: »

Easy to link it back to you... you should really be more careful.

<SNIP?>

I suggest you ask mods to delete this thread.

no, her name is not anything beginning with <SNIP>

Fair enough. Just that person commenting on your <SNIP>

As I said, be careful what you post here, especially where the justice system or HSE are involved.

Esoteric_

3DataModem wrote: »

Fair enough. Just that person commenting on your <SNIP>
As I said, be careful what you post here, especially where the justice system or HSE are involved.

Yes, and that person is a 14 year old child. :rolleyes:

Mrs OBumble

OP, I think the overall advice here is:

1 There are a lot of potential legal issues here, not just payment of wages, your sister needs legal advice - contact a solicitor (or ask Citizens Information to point your sister to the right place if she can't afford oen).

2 Also, your sister should report other issues to the relevant authorities. For threats of assault against your sister, that is the guards.


Apart from that, I don't think we can help you much: this needs professional advice.

And I am worried about the amount of detail here, too. fyi, I wondered if you were a troll, so I checked out your previous posts: without going back very far at all, I now know your age, location, where you worked for two years, why you left your last job, and what income you're getting now. It would not be difficult for your sister's employer's solicitor (or a trouble-maker) to do the same, using features available to all visitors not just moderators. This may well be enough to let them match it to your sister.

If you would like the mods to make this thread "disappear", please report this post and one of us will hide it. It likely will already have been cached by google, but the evidence there wil disappear in a few weeks.