How many people here know someone who committed suicide?

token101

gsxr1 wrote: »

Its a bad selfish act which leaves nothing but lifelong pain for parents, family and friends.
.

How did anyone thank this ****ing horrible, medieval post?

anncoates

jarvis wrote: »

I'm really happy with my life at the moment and I am fairly laid back, no matter what's happening I'm always of the opinion that it could be worse. I miss them of course, but I wouldn't change anything as it has made me who I am and the hand I've been dealt has been ok.

You're something else, chief. Fair play to you.

Madam_X

token101 wrote: »

How did anyone thank this ****ing horrible, medieval post?

Well no surprise to see Actor there. The others, I don't know.

Some really hard reading there.
The people i knew weren't that close to me so i really feel for those here who have been affected by it.:(

The last thing they or the families want to hear is anything about selfishness.
Sometimes people don't know when the it's the wrong time to be controversial :rolleyes:

Da Shins Kelly

Thankfully no one very close to me, but I do know of a few people who have committed suicide. A neighbour shot himself after finding out that his house was being repossessed. Three young teenage lads in my town in the space of a year all hanged themselves, and so did the father of a classmate. Don't know the full reasons for those suicides, and I don't like to speculate. It's all very, very sad. I'm so grateful that I've never experienced those depths of despair, and I hope I never do.

MajorMax

20 years ago, and I still feel betrayed

ahnowbrowncow

token101 wrote: »

How did anyone thank this ****ing horrible, medieval post?

You're naive thinking that all suicides aren't selfish

EZ24GET

I have known quite a few people who committed suicide, some were very close. Youngest was about 20. It makes you feel so lost.

anncoates

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

You're naive thinking that all suicides aren't selfish

Piss off.

The Big Red Button

I've never lost anyone close to me to suicide (and I really appreciate how lucky I am.)

I have a couple of close friends, and an ex, who suffer from depression, and who have considered or attempted suicide. Thankfully they're all really well right now. We've had long talks about it, both at times when they were at their very lowest and could barely imagine staying alive, and at times when the depression was under control.

I'm not going to go into detail, as they were private conversations. But I guess that talking about it with people so very close to me has definitely affected my views of those who take their own lives. I guess that, as a child, I was brought up with the impression that suicide was very wrong and selfish, and immoral somehow (the religious aspect, I suppose.)

But speaking about it with people I loved and respected, hearing how bad it was for them at the worst of times, well it made me love and respect them even more. It made me see how brave and tough they were, for each and every minute and hour and day that they kept living through the agony inside their heads. It made me appreciate every minute I get with them (and with others close to me.)

Life is SO precious and valuable, but can be taken away so swiftly. When the person chooses to take their own life, well of course it's going to be extremely tough for family and friends to deal with, with thoughts like "They were so selfish, they chose to inflict this pain on us, how could they knowingly hurt us like this ..." ... I can understand the anger and hurt that families/friends would have to deal with in the case of a suicide, as well as the usual feelings associated with grief. But you have to realise that it's not a case that they chose to hurt you. I think that it's often a case that they just didn't/couldn't foresee the impact that their death would have on those around them.

If my parents/aunts/uncles ever hear about someone who's taken their own life, their first response is "Well the feckin' eejit." Obviously they'd never be so insensitive as to say that to family/friends of the deceased! But it's black and white to them - they see suicide as being a stupid, selfish, short-sighted act, something done on a whim, on the spur of the moment. To the best of my knowledge, no one in my own family or in my mother or father's immediate families has ever suffered with mental health issues, and I guess they still see it as something quite shameful, that shouldn't be openly discussed. E.g. if my parents were telling me of a suicide, they'd never say the word itself - it would be "I heard that X got hit by a train" or "I heard that Y was found dead", whatever. And then straight away "But don't go telling anyone, unless they mention it first!" I do try to discuss suicide, depression, mental health with them, in an attempt to combat the stigma a little, but they just don't ever want to hear it. It's sad, really, but I guess maybe it's a generational thing. Catholic guilt is probably a factor, too, in their case.

I can honestly say that I've never heard of a suicide where it didn't affect me in some way. Whether it was a friend-of-a-friend, or a case in the news, whatever. Even though I have never been close to the person involved, any time I hear of a suicide it really makes me stop and think ... and appreciate how lucky I am. I think most of us take our health (both physical health and mental health) for granted at times.

Most of my close friends have been seriously affected by the suicide of someone close to them at some stage during their lives. I've seen firsthand, on many occasions, how one suicide can turn numerous lives upside down, change them forever. The saddest thing is hearing friends say "I should have known, there must have been something I could have done." My own opinion is that, in most cases, there was probably not much anyone could have done. Depression is so much bigger than that, it's not a case that one little chat or text or gesture could have fixed it, could have stopped the person from taking their own life. We all have to take responsibility for our own mental health - and reach out for professional help when we need it. Friends and family can certainly help, a lot, but depression is an illness which often requires medical treatment. And sadly, sometimes, even this isn't enough to save the person's life.

No one should blame themselves for the suicide of a loved one, any more than one should blame themselves for a loved one getting cancer. My heart really does go out to anyone who has ever lost someone to suicide, or anyone who has ever considered it themselves. I hope you find peace.

fearcruach

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

You're naive thinking that all suicides aren't selfish

Suicide is not easy. People don't kill themselves on a whim or "to get back at someone". It happens when there seems to be no other alternative.

I attempted in February and it was because I could not see any way of ever escaping the pain and emptiness. When it got down to it, I definitely had second thoughts because I did want to live but I couldn't see how.

Some people called me selfish, trotting out the usual "you'd cause lots of hurt, pain etc". This doens't hold any water with me because no matter how bad the pain it causes, it will not be as bad as what the suicidal person is experiencing. It is instinct to want to live, it takes a serious amount of suffering to override that.

I also found that the most people saying it was selfish, were the last in line to help. That's selfish.

EZ24GET

Even if you do know or suspect it's pretty impossible to stop someone from committing suicide. You cannot follow someone 24 hours a day. If the person is convinced that suicide is the answer they will find a way despite anything you do. No one should blame themselves for the actions of another. You can not make choices for someone else.

ahnowbrowncow

anncoates wrote: »

Piss off.

Great response there, very well put together argument

As I have said I know one person who had a wife and young kids and lost his job, a few days later he killed himself. Leaving them with a mortgage to pay and no form of income as he was the main earner.

Please explain how that is not selfish? He brought kids into this world and just left them with a massive debt and no father.

Well done to you Bluewolf, great to see a mod thanking abusive posts :rolleyes:

fearcruach wrote: »

Suicide is not easy. People don't kill themselves on a whim or "to get back at someone". It happens when there seems to be no other alternative.

I attempted in February and it was because I could not see any way of ever escaping the pain and emptiness. When it got down to it, I definitely had second thoughts because I did want to live but I couldn't see how.

Some people called me selfish, trotting out the usual "you'd cause lots of hurt, pain etc". This doens't hold any water with me because no matter how bad the pain it causes, it will not be as bad as what the suicidal person is experiencing. It is instinct to want to live, it takes a serious amount of suffering to override that.

I also found that the most people saying it was selfish, were the last in line to help. That's selfish.

I never said all suicides are selfish, it depends on each individual case, people do it for different reasons.

anncoates

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

Great response there, very well put together argument

As I have said I know one person who had a wife and young kids and lost his job, a few days later he killed himself. Leaving them with a mortgage to pay and no form of income as he was the main earner.

Please explain how that is not selfish? He brought kids into this world and just left them with a massive debt and no father

I got a red card in my last post for saying what I think of your opinion.

Just reread it if you're in need of a refreshment of my views on the topic.

The Big Red Button

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

As I have said I know one person who had a wife and young kids and lost his job, a few days later he killed himself. Leaving them with a mortgage to pay and no form of income as he was the main earner.

Please explain how that is not selfish? He brought kids into this world and just left them with a massive debt and no father.

If someone commits suicide, it's generally not a case that they've made up a list, pros and cons, benefits of suicide vs responsibilities in life. It's not a logical process ... and, even if it is, if you're suffering from mental health issues your logic may be severely flawed. It's possible that he may have honestly believed that this was what was best for his family. You just don't know what was going on inside his head.

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

Well done to you Bluewolf, great to see a mod thanking abusive posts :rolleyes:

Bluewolf isn't an AH mod. (Yet. I'm sure it's all part of her plan for world domination! :pac: )

ahnowbrowncow

anncoates wrote: »

I got a red card in my last post for saying what I think of your opinion.

Just reread it if you're in need of a refreshment of my views on the topic.

I don't care what you think, you're not the only one here who has lost a family member to suicide

anncoates

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

I don't care what you think

How convenient.

Owryan

Japer wrote: »

I know some people who committed suicide in Ireland who would not be on any official list of people who committed suicide....it was an "accident" etc but close friends etc knew of the persons intentions. Very sad.

The real figure is much higher, my own counsellor has always maintained that an awful lot of suicides are recorded as "drowning", "road traffic accident victim" and "misadventure"

For myself if i could pass on one single tip to anyone who is thinking about it , it would be talk to someone . I was someone who bottled everything up and finally i ran out of strength and nearly it nearly cost me my family and my life.

Please god next year i ll be in training to help people who are where i was

GarIT

A lot of people do it because they really have no other choice. Depending on who you are and whats going on it may be impossible to change your situation, take someone that has no friends and is bullied in school, it could be even worse they could have some sort of social disorder like autism or aspergers, they can't force people to like them and they decided that dying is better than what they go through everyday.

In a way you could say its selfish because it hurts other people but some people have no choice, I think its more selfish to expect someone to live for someone else when things are so bad thay just want to die and be done with it.

ahnowbrowncow

anncoates wrote: »

How convenient.

You're rebuttals are awesome, keep up the good work

GarIT

Owryan wrote: »

For myself if i could pass on one single tip to anyone who is thinking about it , it would be talk to someone .

I've heard that a lot but I have to say 99% of the time its a load of crap. Nearly everyone that says that is just trying to make money out of it. I've yet to meet someone that has said that and actually means it, for counselors depressed people are just a way to line their pockets.

anncoates

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

You're rebuttals are awesome, keep up the good work

Keep up the good work.

You've helped to turn a heartfelt discussion on the devastating effects of suicide of loved ones into the usual AH pissing contest about blame.

Sorry mods, I won't derail the thread any further.

Princess Peach

Unfortunately I do. Tough one to understand when young.

Been on the verge of an attempt a couple of times myself, so glad I never did. Life really did turn around for me

Augmerson

A close friend of mine recently took his own life. It's very sad, he was very young - late 20s. He hadn't had an easy life to be honest, you could see the reasons why, but it's still sad and I still wish it hadn't happened. He was great craic, one of the funniest and most original people I've ever met. He could also be a bit of a bollock sometimes as he was strong-willed but he was genuine and always would say sorry when he was bang out of order. He had problems with drink and other drugs but ultimately it was losing his girlfriend in a car crash a few years before that really ruined him.

I miss him. I don't hold it against him, what he did. I wish of course he hadn't of done it, because it's a very final thing, you can't reverse it, but he suffered more than anyone should, and I hope wherever he is now, his journey continues and he isn't in pain or torment. I feel I could have done more as a friend for him, it was a serious shock when I heard he'd took his own life.

3 people in the last 3 or 4 months have taken their own lives in the town I am from, all lads and all roughly the same age.

xDramaxQueenx

My grandfather did, but it was before I was born so I didn't know him, obviously.

Last year my next door neighbour killed himself 6 days before his wedding, left his 4yr old autistic son without a dad.
My dads cousin shot himself but they still maintain it was an accident, probably wasn't.

ahnowbrowncow

anncoates wrote: »

Keep up the good work.

You've helped to turn a heartfelt discussion on the devastating effects of suicide of loved ones into the usual AH pissing contest about blame.

Sorry mods, I won't derail the thread any further.

It was actually you who brought the discussion down with your "piss off" just because you don't agree with and can't handle a differing opinion. So please don't respond to me unless you are going to add to the discussion.

Owryan

GarIT wrote: »

I've heard that a lot but I have to say 99% of the time its a load of crap. Nearly everyone that says that is just trying to make money out of it. I've yet to meet someone that has said that and actually means it, for counselors depressed people are just a way to line their pockets.

Im not just talking about counsellors , can be anyone, brother, father, sister , workmate.

I ve spoken to plenty of other people who have tried to or were close to killing themselves and always one thing comes up. they thought they were the only one who felt that way or that no one would understand what was wrong

GarIT

Owryan wrote: »

Im not just talking about counsellors , can be anyone, brother, father, sister , workmate.

I ve spoken to plenty of other people who have tried to or were close to killing themselves and always one thing comes up. they thought they were the only one who felt that way or that no one would understand what was wrong

I suppose thats different, but from being there the worst thing that could possibly happen is to end up talking to someone who is pretneding to care just to make a profit.

Real Life

GarIT wrote: »

I've heard that a lot but I have to say 99% of the time its a load of crap. Nearly everyone that says that is just trying to make money out of it. I've yet to meet someone that has said that and actually means it, for counselors depressed people are just a way to line their pockets.

this, I really didnt want to have to go into this here but seeing some of the ignorant posts i think i do have to.

As someone who suffers from serious depression i will tell you its extremely hard to see a way out.
Ive been on meds had counselling etc, it really does nothing but cover it up. deep down its always there eating away at you.
every day is such a struggle to get through, yes there will be times of happiness and you can have fun and pretty much everyone will think you are a normal happy person but its all a front really cos deep down its like you are already dead most of the time.
I hate to see people say suicide is selfish, yes its very hard on the family and friends left behind but if you have been going through such severe mental pain which is just torture its hard to see another way out.
thats why i think its more selfish for people to expect someone to stay alive just so they dont have to worry about it. you have to think of the person struggling too, why should they have to just life their life to keep you happy while they are being tortured every day. its a horrible thing thats hard to understand unless you have experience with it.

GarIT

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

It was actually you who brought the discussion down with your "piss off" just because you don't agree with and can't handle a differing opinion. So please don't respond to me unless you are going to add to the discussion.

I'll respond to you, do you not think thats its selfish to expect someone to live for you when they are suffering so much they want to die.

ahnowbrowncow

GarIT wrote: »

I'll respond to you, do you not think thats its selfish to expect someone to live for you when they are suffering so much they want to die.

Yeah it is, but circumstances aren't the same for every everyone. Someone who brought vulnerable kids into the world and is responsible for taking care of them, how is it not selfish when he just leaves them and not only without an income and a father but also a massive debt hindering their future

GarIT

Real Life wrote: »

this, I really didnt want to have to go into this here but seeing some of the ignorant posts i think i do have to.

As someone who suffers from serious depression i will tell you its extremely hard to see a way out.
Ive been on meds had counselling etc, it really does nothing but cover it up. deep down its always there eating away at you.
every day is such a struggle to get through, yes there will be times of happiness and you can have fun and pretty much everyone will think you are a normal happy person but its all a front really cos deep down its like you are already dead most of the time.
I hate to see people say suicide is selfish, yes its very hard on the family and friends left behind but if you have been going through such severe mental pain which is just torture its hard to see another way out.
thats why i think its more selfish for people to expect someone to stay alive just so they dont have to worry about it. you have to think of the person struggling too, why should they have to just life their life to keep you happy while they are being tortured every day. its a horrible thing thats hard to understand unless you have experience with it.

I think what I bolded is a big thing people need to look out for especially parents, I've gone looking for help before and told "You're only looking for attention, you were grand when you were at the party on the weekend or when the gf was over" You can try to be strong and then you get judged on how you appear and not whats really going on. You really can't win sometimes.

GarIT

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

Yeah it is, but circumstances aren't the same for every everyone. Someone who brought vulnerable kids into the world and is responsible for taking care of them, how is it not selfish when he just leaves them and not only without an income and a father but also a massive debt hindering their future

Sometimes life can be unbareable, financial debit is nothing compared to mental suffering. A debit hindering someone's future isnt even comparable to having your head hurt everytime you think.

ahnowbrowncow

GarIT wrote: »

Sometimes life can be unbareable, financial debit is nothing compared to mental suffering. A debit hindering someone's future isnt even comparable to having your head hurt everytime you think.

What aboutthe kids who want to know where their father went? He's just disappeared from their lives, no goodbye or anything. You think that doesn't hurt?

What about the mother who has no clue how to go on now without the person she was closest to, has to struggle to meet end's meet, lose her home and bring her kids up by herself.

Not all suicides are selfish but it's not the same for everyone

Chavways

A family living near me lost a teenage son and daughter to suicide within 3 months. Even though I live in a pretty rural area you always hear of local suicides every couple of weeks. Its unbelievable that it doesn't get more attention from the media or the government.

Daisy M

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

What aboutthe kids who want to know where their father went? He's just disappeared from their lives, no goodbye or anything. You think that doesn't hurt?

What about the mother who has no clue how to go on now without the person she was closest to, has to struggle to meet end's meet, lose her home and bring her kids up by herself.

Not all suicides are selfish but it's not the same for everyone

But when someone is severely depressed and has a warped sense of reality its hardly fair to call their actions selfish. If they believe themselves to be a burden, feel they are not contributing either financially or otherwise to the running of the household, feel they have to be looked after all the time by their spouse and indeed children and that it is too much to expect from anyone, what about the amount of people who have been over medicated with anti depressants, some of which a known side effect is suicide, what about those that feel they are in the way of stopping their spouse having a loving partner and indeed their children the chance of having a loving step parent?

People commiting suicide are not trying to be selfish they are in a black hole, have no self worth and can not see that they ever will.

Owryan

Regards the whole "selfish" or not debate i'm torn. Everyone is different and have their own reasons for why they take such a fateful decision so a blanket statement is unfair . So i ll offer up my own suicide attempt as an example.

Scene setter : messy break up due to depression/not talking/mood swings/family ****e n so on . " young kids with a 3rd on the way

Was committing suicide selfish ? Yes , no doubting it

Did I think i was being selfish ? No, i genuinely felt i was doing everyone a favour and that my kids would be better off without a loser like me as a dad. From my pov, i saw no other way out and like i said it would be a favour to everyone

Now, 2 years on, do i still see it that way ? No , i now know i was been selfish in only considering how i thought everyone would feel and not the reality. Probably the single biggest thing my therapy has helped me realise is that i was important to those around me and they would need me no matter how useless i thought i was.

I can only say from experience that in my own case i was being selfish but that doesnt apply to every case. However, not to try get help when there is help out there is a whole different story. likewise, the whole arguement about whether the support is there whether from the state or the family or circle of friends.

guinnessdrinker

GarIT wrote: »

I've heard that a lot but I have to say 99% of the time its a load of crap. Nearly everyone that says that is just trying to make money out of it. I've yet to meet someone that has said that and actually means it, for counselors depressed people are just a way to line their pockets.

There is a very good two day course called the Applied Suicide Intervention Skills Training (ASIST). I have done it myself as I knew somebody that died by suicide. It doesn't make someone an expert of course but I found it to be a very worthwhile course.

Not everyone that wants to help is in it for the money, some people just want to help others because of the good side of human nature. I also think it is wrong for people to judge those that have died by suicide, that is imo one of the bad sides of human nature.

IM0

3

flyswatter

GarIT wrote: »

I've heard that a lot but I have to say 99% of the time its a load of crap. Nearly everyone that says that is just trying to make money out of it. I've yet to meet someone that has said that and actually means it, for counselors depressed people are just a way to line their pockets.

To be honest that advice is dangerously misleading. Telling someone to not seek professional help when suffering.

It's also feeding into the Irish macho ideology bullshit of "Bottle it up, you'll be grand".

hattoncracker

I think some people see it as a weakness to ask for help.. Feelings are not something that's talked about all the time, people bottle them up..

Rural Ireland, you don't want anyone knowing family business, mental health problems mean you're "bad with your nerves." Very few jobs, a recession... My mental health isn't great, I have a part time job but if I didn't I would be a lot worse off mentally than I am now.

GarIT

flyswatter wrote: »

To be honest that advice is dangerously misleading. Telling someone to not seek professional help when suffering.

It's also feeding into the Irish macho ideology bullshit of "Bottle it up, you'll be grand".

I'm not telling people not to look for help, I'm just saying a lot of the organisations that say it are just looking for a profit.

As another poster said talking to a friend or family member is probably the best thing to do.

who_me

A couple of 'distant friends' in college killed themselves. My Dad attempted suicide after decades of suffering from depression, but I think it was more a cry of desperation than a real attempt at suicide.

But the worst was my cousin, who killed himself in his early 20s; by taking rat poison. It was a long and extremely painful death, and his family could only look on knowing there was nothing they could do. Horrible.

I nearly ended up the same way myself, about 12 years ago. Have suffered from anxiety all my life, always afraid I'm letting people down. When I went through a bad patch in work, and started running up debts. I really couldn't see a way out and was sick of the constant fear. Luckily, I found an excellent CBT psychologist who has helped turn my life around, but things could so easily have gone the other way.

IMO, people suffering from depression/anxiety really have a broken sense of perception. Tiny problems in the real world become huge in their heads. They really have no sense of self-esteem, if anything they're an annoyance or burden to others. The last thing they're going to do is ask for help, since that just 'confirms' how useless they are and how much of a burden they are.

That's why it's not a selfish act - at least no more selfish than every other thing we do. They're already so isolated in their lives, they either don't think the suicide will impact others greatly, or it may even be a "relief" to others to be rid of them.

You can't evaluate their actions logically as their perceptions are so warped. If they saw things normally and logically, they wouldn't be in trouble in the first place. Deriding them for being selfish makes as much sense as calling someone with broken legs who won't walk to the doctor 'lazy'.

Frito

Just a quick point as I don't want to derail thread in any way, I believe the terms 'died by suicide' and 'completed suicide' are preferred over 'committed suicide' for reasons of empathy and destigmatisation (not trying to nitpick here). I think the media are also urged to use these terms in reporting such events.

For people bereaved by suicide, support can be found at console.ie

Lelantos

Frito wrote: »

Just a quick point as I don't want to derail thread in any way, I believe the terms 'died by suicide' and 'completed suicide' are preferred over 'committed suicide' for reasons of empathy and destigmatisation (not trying to nitpick here). I think the media are also urged to use these terms in reporting such events.

For people bereaved by suicide, support can be found at console.ie

Died by suicide I would agree with, but completed?! It makes it sound like something that should be achieved. Maybe its just my take on it, not trying to upset anyone.

Iwannahurl

Frito wrote: »

Just a quick point as I don't want to derail thread in any way, I believe the terms 'died by suicide' and 'completed suicide' are preferred over 'committed suicide' for reasons of empathy and destigmatisation (not trying to nitpick here). I think the media are also urged to use these terms in reporting such events.

For people bereaved by suicide, support can be found at console.ie

I logged on just now with the intention of making the same point.

Guidelines state that the term "commit suicide" is inappropriate and insensitive.

http://www.nosp.ie/mmm.pdf

I'm not criticising the OP, but I would suggest that the thread title be amended accordingly.

Frito

More of a medical term I think, completed vs attempted.

mikemac1

who_me wrote: »

I nearly ended up the same way myself, about 12 years ago. Have suffered from anxiety all my life, always afraid I'm letting people down. When I went through a bad patch in work, and started running up debts. I really couldn't see a way out and was sick of the constant fear. Luckily, I found an excellent CBT psychologist who has helped turn my life around, but things could so easily have gone the other way.

IMO, people suffering from depression/anxiety really have a broken sense of perception. Tiny problems in the real world become huge in their heads. They really have no sense of self-esteem, if anything they're an annoyance or burden to others. The last thing they're going to do is ask for help, since that just 'confirms' how useless they are and how much of a burden they are.

That's why it's not a selfish act - at least no more selfish than every other thing we do. They're already so isolated in their lives, they either don't think the suicide will impact others greatly, or it may even be a "relief" to others to be rid of them.

You can't evaluate their actions logically as their perceptions are so warped. If they saw things normally and logically, they wouldn't be in trouble in the first place. Deriding them for being selfish makes as much sense as calling someone with broken legs who won't walk to the doctor 'lazy'.

Fantastic post, I agree fully

Captain Graphite

I can only think of one person. Wasn't someone I knew particularly well but I was shocked when I heard it because they really didn't seem like the type of person. I've never attempted it myself but thought about it plenty of times, in a kind of "what if?" way when I felt really really down. I'm mostly doing ok these days (three months off of anti-depressants after two and a half years of needing to take them) but I couldn't hand on heart say that it'll never crop into my head again.

As regards the selfishness debate, I must admit I struggled with it before. I had a (pretty awful) counseller who tried to drill the idea of it being a selfish act into me and make me feel guilty for even hypothetically thinking about it. I used think it was particularly selfish if someone committed suicide by jumping in front of a train (traumatising train drivers, disrupting consumers etc.) but tbh I think my perception of suicide was a bit distorted. Anytime I've thought about it I've never been in such a desperate place that it's my last resort. For me, thinking about suicide was more about considering it as a cold, logical process that I just figured may or may not happen at some point in the future. I often need reminding that people who commit suicide are very often unable to think clearly due to their mental health being shot. Someone mentioned earlier in the thread that people who commit suicide don't make a "pros vs cons" list beforehand, and I think that's actually more like the attitude I'd have had to it.

Anyone who adamantly states that suicide is selfish in all cases is hopelessly shortsighted, and their attitude contributes to the stigma that surrounds suicide and depression in society. It's far more selfish to expect someone who's clearly in so much pain that they don't want to be alive anymore to continue enduring their life just for the sake of others.

steddyeddy

I knew two vicitms of sexual abuse who died by suicide. The image of the rope marks on her neck at the wake will haunt me for a long time . Theres not a week goes by where I dont think about her and the b"stards who took her innocence and those in power who refused to protect her.