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Landlord Vanished with my Deposit!

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  • 06-09-2012 4:58pm
    #1
    Stu_77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34 ✭


    Hi,

    I'm looking for some advice on how to get my deposit back from my previous Landlord.

    The House I rent from him has gone into receivership because the Landlord hasn't been keeping up with mortgage re-payments. I received a letter from the bank stating that all future rent was to be paid into a different bank account of which I was given details.

    My landlord is no longer contactable via his phone and has apparently done a vanishing act without returning my deposit, given that he no longer owns the property.

    Do I just accept that my deposit won't be returned or is there somebody I can contact to help me get it back? Are the banks legally obliged to claim the deposit on my behalf seeing as they are now my landlord or is this situation solely between me and my previous landlord.

    Any advice greatly appreciated. Thanks


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    #2
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    I'd get in touch with the bank first. See what they say. I would also have a word with Threshold too to see where you stand.

    Unfortunately, it doesn't look too good OP. I hope you get something sorted.


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    #3
    Yawns
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,255 ✭✭✭Yawns


    Such a long hassle of everything. If you were moving out just don't pay the last month's rent. Not the right thing to do but I certainly wouldn't fancy the chances of seeing a deposit returned.


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    #4
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    OP if it were me Id tell the bank that you have paid rent up to x date that date being a month further in advance than you have and therefore wont be paying x until the following due rental date.

    Getting it back from the landlord is unlikely to happen so cover yourself. It might not legally be the right thing to do but its sure as hell what I would do.


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    #5
    Stu_77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34 ✭Stu_77


    I was thinking that I wouldn't see the deposit again given that I don't have a contract with my previous Landlord anymore but this is really frustrating, €700 euro that I just don't have at the moment if I have to move to another place and pay a similar deposit. :mad: Thanks "Abajinincork", I'll have a chat with threshold and see what the have to say.


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    #6
    Yawns
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,255 ✭✭✭Yawns


    Yeah D3PO's method is another to consider. While not the right thing to do, it will be easier for you.


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    #7
    Stu_77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34 ✭Stu_77


    D3PO, yeah that's an option but the bank may ask for proof (rent book) or receipts that I've paid 4 weeks in advance. My rent was due yesterday but then the Landlord wasn't going to turn up looking for a weeks rent when he has my deposit and is no longer owner of the property. Could I take the Landlord to the small claims court?


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    #8
    ABajaninCork
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,411 ✭✭✭ABajaninCork


    Yeah. If you can find him and have proof of the deposit paid...


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    #9
    professore
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,857 ✭✭✭professore


    Are you still in the property? Stay there and get the value for your deposit - or get the receivers to pay it back to you. Don't move until you get the money though.

    If the landlord's properties are being repossessed, even if you get him to small claims court, he'll plead poverty and pay you €10 per month. Good luck with that.


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    #10
    silenceisfoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭silenceisfoo


    OP you should go to a FLAC centre. As the bank has taken over the contract that you originally had with the landlord you may be entitled to recover the deposit from the bank as they are now the landlord. The bank is probably going to deny that they owe you anything but you may be entitled.
    If you feel the situation is going to get dodgy then get out while you can is my advice and find somewhere else. Assuming you didn't consent to the bank becoming your landlord, then you are entitled to rescind the contract with no notice. Then try and sue the landlord in the small claims court-easy enough to do, fill a form out online and pay a few euro charge.


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    #11
    Stu_77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34 ✭Stu_77


    I do have a receipt from both the Landlord and letting agency proving that I paid a deposit so I suppose I'll need that if I take it too the small claims court although your right "Professore", he will probably pay it back in very small amounts, even if at all.

    Thanks Silenceisfoo, I'll check that out the "FLAC centre" option. I haven't got the money to fork out for another deposit at the moment so I have to sit tight hope that the banks (unlikely) will either forfeit a months rent or recover the deposit from my landlord.


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    #12
    odds_on
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,869 ✭✭✭odds_on


    Stu_77 wrote: »
    D3PO, yeah that's an option but the bank may ask for proof (rent book) or receipts that I've paid 4 weeks in advance. My rent was due yesterday but then the Landlord wasn't going to turn up looking for a weeks rent when he has my deposit and is no longer owner of the property. Could I take the Landlord to the small claims court?

    No, you cannot make a claim with the small claims court. Any claim must be made through the PRTB. If you do not have the current address of the landlord, then the PRTB will be unlikely to proceed with a claim as they cannot forward any claim details to the landlord.


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    #13
    gosuckonalemon
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 730 ✭✭✭gosuckonalemon


    Don't make life hard on yourself. Just don't pay the last month's rent.

    Also, feel free to sell whatever items are in the house-TV, microwave etc., the bank don't know what's there and your LL won't be back for a long time to come


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    #14
    StillWaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,799 ✭✭✭StillWaters


    gosuckonalemon wrote: »
    Don't make life hard on yourself. Just don't pay the last month's rent.

    Also, feel free to sell whatever items are in the house-TV, microwave etc., the bank don't know what's there and your LL won't be back for a long time to come

    Normally I am totally against tenants witholding last months rent, however, in this case, you are way way down your ex LL's list of creditors and the bank wont really care as long as you dont trash the place and leave it in a state fit to sell.


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    #15
    hognef
    Registered Users Posts: 828 ✭✭✭hognef


    I'm probably wrong about this (if so, someone please explain), but I would have thought that, when the bank took possession of the house, it would also have taken over all of the former landlord's rights and duties, including those related to the deposit -- in other words, the bank are now in principle in possession of the OP's deposit?


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    #16
    silenceisfoo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 88 ✭✭silenceisfoo


    hognef wrote: »
    I'm probably wrong about this (if so, someone please explain), but I would have thought that, when the bank took possession of the house, it would also have taken over all of the former landlord's rights and duties, including those related to the deposit -- in other words, the bank are now in principle in possession of the OP's deposit?

    I think so as well- there has been a novation in the contract after all.
    I disagree about going to the small claims court- this is a contract issue more than it is a tenancy issue.


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    #17
    odds_on
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,869 ✭✭✭odds_on


    PRTB Determination Order DR810/2011 is a claim with the PRTB by a receiver wishing to evict a tenant. The receiver, as a new landlord, was instructed to refund the deposit:
    5. The Applicant Landlord shall refund the entire of the security deposit of €770.00 to the Respondent Tenant, on gaining vacant possession of the above dwelling, less any amounts properly withheld in accordance with the provisions of the Act.
    http://public.prtb.ie/2011%20Disputes/2011-12/810.2011.pdf


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    #18
    Stu_77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34 ✭Stu_77


    Thanks for that PDF "Odds On". I managed to get a hold of my landlord but he told me that he'd give me back my deposit if I decided to move out. But surely, he can't withhold my deposit given that he's no longer my Landlord. I had a contract with him so I'm assuming that he can no longer legally keep my deposit and has to hand it back to me. Correct me if I'm wrong.


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    #19
    odds_on
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,869 ✭✭✭odds_on


    Stu_77 wrote: »
    Thanks for that PDF "Odds On". I managed to get a hold of my landlord but he told me that he'd give me back my deposit if I decided to move out. But surely, he can't withhold my deposit given that he's no longer my Landlord. I had a contract with him so I'm assuming that he can no longer legally keep my deposit and has to hand it back to me. Correct me if I'm wrong.
    When a bank/receiver takes over as landlord, the new landlord is responsible, whether or not he has received the deposit or not. The PRTB seem to say that they, as new landlords, are liable to repay the deposit when you leave. It is between the old landlord and the new landlord to sort out the transfer of the deposit between themselves.

    IMO, there is no novation as the tenant has not been involved with any new agreement nor has he signed any new contract. It is strictly a change of landlord - however, I do not know if a landlord can "assign" the lease to a new landlord.


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    #20
    3DataModem
    Registered Users Posts: 3,997 ✭✭✭3DataModem


    StillWaters wrote: »
    gosuckonalemon wrote: »
    Don't make life hard on yourself. Just don't pay the last month's rent.

    Also, feel free to sell whatever items are in the house-TV, microwave etc., the bank don't know what's there and your LL won't be back for a long time to come

    Normally I am totally against tenants witholding last months rent, however, in this case, you are way way down your ex LL's list of creditors and the bank wont really care as long as you dont trash the place and leave it in a state fit to sell.

    Agree. There is what is legal and what is just and moral.

    Perhaps the landlord verbally agreed that you could use the last months rent as deposit and / or keep certain chattels after you leave in lieu of deposit? I'd see what you can recall, then call the bank. You are the tenant so you have the control.


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    #21
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,285 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Guys- you may like to look at the 2004 Residential Tenancies Act.
    The tenant has a contract with the landlord- and until such time as he is released from this contract by the landlord, is due to continue paying rent to the landlord. The bank can appoint a receiver to their hearts content- it means nothing to a pre-existing tenant. There are a number of cases in litigation over this at the moment- get professional advice before handing over your rent to anyone other than the original owner, with whom you have signed a contract. If the landlord does not forward the rent to the bank, or pay the mortgage with the lender- this is an issue between the owner and the lender- not the tenant and the lender........

    Thread carefully here........


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    #22
    3DataModem
    Registered Users Posts: 3,997 ✭✭✭3DataModem


    smccarrick wrote: »
    Guys- you may like to look at the 2004 Residential Tenancies Act.
    The tenant has a contract with the landlord- and until such time as he is released from this contract by the landlord, is due to continue paying rent to the landlord. The bank can appoint a receiver to their hearts content- it means nothing to a pre-existing tenant. There are a number of cases in litigation over this at the moment- get professional advice before handing over your rent to anyone other than the original owner, with whom you have signed a contract. If the landlord does not forward the rent to the bank, or pay the mortgage with the lender- this is an issue between the owner and the lender- not the tenant and the lender........

    Thread carefully here........

    Good post, thanks Smc.


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    #23
    Stu_77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34 ✭Stu_77


    Thanks for your advice "odds on". You seem to know what your talking about.

    Regarding the "smccarick" post, I'm still kinda confused because I no longer have a contract with my landlord so I haven't paid him any rent in the last week since the court has told him to relinquish the keys to all his properties but I've still not been contacted by the bank (National Irish Bank) regarding the status of my tenancy.

    My Landlord is withholding my deposit until I move out! even though he has broken our contract by being in contempt of court and unlawfully collecting rent over the last month! My head is melted, I'm just not sure if he has to pass the deposit onto the bank or hand it back to me. Below is an article that might shed some more light on the subject. Thanks for all the advice, very much appreciated.

    http://www.independent.ie/national-news/courts/landlord-who-owns-17-properties-told-by-judge-bring-pyjamas-to-court-next-time-3214694.html


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