Reading

everdead.ie

Delighted to get the win!
A few things I was disappointed with though we weren't clinical enough and conceding the 90th minute goal again.

We seem to have a problem conceding goals really late and that's what cost us but onward and upward hopefully it will be the catalyst to give the team a lift and get us going on a good run!

mickman

Yes , Vertonghen is a real good player. Very comfortable and assured.

Ade is fit (has to be at this stage) - avb is just sticking with defoe

lloris did not look happy on the bench :-)

Brad looked a little flaky with kicks , id say he will lose the place in a few weeks

Sugarlumps

mickman wrote: »

Yes , Vertonghen is a real good player. Very comfortable and assured.

Ade is fit (has to be at this stage) - avb is just sticking with defoe

lloris did not look happy on the bench :-)

Brad looked a little flaky with kicks , id say he will lose the place in a few weeks

He certainly didn't, right sulky French gob on him.

I don't think Brad will lose his place, he's been nothing but solid since he's joined us. Easily got a season in him, unless his reflexes dictate otherwise.

Maybe he'll play the frenchie against Lazio?

spursman11

tippspur wrote: »

Looks like Naughton could be in the team for a while,Benny needs an op on his knee it seems.

that would be worrying,man utd and others will be looking to expose him big time,Bale will be doing alot more defending until Ekotto bac

SuprSi

spursman11 wrote: »

that would be worrying,man utd and others will be looking to expose him big time,Bale will be doing alot more defending until Ekotto bac

It's a worry alright though I thought Naughton did ok but will hopefully improve with game time.

oppiuy

I was screaming at my phone once i saw the line up and Ade wasnt playing but i think AVB is doing the right thing. Harry was far to quick in dropping players or not giving them a chance to shine. That was one critism we all had of him. I think if your playing well you stay in the team and if your on the fringes you'd better be ready to take your chance. I do feel we'd be much better with Ade up top in this system but if Defoe keeps scoring and preforming them i've no complaints.

Reading were pants yesterday and hopefully thats because we were good. I liked the way we were playing and the through ball for lennon on Defoes goal was sumblime and hopefully a sign of things to come instead of just wacking it down the line for him to chase or giving it directly to his feet.

Did anyone notice the sort of cold shoulder Lennon gave Avb when he came off. I dont like to see that if im correct.

Antisocialiser

Bale got the 3 Bonus Points in the Fantasy Football at premierleague.com

WTF!?

Bonus
Sandro(1)
Walker (2)
Bale (3)

lol none for Defoe!

2nd Row Donkey

Antisocialiser wrote: »

Bale got the 3 Bonus Points in the Fantasy Football at premierleague.com

WTF!?


lol none for Defoe!

You're kidding right?
I dont follow the FF on premierleague.com but thats a joke.

PogMoThoin

Antisocialiser wrote: »

Bale got the 3 Bonus Points in the Fantasy Football at premierleague.com

WTF!?




lol none for Defoe!

Yeah, I was very surprised and had already transferred him for Michu. He did feck all and I was delighted when he was taken off.

Saab Ed

Lads I'm delighted with the win but that's as good as it gets. With a little hard nosed assessment of this game, its easy to see things slightly differently from the apparent joy with our fans for beating Reading ...

Reading are fighting with Southampton to be the worst team in the league. You can only win against the team in front of you, this is true. Let's be fair though, it would be an honest expectation to win this game and we did. We did it though against a poor team who (for some unknown reason) showed us far too much respect. They let us off the hook.

Here's some of my observations from the game :

Firstly, as above, they never took us on for some reason. How they played yesterday is not true Reading. Had they have come at us at all, as they did for 10 minutes in the second half , still at 1-0, then things might have been very different. Hands up here who was confident at 1 up. No one if you're honest.

If ever it was shown how he got the tactic wrong with a holding midfielder then it was yesterday. Sandro just about didn't touch the ball yesterday in the first half. He was redundant. Dembele should have been further up the pitch from the start, even a second striker instead of a defensive mid.

Playing so deep will be shown up against the big boys. Defoe will not get easier chances so we can't bank on getting all that time to attack in the future. Although it was late in the game, the introduction of Thud, resulting in Dembele being further up, just showed how better we play with two in the middle rather than a covering line in front of the back four.

Amazingly despite our dominance of the game being handed to us on a plate, our lack of urgency through out the game has to be a worry. This performance wasn't much different from our last home game. They even managed a late consolation because we switched off. The back four in particular look very ponderous and the full backs look to be held within a very rigid system.

Lastly zonal bloody marking. It doesn't work. Gallas never one a single ball from a set piece yesterday because either a) the ball in was shocking or b ) he never got near the man attacking the ball.

In conclusion yesterdays match was a lucky let off game at the right time for AVB. QPR next week will be a very different animal. I suspect we'll be suggesting things haven't changed much again after that one. Funny enough I think we'll do rather well against Lazio on Thursday. Tenner says he'll try and win that competition.

I know I'm fast becoming an unpopular commentator around here with my mistrust of AVB but its just an honesty opinion. I'll be the first one to put my hands up if I'm wrong and being a genuine fan then I really hope I am wrong. But for now, still not impressed.

COYS .

2nd Row Donkey

Wots the story with Bale.
He's only a shadow of the himself these days..
He's chipped in with a few goals but other then that he's been very ordinary since last xmas.

Leinstersqspur

Saab Ed, I agree that Reading are a poor side to gauge any real progress.

That said, the comment about Sandro is incorrect. "No player on the pitch had more touches of the ball in his own half than Sandro (35) and no player on the pitch had more touches of the ball in total." http://www.footyplace.com/features/tactics-talk-spurs-midfield-assert-control/

The tactics worked yesterday, the two centre backs drift wide protected by Sandro who allows the full backs to push up and attack with Dembele pulling the strings... We created 20 chances, more than Arsenal or United did at home to relatively weak opposition..

I took a lot of positives from the game, mostly the tactics and the work rate of the midfield.

PogMoThoin

Anyone else feel Dembele could be the perfect Modric replacement?

I think Bale needs to stay left, he's better on the wing, causes problems. Maybe drop him for a game or two until he gets his hunger back

Sugarlumps

PogMoThoin wrote: »

Anyone else feel Dembele could be the perfect Modric replacement?

I think Bale needs to stay left, he's better on the wing, causes problems. Maybe drop him for a game or two until he gets his hunger back

He's going to be huge for us, the way he glides pasts the opposition is a thing of beauty. I think he'll easily surpass Modric.

DubPerryman

2nd Row Donkey wrote: »

Wots the story with Bale.
He's only a shadow of the himself these days..
He's chipped in with a few goals but other then that he's been very ordinary since last xmas.

I think we will see more of Bale once Adebayor is consistently starting up front. Unfortunately Defoe doesn't hold the ball up well, so Bale sprints up the wing to support, the ball gets given to the opposition and then Bale has to sprint back.

I also think we'll see a lot more of Bale hugging the touchline if Dempsey takes Lennon's place. Dempsey will be asked to come in off the line, so Bale will be told to stay out wide in order to free up space.

DubPerryman

Saab Ed wrote: »

I know I'm fast becoming an unpopular commentator around here with my mistrust of AVB but its just an honesty opinion. I'll be the first one to put my hands up if I'm wrong and being a genuine fan then I really hope I am wrong. But for now, still not impressed.

I don't agree with most of what you say but once you have an opinion, which you can articulate, I'll always respect it. Every 'yin' needs as 'yang'. All debates need opposition.

Here Precious

DubPerryman wrote: »

I also think we'll see a lot more of Bale hugging the touchline if Dempsey takes Lennon's place. Dempsey will be asked to come in off the line, so Bale will be told to stay out wide in order to free up space.

No chance dempsey will take lennon place. We are at our most dangerous with 2 pacey wingers ala Lennon & Bale.

Glad JD getting a chance to shine.

AVB needs to man up and forget about playing 2 defensive midfielders together after that reading performance.

When is Parker back?

Leinstersqspur

PogMoThoin wrote: »

Anyone else feel Dembele could be the perfect Modric replacement?

I think Bale needs to stay left, he's better on the wing, causes problems. Maybe drop him for a game or two until he gets his hunger back

Dembele looks the business. He has that low centre of gravity and silky touch but more athleticism and upper body strength.

I think maybe if we had as pacey a full back as Walker on the left we wouldn't mind Bale cutting inside, creating space for the lone striker like he did for Defoe's 2nd..

Could be a very big season for Townsend too, he looked razor sharp when he came on, fast, two footed, and a lovely cut back.. Could push Lennon close?

Ormus

DubPerryman wrote: »

I also think we'll see a lot more of Bale hugging the touchline if Dempsey takes Lennon's place. Dempsey will be asked to come in off the line, so Bale will be told to stay out wide in order to free up space.

I keep hearing Dempsey mentioned as a winger. I've seen Fulham play a lot of games and I've also seen Dempsey play for the USA, but never once have I seen him on the wing. He isn't particularly fast or tricky on the ball and is a better header than crosser.

Saab Ed

Leinstersqspur wrote: »

That said, the comment about Sandro is incorrect. "No player on the pitch had more touches of the ball in his own half than Sandro (35) and no player on the pitch had more touches of the ball in total." http://www.footyplace.com/features/tactics-talk-spurs-midfield-assert-control/

Bloody stats

But they can be deceptive. The balls he gave and received were (as the article writer points out) from the centre backs and back again. This very stat alone should give us great cause for concern in my opinion. There's no need to play this way with the players we have, especially againts Reading.

A defensive mid in the middle of the park is fine, not sitting in front of a back 4. Maybe when Scotty is back he might just play him along side Dembele in the middle rather than from so deep. My fear is he wont play Scotty at all though and continue with this system. Who'd fancy that as an option!

Games aint played on paper, they're played on the pitch. Those stas do sound lovely but to anybody who watched the game it just looked like we sat very deep, too deep. Much more effective breaking things up further up the park. I know you need Scotty for that so it will be interesting to see if thats how he deploys him if at all.

Leinstersqspur

Haha, not sure if you caught match of the day on Sunday but they praised the work of Sandro and Dembele, showed loads of clips on one supporting the others movement, worth a watch...

Sandro wasn't sitting in front of the back four all day but he was there to protect them if they needed it, a kin to Makelele, De Jong, Parker...

I know they're only stats but another part of that article shows the roles of the midfield, "53% of Sandro’s passes were in his own half, 40% for Mousa Dembele. and 24% for Sigurdsson. The progressive nature of the midfield from player to player is also mirrored in the players’ figures for amount of passes made in the final third (18%, 24%, 44%)." Noting in particular Sigurdsson sublime ball for Lennon's assist on the 1st goal.

I agree with your earlier point though, until we went 2 up I was beginning to think it was another one of those days!

Saab Ed

Leinstersqspur wrote: »

" Noting in particular Sigurdsson sublime ball for Lennon's assist on the 1st goal.

!

That really was a thing of beauty At last we agree

DubPerryman

Here Precious wrote: »

No chance dempsey will take lennon place. We are at our most dangerous with 2 pacey wingers ala Lennon & Bale.

Ormus wrote: »

I keep hearing Dempsey mentioned as a winger. I've seen Fulham play a lot of games and I've also seen Dempsey play for the USA, but never once have I seen him on the wing. He isn't particularly fast or tricky on the ball and is a better header than crosser.

If Dempsey replaces Lennon he won't be played as a winger. He'll be on the right-side of the midfield and will be drifting inwards picking up balls from Adebayor. As a result of this drifting inside, Walker will be expected to run on the outside dragging the oppositions left back with him and leaving Dempsey free. I think it will be in this space that Dempsey will become most dangerous.... either playing balls through for Bale/Adebayor or setting up supporting midfielders like Dembele or Gylf.

SuprSi

DubPerryman wrote: »

If Dempsey replaces Lennon he won't be played as a winger. He'll be on the right-side of the midfield and will be drifting inwards picking up balls from Adebayor. As a result of this drifting inside, Walker will be expected to run on the outside dragging the oppositions left back with him and leaving Dempsey free. I think it will be in this space that Dempsey will become most dangerous.... either playing balls through for Bale/Adebayor or setting up supporting midfielders like Dembele or Gylf.

The only problem I see here is that if Dempsey doesn't get the ball and it ends up with Walker it'll be wasted unless he passes it back. He's quick and agile but can't cross or shoot the save his life and defenders will be well briefed on this aspect of his game, thus encouraging him down the line.

DubPerryman

Saab Ed wrote: »

But they can be deceptive. The balls he gave and received were (as the article writer points out) from the centre backs and back again. This very stat alone should give us great cause for concern in my opinion. There's no need to play this way with the players we have, especially againts Reading.

Sandro did his job well. He was the holding midfielder. When we were in possession the two full-back got forward offering support from the wings, this meant Sandro had to drop back to provide cover. Thus we effectively played a 3-5-1 when in possession, with Vergie, Sandro and Gallas the defenders.

When Friedel had the ball, the two centre backs split and effectively became full-backs, thus allowing Sandro to pick up the ball centrally and then pass to the two centre backs who were providing support in the full back positions, thus you see the stats show that he predominantly passed to and from the centre backs.

The system which AVB is deploying is a 'slow, slow, slow, fast' system. Meaning the centre backs will maintain possession between themselves until a movement by one of the forward players is not followed by one of his markers - thus giving us a numerical advantage with the support coming from Naughton and Walker.

Saab Ed wrote: »

A defensive mid in the middle of the park is fine, not sitting in front of a back 4. Maybe when Scotty is back he might just play him along side Dembele in the middle rather than from so deep. My fear is he wont play Scotty at all though and continue with this system. Who'd fancy that as an option!

If Scott Parker, or any other DMC for that matter, comes in and doesn't sit deep and support the centre backs then we will be exposed and overrun - it'll leave a two on two situation in our defence.

DubPerryman

SuprSi wrote: »

The only problem I see here is that if Dempsey doesn't get the ball and it ends up with Walker it'll be wasted unless he passes it back. He's quick and agile but can't cross or shoot the save his life and defenders will be well briefed on this aspect of his game, thus encouraging him down the line.

I agree he's not the best crosser. Though Walker should have ample support from Gylfi and Dempsey (if he was to play it back) plus he has targets in the box in the form of Adebayor and Bale. I know Walker's final ball is pretty poor but if he gets it right three out of ten times that he makes that run, then we have a serious threat from all quarters.

Leinstersqspur

Sandro's position under AVB is similar to Sergio Busquets role under Pep Guardiola. Key to overloading the midfield, pressing opponents and keeping possession the defensive midfielder drops into defence, allowing the two fullbacks to push up into extremely advanced positions. In either shape, Barcelona are able to free up their wide players and provide adequate cover in defence too. Only Xavi and Dani Alves pass the ball more per game than Sergio Busquets does from his center half position..

Barcelona's "4-3-3" on paper and how it really plays. Sergio Busquets (16), Eric Abidal (21) and Dani Alves (2) circled as movement crucial to shape. Match vs Athletic Bilbao played on March 31, 2012

MrKingsley

2nd Row Donkey wrote: »

Wots the story with Bale.
He's only a shadow of the himself these days..
He's chipped in with a few goals but other then that he's been very ordinary since last xmas.

Yeah hes not been the same. For me it could be one of a couple of things.

-Hes started believing the hype that he is THAT good and has taken his foot off the gas
-Teams realise that he is our number one threat and have been doubling up on him quicker recently. Dont care how good you are against 2 disciplined defenders even messi has trouble
-Or perhaps Gary Speed had a prolonged impact on him. Craig Bellamy has come out and said that his marriage is on the rocks as a result of it. Maybe on the younger players it is just as bad as those who were his mates

Could be anything really but id just like him to be more direct. When he has the ball his first thought should be to get to the byline and whip a cross in. Thats when hes at his best