US ambassador killed in Libya

DipStick McSwindler

This post has been deleted.

RGM

Wompa1 wrote: »

That's like blaming the Irish voters for the mess Finna Fail an Fine Gael have created. Presidents since the 80's have alternated from Democratic to Republican.

I can't comment on Ireland, but eighty percent of Americans disapprove of their own elected congress. Yet they continue to vote Republican and Democrat despite the fact that both parties are terrible and no longer serve the interests of citizens.

That puts blame on the voters.

But this is an OT discussion.

fran17

and so the cycle begins all over again...uncle sam finances and arms the over throw of one regime because they dont agree with there brand of democracy.then find out the new guys aint happy to be there puppets for long so it wont be long before the brave rebels of a few months ago become the terrorists of tomorrow and get a few cruise missles up the ass.god bless america

jmayo

fran17 wrote: »

and so the cycle begins all over again...uncle sam finances and arms the over throw of one regime because they dont agree with there brand of democracy.then find out the new guys aint happy to be there puppets for long so it wont be long before the brave rebels of a few months ago become the terrorists of tomorrow and get a few cruise missles up the ass.god bless america

You do know that Gaddafii had actually come in from the cold so to speak in comparison to the days when they were trying to bomb his ass and he was sending shi* loads of weapons to people to fight their allies.

If anything Gaddafi was closer to the US (and Britain) in the last few years than he had been for decades.

BTW how would you describe the ones that attacked the embassy ?
Brave rebels, terrorists or nutjobs ?

Maybe you should bless American a bit more because the alternatives aint that appealing either.

partyatmygaff

asherbassad wrote: »

Why do people insist on insulting Muslims so often anyway?

People insult Islam far more often than they insult Muslims as a group of people. The reason for that is that there's quite a lot to dislike in Islam.

Well if that's the case then why do we have to treat the Jews with such kid gloves? Either apply the same rules to criticising Israel as you do to pissing off Muslims or be as PC with Islam as you are with Judaism.

Israel is a country. Jews are a group of people. Judaism is a religion. They're not all synonyms.

But don't be hypocritical and have one set of rules for one and a different set for the other.

No one usually has much of an issue with Judaism. The usual vitriol for Jews and Israel where they are most concentrated comes from stereotypes and social stigma. It's arguably ok to insult Judaism but it's not as ok to insult Jews as a group of people.

Wasn't there outrage among Christians not long ago about that Jerry Springer opera which depicted Jesus in a nappy?

There was and that's fine. Nothing wrong with a peaceful protest against something you disagree with.

Don't Christians routinely attack and even kill abortion clinic workers in the name of their religion.

It's quite infrequent. Even though I disagree with it, looking at from the point of view of those involved they think they're saving the lives of unborn children. It's not even exclusive to protestant extremists. Even an atheist pro-life with very strong convictions could do the same thing.

It's certainly not the same as "Argh, they drew a picture of my religion's founder. Let's kill them all." which is nothing short of idiocy.

asherbassad

Now the Marines are being sent in as a "protection unit". How convenient this Ambassador killing was. Not saying it was a black op but the US are damn delighted it happened. Now they can step up part two of their plan for Libya, i.e. full blown occupation. Anybody who can't see the bigger picture in all of this really should just not bother commenting. This Libyan War was planned as far back as 1999/2000.

The whole (Middle East) thing is a Western initiated war and the enemies are Russia, China and Iran.

See what Wesley Clark admits in this video:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article29129.htm

scamalert

partyatmygaff wrote: »

People insult Islam far more often than they insult Muslims as a group of people. The reason for that is that there's quite a lot to dislike in Islam.

Israel is a country. Jews are a group of people. Judaism is a religion. They're not all synonyms.

No one usually has much of an issue with Judaism. The usual vitriol for Jews and Israel where they are most concentrated comes from stereotypes and social stigma. It's arguably ok to insult Judaism but it's not as ok to insult Jews as a group of people.

There was and that's fine. Nothing wrong with a peaceful protest against something you disagree with.

It's quite infrequent. Even though I disagree with it, looking at from the point of view of those involved they think they're saving the lives of unborn children. It's not even exclusive to protestant extremists. Even an atheist pro-life with very strong convictions could do the same thing.

It's certainly not the same as "Argh, they drew a picture of my religion's founder. Let's kill them all." which is nothing short of idiocy.

you're comparing two different religions,while most Jews love protesting making claims and such most of them are peaceful,while Arabic and some African nations, will saw your head off for having a joke on their god :cool:
I say bomb the F***ers who do such $hit let them root in their deserts.I dont mind people of any race or color but muslims always push to far with their religious $hit and beliefs.If it was me id nuke them off the ground of earth without a blink,let them meet their eternal life with 69 virgins up there :pac:

CucaFace

asherbassad wrote: »

Now the Marines are being sent in as a "protection unit". How convenient this Ambassador killing was. Not saying it was a black op but the US are damn delighted it happened. Now they can step up part two of their plan for Libya, i.e. full blown occupation. Anybody who can't see the bigger picture in all of this really should just not bother commenting. This Libyan War was planned as far back as 1999/2000.

The whole (Middle East) thing is a Western initiated war and the enemies are Russia, China and Iran.

See what Wesley Clark admits in this video:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article29129.htm[/QUOTE]

Cuckoo

:eek:

partyatmygaff

asherbassad wrote: »

Ever been to a Muslim country? I have....quite a few of them.

As have I.

The vast majority of Muslim men absolutely revere women.

And what evidence have you got for that? Hang on... here it comes in the next part of your post.

If you ever turn on an Arab TV music station it's 24/7 loves songs with images of raven haired beauties and love-sick men singing to them.

Your idea of evidence that Arab Muslims "absolutely revere women" is cheesy, manufactured pop music? If you were going to go for evidence as weak as lyrics to a few songs, you may as well have went for one of the greats in Arabic music instead of the recent crap.

Not only that but the vast majority of popular Arabic music comes from Egypt/Lebanon and North Africa. Hardly representative of all Muslim men.

In the mountains where the rednecks live they treat women like sh!t but that could be the same in Italy or Ireland or West Virginia.

I'm sure a small minority of people do. That's not really the point though, Islam as a religion treats women as if they were worthless.

Want to hear something absolutely crazy? If a man dies and leaves behind a five year old girl and his wife in Egypt and he has male cousins, the male cousins (Even if they didn't get along) get 2/3 of his inheritance and his wife and child only get 1/3 of his inheritance. If he had a son, his son would get all his inheritance. The source of this injustice is the Qur'an and its attitude towards women.

Let's not forget the fact only men can divorce and marry up to four and they can do it on a whim even without their wife's assent. I could go on and on but most of us have already heard it all.

You'll never hear a Muslim telling a joke about a woman like how she's dumb or talking about pussy or making disparaging mysogynistic comments like us oh-so-civilised western folk do on a daily basis.

That's funny. I could have sworn I heard countless Muslims do what you just described and even worse.

and in other news:

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/become-muslim-beat-your-wife-televangelist-advises-us-man.aspx?pageID=238&nID=29950&NewsCatID=358

http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/french-mosque-desecrated-by-human-excrement.aspx?pageID=238&nID=29955&NewsCatID=351

And in other news:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-19440656

Stop trying to raise a smokescreen over the truth.

Royal Irish

It was the Imam, in the dining room, with the candle stick.

Oh Muslims up to no good again.

TAlderson

SamHarris

fran17 wrote: »

and so the cycle begins all over again...uncle sam finances and arms the over throw of one regime because they dont agree with there brand of democracy.then find out the new guys aint happy to be there puppets for long so it wont be long before the brave rebels of a few months ago become the terrorists of tomorrow and get a few cruise missles up the ass.god bless america

Interesting brand. "None of the parties, still great democratic label!"

you do know there are more than a few people in Libya, right? And that people in a country can be a freedom fighter, a terrorist, or any number of other things.

Your theory is that it is ridiculous for a country to have "freedom fighters" in it, and then months later have terrorists? Why?

And Wrench, this is exhibit A of what I was talking about. If the US hadnt helped the rebels and Gadaffi slaughtered them all, as he said they would, the Us would have been evil for not acting when Gadafi SAID what he was going to do. They would have been merely looking out for profits and they surely would have acted had Libya been selling them oil!

Its always the same, its become almost sterotypical for people in Ireland of a certain political disposition to have the same perdictable childish reaction to everything that happens, regardless of complexity.

old hippy

mise_me_fein3 wrote: »

When is the last time Catholics protested and killed like this? I mean it must have been centuries ago...

No religion is tolerant...it's all violent but I have not seen any religion inspire it's followers to kill like Islam.

Maybe Christians did a long time ago but then again we have moved on in "Christian" countries and most of us dont really follow all this stuff, even people that say they are Catholic dont really follow it ...Arabs on the other hand are backward.[/QUOTE]

:rolleyes:

Not to generalise or anything...

SamHarris

asherbassad wrote: »

Now the Marines are being sent in as a "protection unit". How convenient this Ambassador killing was. Not saying it was a black op but the US are damn delighted it happened. Now they can step up part two of their plan for Libya, i.e. full blown occupation. Anybody who can't see the bigger picture in all of this really should just not bother commenting. This Libyan War was planned as far back as 1999/2000.

The whole (Middle East) thing is a Western initiated war and the enemies are Russia, China and Iran.

See what Wesley Clark admits in this video:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article29129.htm

Its interesting that there is a type of person that, instead of changing his opinion when new revelations take place, will instead change or discredit the facts and reports untill it fits in with their preconceived paradigm.

American official/ group killed - it was a false flag. Thats just it for some people. The idea that there are people out there with the power and the will to kill Americans is just completly fabricated in their mind. Any reports or statements that does not agree with this is instantly dismissed as part of the shadow governments propoganda machine, any report that agrees is waived around as gospel, no matter how ridiculous or discredited it becomes.

You and the Islamists actually have something else in common besides an unwavering love of Islam - you both have entrenched ideologies.

Out of curiosity - when was the last time the US was attacked and it wasnt a false flag in your mind?

Its nice to see that for once the only apologists for Islamic terrorism are the CT boys.

Biggins

snubbleste wrote: »

So some Libyan militia group have killed the representative of the 'free world'.

So, what happens now? A US committee installed to prove that Libya has weapons of mass destruction to the UN, followed by an invasion, followed by seizing of Libya's oil & gas resources?

At a guess, the Americans bide their time (not too long) and take out someone and say "They were the enemy!"
USA can't be seen to let others away with these things - and they know it - especially coming up to an election!

SamHarris

asherbassad wrote: »

You'll never hear a Muslim telling a joke about a woman like how she's dumb or talking about pussy or making disparaging mysogynistic comments like us oh-so-civilised western folk do on a daily basis.

Well that sure balances out the enormous sexual violence that ends in punishment for the victim.

Or that women are forced to wear certain clothes- are routinely are attacked with acid.

Or that it takes the word of three women to balance one man - effectivly meaning there is no rape or violence against women cases - no woman would dare come forward.

Or that rape within marriage isnt even recognised as a reality.

You should really read about the recent news of sexual abuse coming from Egypt. Hardly a surprise. A culture that foces women to take responsibility for their own rapes? In the future, if and when the Muslim world joins us in the 21st century, there will be people looking back on this time and trying to figure out just how bad things really were for women in these socieities. I can see parallels with the abuse in Catholic churches coming up already.

Really that people could try and claim that Islam is respectful towards women is nearly as ridiculous as the claims that other relgions have the same issues with violence as Islam.

SamHarris

old hippy wrote: »

:rolleyes:

Not to generalise or anything...

If he were to say "Arab societies" you would be hard pressed to prove him wrong.

SamHarris

Biggins wrote: »

At a guess, the Americans bide their time (not too long) and take out someone and say "They were the enemy!"
USA can't be seen to let others away with these things - and they know it - especially coming up to an election!

Do you think they should let people get away with it?

My guess is enormous preassure and strong words for the Libyan government to do something. A push for an official apology and at least some arrests before the elections.

If Libya seems to not be co operating, then yes I think they will take people out.

fran17

jmayo wrote: »

You do know that Gaddafii had actually come in from the cold so to speak in comparison to the days when they were trying to bomb his ass and he was sending shi* loads of weapons to people to fight their allies.

If anything Gaddafi was closer to the US (and Britain) in the last few years than he had been for decades.

BTW how would you describe the ones that attacked the embassy ?
Brave rebels, terrorists or nutjobs ?

Maybe you should bless American a bit more because the alternatives aint that appealing either.

he may have come in from the cold,so to speak,but the only reason blair was kissing his ass in the desert in 07 was to get rights for bp to drill in the country.im sure the u.s motives were much of the same as gaddafii was opening up to western investment.
and the ones who destroyed the u.s embassy are the beginning of a people who were thankfull for help but now see that the help was just the means to get a foothold in there country

Biggins

SamHarris wrote: »

Do you think they should let people get away with it?

No, I just hope they DO get the right person/people responsible.

SamHarris wrote: »

My guess is enormous preassure and strong words for the Libyan government to do something. A push for an official apology and at least some arrests before the elections.

If Libya seems to not be co operating, then yes I think they will take people out.

Indeed.

SamHarris

fran17 wrote: »

he may have come in from the cold,so to speak,but the only reason blair was kissing his ass in the desert in 07 was to get rights for bp to drill in the country.im sure the u.s motives were much of the same as gaddafii was opening up to western investment.
and the ones who destroyed the u.s embassy are the beginning of a people who were thankfull for help but now see that the help was just the means to get a foothold in there country

Gadaffi stopped exporting terror so countries started doing business with him? When will the West stop with their dastardly plans!

No it was the reaction of a group filled with hate and shame at their societies own inadequecies. Exactly where did you read that this toe hold was what the protests were about?

fran17

SamHarris wrote: »

Gadaffi stopped exporting terror so countries started doing business with him? When will the West stop with their dastardly plans!

No it was the reaction of a group filled with hate and shame at their societies own inadequecies. Exactly where did you read that this toe hold was what the protests were about?

i dont neeed to read the obvious,history alone will tell us how these situations play out.the yanks m.o is always the same.
where did you find out that it was a "group filled with hate and shame at their societies own inadequecies"? fox news by any chance:rolleyes:

SamHarris

fran17 wrote: »

i dont neeed to read the obvious,history alone will tell us how these situations play out.the yanks m.o is always the same.
where did you find out that it was a "group filled with hate and shame at their societies own inadequecies"? fox news by any chance:rolleyes:

No, they are filled with hate because they killed someone over a movie.

They are filled with shame because their societies cannot compete scienctificaly, technologicaly, economicaly, militarily or culturaly ( I could go on) - the majority polled obivously believes this is a Jewish conspiracy (see the Pew Poll East-West divide). Their frustration is obvious in all their statements (they being radical Islamists)

Isnt it funny that all the people constantly piping on about Fox are often the first to rush on over to Info wars, Press TV or RT to get the 'real story' :rolleyes: I wonder if any of them have ever read a book? Well, one not authored by Noam Chomsky.

So, hit me, why was it about the toe hold and not what the crowd were chanting after all?

SamHarris

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/fighting_words/2006/02/stand_up_for_denmark.html About the cartoons from Denmark - but equally applies to today.

Gee Bag

SamHarris wrote: »

No, they are filled with hate because they killed someone over a movie.

They are filled with shame because their societies cannot compete scienctificaly, technologicaly, economicaly, militarily or culturaly ( I could go on) - the majority polled obivously believed this is a Jewishs conspiracy (see the Pew Poll East-West divide). Their frustration is obvious in all their statements (they being radical Islamists)

Section highlighted is a bit too ninteenth century for my liking. The structure of societies in the Arab World are different to the west, that doesn't mean they are inferior.

SamHarris

Gee Bag wrote: »

Section highlighted is a bit too ninteenth century for my liking. The structure of societies in the Arab World are different to the west, that doesn't mean they are inferior.

Well no, not if you dont have any particular ways of measuring the succes of a society. But most people do, give or take some differences.

For example if you believe the best way you can possibly run a society is by following the creed sent by god to an Arab tribal in the 7th century, then they are doing a bang up job.

If you believe that a 'successful' society means succeeding by certain other criteria - like the ones I listed, then yes, compared to the West their societies are inferior. And yes, the structure of a society most definitly impacts that.

To follow your logic to its extreme, a slave society would be just as 'good' as modern liberal democracy. Not many would agree, though again its entirely subjective.

Gee Bag

SamHarris wrote: »

Well no, not if you dont have any particular ways of measuring the succes of a society. But most people do, give or take some differences.

For example if you believe the best way you can possibly run a society is by following the creed sent by god to an Arab tribal in the 7th century, then they are doing a bang up job.

If you believe that a 'successful' society means succeeding by certain other criteria - like the ones I listed, then yes, compared to the West their societies are inferior. And yes, the structure of a society most definitly impacts that.

To follow your logic to its extreme, a slave society would be just as 'good' as modern liberal democracy. Not many would agree, though again its entirely subjective.

Thing is, I think the criteria you listed are complete and utter bullsh1t. They are like something out of a Rudyard Kipling poem. Frankly, I'm surprised you didn't mention the White Man's Burden.

Scientific and technological criteria are pretty much the same thing. The Arabs were once the worlds technological super power, so were the Chinese. Now the west is in the ascendency. Swings and roundabouts really.

Economically speaking, the west can't really be pointing too many fingers at any one else given the fact that we are all pretty much leveraged up to out eyeballs so we can buy useless shyte we can neither afford or need. Furthermore, the west (meaning the US, UK and France) have been continually fcuking up the Middle East from pretty soon after the invention of the combustion engine in the pursuit of oil. They have a pretty good reason to be p1ssed off with us.

Military prowess is something I put very little stock in. Enough to defend your own borders is plenty. The Soviet Union had the largest military in the world, fat lot of good it did them in the long run.

Culture is entirley subjective. Western culture gave us Caravaggio and Shakespeare. It also gave us Westlife, the X-Factor and Big Brother. Italians tend to enjoy music I think is utter shyte, Indians like Bollywood movies which are my idea of hell. Doesn't mean that I think that I'm culturally superior to them. It just means they have different tastes and sensibilities.

What makes a worthwhile society for me? A strong emphasis on the importance of the family, genuine empathy for your fellow citizens, being hospitable to strangers, a willingness to share no matter how little you have, not drinking until you puke, etc. All of which are of great importance in Islamic countries.

I've worked extensivley in the Middle East and North Africa and never once did any one give me any kind of grief. I can't remember anyone being anything but welcoming.

Daft point at the end of your post about slavery. How you managed to arrive at that conclusion from a one-line post by me is baffling.

Gbear

A nice gesture by non-dickheaded Libyans who I presume are in fact more representative of the population as a whole:
http://imgur.com/a/tlCyI

Sir Pompous Righteousness

Gbear wrote: »

A nice gesture by non-dickheaded Libyans who I presume are in fact more representative of the population as a whole:
http://imgur.com/a/tlCyI

"Sorry, I didn't understand that because the spellings all wrong", said the US General.

*continues bombing raids*

token101

Gee Bag wrote: »

Section highlighted is a bit too ninteenth century for my liking. The structure of societies in the Arab World are different to the west, that doesn't mean they are inferior.

I think it's fair to say a lot of societies with a heavy Islamic influence are vastly inferior to the West.

Thrill

Protesters clashing with police outside American embassy in Cairo again.

The link is a live feed by reuters news agency. Looks quiet atm. The odd rock being thrown.

http://reuters.livestation.com/demo

asherbassad

Yet the US are now allied with Al-qaeda in Syria.

So are you with us or the terrists:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article32424.htm

Just when you thought the Americans couldn't get any more thick and incompetent.

asherbassad

Now the US ambassador has been killed in Libya.

Can anyone explain to me why 2 US warships are being moved to the Libyan Coast?

When an American is killed in any other country the place isn't invaded.
Of course many will spit out the "this is an act of war" rubbish.....but it isn't.

It's being exploited to occupy Libya and turn NATO into a force that controls the Mediterranean (what was the term Nostre Mare?).

You want to control the world you have to control resources (Middle East), waterways (Suez, Red Sea, Indian Ocean, Hormuz and South China Sea), economies ( Reserve currency) and information (mass media, airwaves and internet). You have to control Africa and also put a ring of military bases around your competitors (China, Iran, Russia).


It ain't rocket science.

Wompa1

asherbassad wrote: »

Yet the US are now allied with Al-qaeda in Syria.

So are you with us or the terrists:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article32424.htm

Just when you thought the Americans couldn't get any more thick and incompetent.

You got a link that actually proves your claim that the US are allied with Al-Qaeda?

Or are you too thick to get the difference between credible evidence and speculation? Or just too incompetent to provide the proper link

IvySlayer

Some muslims go out and murder people because of a film that depicts them as murderers

asherbassad

Latest bullsh!t report

BBC: (Jeremy Bowen)

(In the thick of night)

"The compound was surrounded by heavily armed bearded men"

So...... you were in a position to determine how they wore their haircuts and facial hair during a bombardment in the middle of the night....and why would the fact that they hadn't shaved in a while be important?? Unless you want to spin this as if it was Islamic Lunatics and you want everyone to skew that way. Christ this news reporting nonsense is getting worse.

Son Of A Vidic

IvySlayer wrote: »

Some muslims go out and murder people because of a film that depicts them as murderers

You there? Did they tell you that they were devout practicing Muslims? Because their actions certainly don't suggest it to me. Christianity, Islam and Judaism all have their extremists who try to justify acts of violence, while hiding behind the cloak of religion.

We of all people should have learned not to generalise and tar everyone with the same brush. After all, we had 800 hundred years of it on this little island. Ignorance, bigotry and sweeping generalisations, whether subtle or otherwise, is always something that is best avoided.

Manic Moran

Gbear wrote: »

A nice gesture by non-dickheaded Libyans who I presume are in fact more representative of the population as a whole:
http://imgur.com/a/tlCyI

Apparently that little demonstration (note repeated photos of the same people and signs) was substantially smaller than the angry ones.

When an American is killed in any other country the place isn't invaded.

The man represented the US as the Head of State's official representative. Not exactly a tourist from Arkansas.

NTM

El Siglo

Robert Fisk's article on the embassy attack [Link: http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/the-provocateurs-know-politics-and-religion-dont-mix-8131297.html]

The provocateurs, of course, know that politics and religion don’t mix in the Middle East. They are the same. Christopher Stevens, his diplomat colleagues in Benghazi, priests in Turkey and Africa, UN personnel in Afghanistan; they have all paid the price for those ‘Christian priests’, ‘cartoonists’, ‘film-makers’ and ‘authors’ – the inverted commas are necessary to mark a thin line between illusionists and the real thing – who knowingly choose to provoke 1.6 billion Muslims.

Chazz Michael Michaels

No such thing as a reasonable reaction to something as frivilous as a film from these people, is there?

old_aussie

The religion of love and peace.

ejmaztec

Chazz Michael Michaels wrote: »

No such thing as a reasonable reaction to something as frivilous as a film from these people, is there?

Reasonable people would have got the film nominated for a Golden Raspberry Award and left it at that.:(

old hippy

old_aussie wrote: »

The religion of love and peace.

The tedious repetition, as useful as graffiti on a toilet door.

old hippy

token101 wrote: »

I think it's fair to say a lot of societies with a heavy Islamic influence are vastly inferior to the West.

I think it's fair to say that Ireland is not a great role model anyone should be aspiring to these days/

Mervyn Crawford

Obama's claim that religious freedom is tolerated in America is hypocritical in the extreme.
Muslims are villified in a relentless campaign to create an Enemy and thus allow the destruction of democratic rights at home and the loss of sovereignty of those (accumulating) countries that are targeted.

While at the same time the secret agencies of the American state form alliances with and manipulate the very fundamentalists they have in fact funded and run.

Separation of Church and State is more and more broken down in America - prayers in schools; invocations to God by the political rulers, ...... . Coupled with the hand across the chest before the flag.
Official life in America is sliding towards dictatorship and fascism.

A note to a contributor above. Ireland unlike Iraq, Afgahnistan, Palestine .......is not being ravaged by unending military savagery from the Imperialist lords. Yet even given that, to declare one is against the Catholic Church does have consequences - try asking the parents of a child who they wish to have no religious 'education'.

http://wsws.org/articles/2012/sep2012/pers-s12.shtml

ejmaztec

old hippy wrote: »

The tedious repetition, as useful as graffiti on a toilet door.

I find that uncalled for, as I find 99% of graffiti on toilet doors to be extremely entertaining, inspirational and uplifting.

old hippy

SamHarris wrote: »

.

Really that people could try and claim that Islam is respectful towards women is nearly as ridiculous as the claims that other relgions have the same issues with violence as Islam.

Bombing churches in the US, just one of the many, many inccidents of home grown terrorism over the years. How fast we are to brush things aside.

Abortion clinics and doctors being attacked all because of a woman's right to chose.

Too long ago? How about the attack on the Sikh Temple?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-19554619

Clearly, America is a backward society and the world would be a better place without Americans. Right? :rolleyes:

Mervyn Crawford

The black propaganda, the psyops, that the western intelligence and political agencies promote centres on Arab = Muslim (Arabs meaning anyone living in the Middle East or North Africa!). And Muslim = Fundamentalist.

The Muslim Brotherhood's taking of Presidential power in Egypt is rightly regarded with utmost suspicion by the great mass of the Egyptian population.
Events are followed very closely and the words and deeds of the government do not go without being closely monitorerd by the masses who fought to bring down Mubarak.

The slaughter in Libya and Syria is also seen as an Imperialist intervention - and the alliance between fundamentalists and the western powers is seen for waht it is.

What is missing in Egypt is the same as what is missing here, a voice and a leadership that articulates the aims of the oppressed and exposes the rotten and violent nature of the cabal that joins together to keep the rich rich and the poor poor.

Islamist thugs attack Tunisian unemployed workers’ protest in Sidi Bouzid

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/aug2012/tuni-a29.shtml

old hippy

Just because someone is a Muslim, it doesn't make them an Arab. Iraqis, for example are Persian, not Arab.

Mervyn Crawford

Old Hippy, I believe you mean Iran.

That is my point. The political aim by the western powres is to whip up racism so as to justify the War on Terror.

The problem is that the so-called leaders of the working class promote these self-same lies:

"Syria’s “eerie parallel to Afghanistan” and the pro-imperialist pseudo-left"

http://wsws.org/articles/2012/sep2012/igna-s10.shtml