US ambassador killed in Libya

old hippy

hellboy99 wrote: »

Not all Muslims, but it's certainly more than just a mob!

Well that's big of you. The kind of generalising that goes on from some of ye about Muslims is every bit as offensive as the type of person who bangs on about "dumb Americans".

snafuk35

old hippy wrote: »

Again with the "they". Who is this "they"?

The screaming mobs of violent Islamic nutters.
This thread is about the US ambassador who was killed by a mob of Islamic nutters.
Over the past few years mobs of Islamic nutters getting very very offended and then going around murdering people who are not connected to cartoons or films or books that set them off is becoming a common occurance.

But do I have to include a lengthy note at the end of all my posts saying that not all Muslims are whackjobs and that other religious people can be violent too. Just so nobody is offended wha?

Higher

There were more scumbags involved in the 'Love Ulster' riot than they were muslims involved in the Libyan embassy attacks.

Weird how we didn't label ourselves as a nation of scumbags after that yet 1.9 billion Muslims are fair game to be called savages after an incident involving a much smaller contingent in a nation strifed by poverty and civil war.

old hippy

old hippy wrote: »

Well that's big of you. The kind of generalising that goes on from some of ye about Muslims is every bit as offensive as the type of person who bangs on about "dumb Americans".

Stop trying to take my posts out of context, I made them specifically to the thread topic, "they" being the mindless, backward thinking people that have taken their own so called religious beliefs out of context to justify their barbaric behaviour!

snafuk35 wrote: »

The screaming mobs of violent Islamic nutters.
This thread is about the US ambassador who was killed by a mob of Islamic nutters.

+1

SamHarris

Higher wrote: »

There were more scumbags involved in the 'Love Ulster' riot than they were muslims involved in the Libyan embassy attacks.

Weird how we didn't label ourselves as a nation of scumbags after that yet 1.9 billion Muslims are fair game to be called savages after an incident involving a much smaller contingent in a nation strifed by poverty and civil war.

Your right. I mean after they have been so quiet for decades! :rolleyes:

Its hardly just about this that people then see problems with Islam as a whole. Its near daily attacks, over a long period of time, over a wide geographical area.

Also for most people its hardly labeling every single Muslim as violent and hateful its recognising there is enormous issues with the ideology that often and repeatedly lead to those end.

And yes it happens more than enough in and in enough different places that it relfects on the ideology of the whole.

therewillbe

Altogether now,Always look on the bright side of life! Classic,I love a sense of humour.

czx

old hippy wrote: »

Corrupt politicians and businessmen who pilfered from the nation? Paramilitary groups opertating north and south of the border? A rapist church that still holds sway over people? An economy in ruins? Mass unemployment? An increase in drug related crime?

LOL. You better take them blinkers off, a chara.

Yet I'm still free to do and say as I like. I have enough food, shelter etc. meaning I'm already better off than most people. Get some real problems.

getzls

Reports through a internet site claims he was raped before they killed him.

Seems, according to this site it's a normal thing they do. Never heard of that one before. Will try to find the site again that claims this.

Snake Plisken

Jezus imagine if Monty Python had made Life of Brian as a parody of the prophet, the members would have to be protected, British embassies under attack etc. Now think back when Life of Brian was released ok it was banned here, but there was some picketing outside cinemas showing it in the UK and America, and I recall John Cleese debated on TV with a Bishop about the film.

Just goes to show how stuck in the middle ages these nutty muslim mobs are!

BTW all the PC brigade on here, I'd like to see you go out and work in these countries, we'd probably see you on LiveLeak being beheaded in the name of Allah!

Killer Wench

getzls wrote: »

Reports through a internet site claims he was raped before they killed him.

Seems, according to this site it's a normal thing they do. Never heard of that one before. Will try to find the site again that claims this.

I haven't heard rape. Instead, through the Huffington Post, I have heard his body was dragged through the streets.

Killer Wench

Here's the story about the alleged rape and body dragging:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/watercooler/2012/sep/13/picket-report-murdered-us-ambassador-libya-reporte/

asherbassad

Question...

What is the definition of a sovereign state?
(nevermind what you feel about the way that state is conducted)

Who has the right to make laws, and/or determine those within a sovereign state?

What constitutes the protection of a sovereign state with regards to those who choose to reside within that sovereign state?

Should the citizens of a sovereign state EVER have no decision with respect to others who would enter their sovereign state, uninvited and armed?

Should the citizens of a sovereign state, negotiate the departure of non participants and non-invitees within aforementioned sovereign state and if this reaches an impasse, are said citizens of a sovereign state within their right to neglect dialogue and resort to force?


These things I wonder.

czx

asherbassad wrote: »

Question...

What is the definition of a sovereign state?
(nevermind what you feel about the way that state is conducted)

How the state conducts itself is very important.

partyatmygaff

asherbassad wrote: »

Question...

What is the definition of a sovereign state?
(nevermind what you feel about the way that state is conducted)

Who has the right to make laws, and/or determine those within a sovereign state?

What constitutes the protection of a sovereign state with regards to those who choose to reside within that sovereign state?

Should the citizens of a sovereign state EVER have no decision with respect to others who would enter their sovereign state, uninvited and armed?

Should the citizens of a sovereign state, negotiate the departure of non participants and non-invitees within aforementioned sovereign state and if this reaches an impasse, are said citizens of a sovereign state within their right to neglect dialogue and resort to force?


These things I wonder.

Question:
Are you somehow trying to justify lunatics murdering embassy staff and dragging the ambassador through the street because NATO were brought in to help the rebels during the Libyan civil war?

alchemist33

Killer Wench wrote: »

Here's the story about the alleged rape and body dragging:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/watercooler/2012/sep/13/picket-report-murdered-us-ambassador-libya-reporte/

The responses after that article make very depressing reading. It's just bomb, bomb, bomb; the sort of blind lashing out that this mess is all about.

preddy

Is the US embassy not considered US soil with armed troops inside to stop this thing from happening?

jmayo

old hippy wrote: »

Corrupt politicians and businessmen who pilfered from the nation? Paramilitary groups opertating north and south of the border? A rapist church that still holds sway over people? An economy in ruins? Mass unemployment? An increase in drug related crime?

LOL. You better take them blinkers off, a chara.

Nice try there, but AFAIK we haven't forced any rape victims to marry their rapists, we haven't arrested any mentally handicapped kids for supposedly burning any copies of the bible and haven't violently attacked an embassy because someone from that country made a film that slags off our primary religion.
And as bad as our primary churches go they haven't issued any death sentences on anyone in the last few years.

old hippy wrote: »

I live in London which is not stranger to protest or riots. It's not the sole preserve of "Muslim countries".

Except I don't recall riots over cartoons, films, books, etc.

old hippy wrote: »

You do see them bombing abortion clinics, declaring modern day crusades (Bush et Blair) or killing someone because they're the wrong kind of christian (see NI)...

Nice try again, but again just bullsh** and crap.
Yes in the US you have had some religious nutjobs attack abortion clinics and doctors but I don't recall it in other countries.
And if you think that the majority of killings in the north were down to just religion you know fook all about the problem.

old hippy wrote: »

People react strongly to things they feel strongly about. And no, I'm not for one minute condoning such behaviour but it does happen.

You've heard about how "Playboy of the Western World" went down on its premiere? Or even Stravinsky's "Rites of Spring"?

Anyway, you can't judge all Muslims by the acts of a minority of nutters.

Again you are trying your best to equate Muslim dominated countries in North Africa, Middle East and some of the muslim countries of Asia (not counting Malaysia or Indonesia here) with the western world.


Why don't you tell the people when the above riots occurred ?
The Stravinsky's "Rites of Spring" was in 1913, yes 1 year short of 100 years ago.
Oh and the Playboy riote occurred in 1907.

So basically you are comparing modern day islamic countries with Ireland and France of a 100 years ago. :rolleyes:

I think you prove our point about the backwardsness.

old hippy

While the usual apologists for Islamaphobia and incitement to hatred wax lyrical over the dreaded PC brigade, I like to quote Fintan O' Toole

We have now reached the point where every goon with a grievance, every bitter bigot, merely has to place the prefix, 'I know this is not politically correct, but...' in front of the usual string of insults in order to be not just safe from criticism, but actually a card, a lad, even a hero. Conversely, to talk about poverty and inequality, to draw attention to the reality that discrimination and injustice are still facts of life, is to commit the sin of political correctness. Anti-PC has become the latest cover for creeps. It is a godsend for every curmudgeon and crank, from fascists to the merely smug.

old hippy

getzls wrote: »

Reports through a internet site claims he was raped before they killed him.

Seems, according to this site it's a normal thing they do. Never heard of that one before. Will try to find the site again that claims this.

I'm sure plenty of sites like to claim various things, in order to further their own agenda.

jmayo

old hippy wrote: »

While the usual apologists for Islamaphobia and incitement to hatred wax lyrical over the dreaded PC brigade, I like to quote Fintan O' Toole

We have now reached the point where every goon with a grievance, every bitter bigot, merely has to place the prefix, 'I know this is not politically correct, but...' in front of the usual string of insults in order to be not just safe from criticism, but actually a card, a lad, even a hero. Conversely, to talk about poverty and inequality, to draw attention to the reality that discrimination and injustice are still facts of life, is to commit the sin of political correctness. Anti-PC has become the latest cover for creeps. It is a godsend for every curmudgeon and crank, from fascists to the merely smug.

If anything I see you as the one insulting people and countries.
Of course these would be peoples and countries that are in this part of the world, in other words the evil western world. :rolleyes:

In the posts I responded to above you are basically equating my country and it's people to countries and peoples where discrimination and actually violence against certain classes people (women, non believers, homesexuals, etc) is not alone practiced, but at best tolerated and at worse fooking encouraged.

old hippy

jmayo wrote: »

If anything I see you as the one insulting people and countries.
Of course these would be peoples and countries that are in this part of the world, in other words the evil western world. :rolleyes:

In the posts I responded to above you are basically equating my country and it's people to countries and peoples where discrimination and actually violence against certain classes people (women, non believers, homesexuals, etc) is not alone practiced, but at best tolerated and at worse fooking encouraged.

I basically see you tarring all Muslims with the same brush. No one country is "better" than another. You don't think there's discrimination in Ireland? Really? Have you not read threads here on gays, Travellers, newcomers to Ireland or women in general? The infantile level of sexism?

asherbassad

getzls wrote: »

Reports through a internet site claims he was raped before they killed him.

Seems, according to this site it's a normal thing they do. Never heard of that one before. Will try to find the site again that claims this.

As usual, the bullsh!t propaganda machine spins into high gear with their predicatable horsecrap claims that are meant to outrage (and they do outrage alright....only the idiots though). Do they take us for fools?

Same as the nonsense about Gadaffi giving his troops viagra to rape people. Same as the pathetic claims about Iraqi soldiers tossing infants out of incubators.

Absolutely laughable.

asherbassad

Killer Wench wrote: »

Here's the story about the alleged rape and body dragging:

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/watercooler/2012/sep/13/picket-report-murdered-us-ambassador-libya-reporte/

You should read the comments at the bottom of that article. Absolutely hysterical, like the rantings of Beavis and Butthead.

asherbassad

hellboy99 wrote: »

They just like violence and are backward thinkers, they need to come out of the stone ages! Can't see things changing with these type of people anytime soon.

Do you remember when those two undercover British soldiers got caught up in an IRA funeral? The crowd stormed the car, dragged them out, beat them unconscious, stripped them and executed them. Do you remember that?

So now all Irish people need to come out of the Stone Age, is that what you're saying?

Think about what you're saying before you come out with rubbish like that.

partyatmygaff

In related news... for those who happen to understand Arabic and are looking for a bit of comic relief, Al Jazeera is interviewing some of the protestors in front of the US Embassy in Cairo.

For one, they all seem completely clueless. Not one of them have actually watched the video but they're all angry, ridiculously impassioned and keep repeating that they're out to "defend the prophet". As for what kind of people they are, half of them seem unable to string together a proper sentence. Almost like the junkies that roam Dublin save for the fact they're probably not addicted to heroin. There's also a few drop-ins who don't even know what the protest is about but just joined in because they want to "defend the prophet".

jmayo

old hippy wrote: »

I basically see you tarring all Muslims with the same brush. No one country is "better" than another.

In your opinion.

So you reckon a country where it can mean death to be found out to be homosexual, where it is often the case where a woman who is raped is blamed and forced to marry the rapist or you can be killed for wearing a symbol of your religion which doesn't happen to be that of the majority are as safe to live in as say Ireland, Uk, France, etc ?
FFS you really have one twisted view.

old hippy wrote: »

You don't think there's discrimination in Ireland? Really? Have you not read threads here on gays, Travellers, newcomers to Ireland or women in general? The infantile level of sexism?

Yeah the discrimination in Ireland against women is the same as that in Saudi. :rolleyes:
Are you seriously fooking trying to tell us that ?

Are you equating the discrimination against gays in any Arab country with that against gays in Ireland ?

Yes there is discrimination in Ireland like there is discrimination I would say in every country in the world, but what you can't get into your head or what you refuse to acknowledge is we don't have it a level where it can fooking get you killed left right and centre.
And please don't drag Northern Ireland into this.

BTW if you think we are no better than some of these countries then feel free to go live there.

partyatmygaff

asherbassad wrote: »

Do you remember when those two undercover British soldiers got caught up in an IRA funeral? The crowd stormed the car, dragged them out, beat them unconscious, stripped them and executed them. Do you remember that?

So now all Irish people need to come out of the Stone Age, is that what you're saying?

Think about what you're saying before you come out with rubbish like that.

Think for a moment. Why would there be undercover British soldiers in an IRA funeral?

When two groups are at war with each other (Let's not get started on who's more legitimate than the other) and your enemy sends undercover soldiers to a funeral, what would be the expected response? It's almost akin to an act of war.

Making an amateur film criticising an ideology (Using sources that the ideology in question is based on) is not an act of war. It certainly doesn't warrant killing completely unrelated and innocent people and inciting hate and violence against entire nations.

asherbassad

SamHarris wrote: »

Your right. I mean after they have been so quiet for decades! :rolleyes:

Its hardly just about this that people then see problems with Islam as a whole. Its near daily attacks, over a long period of time, over a wide geographical area.

Also for most people its hardly labeling every single Muslim as violent and hateful its recognising there is enormous issues with the ideology that often and repeatedly lead to those end.

And yes it happens more than enough in and in enough different places that it relfects on the ideology of the whole.

Serious question Sam....why, in your opinion, are these people so angry and why do these attacks that you talk about occur?
Why is all this happening?

asherbassad

czx wrote: »

Yet I'm still free to do and say as I like. I have enough food, shelter etc. meaning I'm already better off than most people. Get some real problems.

As opposed to who, exactly?

snubbleste

Protesters target European embassies in Sudan

Protesters angered by a film mocking Islam have attacked the German and British embassies in Khartoum.
Demonstrators started fires and tore down the German flag, raising an Islamist banner in its place.

Protests taking place from Morocco to Indonesia.
Al Jazeera live blog

SamHarris

asherbassad wrote: »

Serious question Sam....why, in your opinion, are these people so angry and why do these attacks that you talk about occur?
Why is all this happening?

You dont have to guess, they tell you.

I know where your going with this, youll list all these reasons why you think they should be protesting but its irrelevant - they are entirelly clear about what motivates them in this case.

The line isnt supporting the 'Zionists' or whatever is the cause de jour of the left its a private citizen making a movie, or drawing a cartoon. Thats the line they deem worthy of commiting murder to defend. Pitty it isnt a tiny minority in a single country, its a large minority over a big political area the common factor being a devotion to Islam.

Its sad that people even imply that the groups violently protesting are not insane, childish and a blight on the 21st century or somehow try and shift the blame to a man who made a movie. It is emblematic of how sad and reactionary people of a certain political disposition have become - trying desperatly every time something like this happens to deflect blame away from the people who carried it out and onto those that 'provoked' them for having the audacity to draw their prophet.

And arguing, still, that Islam should not be judged by the opinion and actions of a large number of its adherents over a long period of time. If it were any other ideology their would be absolutly no question of the dangerous hate being an element of it.


When a movie on the other side of the world can inflame hate and murder like this over such a wide geographical area every right tihnking person realises there is something seriously wrong with the ideology followed by these people.

SamHarris

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/14/world/middleeast/egypt-hearing-from-obama-moves-to-heal-rift-from-protests.html?pagewanted=all

The United States Embassy publicly mocked the Brotherhood for sending out conflicting messages in its English and Arabic Twitter accounts. “Egyptians rise up to support Muhammad in front of the American Embassy. Sept. 11,” read an Arabic language post the Brotherhood sent out on the day of the attacks — one of several over the last few days emphasizing outrage at the video or calls for its censorship.

As though realising their was a hole in their tapestry of unfortunate character traits, the Egyptian Muslim Brothers rush to fill it with duplicity. What a delightful bunch they are.

live webcam here near the US Embassy, Cairo

trying to find ways to breach the wall. fecking lunatics.

therre is one kid on top of the wall, I keep expecting a volley of bullets to blast him down.#



http://video.foxnews.com/video-live-streaming.html?video_id=1155606218001

asherbassad

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Question:
Are you somehow trying to justify lunatics murdering embassy staff and dragging the ambassador through the street because NATO were brought in to help the rebels during the Libyan civil war?

I'm not trying to justify anything. Seems you are trying to justify a so called mutual DEFENCE pact banding together and attacking, yet again, a sovereign independent state. This, my friend, is a crime against humanity and is illegal no matter how you slice and dice it.
You can wrap yourself in all the rationalisations you want. You can bang on about humanitarian intervention until you're blue in the face but all you're doing is ignoring the facts so as to ease your own conscience.

Now same thing in Tunisia.

Breaking News: Protesters jump over wall into U.S. embassy in Tunis: Reuter’s witness

Hope this **** dosent happen at the Embassy here in Dublin.

asherbassad

jmayo wrote: »

In your opinion.

So you reckon a country where it can mean death to be found out to be homosexual, where it is often the case where a woman who is raped is blamed and forced to marry the rapist or you can be killed for wearing a symbol of your religion which doesn't happen to be that of the majority are as safe to live in as say Ireland, Uk, France, etc ?
FFS you really have one twisted view.



Yeah the discrimination in Ireland against women is the same as that in Saudi. :rolleyes:
Are you seriously fooking trying to tell us that ?

Are you equating the discrimination against gays in any Arab country with that against gays in Ireland ?

Yes there is discrimination in Ireland like there is discrimination I would say in every country in the world, but what you can't get into your head or what you refuse to acknowledge is we don't have it a level where it can fooking get you killed left right and centre.
And please don't drag Northern Ireland into this.

BTW if you think we are no better than some of these countries then feel free to go live there.

This sounds like something you'd overhear in Abrakebabra around 3am.

OK, in which country or countries is it a capital offence to be homosexual? You keep bringing this up so please name them.
In which country is it mandatory for a rape victim to marry her tormentor and in which country is it a capital offence to wear certain religious symbols?
You mention Saudi Arabia. Indeed this corrupt and brutal monarchic dictatorship has one of the (if not THE) worst human rights records in the world. Yet not a single western country airs the slightest criticism against them.
London and Washington and Paris scream blue murders if a few student protestors are water-cannoned in Tehran, they howl like banshees that Putin is worse than Stalin because Pussy Riot were tossed in jail for a few weeks, the hypocritical arseholes have an apoplectic meltdown and squeal about rights, and the law, and freedom when Hugo Chavez shuts down a radio station (funded by the CIA) which advocates overthrowing the government (fact: he didn't shut them down. He just waited for their license to expire and then didn't renew it...perfectly legal and in the Terms and Conditions of aforementioned license) yet they don't make so much as a mouse fart when Saudi Arabia sends tanks into Bahrain and slaughters dozens of peaceful protesters. They don't say boo when Saudi Arabia routinely stones to death women ACCUSED (not proven, just accused) of adultery. Petty thieves in Saudi Arabia frequently have a limb amputated. Non-related couples in public face a jail sentence though it's usually a night in the cells for the man but 14 days for the woman.
These champions of rights, and the law, and all that crap never say a word about the Saudis. They never batted an eyelid when Mubarak of Egypt imprisoned his political opponents or tortured detainees. They are deafeningly silent when the Israelis torture (some to death) Palestinian detainees. They don't utter a peep at the horrors inflicted by Uzbekistan dictator Islam Karimov.


Why is that?

And why is it that some people are so angry that they would attack an embassy and kill the occupants? Why do these people attack and fight back against countries that have been fcuking with them for centuries and continue to do so? Are you going to throw out the laughable "they're savages" or "they hate us for our freedom" rubbish like that mental midget Bush did?

These so-called western powers make me fcuking sick. The assholes are the kind of dicks who kick a dog and then go screaming to Animal Protection when the thing bites back.

And all you do is parrot their propaganda. Quacking like a duck the party line without pausing for a second to do some real thinking on your own. Quack, quack. Double-plus-good duck-speak as Orwell phrased it.

getting crazy in Tunis now, lots of smoke and gunfire,

http://www.aljazeera.com/watch_now/


Has the US president made any statement regarding todays attacks, has anyone heard?

According to Al Jazeera Mubasher: Some Tunisian protesters have taken down the US Flag at the US embassy

brimal

Protesters have breached the wall of the US embassy in Sudan

They have also torched the German embassy for good measure

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-africa-19602177

asherbassad

partyatmygaff wrote: »

Think for a moment. Why would there be undercover British soldiers in an IRA funeral?

When two groups are at war with each other (Let's not get started on who's more legitimate than the other) and your enemy sends undercover soldiers to a funeral, what would be the expected response? It's almost akin to an act of war.

Making an amateur film criticising an ideology (Using sources that the ideology in question is based on) is not an act of war. It certainly doesn't warrant killing completely unrelated and innocent people and inciting hate and violence against entire nations.

Excuse me but that is the most inane thing I've ever read. First off, the crowd who bludgeoned these two weren't at WAR.. they were civilians (albeit Republican sympathisers) attending a funeral. Secondly, they didn't know that the 2 soldiers were in fact soldiers. They thought they were another loyalist hit squad under the protection of the RUC sent to kill Catholic mourners just as Michael Stone had done the week before. In fact if my memory serves me correctly this was actually a funeral of one of the mourners that Stone murdered the week before.

But all that aside, they still killed two people in a fit of blind mob rage. No different from any other act of savagery fuelled by blind rage.

You try and differentiate between the cause of this rage and say that one is understandable while the other is not and that right there demonstrates that you've completely missed the point.

The previous poster zeroes in on an act or acts of brutality and the states that such behaviour proves that "these" people belong in the Stone Age.

Do black people belong in the Stone Age because in a fit of sheer hatred, rage and frustration at yet another miscarriage of justice at their expense (the cops who nearly beat Rodney King to death were simply exonerrated) they ran riot, torch the town and dragged a white trucker from his cab and battered him?

It's not rocket science. You fcuk with someone long enough they're eventually going to crack and push back. You can waffle all you want about how some races or religions are just genetically predisposed to be violent but that's bullsh!t. If it helps you sleep at night then by all means subscribe to this train of thought but you're only fooling yourself.

I have to admit, I think the US is crazy allowing this to continue.

Crazy.

Thrill

The Pentagon has sent 50 Marines to Yemen to provide additional security for the U.S. Embassy, NBC News confirms

3 protestors killed in clashes near US Embassy in Khartoum. Apparently crushed by police cars trying to protect US embassy

At least 5 protesters wounded by police gunfire near US Embassy in Tunis

Large cloud of black smoke seen coming from around U.S. embassy in Tunis.



Things are getting a bit out of control at the moment

Conall Cernach

asherbassad wrote: »

Excuse me but that is the most inane thing I've ever read. First off, the crowd who bludgeoned these two weren't at WAR.. they were civilians (albeit Republican sympathisers) attending a funeral. Secondly, they didn't know that the 2 soldiers were in fact soldiers. They thought they were another loyalist hit squad under the protection of the RUC sent to kill Catholic mourners just as Michael Stone had done the week before. In fact if my memory serves me correctly this was actually a funeral of one of the mourners that Stone murdered the week before.

But all that aside, they still killed two people in a fit of blind mob rage. No different from any other act of savagery fuelled by blind rage.

You try and differentiate between the cause of this rage and say that one is understandable while the other is not and that right there demonstrates that you've completely missed the point.

The previous poster zeroes in on an act or acts of brutality and the states that such behaviour proves that "these" people belong in the Stone Age.

Do black people belong in the Stone Age because in a fit of sheer hatred, rage and frustration at yet another miscarriage of justice at their expense (the cops who nearly beat Rodney King to death were simply exonerrated) they ran riot, torch the town and dragged a white trucker from his cab and battered him?

It's not rocket science. You fcuk with someone long enough they're eventually going to crack and push back. You can waffle all you want about how some races or religions are just genetically predisposed to be violent but that's bullsh!t. If it helps you sleep at night then by all means subscribe to this train of thought but you're only fooling yourself.

On a point of information the two soldiers were not killed by the crowd. They were taken away and shot in the head by the IRA.

bodhrandude

I watched that video clip last night (The Innocence of Muslims) on Youtube after seeing the BBC news reports and it does go all out into inflaming anger. The prophet is not supposed to be depicted or insulted and this film does exactly that. Nakoula Basseley Nakoula and Sam Bacile what was their motive, were they testing to see if the Muslim religion had a sense of humour and when it comes to religion, apparently not.

partyatmygaff

asherbassad wrote: »

Serious question Sam....why, in your opinion, are these people so angry and why do these attacks that you talk about occur?
Why is all this happening?

Simple. The religion being criticised uses violence as a solution to criticism. If Muhammad himself frequently ordered people to be assasinated because they mocked him in poetry, what do you think his followers will do?

But obviously it's because of the big bad "West" with all its aid and what not. That's the "truth" right?

SamHarris wrote: »

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/14/world/middleeast/egypt-hearing-from-obama-moves-to-heal-rift-from-protests.html?pagewanted=all

The United States Embassy publicly mocked the Brotherhood for sending out conflicting messages in its English and Arabic Twitter accounts. “Egyptians rise up to support Muhammad in front of the American Embassy. Sept. 11,” read an Arabic language post the Brotherhood sent out on the day of the attacks — one of several over the last few days emphasizing outrage at the video or calls for its censorship.

As though realising their was a hole in their tapestry of unfortunate character traits, the Egyptian Muslim Brothers rush to fill it with duplicity. What a delightful bunch they are.

Nothing new. Even their election campaign was filled with contradictory views. They say whatever their audience wants to hear.

To the country, they tell people to go "Defend the prophet" (In Arabic only of course) but they present a sympathetic face to the rest of the world to try and keep things moving. They're no better than the regime they placed.

asherbassad wrote: »

I'm not trying to justify anything. Seems you are trying to justify a so called mutual DEFENCE pact banding together and attacking, yet again, a sovereign independent state. This, my friend, is a crime against humanity and is illegal no matter how you slice and dice it.

Before you go in to your righteous rant about "crimes against humanity" and what is legal, could you remind me of what the US Ambassador and three of his aides did to the Libyan public to warrant their murder?

You can wrap yourself in all the rationalisations you want. You can bang on about humanitarian intervention until you're blue in the face but all you're doing is ignoring the facts so as to ease your own conscience.

My conscience is thankfully at ease. I am not justifying violence and cold-blooded, pointless and hateful murder.

asherbassad wrote: »

Excuse me but that is the most inane thing I've ever read. First off, the crowd who bludgeoned these two weren't at WAR.. they were civilians (albeit Republican sympathisers) attending a funeral. Secondly, they didn't know that the 2 soldiers were in fact soldiers. They thought they were another loyalist hit squad under the protection of the RUC sent to kill Catholic mourners just as Michael Stone had done the week before. In fact if my memory serves me correctly this was actually a funeral of one of the mourners that Stone murdered the week before.

You do realise that if they felt they were under threat by those undercover soldiers that makes attacking them even more justifiable? Thanks for making my point stronger.

But all that aside, they still killed two people in a fit of blind mob rage. No different from any other act of savagery fuelled by blind rage.

This embassy killing was done in a fit of ignorant, blind rage. The shooting you were talking about earlier was a pre-emptive strike on what they thought were hit men.

It's not rocket science. You fcuk with someone long enough they're eventually going to crack and push back. You can waffle all you want about how some races or religions are just genetically predisposed to be violent but that's bullsh!t. If it helps you sleep at night then by all means subscribe to this train of thought but you're only fooling yourself.

Who the hell mentioned genetic predisposition?

If your religion's founder killed people who mocked him, why wouldn't his followers follow his example?

mmitch007

It always amazes me that people do not read they assume. How does one pick theer religion? If I ran this world I would make every one force to study at least three religions and then have to past a test when they are eighteen before they could declare what religion they are. And then everyone would come to the same conclusion that all religions are man made and it time to close this chapter and move on with solving the real problems the world faces like education, hunger, longivity and quality of life. And it is time for the people to wake up and realise it is only dumb people that believe in religion and unfortunately in the middle east, north africa, india (where large % of the population cannot even read and write there own language) have some highest poorly educated people in the world are the ones that cause the problems, becasue they act without thinking and now in the middle east, north africa, india where slavery is far worse than it was ever in the west and guys just becasue they are guys that live in oil rich countries get money for nothing so most of them do not have to work, so most do not get educated either (thou india is just has allot of poor, but india are taken to arab countiries to be slaves, often not getting paid). It time cut off those countires from the rest of the world that do not split religion and state and stop slavery. Note mise_me_fein3 said he was not relgious yet dumb as arabs assume he was christian, read please read and understand

SK101

I am very tired of the feeling of having to tip-toe around Islam. I do not have a problem with their beliefs, rituals, culture but I do not like the extremes to which these people go.

Is the holiness of the Koran so strong that it drives people to acts of violence on innocent bystanders?

Is it a lack of education that causes these people to riot and attack embassies? I mean I do not know the Koran's teachings so I do not want to be pushing any ideas out there without the proper knowledge but does it teach it's followers that they can attack whoever they deem responsible for an insult to Islam and be perfectly justified?

Actually is the Koran in likeness to the Old Testament?

mmitch007

So what it a movie. Did you know the sun stops for three days in the sky if you track it position at the same time every day then is reborn. What if the earth had two moons or none then how difrent would our religion beliies be? Like I said if I ran this world I would make every one force to study at least three religions and then have to past a test when they are eighteen before they could declare what religion they are. And then everyone would come to the same conclusion that all religions are man made and it time to close this chapter and move on with solving the real problems the world faces like education, hunger, longivity and quality of life. It only dumb people that believe in religion and even dumber people that fight over it.

mmitch007

right on you said it like it is,thanks

Lord Trollington

Jake1 wrote: »

Now same thing in Tunisia.

Breaking News: Protesters jump over wall into U.S. embassy in Tunis: Reuter’s witness

Hope this **** dosent happen at the Embassy here in Dublin.

Doubtful. Say there all in Flannery's drinking their dole money and are currently planning their night in Coppers.

partyatmygaff

mmitch007 wrote: »

It always amazes me that people do not read they assume. How does one pick theer religion? If I ran this world I would make every one force to study at least three religions and then have to past a test when they are eighteen before they could declare what religion they are. And then everyone would come to the same conclusion that all religions are man made and it time to close this chapter and move on with solving the real problems the world faces like education, hunger, longivity and quality of life.

So essentially you want to be a dictator who wants everything to think as you do? Sounds awfully familiar.

And it is time for the people to wake up and realise it is only dumb people that believe in religion and unfortunately in the middle east, north africa, india (where large % of the population cannot even read and write there own language) have some highest poorly educated people in the world are the ones that cause the problems, becasue they act without thinking and now in the middle east, north africa, india where slavery is far worse than it was ever in the west and guys just becasue they are guys that live in oil rich countries get money for nothing so most of them do not have to work, so most do not get educated either (thou india is just has allot of poor, but india are taken to arab countiries to be slaves, often not getting paid). It time cut off those countires from the rest of the world that do not split religion and state and stop slavery.

For someone talking about "dumb people" you'd do well to write proper sentences.

Another thing, a sizeable amount of what you said up there is ridiculous. For one, the only countries whose people have a significant amount of oil wealth are countries in the gulf. Oddly enough, you'll find the situation is less turbulent over there.