In defence of Bikers

Cienciano

Sponge25 wrote: »

Two motorcyclists were walking down the road absolutely drunk when me and my gf were waiting for a chinese about a week ago. He stumbled into my gf and said to me "Hey watch her keep her out of my way" and I said "You bumped into her, just go home will ya"

He start getting hard so I told him "Look, I live around here, it'll take me five minutes to get you kicked up and down Bray main street, just f**k off home ya drunk, we have nothing for ya" but when he called my girlfriend a tramp, that was it. Needless to say he must have woke up with a sore cheek the next morning because I gave him the hardest right hook I could muster, suddenly his bravery turned into sobbing and he's friend dragged him on.

I'm a nice guy but I won't take that crap. He's VERY lucky, if any of my old pals had've walked past which they regularly do, he would've took a little trip to Beaumount hospital!

This doesn't reflect all bikers or even a minority. My dad is a biker and he's served 25 years in the army and is a good man.

I know people say they didn't do absolutely nothing to diserve being started on but they give someone a dirty look or something but I HONESTLY didn't do anything. I didn't even see the smelly prick untill he fell into me and my gf and squashed us against the wall! It scared my gf but I was prepared to let it slide untill he tried to blame me and called my girl a tramp!

Wow, I'm not going to mess with you if I'm ever in Bray. You taught that bad man a lesson, I hope his sore cheek reminds him that he messed with the wrong man.

daenerysstormborn3

Bam Bam Mickey wrote: »

You should get a Go Pro Hero camera.
Suction mount on the front of your bike.
Very handy in case of someone driving like an AHole.

Saving up for a cam at the moment :cool:

gallag

I hate it when I carefully get round a cyclist only for him to squeeze past me at traffic lights then I have to wait behind him untill it is safe to pass again, I think we could all use the roads safely together but it takes a bit of thought from both party's.

pixiebean22

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Saving up for a cam at the moment :cool:

Nice, hope you heal up well after that prick of a van driver.

opti0nal

Pataman wrote: »

Mostly motorcyclists do use the bus lanes because they are statistically safer.

Safer than, what?

RATM

opti0nal wrote: »

Were you overtaking?

I was and I wasn't- 2 of the incidents happened down the quays in Dublin- I was overtaking on a 3 lane road. But its not really over taking, more so just keeping in the lane I was in and going 10kph faster than the car next to me. I was in their blind spot but had they have looked properly in their wing mirror before moving into my lane they would have seen me. But instead a lot of drivers take a quick glance in their rearviewmirror and if they don't see a car they make the manouvre without looking in the wing mirror. .

I'm a pretty defensive biker, when moving through stopped traffic I am always looking through peoples car windows trying to spot the pedestrian who doesn't spot me first. I've had plenty of occasions where pedestrians have stepped out in front of a stopped car but luckily I am slamming the brakes before they even realise how close they are to being hit.

Basically as a biker I take the attitude that they are great machines to drive but they are also very dangerous. Hence I try to minimise the risk as much as possible by driving defensively and always being aware. The same can be said for the majority of bikers but there is a minority who dispel this.

cantdecide

opti0nal wrote: »

Safer than, what?

Than getting tailgated by a self important twit in an X5 on his mobile.

dj jarvis

funny, but in all my years as a courier and running with the club , another biker has NEVER nearly killed me by not paying attention , i have never been knocked off my bike by another motorcyclist , never had one swerve to block my passage or had one blindly jump out in front of me

its always cars and pedestrians , and to a lesser extent buses coaches and trucks - but strangely enough not bikers - i wonder why ???

BECASUE THEY ****ING PAY ATTENTION TO THE ROAD, BECASUE THEIR LIVES DEPEND ON IT

i swear the sentence " i didn't see him " drives me mental :mad:
no you stupid crunt YOU DIDN'T FECKIN LOOK

cantdecide

dj jarvis wrote: »

i swear the sentence " i didn't see him " drives me mental :mad: no you stupid crunt YOU DIDN'T FECKIN LOOK

The classic SMIDSY...

opti0nal

RATM wrote: »

I was overtaking on a 3 lane road. But its not really over taking, more so just keeping in the lane I was in and going 10kph faster than the car next to me. I was in their blind spot but had they have looked properly in their wing mirror before moving into my lane they would have seen me. ...I've had plenty of occasions where pedestrians have stepped out in front of a stopped car but luckily I am slamming the brakes before they even realise how close they are to being hit.

Clearly you're skilled and experienced at being careful.

But, just because you can do something does not mean you should.

I also ride in the city centre, but not as fast as I could because I know people won't see me & I adjust my style to their ability. I avoid the need for emergency stops by going more slowly.

I still don't understand why so many motorcyclists break the law, either the speed limit or bus lane regulations (or both at the same time) and then blame others for 'not seeing them'.

Pataman

opti0nal wrote: »

Safer than, what?

Safer than filtering between cars that are driven by half asleep, mobile phone using, breakfast eating, chatting, radio adjusting, make-up applying drivers who are in their own world completely oblivous to what is going on around them.

And as I said the Garda traffic corp, not known for being shy at catching errant motorists, ignore the fact. That tells you something in its self.

opti0nal

Pataman wrote: »

Safer than filtering between cars that are driven by half asleep, mobile phone using, breakfast eating, chatting, radio adjusting, make-up applying drivers who are in their own world completely oblivous to what is going on around them.

They don't have to break the law by using bus and cycle lanes. They don't have to filter. It's not compulsory. They could wait in line, just like everyone else.

Bikers can't be making their own rules.

I got passed by one today doing well over 50kph in a 50 zone, near schools, junctions and pedestrian crossings, skillfully weaving in and out of each car's safety gap as he overtook. When he eventually comes a cropper, no doubt, he'll look for someone else to blame.

Pataman

I agree. I haven't seen a biker use a cycle lane, however that's just wrong. I commute on my bike every day and see bikers weaving between cars. I also think its dangerous, maybe it comes with age. However I stand by my comments about use of the bus lane, it is much safer than filtering through traffic.

Before you say it's not mandatory to filter, but that's the inherent advantage with a bike, otherwise you should just drive a car and sit in traffic

smellslikeshoes

Gbear wrote: »

Incidentally, virtually every motorcyclist I've ever seen on a motorway was speeding. I drive the speed limit and there's a conspicuous lack of motorcyclists who drive at the same speed.

I can't speak for all bikers but from my own point of view, I do regularly break the speed limit to get myself some distance away from a situation I dislike. If I'm surrounded by cars, being tailgated or even just being weary of cars coming up behind me when I'm sitting behind you, you bet your ass I'll use the bikes power to get myself away from you. The extra acceleration is one of our main tools to keep ourselves safe.

cantdecide

smellslikeshoes wrote: »

I can't speak for all bikers but from my own point of view, I do regularly break the speed limit to get myself some distance away from a situation I dislike. If I'm surrounded by cars, being tailgated or even just being weary of cars coming up behind me when I'm sitting behind you, you bet your ass I'll use the bikes power to get myself away from you. The extra acceleration is one of our main tools to keep ourselves safe.

I have a buddy that sticks pedantically to the speed limit (on his 954 Blade...) and regularly has queues of cars behind wherever he goes. He regularly gets overtaken by cars. I keep telling him he needs to get out of heavy traffic and get away from dangerous situations. He doesn't listen.

Fawkon

opti0nal wrote: »

They don't have to break the law by using bus and cycle lanes. They don't have to filter. It's not compulsory. They could wait in line, just like everyone else.

Why the in the name of Buddha would you "wait in line, just like everyone else" when half the point of riding a motorbike is so we don't have to sit in traffic... You really think that sitting in sh*tty Irish weather behind a nice and toasty BMW is fun? And please don't retort with "then don't ride a bike, buy a car".

opti0nal

Fawkon wrote: »

Why the in the name of Buddha would you "wait in line, just like everyone else" when half the point of riding a motorbike is so we don't have to sit in traffic... You really think that sitting in sh*tty Irish weather behind a nice and toasty BMW is fun? And please don't retort with "then don't ride a bike, buy a car".

Getting knocked off your motorbike us not fun. Breaking the law by going at inappropriate speed for the conditions or riding in bus lanes is not acceptable 'fun'.

Motorcyclists are complaining how inconsiderate everyone is to them, but they don't look at their own behaviour contributes to the problems they experience.

allibastor

as a person who has both, and has crashed both, i can tell you from what i know.

Most, not all bikers, use the bus lane when it suits them. they also weave in and out of traffic when it suits, with little regard for the person in the car who cannot see them. I have persoannly seen a guy on the M50 weave in and out of traffic doing 150km. imagine if he even got a small clip. DEAD,

I do drive a car now and i must say that i also see loads of car drivers who should not be driving. they pull out with no warning, thinking that the bulb for the indicator is very expensive to waste.

I was also knocked off a bike by a soccer mom in a range years ago, came around a corner and was trying to overtake me, then an opposing car came and she pulled back in on top of me, breaking my bike and nearly losing me my knee.


I know the joy of owning a bike is that you can avoid sitting in traffic, but it comes with dangers then, and its unfair for bikers to push thier driving choice and the ramifications of it onto cars users. its all about being safe and using common sense.

Peanut2011

opti0nal wrote: »

Getting knocked off your motorbike us not fun. Breaking the law by going at inappropriate speed for the conditions or riding in bus lanes is not acceptable 'fun'.

As pointed out before the only time we are knocked off our bike is when the car in most cases does something without announcing it prior. For example, taking a U turn without indicating and checking the area around, switching lanes without checking the blind spot, turning across 2 lanes of traffic without checking if the second one away is free, turning right / left and indicating only when commenting the turn and so on...

I am not saying that car is always at fault but soooo many times I was saved cos I saw what he was going to do before he even knew about it. We as bikers understand the danger of the bike but car drivers could be a bit more aware what is around them.

The problem seems to be the fact that we don't have to be stuck in traffic where car drivers do and they get annoyed we can continue and therefore do stupid things to endanger people like us.

If I am driving over the speed limit that is my choice and as long as you are aware of your surroundings that is no skin off your nose. If I choose to use the bus lane, so what, what is that to you? You are free to use it to I won't stop you.

As a car driver you can hardly know what is and is not appropriate speed for conditions. If you only knew how many times I would get the car driver driving so close behind me in bends especially when is extremely wet cos they think I am going to slow for them. What they don't realise is that my 2 tyres have different traction to his 4 and slight miscalculation on my part will have me in a ditch!

So next time you are on the road, just drive your car and don't worry about what we are doing and if it is appropriate or not, just be aware there are other road users there.

Peanut2011

allibastor wrote: »

Most, not all bikers, use the bus lane when it suits them. they also weave in and out of traffic when it suits, with little regard for the person in the car who cannot see them. I have persoannly seen a guy on the M50 weave in and out of traffic doing 150km. imagine if he even got a small clip.

Now see I disagree with you there! You say most bikers, not true! The bus lane is only used in many cases when the road is narrow and trying to overtake the stationary traffic on the outside is not an option. The last thing most of us want to do is try and navigate trough all the cycles in the bus lane.

We have all seen idiot drivers no matter what the vehicle type. I've also seen many car drivers weaving in and out of traffic on M50, tailgating, erratic driving and so on but I don't say "most car drivers".

The only reason why a car driver can not see me is cos he is not looking, simple!

If I as a biker can see other bikers approaching behind me so can you as a car driver. The problem is that you are too comfy in the car and in your own little world to pay 100% attention to the road and around you.

The generalization of any vehicle drivers does not help anyone.

allibastor

Peanut2011 wrote: »

Now see I disagree with you there! You say most bikers, not true! The bus lane is only used in many cases when the road is narrow and trying to overtake the stationary traffic on the outside is not an option.

We have all seen idiot drivers no matter what the vehicle type. I've also seen many car drivers weaving in and out of traffic on M50, tailgating, erratic driving and so on but I don't say "most car drivers".

The only reason why a car driver can not see me is cos he is not looking, simple!

If I as a biker can see other bikers approaching behind me so can you as a car driver. The problem is that you are too comfy in the car and in your own little world to pay 100% attention to the road and around you.

The generalization of any vehicle drivers does not help anyone.

Fair enough, But i see an aweful lot of drivers of bikes doing very stupid things. i am now a cyclist in dublin and you would not beleive what you see from going slow, both bikers and car drivers are very poor in this country. I only this mornign had a biker pull into the cyling lane to avoid traffic, only to nearly hit me, then speed off only to have to wait in traffic in the next year.

Peanut2011

allibastor wrote: »

Fair enough, But i see an aweful lot of drivers of bikes doing very stupid things. i am now a cyclist in dublin and you would not beleive what you see from going slow, both bikers and car drivers are very poor in this country. I only this mornign had a biker pull into the cyling lane to avoid traffic, only to nearly hit me, then speed off only to have to wait in traffic in the next year.

I agree, there are many that make poor judgements. At the same time, there are many cyclists that also make the mistakes.

The standard of driving in Ireland is very poor overall so no wonder we have so many bad drivers.

allibastor

Peanut2011 wrote: »

I agree, there are many that make poor judgements. At the same time, there are many cyclists that also make the mistakes.

The standard of driving in Ireland is very poor overall so no wonder we have so many bad drivers.

To be fair, from a cyclists point, there is not a huge amount we can do about it. the lanes seem to stop and start in no particular order. then we have maniac bus drivers who seem to think the road is only for them, taxis which use the bus lanes like a spped way. then the good old guards, who are only supposed to use the bus lanes on route to an emergency AFAIK using them on a burger run and on the phone to boot.

suicide_circus

Motorist wrote: »

In two-thirds of motorcycle accidents involving another vehicle, the driver of the other vehicle violated the motorcycle rider's right of way and caused the accident. Motorcyclists are about 26 times more likely to die in a crash than someone riding in a passenger car, and are 5 times as likely to be injured. Per mile travelled, motorcyclists were about 16 times more likely than passenger car occupants to die, and about 3 times as likely to be injured, in a motor vehicle crash.

70% per cent of collisions occur at intersections.

Given these statistics, anyone who chooses to ride a motorbike is accepting an increased level of danger so it's hard to have a great deal of sympathy. I engage in some dangerous pastimes myself but i accept full responsibility for whatever befalls me. Very few people NEED to ride a motorbike, they choose to do it cause it's faster, cheaper , more fun and they look cool. Rough with the smooth.

Peanut2011

suicide_circus wrote: »

Given these statistics, anyone who chooses to ride a motorbike is accepting an increased level of danger so it's hard to have a great deal of sympathy. I engage in some dangerous pastimes myself but i accept full responsibility for whatever befalls me. Very few people NEED to ride a motorbike, they choose to do it cause it's faster, cheaper , more fun and they look cool. Rough with the smooth.

Just curious, does the danger in your pastimes come from other participants or from the activity itself?

minidazzler

suicide_circus wrote: »

Given these statistics, anyone who chooses to ride a motorbike is accepting an increased level of danger so it's hard to have a great deal of sympathy. I engage in some dangerous pastimes myself but i accept full responsibility for whatever befalls me. Very few people NEED to ride a motorbike, they choose to do it cause it's faster, cheaper , more fun and they look cool. Rough with the smooth.

We have to accept the increased level of danger, I'd agree with.

We do NOT have to accept responsibility for car drivers being unaware of their surroundings.

JuliusCaesar

Motorist wrote: »

In two-thirds of motorcycle accidents involving another vehicle, the driver of the other vehicle violated the motorcycle rider's right of way and caused the accident. Motorcyclists are about 26 times more likely to die in a crash than someone riding in a passenger car, and are 5 times as likely to be injured. Per mile travelled, motorcyclists were about 16 times more likely than passenger car occupants to die, and about 3 times as likely to be injured, in a motor vehicle crash.

70% per cent of collisions occur at intersections.

suicide_circus wrote: »

Given these statistics, anyone who chooses to ride a motorbike is accepting an increased level of danger . ..... Very few people NEED to ride a motorbike, they choose to do it cause it's faster, cheaper , more fun and they look cool..

The more vulnerable person NEEDS to be more careful. People get motorbikes for many different reasons. For the couple of years that I had one, it was for money reasons - I couldn't afford a car.

But I'm hoping that the new driving tests will make new drivers more aware of other road users. Before they all pick up stupid habits from the existing lot.

suicide_circus

minidazzler wrote: »

We have to accept the increased level of danger, I'd agree with.

We do NOT have to accept responsibility for car drivers being unaware of their surroundings.

True. But it is a FACT that you are more likely to die if you choose to ride a motorbike. Bikers do not exist in a vacuum. They use the same roads as other people. People are stupid. People are dangerous. Other road users make up part of the environment in which you choose to ride. You sign up to all these facts when you hop on a motorbike. Many people would like to ride a motorbike but don't as they calculate that the potential risks are too great. Bikers acknowledge these risks but ride anyway.

minidazzler

suicide_circus wrote: »

True. But it is a FACT that you are more likely to die if you choose to ride a motorbike. Bikers do not exist in a vacuum. They use the same roads as other people. People are stupid. People are dangerous. Other road users make up part of the environment in which you choose to ride. You sign up to all these facts when you hop on a motorbike. Many people would like to ride a motorbike but don't as the calculate that the potential risks are too great. Bikers acknowledge these risks but ride anyway.

That is exactly what I said, we accept the risks.

And bikers know we don't exist in a vacuum, but inside a car is completely different, a lot of car drivers think they are in a vacuum and nothing could happen. They don't accept the possible risks or are not fully aware of them.

I only started riding recently, and very very quickly I am learning that I have to be more attentive to my surroundings than in anything else I have ever done. I have to watch for other people, other vehicles, Gravel, mud, even wet fcuking road markings. I accept that these are hazards that I signed up for.

What I don't accept is that car drivers shouldn't have to pay more attention just because they are in a car. You have to do 16 hours of lessons to legally ride a motorcycle these days, and only 12 in a car. Another 4 hours should be devoted to car drivers to learn to actually look around and really SEE what is around them.

I wear a big Hi-vis, full leathers and keep my front light on when riding, yet I got swerved into yesterday when travelling on a dual carriage way at the speed limit because the car tried to come into my lane without indicating or even looking at me. That would not have happened if the driver was more attentive, it certainly wouldn't have happened if the driver had ever ridden a bike for a period of time.

chasm

minidazzler wrote: »

What I don't accept is that car drivers shouldn't have to pay more attention just because they are in a car. You have to do 16 hours of lessons to legally ride a motorcycle these days, and only 12 in a car. Another 4 hours should be devoted to car drivers to learn to actually look around and really SEE what is around them.

+1.
If anything i'd say it is car drivers who think they exist in a vacuum.
I was always led to believe that motorcyclists were vulnerable due to their size on the road but after reading this thread i think i may be more vulnerable due to other road users attitudes!

suicide_circus

minidazzler wrote: »

That is exactly what I said, we accept the risks.

And bikers know we don't exist in a vacuum, but inside a car is completely different, a lot of car drivers think they are in a vacuum and nothing could happen. They don't accept the possible risks or are not fully aware of them.

I only started riding recently, and very very quickly I am learning that I have to be more attentive to my surroundings than in anything else I have ever done. I have to watch for other people, other vehicles, Gravel, mud, even wet fcuking road markings. I accept that these are hazards that I signed up for.

What I don't accept is that car drivers shouldn't have to pay more attention just because they are in a car. You have to do 16 hours of lessons to legally ride a motorcycle these days, and only 12 in a car. Another 4 hours should be devoted to car drivers to learn to actually look around and really SEE what is around them.

I wear a big Hi-vis, full leathers and keep my front light on when riding, yet I got swerved into yesterday when travelling on a dual carriage way at the speed limit because the car tried to come into my lane without indicating or even looking at me. That would not have happened if the driver was more attentive, it certainly wouldn't have happened if the driver had ever ridden a bike for a period of time.

i don't deny any of that. But car drivers ARE less attentive, this is the nature of the beast. They are literally in their own little bubble. You know this. This makes up part of the information you assess before you get on a motorbike. You are ultimately responsible for your own life, we all are. You know that riding a motorbike significantly increases your likelihood of dying on the road but you do it anyway.
Do we need better driven education? Yes. Do we need motorbike awareness campaigns? Sure. But the stats are unlikely to change. Everywhere in the world, no matter what driving instruction is like, motorbikes are more dangerous l.
I don't ride a motorbike even though i love them, why? Because i think there is a decent chance some retarded car driver is gonna clip me and send me sliding across the road under a truck like so much raspberry jam.

suicide_circus

Peanut2011 wrote: »

Just curious, does the danger in your pastimes come from other participants or from the activity itself?

In the case of motorbike riding on public roads, you cannot have one without the other. Other participants are integral and form a major part of your risk assessment.

daenerysstormborn3

There is no need to preach to bikers about the danger of the roads we ride on. Trust me, we know how dangerous other road users are and we know how much more likely we are to be injured and suffer vehicle damage in the event of even a slow speed off.

Just because we choose a mode of transport that leaves us more exposed to dangers, that does not mean that we deserve to suffer because of our choice of mode of transport.

I wish that i had been wearing a camera when that van driver hit me. He sent me through the air, my bike and i bounced off the wire barriers and went up the wrong side of the road into oncoming traffic. All because the man driving the van didn't look for a bike and pulled out when I was a couple of metres away from his van. Yes, we know the risks we take by riding a bike and other road users need to also be aware of the danger they put us in by acting like idiots. All road users, bikers included, should drive with care and attention. When a car driver drives without care and attention the consequences are massive.

The reason why bikers dislike other road users is because in 99% of cases they've either been the victim of a collision or they know someone who has, or worse, they know someone killed by the stupidity of another road user. Yes, there are a minority of road users, bikers included, who act like idiots everytime they go out on the road, that still doesn't make them a free for all to disregard on the road. All road users break the law everyday, it's a fact of life and sadly it's down to those of us who drive carefully to accommodate the stupidity of others.

Mark Tapley

suicide_circus wrote: »

Given these statistics, anyone who chooses to ride a motorbike is accepting an increased level of danger so it's hard to have a great deal of sympathy. I engage in some dangerous pastimes myself but i accept full responsibility for whatever befalls me. Very few people NEED to ride a motorbike, they choose to do it cause it's faster, cheaper , more fun and they look cool. Rough with the smooth.

You seem to be saying that if I am injured because of the inattention of a car driver that it is my fault . Regardless of whether I want or need to drive my bike I am entitled to do so and I will . Motorcyclists although in a minority on the road are not second class citizens . This should not be an us and them situation. All any biker can ask is that you show some regard for the life of a fellow human being. To those car drivers who are just irritated by bikes because we seem to be having more fun, you are right we are. You should try it.

suicide_circus

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Just because we choose a mode of transport that leaves us more exposed to dangers, that does not mean that we deserve to suffer because of our choice of mode of transport..

Its not about "deserve" and Im not trying to preach. You accept the dangers. Well one of the dangers is maniac drivers.

daenerysstormborn3

suicide_circus wrote: »

Its not about "deserve" and Im not trying to preach. You accept the dangers. Well one of the dangers is maniac drivers.

You are succeeding though. Yes, we do accept the dangers. Yes, we are well aware of maniac drivers.

JohnMarston

I have no problem with bikers. I used to know a few lads who belonged to the local harley davidson club, sound out.
The only minor issue i have is the ear-rattling noise on some of those bikes. Though the same argument can be made for the ridiculous noise some boy-racer cars make

daenerysstormborn3

JohnMarston wrote: »

I have no problem with bikers. I used to know a few lads who belonged to the local harley davidson club, sound out.
The only minor issue i have is the ear-rattling noise on some of those bikes. Though the same argument can be made for the ridiculous noise some boy-racer cars make

Loud pipes save lives. If you can't see a bike, you'll hopefully hear it.

pixiebean22

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Loud pipes save lives. If you can't see a bike, you'll hopefully hear it.

Sometimes a flick of the old revs on a bike can wake some drivers up, even if they do look at you like you just kicked their car.;)

JohnMarston

pixiebean22 wrote: »

Loud pipes save lives. If you can't see a bike, you'll hopefully hear it.

i look both ways before crossing the road

dj jarvis

this lad was lucky :eek:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2012/sep/18/missing-motorcyclist-alive-ditch

daenerysstormborn3

Jesus, poor guy, very lucky to be found and hopefully he'll make a full recovery.

TTDublin

suicide_circus wrote: »

Its not about "deserve" and Im not trying to preach. You accept the dangers. Well one of the dangers is maniac drivers.

I don't accept those dangers!

I accept that I could put myself in danger by riding to fast or by poor machine control or any one f a number of reasons that any other road user could be guilty of. Hence I don't ride that way.

I don't accept that because I ride a motorcycle that I am an acceptable road casualty just because a car driver feels it's his/her God given right to be an idiot on the road just because you're bigger....:mad:

Peanut2011

While we are on the subject' big thank you to the 5series BMW that went out of his way to let me pass and big grow up to the driver of the Chubb van that did all to have me blocked behind him even as far as driving half on other lane. Passed you anyhow' what was the point?

daenerysstormborn3

Peanut2011 wrote: »

While we are on the subject' big thank you to the 5series BMW that went out of his way to let me pass and big grow up to the driver of the Chubb van that did all to have me blocked behind him even as far as driving half on other lane. Passed you anyhow' what was the point?

You were skipping the queue! :eek: Down with that sort of thing!!

Fawkon

opti0nal wrote: »

Getting knocked off your motorbike us not fun. Breaking the law by going at inappropriate speed for the conditions or riding in bus lanes is not acceptable 'fun'.

I've been hit by cars twice, broken collarbone, concussion and broken wrist, Trust me, i know what is and isn't fun on a Bike. Oh and both times it was the car drivers fault (illegal u-turn and a beemer who pulled out from a side road managed to block both my lane and the bus lane...). And riding in bus lanes is not for fun, it's to get ahead of traffic and also to get out of the main lanes which can and are used by many people who shouldn't be driving cars, it's to maximize our safety and effeciancy.

opti0nal

Fawkon wrote: »

And riding in bus lanes is not for fun, it's to get ahead of traffic and also to get out of the main lanes which can and are used by many people who shouldn't be driving cars, it's to maximize our safety and effeciancy.

Should motorcyclists be allowed to decide what laws they will follow? Car drivers could equally claim to be entitled to use bus lanes, but generally they don't. What is it about motorcyclists that makes think they're above the law?

The 'maximise safety' excuse is just that: an excuse. If motorcyclists stayed in the private vehicle lanes as required by law, and did not try to overtake, they would not be at any significant risk.

Fawkon

opti0nal wrote: »

The 'maximise safety' excuse is just that: an excuse. If motorcyclists stayed in the private vehicle lanes as required by law, and did not try to overtake, they would not be at any significant risk.

From your posts you clearly have no experience riding a motorcycle so I'm gonna stop wasting my time. Best of luck.

rubadubduba

Trust no car.

Ouchette

opti0nal wrote: »

Should motorcyclists be allowed to decide what laws they will follow? Car drivers could equally claim to be entitled to use bus lanes, but generally they don't. What is it about motorcyclists that makes think they're above the law?

It quite often comes down to breaking the law or being safe, and as vulnerable road users, we'll often choose the not dying option over the legal one.

For example, I was sitting in traffic at soon after getting my licence because I didn't yet have the confidence to filter. 3 lanes of traffic, all going in the same direction, waiting at the lights. A lorry pulls up in the lane next to me and slightly behind me. After sitting there a bit, he decides that I am in fact an empty space and tries to edge in on top of me. Luckily, he didn't quite manage to pull over far enough to hit me but it was only centimetres away. Lesson learnt. These days, I filter to the front where I know I can be seen. If necessary I'll sit in the cyclist box ahead of the traffic (I'm in London now) with all the other bikers. I can be seen. I am where drivers expect me to be. It's not allowed but it is much, much safer.

Similar arguments for speeding - when I stuck rigidly to the speed limits, knobs in sports cars were always squeezing past very dangerously. By going at the same speed as all the other traffic, that doesn't happen nearly so much. In a car, you can choose to just let them overtake, but then you probably won't die if one of them clips you. On a bike, you might.

Pulling away on an amber light - all the other traffic starts to move on amber and if I don't, and someone behind me isn't paying attention, it's someone on the transplant list's lucky day. In a car, you might get shunted forward a bit and be annoyed about a dent. On a bike, you'll go over the handlebars or under someone's wheels.