Breeding Cocker Spaniel female

shaunk85

Hi I have a cocker spaniel bitch and am considering breeding her! My wife is also pregnant so I am thrashing out the logistics and finacial side of breeding! Does anyone have an idea how much it costs per pup to get them vaccinated, wormed and chipped in the vets! I am only intending to breed her once and hope the money from the pups will cover all the costs with a bit extra left over! Any other breeding advice accepted greatly!!

SingItOut

shaunk85 wrote: »

Hi I have a cocker spaniel bitch and am considering breeding her! My wife is also pregnant so I am thrashing out the logistics and finacial side of breeding! Does anyone have an idea how much it costs per pup to get them vaccinated, wormed and chipped in the vets! I am only intending to breed her once and hope the money from the pups will cover all the costs with a bit extra left over! Any other breeding advice accepted greatly!!

Vaccinations vary but generally its €50 for the full course per pup but your vet may do a deal for you if there's a few pups. I work in a MZ store and drontal oral suspension costs €44.99 a box. Microchipping costs between €25-€50 depending on the vets. The majority of vets do a deal for numerous animals.

I also wouldn't be breeding her just to help with the new baby, there's no profit (money wise) from breeding a litter after you've paid for vaccinations/worming/chipping

andreac

Don't do it!! Seriously, unless your dog is of exceptional quality and is shown at championship shows and seemed a champion then you shouldn't be breeding. Is your dog health tested for all health issues for the breed?

So you are only doing this for money, lovely!! Another back yard breeder trying to make cash from their dog.
I suggest you do a lot more research about breeding as your reasons for breeding are not good enough reasons to breed. There's much more costs than what you just mentioned, a lot!!!

shaunk85

SingItOut wrote: »

shaunk85 wrote: »

Hi I have a cocker spaniel bitch and am considering breeding her! My wife is also pregnant so I am thrashing out the logistics and finacial side of breeding! Does anyone have an idea how much it costs per pup to get them vaccinated, wormed and chipped in the vets! I am only intending to breed her once and hope the money from the pups will cover all the costs with a bit extra left over! Any other breeding advice accepted greatly!!

Vaccinations vary but generally its €50 for the full course per pup but your vet may do a deal for you if there's a few pups. I work in a MZ store and drontal oral suspension costs €44.99 a box. Microchipping costs between €25-€50 depending on the vets. The majority of vets do a deal for numerous animals.

I also wouldn't be breeding her just to help with the new baby, there's no profit (money wise) from breeding a litter after you've paid for vaccinations/worming/chipping

Thank you fo the information on the vets fees! I had estimated approximately €100 per pup! I am not considering doing it for the money to help with the arrival of a baby rather I am inquiring that it will not put unexpected expense with one on the way! The bitch is a family pet but is of very good health and also has good lines! I would like to let her have one litter and hold one to one of the pups to keep with her!
I am by no means a puppy farmer or doing it for the wrong reasons! I.e cash!

borderlinemeath

shaunk85 wrote: »

Thank you fo the information on the vets fees! I had estimated approximately €100 per pup! I am not considering doing it for the money to help with the arrival of a baby rather I am inquiring that it will not put unexpected expense with one on the way! The bitch is a family pet but is of very good health and also has good lines! I would like to let her have one litter and hold one to one of the pups to keep with her!
I am by no means a puppy farmer or doing it for the wrong reasons! I.e cash!

When we got our first irish setter 5 years ago we got a female. We always thought we would breed her as she is from fantastic hunting lines, and is highly intelligent and a wonderful temperament and like you we thought we would love to keep one of her puppies.

But.. and there was always a but - what if she has a huge litter? She was one of a dozen so it was possible, how would we rehome all the pups? We wouldn't want to for a start and would be very very choosy as to who would be up to standard to take one.
Also the health risks to her. Why would we put her through it? It's unnecessary and could leave her open to further health problems, even though she's an exceptionally healthy dog with only the very odd minor problem.

Then we took in a rescue dog, another Irish setter, and the more we thought about it, why the hell would we breed just to 'keep a pup' when there are such fantastic dogs out there in rescues and pounds. And the very reason they are there is because people like you and me breed for all the wrong reasons. The pups from the puppy farmers and the back yard breeders and the people who just want to 'keep a pup' all end up in the same pound and rescue when their owners either cant afford them, emigrate, a child comes along, move to an apartment, change in circumstances etc.

The only difference between the puppy farmers who have such a bad rep and all the other breeders is that the conditions that the dogs and pups are kept in are usually squalid and cramped. The majority of back yard breeders and one off breeders don't health test their dogs, and by health testing I mean xraying, screening for inherited problems etc - not just a health check at the vets. So the resulting pups are all the same, untested, possibly unhealthy, possibly too closely bred and sold to unsuspecting punters who just want a cute bundle of fluff.

My setter is neutered now, no pups for her and my other setter came from the rescue neutered so no go for him either. It's not about being all high and mighty and a 'responsible pet owner' but if you actually visited a pound or a rescue and imagined your dogs offspring ending up there then it might change your mind. I certainly couldn't breed a dog once I fully comprehended the bigger picture.

Magenta

shaunk85 wrote: »

Hi I have a cocker spaniel bitch and am considering breeding her! My wife is also pregnant so I am thrashing out the logistics and finacial side of breeding! Does anyone have an idea how much it costs per pup to get them vaccinated, wormed and chipped in the vets! I am only intending to breed her once and hope the money from the pups will cover all the costs with a bit extra left over! Any other breeding advice accepted greatly!!

I'm not being funny, but there are thousands upon thousands of Cocker Spaniels bred every year in this country, and PLENTY of them end up in pounds and shelters.
We REALLY don't need any more.

DBB

Mod note: OP, I have created a new thread for your topic, rather than resurrecting the ancient thread it was added on to.
Thanks,
DBB

Mod Hat Off
OP, having reared many litters of rescue pups both taken from the pounds and born here to heavily pregnant, dumped females, I honestly don't know how anyone could combine this exhausting, pee-soaked, faeces-covered, manky, unhygienic, time-sinking occupation with raising a newborn baby, which is just as exhausting, pee-soaked etc etc...
They will turn your house into a kennel, they will turn your garden into a muddy, plant-free, grass-free cess pit.
Trust me on this one: to raise pups properly, you've got to be prepared for all of the above, because they are the realities of rearing pups properly. Don't get me wrong, it is rewarding and at times great fun, but sheesh! You are a slave to the mother and pups for at least 2 months as long as all pups are sold and rehomed by 8 weeks. And of course, the female will require care pre-parturition, adding to this time commitment.
You also need to set aside an emergency fund in case anything goes wrong during the pregnancy, birth and rearing. And at worst, you need to be prepared to lose the female and pups. I'm not saying this will happen, but you do need to be prepared for the possibility.
So, if you're really hell-bent on breeding from your female, the timing just seems seriously dodgy. Perhaps it'd be the sensible thing to do to let the babby arrive, deal with that, and then decide if you can also take on the added pressures and mank of raising a litter of pups properly.

shaunk85

DBB wrote: »

Mod note: OP, I have created a new thread for your topic, rather than resurrecting the ancient thread it was added on to.
Thanks,
DBB

Mod Hat Off
OP, having reared many litters of rescue pups both taken from the pounds and born here to heavily pregnant, dumped females, I honestly don't know how anyone could combine this exhausting, pee-soaked, faeces-covered, manky, unhygienic, time-sinking occupation with raising a newborn baby, which is just as exhausting, pee-soaked etc etc...
They will turn your house into a kennel, they will turn your garden into a muddy, plant-free, grass-free cess pit.
Trust me on this one: to raise pups properly, you've got to be prepared for all of the above, because they are the realities of rearing pups properly. Don't get me wrong, it is rewarding and at times great fun, but sheesh! You are a slave to the mother and pups for at least 2 months as long as all pups are sold and rehomed by 8 weeks. And of course, the female will require care pre-parturition, adding to this time commitment.
You also need to set aside an emergency fund in case anything goes wrong during the pregnancy, birth and rearing. And at worst, you need to be prepared to lose the female and pups. I'm not saying this will happen, but you do need to be prepared for the possibility.
So, if you're really hell-bent on breeding from your female, the timing just seems seriously dodgy. Perhaps it'd be the sensible thing to do to let the babby arrive, deal with that, and then decide if you can also take on the added pressures and mank of raising a litter of pups properly.

New to this unsure how to start a new thread! Thanks! I am not Planning for the two events to coinside for obvious health reasons! Baby not due until next march and The bitch is currently in heat and as a previous poster said we have always considered having one litter with her so if we were to do it it would be now before a baby comes or get her spayed! We too are unsure about all the 'logistigs' as stated before so I have turned to this site for advice in relation to this! Some valid points have been made and have backed up some of the doubts I would have already had in my mind!

I am certainly not 'hell bent' on breeding from her

Magenta

But WHY are you breeding from her when you could just buy a puppy?
If everyone in the country bred from their dog because they want 1 puppy, the number of dogs in the country would be at least tripling every year - where are they all going to go?
(And don't tell me, yeah but my dog is great and a great example of her breed- EVERYONE thinks their dog is a fantastic example of their breed.)

andreac

shaunk85 wrote: »

Thank you fo the information on the vets fees! I had estimated approximately €100 per pup! I am not considering doing it for the money to help with the arrival of a baby rather I am inquiring that it will not put unexpected expense with one on the way! The bitch is a family pet but is of very good health and also has good lines! I would like to let her have one litter and hold one to one of the pups to keep with her!
I am by no means a puppy farmer or doing it for the wrong reasons! I.e cash!

Well then just buy a pup. Can you guarantee homes for all the other pups?

What happens if the birth doesnt go to plan and she needs an emergency vet and a C-Section, have you the money for that? Are you willing to risk losing your bitch if complications arise during or after the birth?

I know so many responsible breeders, and experienced owners who have lost their bitches and pups during the birth and some even after due to complications, so its not all its cracked up to be.

Have you taken all the costs like special food for mother and then the pups, bedding, vaccinations, stud dog fee, worming, vet check ups, registration fees, Microchipping fees and so on into consideration? It costs a lot to raise a litter, you are doing so for 8 weeks and thats only when the pups are born. You have to care for the mother for the 9 weeks shes in pups first.

I think people need to realise exactly whats involved in raising a litter.

There is no need to "Let her have one litter", that is just nonsense and people need to realise that.

If you want to be responsible, get her spayed, and if you want another pup, go to a reputable breeder, who health tests etc. Not just from someone who is breeding for the sake of it, which is really what you are doing if you do breed from her.

andreac

shaunk85 wrote: »

New to this unsure how to start a new thread! Thanks! I am not Planning for the two events to coinside for obvious health reasons! Baby not due until next march and The bitch is currently in heat and as a previous poster said we have always considered having one litter with her so if we were to do it it would be now before a baby comes or get her spayed! We too are unsure about all the 'logistigs' as stated before so I have turned to this site for advice in relation to this! Some valid points have been made and have backed up some of the doubts I would have already had in my mind!

I am certainly not 'hell bent' on breeding from her

If shes currently in season then you really havent thought this through properly or even planned it properly.

Ill give an idea of how things should be done. I am an experienced dog owner and show my dogs too. I am planning on breeding my dogs next summer and am planning now!! I have been thinking about this for the last year but taking my time and making sure everything is right and in order.
Getting my list of all i need and organising everything and thats a year in advance. Ive to get all my health tests/checks in order first and then start organising all the things i need. I already have potential buyers lined up for some of the pups.

So thats the right way to breed, not just on a whim when you dog is currently in season.

OldNotWIse

shaunk85 wrote: »

New to this unsure how to start a new thread! Thanks! I am not Planning for the two events to coinside for obvious health reasons! Baby not due until next march and The bitch is currently in heat and as a previous poster said we have always considered having one litter with her so if we were to do it it would be now before a baby comes or get her spayed! We too are unsure about all the 'logistigs' as stated before so I have turned to this site for advice in relation to this! Some valid points have been made and have backed up some of the doubts I would have already had in my mind!

I am certainly not 'hell bent' on breeding from her

Ah yes the "let her have one litter first" line I see so much of this in my voluntary work. It's like some kind of urban myth that it will "quieten her down" or something... There are thousands of unwanted dogs destroyed in Ireland every year. We have a euthanasia rate ten times that of the UK. In a recent survey, 96% of people interviewed wanted stricter legislation surrounding breeding. Not to mention if you go onto done deal or gumtree you can find pups for fifty quid. Or better again, go to the pound and rescue a dog thats due to be destroyed. The "multipedigrees" are the best. I mean, see one bishon/labradoodle (wtf like)/golden retriever called Marley or boxer called Rocky...seen 'em all

http://rawr.ie/book/export/html/924

loveisdivine

I just want to second pretty much everything that has been said so far.
You said "let her have a litter", but you are not letting her do anything, you are making the decision to breed from her.

You also said you are not in it for the cash, you just want to keep a pup. Well if you want a pup go buy one, or rescue one. The truth is yes you do want a pup, but you also want to make money from the rest of the litter. Theres no other reason you are doing this, its not like theres a high demand for the breed or anything.

shaunk85

loveisdivine wrote: »

I just want to second pretty much everything that has been said so far.
You said "let her have a litter", but you are not letting her do anything, you are making the decision to breed from her.

You also said you are not in it for the cash, you just want to keep a pup. Well if you want a pup go buy one, or rescue one. The truth is yes you do want a pup, but you also want to make money from the rest of the litter. Theres no other reason you are doing this, its not like theres a high demand for the breed or anything.

Is it not a natural progression in any species to want to reproduce and mate! It's natural instinct so therefore not 'letting' her do this is unnatural and denying her of her natural instinct to mate!

andreac

shaunk85 wrote: »

Is it not a natural progression in any species to want to reproduce and mate! It's natural instinct so therefore not 'letting' her do this is unnatural and denying her of her natural instinct to mate!

Seriously?? Shes not in the wild where it would happen "naturally". Shes a domesticated PET, so therefore , yes, you would be making her do it, not letting her do it.

Honestly, this type of attitude is the reason why there are thousands and thousands of unwanted dogs put to sleep every year in this country.

You really need to look at the bigger picture and take the advice from everyone here, who knows what they are talking about, trust me!!

OldNotWIse

loveisdivine wrote: »

I just want to second pretty much everything that has been said so far.
You said "let her have a litter", but you are not letting her do anything, you are making the decision to breed from her.

You also said you are not in it for the cash, you just want to keep a pup. Well if you want a pup go buy one, or rescue one. The truth is yes you do want a pup, but you also want to make money from the rest of the litter. Theres no other reason you are doing this, its not like theres a high demand for the breed or anything.

Agree. I had a guy coming to me before looking to get his "breeding" dog vaccinated and when I told him there was a nominal fee he was like, "ah jassus the bitch has me out the door". I just looked him dead on and said, "dont worry, I'm sure she'll make it back for you ten fold when you sell on all her pups" - fúckin hate breeders tbh :mad:

Any dog (or any animal for that matter) that I have ever had has been someone else's "rubbish" and I dont take them on so I can play the martyr, but rather because they are all good, loving, deserving creatures who happened upon my path and the rest is history. I think it's utterly mindless to go out and buy a pedigree, most of which will never fulfill their "intended" breed function anyway.

OldNotWIse

shaunk85 wrote: »

Thank you fo the information on the vets fees! I had estimated approximately €100 per pup! I am not considering doing it for the money to help with the arrival of a baby rather I am inquiring that it will not put unexpected expense with one on the way! The bitch is a family pet but is of very good health and also has good lines! I would like to let her have one litter and hold one to one of the pups to keep with her!
I am by no means a puppy farmer or doing it for the wrong reasons! I.e cash!

Are you sure? Has she been screened for genetic disorders? How much did you pay for her? Did you meet the parents? Have either been show dogs? (And I'm not talking about the family day out ones in car parks with rosettes and lemonade )

Dont mind me asking, why are you doing it, if not for the money?

shaunk85

There are alot of people on this who obviously from reading their posts are model citizens and pillars of society! The manner in which some of the posts have been written is quite unnecessary! You would think I was intending to torture the bitch and flog the puppies for cash! The extra money i refered to in my original post was in relation to providing the appropriate food and care after the vets bill had been paid! I am a responsible pet owner who has my dogs welfare at interest! I accept there is alot of over breeding and that breeds have been diluted due to this however I have researched studs with reputable bloodlines that are far away from that of my bitch! Who is to say only show dogs should be bred! I do think my dog is a very good example of her breed but I am aware she is not perfect! But she is perfect for my family and I had hoped if she were to have pups they would bring the same joy to other families(i have many good people lined up to take a pup rather than just selling to Tom dick or Harry) I have not just decided to do this on a whim as someone suggested I too have been researching and planning for a year, she happened to get caught by a Labrador ( belonging to an irresponsible pet owner) who broke into my garden)therefore I had to wait for a heat to pass as instructed by my vet before considering her for pups! I feel I may not avail of this forum again as I have been unjustifiably ridiculed for considering this and trying to go about it the appropriate way when people did not know all of the details! People should not be so quick to pass judgement!

Thanks to all those who posted genuine advice rather than ridicule! I have decided that I will probably not breed from my bitch due to the potential health risks to her and so will book her in to be spayed!

Ziegfeldgirl27

This thread is making me so angry, no offence OP.
If you go on Done Deal or Buy and Sell, or wherever people advertise their puppies, there are literally thousands of puppies for sale in Ireland. What happens if you couldn't sell any of them and you were left with five or six or maybe more boistrous puppies and your own baby on the way too?

I wish I could just knock some sense into people that say they need to have one litter. That is bull***. My female dog was spayed as soon as was possible and she is 11 years old now, fit as a fiddle, no health problems, no temperment issues either. They don't know they're "supposed" to have babies, and like humans some of them mightn't even make good mothers.

My advice to you is to leave your dog in to get spayed once she is out of season. She is a family pet, and you are not a breeder. You would be making a big mistake. What if your dog died during the birth? Or needed a C Section? Or had 12 puppies??

OldNotWIse

shaunk85 wrote: »

Is it not a natural progression in any species to want to reproduce and mate! It's natural instinct so therefore not 'letting' her do this is unnatural and denying her of her natural instinct to mate!

Has she asked you? Sorry but you are going on as if this is something she wants. Do you even know about breeding? It's not just about letting them "at it" - sometimes the male has to be "helped" onto the unwillingly female, it usually takes more than one "go" and with some breeds there is a very high rate of caesareans as well as still births, the trauma of the birthing process itself, pups hanging off nipples, squabbling with their sharp little teeth, risk of infection etc. But sure, "let her" - if you are sure its what she "wants"

The only thing that's unnatural is the fact that hundreds of thousands of dogs are abandoned/abused/destroyed every year because of people who breed indiscriminately.

Buy a dog, kill a dog.

And I'm outta here before my happy Friday buzz is ruined

fatmammycat

OP-It's natural to feel defensive when various people tell you you're making a mistake without sugar-coating it. But you also got plenty of good solid advice from people who know what they're talking about regarding breeding and costs involved as well as a bit of a telling off, try to take the constructive on board and do right by your bitch, get her spayed. Best of luck.

ISDW

shaunk85 wrote: »

Is it not a natural progression in any species to want to reproduce and mate! It's natural instinct so therefore not 'letting' her do this is unnatural and denying her of her natural instinct to mate!

OK, to continue your theory of natural instincts. Where does she live? What does she eat? Does she live wild, and kill her own food? Or does she live on your enclosed property and is fed a commerical dog food?

So are you talking about letting her out to wander, so she can pick her own mate - that is the natural way to do it. Not sure how much money you'd get for the crossbred pups. And if she chose a large breed, she could be in serious trouble trying to give birth to them. If you're looking to pay to use a stud dog of the same breed, I wouldn't consider that natural.

I bought my first PB dog 7 years ago, a husky bitch. I then bought a male 6 months later, and I thought I'd let them have one litter, to pay for the cost of them. Thankfully I at least had the knowledge to get the genetic health tests done first, the bitch's hip score was fine, the males was horrendous. So both were neutered. I am so grateful now that his score was that bad, as I realise that I was no way ready to breed a litter of pups, and that, as much as I love the dogs to bits, he, even without the hip score issue, isn't a good enough example of the breed to use as a stud dog. He now has cataracts and she has corneal dystrophy I have had to handrear a rescue litter here, and it was the hardest thing I've ever done in my life. Up to feed them every 2 hours around the clock for 3 weeks, and I do mean EVERY 2 hours. the mess was unbelievable, and that with the help of a foster bitch who cleaned them after I fed them. We had another rescue litter come into us at 5 weeks of age. 9 of them, great fun, lovely pups but they destroyed the house. :rolleyes:

I can understand that you would like a pup out of your bitch but there is no guarantee that a pup will look just like her, or have her temperament, so if you really want another dog, you can buy one from a reputable, responsible breeder who has done all the health checks. Socialisation is just as important as lines.

Something that hasn't been touched upon, did your bitch not come with endorsements on her papers, so that you couldn't breed her without her breeder's authorisation?


ETA: Sorry OP, for some reason none of the posts on this page except the first one were showing for me, now I can see them and can see you've decided not to breed from her.

Irishchick

Hi OP.

I'm sorry you got such a cold welcome here.

I'm a veterinary nurse and in my opinion any breeding is irresponsible breeding. Whether it be a sloppy lovable family pet or a "show" dog. It's no different to me (most vets and nurses will be of the same opinion)

It's heartbreaking to see dogs brought in everyday who have been dumped on the street because they are no longer wanted. I'm the one who has to find them a home or put them to sleep. It gets so sad some weeks when I have no other choice than to put 4 or 5 unwanted dogs to sleep. I have to look at their little faces looking up at me as they slip away under my needle. Its such a waste

I'm not saying you would do this but the reality is when you sell a dog/pup you really have no idea where it will end up. Even if you believe the person you are selling to is reputable they could easily turn around and sell/give away the dog on a whim.

I'm glad you have decided not to breed her. If it's done right a breeder would be lucky to brake even, never mind any profits! Me and the vet are the only ones who would make money as you'd be in to us so much for vaccinations/worming/microchipping etc!

You should watch this video. It will give you an idea of what the situation in Ireland is like now:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n6xI7xt99zA

andreac

Irishchick wrote: »

Hi OP.

I'm sorry you got such a cold welcome here.

I'm a veterinary nurse and in my opinion any breeding is irresponsible breeding. Whether it be a sloppy lovable family pet or a "show" dog. It's no different to me (most vets and nurses will be of the same opinion)

Not sure if your post makes sense, as how do you think most vets and vet nurses are kept employed? Through revenue from treating puppies that are born through breeding and treating them as they grow up.

If there was no breeding at all, then there would be no dogs and puppies for the vets to treat so therefore you would be potentially out of a job in the future so that argument doesnt really make sense if you ask me.

As long as breeding is done responsibly from the word go then you shouldnt have problems.
Dogs should be health tested, breeders do their homework regarding potential homes for the pups, endorsements put on the registration to stop them breeding and so on.

Irishchick

There are enough dogs in the country to keep vet's going for many years. My opinion is that there should be no breeding full stop until we sort out our stray/abandoned population.

andreac

Irishchick wrote: »

There are enough dogs in the country to keep vet's going for many years. My opinion is that there should be no breeding full stop until we sort out our stray/abandoned population.

I disagree, to the point that a lot of a vets income is through new puppies and their initial treatments, vaccinations, spaying etc. My own dogs who are mature now rarely visit the vets and im sure there are a lot of other dog owners the same. So its new puppies that need microchipping, worming, vaccinations and spaying that provide most of the business for vets.

Irishchick

I disagree,

all breeders do so that doesn't surprise me.

So its new puppies that need microchipping, worming, vaccinations and spaying that provide most of the business for vets

Not true either. Some comes from new pups. A lot comes from shelters who vaccinate/worm/neuter dogs before re-homing. The rest comes from worming/de-flea treatments, boosters, on-going health problems and elderly patients. If vets were dependent on new pups they'd all be gone bust by now.

Ziegfeldgirl27

Actually most of the business for vets would be from farm animals. But that is nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

andreac

Ziegfeldgirl27 wrote: »

Actually most of the business for vets would be from farm animals. But that is nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

Not for a small animal practice, they wouldnt do large animals.

Irishchick

Ziegfeldgirl27 wrote: »

Actually most of the business for vets would be from farm animals. But that is nothing to do with the topic of this thread.

Not all vets treat large animals. Believe me the hardest person to get payment from can be a farmer. :rolleyes:

andreac

Irishchick wrote: »

all breeders do so that doesn't surprise me.




Not true either. Some comes from new pups. A lot comes from shelters who vaccinate/worm/neuter dogs before re-homing. The rest comes from worming/de-flea treatments, boosters, on-going health problems and elderly patients. If vets were dependent on new pups they'd all be gone bust by now.

You dont know me so you cant comment on my dog ownership and breeding practices. I own and show dogs, who have been health tested and are of excellent quality.
I have yet to breed a litter myself, and will do so with a lot of thought and preparation.

My dog has been used for stud 3 times, only to exceptional quality bitches who have been health tested. Everything is done by the book and responsibly and would have given vets a lot of income, so not sure how you can have such an opinion on breeders, even good ones, when its more than likely contributing to you and your fellow colleagues in employment.