The real reason behind anti-american protests?

Memnoch

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-19704981

Civilians are being "terrorised" 24 hours a day by CIA drone attacks that target mainly low-level militants in north-west Pakistan, a US report says.

Rescuers treating the casualties are also being killed and wounded by second drone strikes, the authors say.

But the scale of civilian casualties has been difficult to assess because independent media and researchers are denied access by the authorities to the tribal areas near the Afghan border.

According to the report, 42 people were killed, mostly civilians, when they gathered at a bus depot on 17 March 2011 for a "jirga" (community meeting) to settle a dispute over a nearby mine.

Four Americans are killed in Libya leading for calls for the US to toughen its stance.

Yet how many innocent Muslims have been cold-bloodedly murdered by the US in its various wars and 'anti-terrorism,' crusades? When ordinary Muslim people see the complete and callous disregard the US has for their lives, how can there be anything BUT hatred for America? How can there be any response but the swelling of the ranks of terrorist organisations and how can there be anything but the continuation of a terrible cycle of violence and tragedy.

If American civilians were being killed at the rate that Muslims are without any form of redress or justice or even acknowledgement, I wonder if there would be violent protests by the American people in response?

Higher

It's been proven that anti americanism is highest in countries where there is an intense battle between secular and islamist politicians for control. Both use grievances with America to mobolize supporters and seem tougher than the other side. The increased anti american rhetoric from both secular and islamist politicians results in a correspending rise in anti americanism from the public.

Don't believe me? The countries with intense battles between secularism and islamism i.e Turkey, Malaysia, Pakistan, Jordan, Morocco and Egypt are the most anti american while states where there is a huge muslim population but no such ideological battle are the most favourable towards the U.S i.e Mali, Senegal, Kuwait, Nigeria

People asked why were Morsi was so reluctant to condemn the storming of the embassy, the reason was that he didn't want to cede ground to the islamists by appearing soft on US. There will be a rise in anti americanism in places like Egypt, Libya and Tunisia as secular and islamist parties vye for control. It is a political strategy

Memnoch

The political parties may be fanning the flames, but they do so on the basis of the murder of innocent Muslims, which is a justifiable grievance for you know... Muslims.

Higher

Memnoch wrote: »

The political parties may be fanning the flames, but they do so on the basis of the murder of innocent Muslims, which is a justifiable grievance for you know... Muslims.

So why aren't the same flames fanned in places like Mali, Senegal, Kuwait and Nigeria?

Statistics show that US foreign policy actions only lead to a short lived spike in anti americanism. Indeed by 2OO4 the levels of anti americanism had returned to pre Iraq levels.

Have a read of this and get back to me
http://www.stanford.edu/~blaydes/AA.pdf

M three

Higher wrote: »

So why aren't the same flames fanned in places like Mali, Senegal, Kuwait and Nigeria?

Statistics show that US foreign policy actions only lead to a short lived spike in anti americanism. Indeed by 2OO4 the levels of anti americanism had returned to pre Iraq levels.

Have a read of this and get back to me
http://www.stanford.edu/~blaydes/AA.pdf

Condemnation of american actions is loudest in countries where civilians are slaughtered by the US military.

How about you realise this and "get back to us"

Manach

There are legal issues concerning the use of drones, which is the one thing I'd agree with on the OP. However, legally the US does not murder anyone. It does conduct military operations, which as a side effect innocent civilians do die. Unfortunately this is the reality of war, always has been in historical opinion and always will be.
Based on my reading of books by such as Bernard Lewis, the Muslim world is not one monolithic block and there are a variety of differing currents of opinion, both pro and anti US that are jostling for position with their own agendas. In prior interactions with the West, the more inward looking factions have protested in reaction to French/UK perceived interference, the US is just the current examplar of the West, and hence fits into this role.

M three

Legal issues? Do you think that if an american drone, plane, soldier, tank or whatever blew up your house, school, shop, car or family you'd be sitting there wondering about the legality of what happened?

Such nonsense.

Higher

M three wrote: »

Condemnation of american actions is loudest in countries where civilians are slaughtered by the US military.

How about you realise this and "get back to us"

Turkey, Malaysia, Jordan, Morocco and Egypt have the highest levels of anti americanism. I wasn't aware muslims were slaughtered by the US there?

Indeed in Turkey, where there is by far the most intense battle between secularists and islamists, anti americanism is at 9O%!

Did you even read the article by the way? Stats don't lie. There is a direct correlation between individuals who perceive themselves in a country that has an intense battle between secularists and islamists and high levels of anti americanism. If you don't want to read the article then at least look at all the graphs.

Manach

M three wrote: »

Legal issues? Do you think that if an american drone, plane, soldier, tank or whatever blew up your house, school, shop, car or family you'd be sitting there wondering about the legality of what happened?

Such nonsense.

Spoken from the wisdom of what exactly, besides your own opinion?

M three

Manach wrote: »

Spoken from the wisdom of what exactly, besides your own opinion?

Common sense, cop on good enough for you?
And what exactly is your expertise on this subject?

M three

Higher wrote: »

Turkey, Malaysia, Jordan, Morocco and Egypt have the highest levels of anti americanism. I wasn't aware muslims were slaughtered by the US there?

Indeed in Turkey, where there is by far the most intense battle between secularists and islamists, anti americanism is at 9O%!

Did you even read the article by the way? Stats don't lie. There is a direct correlation between individuals who perceive themselves in a country that has an intense battle between secularists and islamists and high levels of anti americanism. If you don't want to read the article then at least look at all the graphs.

Lies, damned lies, and statistics. Wise up or quit pushing a pro US military viewpoint.
The article is trying to deny the link between US military action in a country and anti US military feeling in the same country.
And all this secularist and islamist hatred of each other in a muslim country is classic divide and conquer tactics by the US military. Also used throughout history by any other power that has ever tried to take over the running of another country, group or region.

Do you really think the average guy in egypt or morrocco hates the american military more than your average iraqi or afghan?

Also stop calling it anti americanism.
Most of the people you are talking about dont give a **** about an american, they do however hate the US military.

The US media portray it as anti americanism so they can sell the idea to joe fat body that his way of life is under threat, and therefore something must be done about those nasty guys thousands of miles away

Higher

Really? PEW are liars? You can't just claim such a well regarded source is wrong simply because it doesn't agree with you.

By the way, you didn't even read it, did you?

M three

Higher wrote: »

Really? PEW are liars? You can't just claim such a well regarded source is wrong simply because it doesn't agree with you.

By the way, you didn't even read it, did you?

You said stats dont lie.
And the original link was to a bbc report, the 2nd was a report from 2 US universities. You think they're neutral in this? You believe everything they tell you.
You either believe what they tell you, which calls into question your judgement
Or you're knowingly spreading their rubbish as fact.
Either way I'm not impressed.

Denerick

What annoys me most is the intense ignorance (They even take pride in it) of Americans about why Muslims hate them. Some lives are worth more than others apparantly.

Hidalgo

Denerick wrote: »

What annoys me most is the intense ignorance (They even take pride in it) of Americans about why Muslims hate them. Some lives are worth more than others apparantly.

Sadly, some lives are worth more than others. 5 people get killed in the US or a western nation and its the main news, 100 get killed in Nigeria and it might get a mention.

Higher

M three wrote: »

You said stats dont lie.
And the original link was to a bbc report, the 2nd was a report from 2 US universities. You think they're neutral in this? You believe everything they tell you.
You either believe what they tell you, which calls into question your judgement
Or you're knowingly spreading their rubbish as fact.
Either way I'm not impressed.

Still haven't read the paper then. If you had you'd see the stats are taken from PEW. You can search the PEW site yourself and see if you don't believe it.

I'm looking at stats here, how do you explain them?