Home Reposessed??

cypressg

nacimroc wrote: »

This is why your up $hit creek wondering why we won't help you and never will!

Lima has a fair point (although a bit hasty)! You all just don't like it. If you step back and look at thousands of people living for free in houses whilst the taxpayer is ACTUALLY picking up the tab. No property on the market as people don't need or want to sell. The property that is up is artificially elevated thanks to NAMA doing nothing. The whole thing is a farce and will collapse because of peoples blatent ignorance to the fact that there was a crash and god forbid they might lose some money.

Lol,sure.It's everybody for themselves right now and if you haven't twigged that yet you're gonna end up losing.
I don't really understand the point you're making in your last paragraph,what is it?

nacimroc

cookie1977 wrote: »

A little more caring for our fellow human beings struggling at a time of great hardship might help the entire country move forward.

So they don't pay 1 single cent of their mortgage for 5 years, I'm picking up the pieces, weather I like it or not, and its me who has to show compassion. cypressg is the perfect example of why the public will let them burn (and in turn screwing any chance the people who are actually in difficulty and trying to resolve it have of getting help).

When my mortgage went up twice this year, my tax went up and everything costs me more because of those exact people I will try spare some thought for them living absolutely rent/mortgage free for 5 years.

cookie1977

No your mortgage and tax went up because the banks were bailed out due to an international recession and bad decisions by the government and banks of the day primarily. Along with the public taking mortgages they couldn't afford although this goes back to very poor due dilagence on the banks part too.

If people are part of the MARP process then they have atmost deferred their capital payments and up to 33% of their payments for up to 5 yearsi don't think their are many living rent free as you say.

youtube!

cypressg wrote: »

Lol,sure.It's everybody for themselves right now and if you haven't twigged that yet you're gonna end up losing.
I don't really understand the point you're making in your last paragraph,what is it?

Ok so just so as I am sure where you're coming from what you are saying basically is if a family lose their home and have no income to pay rent , that they can basically curl up and die? Is that accurate enough? I don't see any room for manoeuvre in your statements, either pay up or piss off

cypressg

youtube! wrote: »

Ok so just so as I am sure where you're coming from what you are saying basically is if a family lose their home and have no income to pay rent , that they can basically curl up and die? Is that accurate enough? I don't see any room for manoeuvre in your statements, either pay up or piss off

What the hell,I'm saying nothing even remotely similiar to this lol.

And this "pay up or piss off" phrase is meaningless in relation to people who have lost their jobs and thus can't pay their mortgage-they can't pay up as they have no money and they can't piss off(sell) as the bank won't let them sell at a loss,so eh what are they to do except stay there .

cypressg

nacimroc wrote: »

So they don't pay 1 single cent of their mortgage for 5 years, I'm picking up the pieces, weather I like it or not, and its me who has to show compassion. cypressg is the perfect example of why the public will let them burn (and in turn screwing any chance the people who are actually in difficulty and trying to resolve it have of getting help).

When my mortgage went up twice this year, my tax went up and everything costs me more because of those exact people I will try spare some thought for them living absolutely rent/mortgage free for 5 years.

You're picking up the pieces because Brian Lenihan decided to nationalise the banks under direction from Timothy Geithner.
Also nobody is asking or expecting you to show compassion,like I said it's everybody for themselves now,those of us who are in the **** realise this,those of us who aren't don't.

StillWaters

So much vitriol on this thread. Wanting their cheap house no matter what the human cost. People angry believing (wrongly) that tax payers are taking the hit on mortgage arrears.

Do people not realise that arrears are capitalised?

cypressg

So much vitriol and a lack of clarity to so many posts,is it just me or are people struggling to say what they mean these days?I can't understand the points people are making half of the time.

nacimroc

StillWaters wrote: »

People angry believing (wrongly) that tax payers are taking the hit on mortgage arrears.

Do people not realise that arrears are capitalised?

Capitalised with a massive loan being paid for by the taxpayer.

cypressg

nacimroc wrote: »

Capitalised with a massive loan being paid for by the taxpayer.

Take it up with your local politician-the homeowners who are in arrears couldn't care less,they signed contracts with private banks not taxpayers.

youtube!

cypressg wrote: »

What the hell,I'm saying nothing even remotely similiar to this lol.

And this "pay up or piss off" phrase is meaningless in relation to people who have lost their jobs and thus can't pay their mortgage-they can't pay up as they have no money and they can't piss off(sell) as the bank won't let them sell at a loss,so eh what are they to do except stay there .

But if you had your way these folks have their houses repossessed en masse, so the market wins. These same families in a lot of cases will be unable to afford to rent. Therefore they will not have a roof over their head, oh but you wil have your cheap house. You can't have it both ways.

golden lane

1....you get a mortgage off a bank.....
2...you cannot pay the repayments....
3....the bank reposesses the house....
4....the government owns the bank...
5....you become a tenant of the government....

yes, a tenant of the taxpayer......like many others....

cookie1977

golden lane wrote: »

1....you get a mortgage off a bank.....
2...you cannot pay the repayments....
3....the bank reposesses the house....
4....the government owns the bank...
5....you become a tenant of the government....

yes, a tenant of the taxpayer......like many others....

The problem with this is that it helps no one (not even the person buying the cheap reposessed house). Taxes will have to rise to support all of these new state tenents. A better solution is needed. Yes there will be a % of homes/families/people where no solution will work and homes will have to be repossesed but for the majority a solution such as mcwilliam's idea (or other ideas) could work.

It's all fine for some to get cheap houses and profit from a recession but I don't think a flat "reposess everything that can't be paid back" is good for society as a whole. Let alone for the tax payers pocket. Not without exploring ALL options.

youtube!

@Cypressg , sorry mate I took you up wrong i thought when you said everyone for themselves it was like people with difficulties could just get lost, I see that's not what you meant.

nacimroc

cypressg wrote: »

Take it up with your local politician-the homeowners who are in arrears couldn't care less,they signed contracts with private banks not taxpayers.

Between you the banks and the politicians you have left this $hit at my front door and I NOW have to deal with it. That bank is NOW owned by us and by default your problem is now ours. I don't care what deal you made with who or who you feel is responsible. Its now my problem when I never asked for it and I don't care who did what and when. This is now. We're looking for a solution instead of moaning and screwing everyone but yourself!

They need to split it up into categories:
1. The people who pay fine
2. The people who bought as investments and stuggle.
3. The people who are struggling, but trying
4. The people who don't pay and don't care.

Repo no. 2 and 4. Speed up NAMA and away we go. No more sitting about doing nothing waiting for the inevitable.

Write off for no 3. but do McWilliams idea.

the_syco

cookie1977 wrote: »

Good column today from McWilliams:

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/david-mcwilliams/david-mcwilliams-mortgage-debt-deal-can-prevent-default-disease-from-spreading-3331455.html

I agree that it looks like a nice idea, but as people will loose their home anyway, they may ask why should they continue paying, if the idea is to get them to pay what they had agreed to pay.

cookie1977

the_syco wrote: »

I agree that it looks like a nice idea, but as people will loose their home anyway, they may ask why should they continue paying, if the idea is to get them to pay what they had agreed to pay.

Well that might happen but they might also get on their feet and be able to buy the bank out or worse case scenario after 20 years they'll still own have a house which could be a good deposit (or more) on a new house. I think it's still better then full reposession and state housing.

golden lane

cookie1977 wrote: »

The problem with this is that it helps no one (not even the person buying the cheap reposessed house). Taxes will have to rise to support all of these new state tenents. A better solution is needed. Yes there will be a % of homes/families/people where no solution will work and homes will have to be repossesed but for the majority a solution such as mcwilliam's idea (or other ideas) could work.

It's all fine for some to get cheap houses and profit from a recession but I don't think a flat "reposess everything that can't be paid back" is good for society as a whole. Let alone for the tax payers pocket. Not without exploring ALL options.

the people who would have been made homeless are helped.....

i would have thought that was the priority....

i would bring some sense into the stupidity that has overcome ireland in the recent past....

cookie1977

golden lane wrote: »

the people who would have been made homeless are helped.....

i would have thought that was the priority....

i would bring some sense into the stupidity that has overcome ireland in the recent past....

But they're helped at the expense of the tax payer. The banks have written down the debt that they feel they won't recoup so why not do a deal. An option like mcWilliams idea could stimulate the economy. People struggling are not contributing to the domestic economy hence why we're only seeing export led growth (which could collapse again if the international economy doesn't grow).

If people had 20 years to deal with half their mortgage debt (and I speak of those struggling, not those that are comfortable) they might start spending in the domestic market. The banks still get half the mortgage paid (that which they may already have written off as unrecoverable) plus in 20 years they get half the sale of the house.

StillWaters

nacimroc wrote: »

Capitalised with a massive loan being paid for by the taxpayer.

No, it means it is added on to the capital of the mortgage, to be paid off at some point in the future. How is the taxpayer paying this?

riclad

IF some family is left homeless,taxpayer may end up paying, thru rent allowance,This offer helps to stabilise banks,prices may go up in 20 years.Say house is now worth, 100k, if someone is struggling to pay loan 200k, who does it help to throw lender out on the street?qqq2
IN a large property crash like we have banks need to be flexible ,willing to compromise abit,in situations where lender has suffered large drop in income,plus increased taxes.THE economy may be better in ten years, peoples income may go up.
PEOPLE who are being threatened with eviction,by banks, are unlikely to go out,spend money in the local economy,apart from basics like food.

lima

riclad wrote: »

Say house is now worth, 100k, if someone is struggling to pay loan 200k, who does it help to throw lender out on the street?

It helps because I can buy their house for a realistic price and rent it back to them at rental market value. If you want to live in a true capitalist era then you have to take the rough with the smooth.

lima

TCP/IP wrote: »

Lima you come across as a child throwing toys out of their pram. You are obviously young with no commitments which is fair enough but stop acting like a spoilt child because you want people and families evicted so you can purchase at a lower price. It's easy been a keyboard warrior.

I'm just saying no-one should think they are entitled to something for free, at the expense of someone else. We all know no one is going to be put on the street, but there are still people out there who would be shocked and appalled if god forbid they had to rent for the rest of their lives as they made a poor financial decision. I'm just saying it in simple terms.

lima

youtube! wrote: »

To be honest he sounds like he would fit in well in the Gestapo . What a completely heartless person you are Lima .referring to your own people as " you Irish " when you say you are Irish yourself and wanting anyone who cannot pay their debt to leave the country and never come back shows such a selfish lack of compassion that I have never seen on boards before. This crisis affects so many good people and their children but you could give a flying one about them could you? Well merry Xmas to you , one day karma will catch up be assured of that.

I aim to avoid tit-for-tat comments on boards so I'm not going to get sucked in and say much, only that maybe Karma has caught up on the greedy hey?

cookie1977

We're not a capitalist country as some. We have a huge social safety net. So why not move to the USA?

lima

cookie1977 wrote: »

We're not a capitalist country as some. We have a huge social safety net. So why not move to the USA?

That may happen in the near future.

The problem with this safety net is that it creates a bottom-tier of society that feels entitled to free things and cause a social and cultural burden on the rest of us.

And because they get things for free then someone else feels that because they got ripped off in the boom then they are entitled to not pay their mortgage any more in the hope of free things also.

All these people not getting removed from their houses are taking advantage of Irelands collective Catholic guilt in feeling that they should be forgiven as they have poor kids. Fair enough there may be families who are totally screwed and would have no where to go, but I bet there is a whole lot more who are just holding out, and have more than enough money for a nice car, Sky TV, Internet, iPads and a few pints at the weekend.

cookie1977

lima wrote: »

That may happen in the near future.

The problem with this safety net is that it creates a bottom-tier of society that feels entitled to free things and cause a social and cultural burden on the rest of us.

And because they get things for free then someone else feels that because they got ripped off in the boom then they are entitled to not pay their mortgage any more in the hope of free things also.

All these people not getting removed from their houses are taking advantage of Irelands collective Catholic guilt in feeling that they should be forgiven as they have poor kids. Fair enough there may be families who are totally screwed and would have no where to go, but I bet there is a whole lot more who are just holding out, and have more than enough money for a nice car, Sky TV, Internet, iPads and a few pints at the weekend.

As far as I am concerned you are way over generalising things. Many people have gone to great lengths to cut their cloth to their measure. You have a very poor view of your fellow human beings.

Yes there are people as you describe but these are not in the majority and they/we are not stopping you buying a home. That is entirely your decision.

lima

cookie1977 wrote: »

Yes there are people as you describe but these are not in the majority and they/we are not stopping you buying a home. That is entirely your decision.

wow, you are a landlord, so do you have more than one home? Probably should have done the math then if you are behind your payments

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=82314481

cookie1977

lima wrote: »

wow, you are a landlord, so do you have more than one home? Probably should have done the math then if you are behind your payments

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=82314481

Ooh. Assumptions again. And you can search.

No I'm not behind in payments thanks. Although I did renegotiate my ppr to a longer term while I have two young kids in creche. Your point?

nacimroc

cookie1977 wrote: »

As far as I am concerned you are way over generalising things. Many people have gone to great lengths to cut their cloth to their measure. You have a very poor view of your fellow human beings.

Yes there are people as you describe but these are not in the majority and they/we are not stopping you buying a home. That is entirely your decision.

I think the real figure would absolutely stun the country! I'm not getting between you and Lima, but after spending the last 2 years bidding on houses that people have no interested in selling I would disagree. They are only selling to keep the banks off their backs and to live rent/mortgage free even though they could be turning down offers above their asking price.

I could gaurantee everyone on here knows at least a few people who are not paying what they should be or could be. I don't care how broke you are, if they haven't paid a mortgage in 5 years they're better off than they should be. Then you have another mass amount of people struggling, debating weather to join them if their is relief coming to the people who won't pay. Its a house of cards.

You cannot have thousands of people living in houses for free for years! Its total madness.